Smack your own conference

PSUFAN · Post by **PSUFAN** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 6:17 pm

Big 10: just get 12 fucking teams and schedule a CCG already. The other major conferences are doing it - it's not really fair for them to render one of their teams BCS unworthy when a Big 10 team can end their season with MSU or Hawaii or IU and get into a BCS bowl.

BlindRef · Post by **BlindRef** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 6:24 pm

Big Ten: for ever expanding and letting Penn State in the conference.

WolverineSteve · Post by **WolverineSteve** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 6:57 pm

Big Ten needs to contract. I'm thinking oh, I don't know...MSU!!!

Terry in Crapchester · Mon Apr 03, 2006 6:58 pm

I don't have a conference to smack. Just sayin'.

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:03 pm

Terry in Crapchester wrote:I don't have a conference to smack. Just sayin'.

We'll have to do something about that... :twisted:

Terry in Crapchester · Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:04 pm

Shoalzie wrote:
Terry in Crapchester wrote:I don't have a conference to smack. Just sayin'.

We'll have to do something about that... :twisted:

No thanks. :twisted:

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:15 pm

No, I insist...

indyfrisco · Post by **indyfrisco** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:16 pm

Big XII: Vito and Baylor

campinfool · Post by **campinfool** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:18 pm

Big XII: Aggies for still thinking they matter nationally

Terry in Crapchester · Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:19 pm

Shoalzie wrote:No, I insist...

Of course, we're getting way off topic here, but . . .

A few years back, when ND did flirt with the idea of joining a conference, several prominent donors to ND's football program -- as in 7 figures per year prominent (and no, I'm not one of them) -- promised to pull their donations to ND football forever if ND ever joined a conference.

Don't know about you, but that sounds to me like a pretty strong incentive for ND to stay independent.

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:35 pm

Does it always have to be about money with you crazy Domers? If someone paid your guys $50 million to wear pink uniforms, would you do that too?

Seriously though, if Notre Dame was independent in every sport, that's one thing but the fact you guys won't join in football when you're in the Big East in mostly every other sport and the CCHA in hockey...is it really going to kill you to join a league in football?

Terry in Crapchester · Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:48 pm

Shoalzie wrote:Does it always have to be about money with you crazy Domers? If someone paid your guys $50 million to wear pink uniforms, would you do that too?

Every team is willing to whore their unis out, at least to some extent, if the price is right. Just ask Nike, Adidas or Reebok about that.

Seriously though, if Notre Dame was independent in every sport, that's one thing but the fact you guys won't join in football when you're in the Big East in mostly every other sport and the CCHA in hockey...is it really going to kill you to join a league in football?

The Big East membership is relatively new -- only a little more than a decade since we joined.

You may be too young to remember, but there was a time not too long ago when a number of prominent programs, not just ND, were football independents. Penn State, FSU and Miami are just the bigger names, and by no means the only ones. And many of those schools played in a conference in other sports, although ND, at the time, did not (except for hockey).

In all seriousness, I submit that if someone on this board were to propose seriously that Oklahoma should leave the Big 12, or Michigan or Ohio State should leave the Big 10, that those teams' contingencies would scream from the rafters about it. Independence is every bit as important to ND's football tradition as those conference memberships are to the respective traditions of those schools, yet people seem genuinely perplexed that ND's fanbase does not want the football team to join a conference. I don't get it.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:53 pm

Shoalzie wrote:Does it always have to be about money with you crazy Domers? If someone paid your guys $50 million to wear pink uniforms, would you do that too?

If it were up to Kevin White, yes.

Terry in Crapchester · Mon Apr 03, 2006 8:02 pm

Killian wrote:
Shoalzie wrote:Does it always have to be about money with you crazy Domers? If someone paid your guys $50 million to wear pink uniforms, would you do that too?
If it were up to Kevin White, yes.

I passed on the rather obvious lead-in there, but you're right.

Btw, I read somewhere that Penn State once had black-and-pink uniforms. That was before even my time, apparently, but I think Wolfie and Luther might have been around back then.

buckeye_in_sc · Post by **buckeye_in_sc** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 8:06 pm

can we just smack Babs and Jon?

seriously I agree...get a 12th team and get it over with...

I would agree that ND would be a "Natural" fit, but hey if they don't want to join...oh well...perhaps they could entice say a Missouri to leave the Big 12??? Just throwing that out for conversation!

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 8:14 pm

buckeye_in_sc wrote:can we just smack Babs and Jon?

Good call...

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 8:28 pm

buckeye_in_sc wrote:can we just smack Babs and Jon?

seriously I agree...get a 12th team and get it over with...

I would agree that ND would be a "Natural" fit, but hey if they don't want to join...oh well...perhaps they could entice say a Missouri to leave the Big 12??? Just throwing that out for conversation!

I don't know why the Big 10 doesn't make a run at Pitt. You have the natural PSU rival, a good basketball team, and teams that are pretty solid in most other olympic sports.

