Dr. Michael Heiser has died

[Softball Bat]

Who?

I'll tell you who, and I'll tell you why I note this.


Dr. Heiser was one of the more noteworthy biblical scholars of our time.
He was a professor, an author, a lecturer, a podcaster, blogger, and other things.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_S._Heiser

Michael Heiser was one of the most accomplished Hebrew Bible experts of this generation.


I’m a Christian and biblical scholar who has a grasp of the fact that ancient Israelite cosmology describes a flat earth.

- Dr. Michael Heiser


Indeed.
That is a fact, and it doesn't even take a Hebrew Bible expert to quickly realize it is a fact.
You can easily read it in any language the Bible is translated into.
God's Word plainly describes a flat, stationary, enclosed earth.

Heiser had a very popular blog.
The interesting thing is that about 6 or 7 years ago some fl@t earthers started coming in to his blog to ask him about the shape of the earth.

He got into a huge rhubarb with the flat earthers.
Heiser's take was, "Yeah, the Bible definitely does say the earth is flat, stationary and enclosed, but it is wrong."
He said, paraphrasing, "God did not care if the authors of the Bible got it wrong -- because it does not really matter."

The scholar/Hebrew Bible expert melted down very badly on his own blog when confronted on this issue, and then he banned flat earthers, as well as any flat earth discussion, from his blog.

lol


Whenever I think of Dr. Michael Heiser, this is what I will think of.

[Rootbeer]

I study a moderate amount of Hebrew but your post raises a question I've never thought to ask or answer. Is flat earth theory taught in Synagogue? If it's the literal word of God to his people I would expect the Jews to lead the world in preaching it but I haven't seen that in my studies.

[Kierland]

There is no such thing as the word of god. It’s all made up. Hope that helps.

[Rootbeer]

Kierland, you don't need to post in every thread. It's not as though you're under contract or anything.

I mention it because I wasn't sure you knew.

[LTS TRN 2]

Too bad about the good doctor. Another Covid vax victim no doubt.

As for Einstein, let's consider how much of a grifter he really was. Here's a discussion which details his shameless plagiarising--of which he was directly accused during his liftetime, while he was already annointed as a Great Genius--and he didn't dare refute any of it. Also let's consider that his great achievement, his "special" theory of Relativity ("special" denoting a moving object, such as the earth) was in fact a collaboration with his Polish wife. But when the Nobel Prize was awarded he made a deal with her that she would get all the money (a lot, even then) and that he would get full credit. He then promptly divorved her and married his first cousin.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcIL4kUBZfA

[Softball Bat]

I study a moderate amount of Hebrew but your post raises a question I've never thought to ask or answer. Is flat earth theory taught in Synagogue? If it's the literal word of God to his people I would expect the Jews to lead the world in preaching it but I haven't seen that in my studies.

It is a good question.

I suspect one would be much more likely to be taught about a flat earth in an Islamic mosque than in a Jewish synagogue.

A few of our members on this board have probably spent time in a synagogue.

They could chime IN on this if they'd like.

[Donnie Baker's Ghost]

The point is, that everything is "theory"
Those who think otherwise, are extremely unintelligent.

I hear the science is settled on a few things.

[Kierland]

Kierland, you don't need to post in every thread. It's not as though you're under contract or anything.

I mention it because I wasn't sure you knew.

Get a life smack.

Outstanding!

[Donnie Baker's Ghost]

The point is, that everything is "theory"
Those who think otherwise, are extremely unintelligent.

I hear the science is settled on a few things.

Yes. Of course there's settled science.
But on the BIG questions, there's only theories.

I was being facetious.

Everything is a theory. Fuck off with your bullshit, IPCC.

[Donnie Baker's Ghost]

Yes. Of course there's settled science.
But on the BIG questions, there's only theories.

I was being facetious.

Everything is a theory. Fuck off with your bullshit, IPCC.

Everything?

From our perspective, absolutely.

Did you see the announcement today about the James Webb Telescope fucking up 100+ years of what we thought we knew about our universe? How about the Younger Dryas theory rolling back human history a couple dozen millennia? Gobekli Tepe?

