A thread for things that don't warrant their own thread

[Sudden Sam]

And tomorrow they're serving ribs

Nutrisystem can blow a goat.

I am about to devour a monstrous pulled pork sandwich with slaw on it. This place is grreat!

[Kierland]

Monday in south Louisiana means red beans and rice. And the inmates at the Capitol cafeteria cook some fine red beans. With smoked sausage, sweet potatoes, mustard greens, cornbread, a fried pork chop, and some tea. Yeah.

And tomorrow they're serving ribs.

Those people are called slaves, you’re eating food prepared by slaves. Hope it made you feel good.

[Meat Head]

Monday in south Louisiana means red beans and rice. And the inmates at the Capitol cafeteria cook some fine red beans. With smoked sausage, sweet potatoes, mustard greens, cornbread, a fried pork chop, and some tea. Yeah.

And tomorrow they're serving ribs.

Those people are called slaves, you’re eating food prepared by slaves. Hope it made you feel good.

Nice troll job, not really though.

13th Amendment:
Section 1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
And from https://www.aclu.org/news/human-rights/ ... onviction.

"U.S. law also explicitly excludes incarcerated workers from the most universally recognized workplace protections. Incarcerated workers are not covered by minimum wage laws or overtime protection, are not afforded the right to unionize, and are denied workplace safety guarantees.

So you are full of shit. "counsellor"

[Screw_Michigan]

"U.S. law also explicitly excludes incarcerated workers from the most universally recognized workplace protections. Incarcerated workers are not covered by minimum wage laws or overtime protection, are not afforded the right to unionize, and are denied workplace safety guarantees.

So...basically slaves. Thanks for pointing this out.

[Kierland]

So you skipped Con Law. How am I not surprised?

“But they are happy slaves, that jumped at a chance to work in the house and not in the fields.”

Like I have been saying for years. You’re a R who pretends to be a D.

[Screw_Michigan]

Holy shit.

They are inmates. They have been convicted of robbery, murder, arson, drug trafficking, and other major crimes.

They currently are in the custody of the Louisiana Department of Public Safety and Corrections. For their crimes, most of them have spent years at Louisiana State Penitentiary, better known as Angola. Because they demonstrated themselves as model inmates, they earned the chance to participate in a work release program. After successful participation in typically construction-type jobs, they are given a chance to work at the Capitol and other state buildings.

Every single one of them jump at this opportunity. They much prefer making and serving red beans and rice at the Capitol, instead of being at Angola locked in their cell 23 hours a day or doing farm work.

So no, they are not slaves. They are inmates serving time. And they would rather be at the Capitol rather than any of their other options.

State governments should not be leveraging prison inmates for their cheap labor at the expense of regular people. I don't care if LA's prison system is so barbaric that this is framed as a reward to well behaving inmates.

In LA's defense, this is not just a LA problem.

[mvscal]

State governments should not be leveraging prison inmates for their cheap labor...

Why not? They are in prison because they are paying a debt to society for their crimes. The opportunity for rehabilitation offered is neither free nor inexpensive. You see this as "slavery," because, well, let's face it, Screwy, you're really fucking stupid.

Evidently these cooks are talented enough to impress, JSC. That is a highly marketable job skill with uptown, word of mouth buzz. It's a skill that a convict who is honestly committed to rehabilitation can use to make a living once they have served their time. Restaurants are hiring everywhere for every position.

[Screw_Michigan]

Why not? They are in prison because they are paying a debt to society for their crimes. The opportunity for rehabilitation offered is neither free nor inexpensive. You see this as "slavery," because, well, let's face it, Screwy, you're really fucking stupid.

Evidently these cooks are talented enough to impress, JSC. That is a highly marketable job skill with uptown, word of mouth buzz. It's a skill that a convict who is honestly committed to rehabilitation can use to make a living once they have served their time. Restaurants are hiring everywhere for every position.

Yeah, removing job opportunities for non-criminals so LA can save a few bucks is a great idea.

[Kierland]

State governments should not be leveraging prison inmates for their cheap labor...