Are the academics at Pitt that bad?

Terry in Crapchester · Mon Apr 03, 2006 8:31 pm

Killian wrote:
buckeye_in_sc wrote:can we just smack Babs and Jon?

seriously I agree...get a 12th team and get it over with...

I would agree that ND would be a "Natural" fit, but hey if they don't want to join...oh well...perhaps they could entice say a Missouri to leave the Big 12??? Just throwing that out for conversation!
I don't know why the Big 10 doesn't make a run at Pitt. You have the natural PSU rival, a good basketball team, and teams that are pretty solid in most other olympic sports.

Are the academics at Pitt that bad?

Actually, Pitt's academics aren't all that bad, at least not according to the link Wolverine Steve posted awhile back. They're ahead of six current Big Ten schools, if my count is correct. viewtopic.php?t=14228

The problem the Big Ten might have with Pitt is that Pitt agreed to stay in the Big East. I don't know whether the agreement is legally enforcible, but it could very well, at a minimum, cause Pitt to become embroiled in some litigation that they would not want.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 8:41 pm

It also doesn't make any sense for Pitt. As it stands now, their path to the BCS is much easier in the Big East than in the Big 10.

Cicero · Post by **Cicero** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 9:13 pm

ACC: NO ONE WASTES MORE TALENT EACH YEAR, LIKE WE DO.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Mon Apr 03, 2006 9:20 pm

Other than Michigan and N'western, it seems to me Pitt's academic standards are on par with any other Big Ten school.

War Stoops · Post by **War Stoops** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 10:58 pm

Big 12: North Division

That was too easy.

BlindRef · Post by **BlindRef** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 2:42 am

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:Other than Michigan and N'western, it seems to me Pitt's academic standards are on par with any other Big Ten school.

Academically Pitt would be fine, I don't know if they are high profile enough for the Big Ten to expand again.

I think the Big Ten is going to either go with Notre Dame or wait until some one leaves.

M2 · Post by M2 » Tue Apr 04, 2006 3:24 am

Arizona and Arizona State... for obvious reasons.

m2

SoCalTrjn · Post by **SoCalTrjn** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 3:58 am

Terry in Crapchester wrote:
Shoalzie wrote:Does it always have to be about money with you crazy Domers? If someone paid your guys $50 million to wear pink uniforms, would you do that too?
Every team is willing to whore their unis out, at least to some extent, if the price is right. Just ask Nike, Adidas or Reebok about that.

USC was asked to wear those gay Nike unis with the 2 different colored sleeves last year, and refused, maybe Phil just didnt throw enough cash their way

Id like to see the Pac add SDSU and Fresno State, then schedulef Florida International, Louisiana Monroe, Wofford and Buffalo for the 4 OOC games and get 8 Home games a year

Terry in Crapchester · Tue Apr 04, 2006 2:15 pm

BlindRef wrote:
MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:Other than Michigan and N'western, it seems to me Pitt's academic standards are on par with any other Big Ten school.
Academically Pitt would be fine, I don't know if they are high profile enough for the Big Ten to expand again.

I think the Big Ten is going to either go with Notre Dame or wait until some one leaves.

With respect to expansion, the Big Ten's problem is getting a school they would like and which also would meet their academic standards. Notre Dame doesn't want the Big Ten -- the fact that we very nearly joined the ACC a few years ago should bear that out. Pitt would be a good fit, but on balance is probably better off staying in the Big East. Any of the upper-tier MAC schools would be a good fit geographically, and would jump at the chance to get into the Big Ten, but none really has the academics the Big Ten is looking for.

Missouri is the only school I've heard mentioned that I could see possibly going to the Big Ten at the present time, although Big 12 fans probably know more about this than I do. If Missouri were to jump, however, that would definitely throw a monkey wrench into the North/South divisional alignment that tOSU and Michigan want. Either Iowa or Penn State would have to go to the North Division. If Iowa goes, they lose an annual matchup with either Illinois or Missouri (both natural rivals in that event). If Penn State goes, they lose an annual matchup with tOSU, the only school located in a geographically contiguous state.

BlindRef · Post by **BlindRef** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 5:10 pm

I have a hard time seeing Missouri being the 12th team, why would they leave the Big 12? Seems like a lateral move at best.

I don't think the Big Ten is going to worry about how a school affects their divisions when they do expand. There is no obligation to have regional divisions, the Big Ten could just have 2 groups of 6 random teams, and by random I mean rival-specific.

I think I posted my suggestion for the Hayes and Schembechler Divisions a few years ago. I can't see Michigan and Ohio State ever wanting a conference championship game.

I just wish the Big Ten would go to a round robin format again, play all 10 teams with 2 non conference games, it still gives you 7 home games for christ sake.