Egyptologists might as well start burning their books for heat. That shit needs a full rewrite.

Might as well write science stuff on plates of sand to save on paper and erasers.

[LTS TRN 2]

I study a moderate amount of Hebrew but your post raises a question I've never thought to ask or answer. Is flat earth theory taught in Synagogue? If it's the literal word of God to his people I would expect the Jews to lead the world in preaching it but I haven't seen that in my studies.

It is a good question.

I suspect one would be much more likely to be taught about a flat earth in an Islamic mosque than in a Jewish synagogue.

A few of our members on this board have probably spent time in a synagogue.

They could chime IN on this if they'd like.

Well I'll say you've at least budged--like a plastered tourist sprawled on a recliner by the pool rolling over for a snack on the little table--and actually moved your arms--a few curls with five-pound handweights--and actually attempted to step up your game on Flat Earth--a premise and assertion that is both brave and brazen, and demanding the full monty of sales skills--of which you'd seemed to have never had or upon which you'd completely given up. And which of course I've called upon you to step it up.

So now you're rolling out a new angle by way of the dead doctor's expertise in translating and interpreting the Torah and similar ancient Hebrew texts. Okay, but why doesn't it occur to him that the tiny nomadic stone-age tribe of Hebrew religious fanatics happened to share the exact same conclusion as the Native American tiny nomadic stone-age tribes--that the earth was the approximate shape of a pizza--well, what does this mean? Of course primitive people would think in such terms. But surely such robust and belligerent ignorance doesn't support their claims. Or what? Are you suggesting that because this "doctor," no doubt a True Believer, dutifully followed through on the clear implications in the Torah concerning the shape of the earth, that his conclusions should be trusted anymore than Joel Osteen's?

[Softball Bat]

Well I'll say you've at least budged--like a plastered tourist sprawled on a recliner by the pool rolling over for a snack on the little table--and actually moved your arms--a few curls with five-pound handweights--and actually attempted to step up your game on Flat Earth--a premise and assertion that is both brave and brazen, and demanding the full monty of sales skills--of which you'd seemed to have never had or upon which you'd completely given up. And which of course I've called upon you to step it up.

There are a good eight to ten lengthy "flat earth" threads that have carried on here at T1B.
I have been the main figure in those threads.

I have probably posted a few hundred times about it, and many of those posts have been lengthy.
I have explained my position in great detail, and have done my best to back up my position.
I've spend hours of my time on it.

I have VERY patiently done my best to respond to those who have mocked me, protested, or disputed things that I have posted.
When I have been asked questions, I have not ducked them.

The threads are actually very interesting, and the topic is very important.

Are you suggesting that because this "doctor," no doubt a True Believer, dutifully followed through on the clear implications in the Torah concerning the shape of the earth, that his conclusions should be trusted anymore than Joel Osteen's?

No.
You can read the Bible yourself and see that it relays to us that the earth is flat, stationary, and enclosed.
In fact, if you read the very first page of the Bible you can see that it disqualifies the globe model.

This thread was basically a parting shot taken at gutless Dr. Heiser.

[LTS TRN 2]

What a pathetic and bloodless salseman you really are. Go ahead, find and post one of those threads. I call total bullshit on you're ever having made any real effort to float the Zeno-like balloon of Flat Earth, or to be able to offer any such argument right now. You are an absolute fraud. A fetid fart. And speaking of which, as for the Torah declaring--or indicating--Flat Earth, so what? What part of Stone-Age Nomadic Fanatically Religious Tribe are you suggesting we take seriously? Sure, we can observe it and consider it like any other archeological find, but why are you somehow accepting it as evidence of anything?

[Softball Bat]

What a pathetic and bloodless salseman you really are. Go ahead, find and post one of those threads. I call total bullshit on you're ever having made any real effort to float the Zeno-like balloon of Flat Earth, or to be able to offer any such argument right now.

Dude, there are a bunch of lengthy flat earth threads on this board.
Use the search function and have fun!