Why not? They are in prison because they are paying a debt to society for their crimes. The opportunity for rehabilitation offered is neither free nor inexpensive. You see this as "slavery," because, well, let's face it, Screwy, you're really fucking stupid.

Evidently these cooks are talented enough to impress, JSC. That is a highly marketable job skill with uptown, word of mouth buzz. It's a skill that a convict who is honestly committed to rehabilitation can use to make a living once they have served their time. Restaurants are hiring everywhere for every position.

^Sees no difference between opportunity and mandates.

That’s why you are a Nazi dude. And he sees it as slavery because that’s what involuntary servitude is. Sorry if facts are hurting your feelings.

[Softball Bat]

This is what would happen if Dinsdale was a reporter.


Reporter + Jimmy Butler + Coalescing =









What the hell does that mean?

You said a big word.

Jimmy and the Heat are coalescing once again.

One game from making it to the NBA Finals.

Up 3-0 over the Celtics in the Eastern Conference Finals.

[Screw_Michigan]

Every one of these guys would rather be making red beans at the Capitol, and when they demonstrate rehabilitation, they may have an opportunity to do so.

That pic is from Angola, where they grow almost all of the food they eat, including cattle, pigs, and chickens.

You're not making the point you think you're making, but continue.

[Kierland]

How it actually works is they are slaves. House slaves are still slaves. But go ahead and dig a bigger hole.

[Screw_Michigan]

I am merely providing information as to how it actually works.

If they are at Angola, then they have been convicted of serious crimes. I don't have any problem at all in having inmates work, especially considering that work directly contributes to their maintenance, upkeep, and rehabilitation.

I get it. Inmates need to work. But the entire reason there is this setup of "talented" inmates cooking food at the LA capitol is because of the history of LA using inmate labor for businesses to profit from. But also so that the priviledged lawmakers and people who work at the capitol can get better food for cheap than having to pay market rate for the same food quality. Or you can pay market rate for a food service employee.

[Screw_Michigan]

For cheap? I just paid over $14 for the red beans plate lunch, and that was before tipping them.

We're not discussing profit margins.....

[Kierland]

Chip wants to know what’s cheaper than a slave. What a POS human.

[Screw_Michigan]

Chip wants to know what’s cheaper than a slave. What a POS human.

Chip is not a POS human. He might be a bit conservative for your taste and mine, but he's not a POS human.

But again, he inadvertently made my point. He correctly pointed out that his $14 was not cheap. But who's profiting from that $14 lunch if the inmates are making $0.50/hour (at the most)? The fukkin state of LA.

[Kierland]

It just keeps getting better. “I don’t mind a bunch of guards getting paid bank to watch the slaves.”

Only a POS has these views of other human beings, especially since he is ok to doing it to entrepreneurs just because they sell crack and not booze.

[Sven Golly]

How it actually works is they are slaves. House slaves are still slaves. But go ahead and dig a bigger hole.

Are you insane??? They are inmates you stupid shit.

How do you make the leap to slavery?

You are really grasping.

[Sudden Sam]

Comparing inmates to slaves is ignorant as hell. I can’t believe the garbage I’m reading. There isn’t any similarity whatsoever.

Slaves in the Americas had no choice as to their fate. Inmates opted into the penal system by choosing to break laws.

[Screw_Michigan]

But as noted, the involuntary servitude or slavery is expressly authorized by the Constitution, so I'm not seeing much of an issue here, nothing of concern.

So what? Slavery and segregation was encoded in the Constitution for hundreds of years. That didn't make them right.

[Screw_Michigan]

For Chip--

https://www-jstor-org.dclibrary.idm.ocl ... 5136?seq=2

To understand the conditions that have allowed such an exploitative industry to develop, we have to look at the origin of the US prison system itself. Before the abolition of slavery, there was no real prison system in the US. Punishment for crime consisted of physical torture. In 1865, the 13th Amendment officially abolished slavery for all people except those convicted of a crime and opened the door for mass criminalization.

Prisons were built in the South as part of the backlash to Black Reconstruction and as a mechanism to re-enslave Black workers. In the late 19th century South, an extensive prison system was developed in the interest of maintaining the racial and economic relationship of slavery.