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=49741&start=320 <----- as usual, did not work out well for the globe zealots.


:)

[Kierland]

Is it possible to go to the S Hemi for the first time when you are an adult and see the Southern Cross and not have That Song running in your head?

I know it was running in mine.

[Softball Bat]

Yo, poptart, can you see the North Star (Polaris) from the Southern Hemisphere?

Gosh, why not?

There is a vanishing point.





An overhead light will ultimately move below the horizon (become invisible) once you move far enough away from it.



Eric Dubay has a good short video on this topic.

[Kierland]

When I’m running over right wing tards it sure does.

[Kierland]

Nice projection.

[Donnie Baker's Ghost]

Nice projection.

Ummm.
I don't like Muhammad. He married 7 and 8 year olds.

Strange how KierDiego_Michigan fail to mention that in their pedo rants.

[LTS TRN 2]

What a pathetic and bloodless salseman you really are. Go ahead, find and post one of those threads. I call total bullshit on you're ever having made any real effort to float the Zeno-like balloon of Flat Earth, or to be able to offer any such argument right now.

Dude, there are a bunch of lengthy flat earth threads on this board.
Use the search function and have fun!

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=49741&start=320 <----- as usual, did not work out well for the globe zealots.


:)

Are you kidding? You actually believe that your insipid and idiotic comments on that thread make any sense? Or that things "did not work out well" for those who pointed out your pathetic fallacies? Are you familiar with the fallacies of Zeno? Yours are on a much lower level of clever levering of logic, but it's still the same nonsense. And that's it? That's your best argument for Flat Earth? I'd have to say you're better off fellating camels. :wink:

[Softball Bat]

Are you kidding? You actually believe that your insipid and idiotic comments on that thread make any sense? Or that things "did not work out well" for those who pointed out your pathetic fallacies?

Then *bump* the thread and post your takes.

See how that works out for you.

[LTS TRN 2]

Have you ever considered why airlines fly in the shortest path possible--and that this entails recognizing the earth as spherical? :wink: That is, they fly over the pole when on route to California from Europe. If the earth were flat they would simply fly straight across the pond.

But your "argument" on that thread doesn't even attempt to be logical at all, let alone cleverly inverting logic like Zeno's examples. No, you offer childish nonsense about walking in circles--though of course in a straight line--as per distance from the pole (which doesn't matter at all when you're walking on a globe). And when someone is scratching their head, wondering if you'd been "kicked by a horse" in the head, you try to slide in even more ludicrous pap such as asserting that water should properly fly up off of the earth if it was a globe and actually spinning. But water is relatively heavy. By your ass-backwards logic, everything lighter should also be spun up into the air, including the boats upon the water.

How did you possibly become so utterly dense and stupid? :doh:

[Softball Bat]

That is, they (airlines) fly over the pole when on route to California from Europe.

Which pole do airlines fly over when they travel from Europe to California?

[LTS TRN 2]

The North of course--because the land mass of the respective continents are in the Northern hemisphere. Now, is your hamster wheel mind properly considering that the shortest route from Argentina to Australia would entail going over Anarctica? :wink:

[Softball Bat]

That is, they (airlines) fly over the pole when on route to California from Europe.

Which pole do airlines fly over when they travel from Europe to California?

The North of course

Flights from Europe to California most definitely DO NOT go over the North Pole.

lol



Hey fella, if this is how you begin to engage on this topic, I'll tell you right now you need to -----> EJECT.

[LTS TRN 2]

Yo, poptart, can you see the North Star (Polaris) from the Southern Hemisphere?

Gosh, why not?

There is a vanishing point.

Absolute bullshit. If a lamp lit road like this is indeed flat and straight, a powerful telescope could observe it for light years of distance. But even a medicore telescope would observe a departing ship to disappear below the line of sight. One's flat, one's not.

Game, set, match.

[LTS TRN 2]

That is, they (airlines) fly over the pole when on route to California from Europe.

Which pole do airlines fly over when they travel from Europe to California?

The North of course

Flights from Europe to California most definitely DO NOT go over the North Pole.

lol



Hey fella, if this is how you begin to engage on this topic, I'll tell you right now you need to -----> EJECT.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AuXAG01aUoA

Continue sucking the camel for the remaining BHM

[Softball Bat]

But even a medicore telescope would observe a departing ship to disappear below the line of sight.

There are many videos on YouTube that show ships supposedly over the curve of the earth, but are then brought back into sight with a telescope.

[LTS TRN 2]

But even a medicore telescope would observe a departing ship to disappear below the line of sight.

There are many videos on YouTube that show ships supposedly over the curve of the earth, but are then brought back into sight with a telescope.

And perhaps you could provide one?

And while you're at it, explain why the respective poles of our planet are undeniably frosty. What else but a whirling sphere with a quilted quivering shawl of atmospere would deliver heat to the center and cold to the poles? And since that's what we are certainly dealing with--the actual facts of the earth, well how do you reckon this obvious spheric reality with your quibbled and mumbled nonsense about Flat Earth? :wink:

[Softball Bat]

There are many videos on YouTube that show ships supposedly over the curve of the earth, but are then brought back into sight with a telescope.

And perhaps you could provide one?

Btw, you would have more credibility if you would own up to talking out your @ss when you said that flights from Europe to California go over the North Pole.

People who are actually paying attention to our dialogue here saw that.
lol

But as so often has happened in these discussion, the globe zealot shits the bed very badly, and then just skips right past it and continues speaking down to me.

This is not going particularly well for you.

[Diego in Seattle]

[LTS TRN 2]

There are many videos on YouTube that show ships supposedly over the curve of the earth, but are then brought back into sight with a telescope.

And perhaps you could provide one?

Btw, you would have more credibility if you would own up to talking out your @ss when you said that flights from Europe to California go over the North Pole.

People who are actually paying attention to our dialogue here saw that.
lol

But as so often has happened in these discussion, the globe zealot shits the bed very badly, and then just skips right past it and continues speaking down to me.

This is not going particularly well for you.

The vid is total bullshit. For starters, Aristotle's teleological theory maintained a earth centered universe, and he deduced its sperical shape from the curved shadow of lunar eclipses--a factor you ignore. But the entire premise of this idiotic vid is nonsense--and its narrator sounds like teenager. Notice it doesn't allow for a hypothetical powerful telescope which could actually watch a ship for several hundred miles--as opposed to the limited ability of our eyes--even aided with a simple small telescope. A ship most certainly would drop below the horizon--and of course there's no reason for it to come back up. What utter silliness.

As for airline routes coming over the poles, I don't necessarily mean directly over the pole, but merely over the polar region so as to save thousands of miles which would be entailed in a flight from London to L.A.--as the Arlo Guthrie song details--flying instead across the ocean and across the great plains.



And "it's not going particularly well" for me?

[Softball Bat]

1. You asked me to post a video showing a telescope bringing a boat that was supposedly over the curve of the earth back into view.
I did so.

2. You claimed flights from Europe to California go over the North Pole.
They do not.

3. Just so you know, posting about airline flights will never prove your globe to be true.


My take from the very beginning of the fl@t earth saga is not that it is a fact that the earth is flat, because I DO NOT KNOW for a fact what the shape of the earth is.
It is my assumption that the earth is flat, stationary, and enclosed.

My take has always bee that the globe is absolutely WRONG.

The globe is completely preposterous.

Water does not cling to the outside of a flying, spinning, ball.
lol

Dingbats cling to this ridiculous fantasy.

[Donnie Baker's Ghost]

Terry Pratchett got it right. This lumpy frozen pizza is carried on the backs of four elephants standing on the back of a great star voyaging turtle.

[LTS TRN 2]

1. You asked me to post a video showing a telescope bringing a boat that was supposedly over the curve of the earth back into view.
I did so.

2. You claimed flights from Europe to California go over the North Pole.
They do not.

3. Just so you know, posting about airline flights will never prove your globe to be true.


My take from the very beginning of the fl@t earth saga is not that it is a fact that the earth is flat, because I DO NOT KNOW for a fact what the shape of the earth is.
It is my assumption that the earth is flat, stationary, and enclosed.