LA's famous Angola Prison illustrates this. In 1880, this 8,000-acre family plantation was purchased by the state of LA and converted into a prison. Slave quarters became cell units. Now expanded to 18,000 acres, the Angola plantation is tilled by prisoners working the land--modern day chattel slavery.

[Kierland]

How it actually works is they are slaves. House slaves are still slaves. But go ahead and dig a bigger hole.

Are you insane??? They are inmates you stupid shit.

How do you make the leap to slavery?

You are really grasping.

The 13th Amendment. Try and keep up you stupid Nazi fuck.

[Kierland]

So what? Slavery and segregation was encoded in the Constitution for hundreds of years. That didn't make them right.

Good point. I'll also concede that Angola has a history that is, well, not nice. And I'll further concede that despite relatively recent improvements, more can and should be done.

But still I don't have a problem with inmates working.

What would you prefer they do as they serve their sentence? Angola is huge, one of the largest maximum security prisons in the country. (might be the largest, can't remember now) About 3/4 of the inmates are serving life, or practical life sentences of 200 years. So most of the inmates will never ever leave, and many (most?) will be buried in one of the cemeteries at Angola.

Meh, I'm rambling, sorry about that. Still don't see a problem in working the inmates.

Fuck you are stupid. We want them to work, we don’t want them to HAVE to work or get punished. Do you even know how prisons and their credit system work?
And this is a guy who GRADES con law exams. No wonder you are a bunch of illiterate frog fuckers.

[Meat Head]

How it actually works is they are slaves. House slaves are still slaves. But go ahead and dig a bigger hole.

Are you insane??? They are inmates you stupid shit.

How do you make the leap to slavery?

You are really grasping.

The 13th Amendment. Try and keep up you stupid Nazi fuck.

13 says it's OK to enslave as punishment for crime.

"Section 1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction."

Don't like it? Not fair? Ho hum.

[Diego in Seattle]

MS;
How do you feel about Calfornia's use of inmates for fighting wildfires?

[Kierland]

Are you insane??? They are inmates you stupid shit.

How do you make the leap to slavery?

You are really grasping.

The 13th Amendment. Try and keep up you stupid Nazi fuck.

13 says it's OK to enslave as punishment for crime.

"Section 1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction."

Don't like it? Not fair? Ho hum.

I know what it says. And no I’m not a big fan of slavery, I take it you are.

Diego,
Not sure what your question is about fire fighting specifically, but I’m not in favor of any slavery, even if it’s call voluntary on its surface.

[mvscal]

Every one of these guys would rather be making red beans at the Capitol, and when they demonstrate rehabilitation, they may have an opportunity to do so.

That pic is from Angola, where they grow almost all of the food they eat, including cattle, pigs, and chickens.

That is how all prisons should operate. You grow the food, you maintain the facility and you pay your fucking debt to society. Hard work is neither cruel nor unusual. That being said, inmates should not be subjected to violent abuse from staff or other inmates and prison gangs need to get broken up. That is total bullshit.

Tough but fair.

[Kierland]

Simplistic people like you are so funny. Well funny if you couldn’t vote.

[Smackie Chan]

That is how all prisons should operate. You grow the food, you maintain the facility and you pay your fucking debt to society.

Isn't the debt paid through denial of liberty? Providing free or nearly free labor to commercial interests is also part of the debt repayment?

I have no problem with inmates being put to work, doing the kind of work you cited - self-sustainment and maintenance/cleaning of their living facilities is reasonable. Even providing labor for private industry is fine, as long as they're paid a "reasonable" wage (however that's defined, but certainly higher than what is currently paid). Why should companies that hire prisoners enjoy a cost benefit over competitors by not having to pay nearly as much for labor?

If one of the purposes of incarceration (a big if) is rehabilitation (with the exception of those serving life or on Death Row), it would seem that the primary goal of rehab would be to prepare inmates for release back into society, for the sake of both the inmate and the community. Among the boxes to check would be marketable skills in an area where there was a demand, and some cash to tide one over during the first few weeks/months of freedom. If inmates were allowed to earn and save a bit while benefiting industry with below-market (but not slave) labor and learning a marketable skill, that would go at least part way toward easing the transition back into society (a win for both the inmate and the community), without coddling the offenders.