My take has always bee that the globe is absolutely WRONG.

The globe is completely preposterous.

Water does not cling to the outside of a flying, spinning, ball.
lol

Dingbats cling to this ridiculous fantasy.

Your whole act is some sort of passive-aggressive fan dance, coyly insisting while prudely claiming an agnostic perch.

The vid you provided does not in any way support your claim of a ship somehow coming back into view. Your very syntax is muddled despite your attempt at brevity.

The routes of airlines of course take the shortest route, and that often entails flying over the respective poles. The simple map I provided clearly displays this.

And this brings us to your hole card argument--which is also the most ridiculous--that of water "clinging" to a spinning sphere. Upon what kind of sheer idiocy--or rather twisted logic--is this asinine premise based? As I already asked--and of coure you ignore-why wouldn't everything lighter than water also be flung from the earth's surface by centrifugal force? Why only water? Are you in some denial or ignorance of gravity? Or do you remand it to the same category as Big Foot? Maybe it's real, maybe it's not?

And you can explain the curved shadow of the earth upon the moon during a lunar eclipse? Or what?

And what about all those space missions and orbiting satellites? Is everyone lying? :doh:

[Softball Bat]

The vid you provided does not in any way support your claim of a ship somehow coming back into view.

The video (and there are many more like it on the web) plainly shows that if a boat "disappears over the curve of the earth," it can be brought back into view with a telescope.

I am sorry this troubles you.



And this is what we get...

Denial, a flurry of bluster and insults, assertions backed up by nothing, and -----> a cartoon.


Enjoy your globe!

[LTS TRN 2]

And the photo from space showing the satellite is fake? Who's behind such a brazen conspiracy?

Your claim that a departing ship can be seen with a telescope is a suggesting what exactly? How far could a telescope theoretically follow the ship? All the way to China?

And as for your "no-gravity" suggestion, why does it apply only to water?

And the curved shadow on the moon?

Stop being a squirelly little bitch and answer these questions. :|

[Softball Bat]

And the photo from space showing the satellite is fake?

It isn't a photo.

Who's behind such a brazen conspiracy?

I have posted about this before.
Perhaps I will do so again, seeing as people tend to ask this a lot.

How far could a telescope theoretically follow the ship? All the way to China?

I haven't done that.
Why don't you buy a telescope, go to the ocean, and see how far you can see.

And as for your "no-gravity" suggestion, why does it apply only to water?

I did not say there is no "gravity."
I said that water will NEVER behave in the utterly fantastical ways globe zealots tell us it does.
It is a total joke.

Why don't you link us to an experiment that shows water clinging to the outside of a flying, spinning ball?
Show us how that can be.

Or... measure the curvature of water over some distance, and show that to us.

And the curved shadow on the moon?

What you are proposing requires the earth to be in motion.
Show us the proof you have that the earth is in motion.

We are stationary, and the sun, moon, and stars are in motion above us.

[LTS TRN 2]

It's not a photo? If not, what is it? And who's lying about it? Don't give us some crap about having explained it previously, let's hear it officially. Speak :!:

And why the curved shadow? What, you think you can just squrim about like a weird little worm?

[Softball Bat]

It's not a photo? If not, what is it?

It is an image.
CGI.

It is not a photo of a satellite.

And why the curved shadow?

A solar eclipse on a flat earth is easy to understand.
The moon simply passes between the earth and the sun, causing the sun (or part of it) to be blocked from our view on earth.

Some in the "flat earth community" are of the opinion that there are dark, semi-transparent objects in the heavens (firmament), and that a lunar eclipse occurs when such an object moves in front of the moon, causing the moon (or part of it) to be blocked from view on earth.

Personally, I am not at ease with this explanation, although I certainly do not rule it out, either.

This is a long (but interesting) read on the topic, from Samuel Rowbotham's famous book on the flat earth.

https://www.sacred-texts.com/earth/za/za29.htm