As it is, at least in some parts of the country, the types of private industry jobs farmed out to prisons are ONLY performed by prisoners, such as making license plates. Meaning there's no market for those skill sets on the outside, and those performing the work for pennies an hour are unable to save anything for when they're released. So they're released with a few dollars, no skills, a criminal record making them nearly unhirable, and are expected to seamlessly blend back into proper society and become productive citizens. Just doesn't seem that the rehab aspect of incarceration in this country has been well thought out.

[mvscal]

That is how all prisons should operate. You grow the food, you maintain the facility and you pay your fucking debt to society.

Isn't the debt paid through denial of liberty?

No. Any other questions? I'm here to help.

[Kierland]

SC,
You seem to be stuck in the weeds. The question isn’t about the carrot (how rehabilitation works) it’s the stick (how to make rehabilitation work). If slavery were outlawed the system would still be about the same except the State couldn’t punish you for refusing to work a shit job for no money.

I had a guy the State did not want to parol for political reasons (they basically thought he also killed his wife in Maryland before coming to California but couldn’t prove it, we call it a silent murder) but he had done everything he needed to do except 10years earlier he participated in a prison wide labor strike, which they could only use against him due to slavery still being legal.

The State should be able to lead a prisoner to water, they just shouldn’t be able to force them to drink.

[Kierland]

That is how all prisons should operate. You grow the food, you maintain the facility and you pay your fucking debt to society.

Isn't the debt paid through denial of liberty?

No. Any other questions? I'm here to help.

While this is true (they need to pay restitution and whatnot) it’s not true for the reasons Ginger Hitler thinks.

[Meat Head]

Just doesn't seem that the rehab aspect of incarceration in this country has been well thought out.

Meaningful rehab costs money. No one wants to pay, so most of what we hear about "rehab" is just propaganda. In the mean time we house criminals until the jail/prison is full, then let them out to reoffend.

The circle game, ver. 666x

[Kierland]

What we do costs more money than rehab, which is why it’s done this way. Got to keep the fat prison industrial complex fat.

[Meat Head]

What we do costs more money than rehab, which is why it’s done this way. Got to keep the fat prison industrial complex fat.

This.

[Diego in Seattle]

What we do costs more money than rehab, which is why it’s done this way. Got to keep the fat prison industrial complex fat.

We would never accept paying more for imprisoning criminals than rehabbing them.

That would be like paying more for medical care with our current system than having medicare for all.

Oh wait...

[Screw_Michigan]

We would never accept paying more for imprisoning criminals than rehabbing them.

That would be like paying more for medical care with our current system than having medicare for all.

Oh wait...

Yep

[Sudden Sam]

WTF?!

Uganda is one of the 64 countries in the world that criminalize same-sex consensual acts, but the new law establishes tougher new punishment. It mandates life sentences for same-sex relations, 20 years in prison for “promoting” homosexuality, and death penalty for “aggravated homosexuality,” which includes same-sex acts involving people under the age of 18 or when a person is HIV positive.

[Screw_Michigan]

WTF?!

Uganda is one of the 64 countries in the world that criminalize same-sex consensual acts, but the new law establishes tougher new punishment. It mandates life sentences for same-sex relations, 20 years in prison for “promoting” homosexuality, and death penalty for “aggravated homosexuality,” which includes same-sex acts involving people under the age of 18 or when a person is HIV positive.

Damn, wish we would have thought of this first.

Sincerely,
Ron DeSantis
Greg Abbott

[Kierland]

WTF?!

Uganda is one of the 64 countries in the world that criminalize same-sex consensual acts, but the new law establishes tougher new punishment. It mandates life sentences for same-sex relations, 20 years in prison for “promoting” homosexuality, and death penalty for “aggravated homosexuality,” which includes same-sex acts involving people under the age of 18 or when a person is HIV positive.

Again this is what happens when people like you are in charge.