Terry in Crapchester · Tue Apr 04, 2006 7:22 pm

BlindRef wrote:I have a hard time seeing Missouri being the 12th team, why would they leave the Big 12? Seems like a lateral move at best.

By that standard, if (and admittedly, that's a big qualifier) Notre Dame ever gets its program back to where its fan base wants the program to be, joining any conference could very well be a step backward for Notre Dame. The only possible exception is if the circumstances of college football changed so as to make joining a conference absolutely imperative for ND, and even then, it's entirely possible that ND could win a game of chicken with the rest of college football, particularly when one considers the fans' point of view.

I think I posted my suggestion for the Hayes and Schembechler Divisions a few years ago.

Not saying that you didn't, but I don't remember that.

I can't see Michigan and Ohio State ever wanting a conference championship game.

If that's the case, then why bother expanding in the first place?

BlindRef · Post by **BlindRef** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 3:08 am

Terry in Crapchester wrote:
BlindRef wrote:I have a hard time seeing Missouri being the 12th team, why would they leave the Big 12? Seems like a lateral move at best.
By that standard, if (and admittedly, that's a big qualifier) Notre Dame ever gets its program back to where its fan base wants the program to be, joining any conference could very well be a step backward for Notre Dame. The only possible exception is if the circumstances of college football changed so as to make joining a conference absolutely imperative for ND, and even then, it's entirely possible that ND could win a game of chicken with the rest of college football, particularly when one considers the fans' point of view.

I think I posted my suggestion for the Hayes and Schembechler Divisions a few years ago.
Not saying that you didn't, but I don't remember that.

I can't see Michigan and Ohio State ever wanting a conference championship game.
If that's the case, then why bother expanding in the first place?

Right, I don't support expansion, I don't think it makes sense. The championship games don't interest me, and it just weakens the regular season. Things are fine in Big Ten country.

As for my Hayes-Schembechler division, i wouldn't expect anyone to remember, I can't even remamber what board I posted it on, if it were The trolls or Scobode or whatever. I was just trying to explain a consistency in opinion, that IF the Big 10 were to expand, that regional assignments are unnecessary.

I am making the roadie to South Bend in the fall. I love going down there, hopefully Michigan will steal one.

Screw_Michigan · Post by **Screw_Michigan** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 3:24 am

Terry in Crapchester wrote:Any of the upper-tier MAC schools would be a good fit geographically, and would jump at the chance to get into the Big Ten, but none really has the academics the Big Ten is looking for.

i'd say that miami is the #1 academic school in the mac and it is on par with most of the big 11 schools. ohio u is probably #2. i know miami has a huge endowment and they have competitive teams across the board in all sports. could they have an impact in big 11 football? probably not for the next few years, but they would probably be the team who could make the jump and hold their own.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Wed Apr 05, 2006 4:48 pm

Agreed on Miami. They're on par with MSU, Ohio St, Minnesota, etc., and have a really nice campus. Plus the MAC can afford to lose an Ohio school...that state pretty much IS the MAC conference.

PSUFAN · Post by **PSUFAN** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 5:08 pm

could they have an impact in big 11 football?

I'd give them shot over Illinois, NW, IU, and MSU most of the time...

BlindRef · Post by **BlindRef** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 5:48 pm

THe suckeyes will fight that very hard, just like Michigan fought the Sparties application.

Terry in Crapchester · Wed Apr 05, 2006 6:10 pm

Miami would be a good fit in the Big Ten, both geographically and academically. Athletically, they'd probably be a bottom feeder for at least awhile, but that's not to say that it'd be that way forever.

Two problems, however, with Miami joining the Big Ten:

1. As Blind Ref stated, tOSU would fight that hard. Right now they're the kings of their state, but that possibly could change if another Ohio school got into the Big Ten.

2. Notre Dame. Like I said, I think it's pretty clear that ND doesn't want the Big Ten, but as long as the Big Ten thinks there's a ghost of a chance that ND will change their minds about that, I'm not sure they will invite another school to join their conference.

indyfrisco · Post by **indyfrisco** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 6:19 pm

Terry in Crapchester wrote:2. Notre Dame. Like I said, I think it's pretty clear that ND doesn't want the Big Ten, but as long as the Big Ten thinks there's a ghost of a chance that ND will change their minds about that, I'm not sure they will invite another school to join their conference.

Can't they always just kick out Northwestern?

J/k. I know that NW is their private school. Something to do with acocunting I beilieve...

Screw_Michigan · Post by **Screw_Michigan** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 7:52 pm

as for smacking my own conference, well what can i say? it's the mac. mid-major football, pathetic attendance at schools that aren't fighting for first place, playing second-fiddle in big 11 country, a league championship game at ford field that only had around 10k people, no flights for intraconference games, and home to temple and buffalo football.

but i'll always give the mac props for having free beer at the media day receptions. epoch.

Terry in Crapchester · Wed Apr 05, 2006 7:57 pm

IndyFrisco wrote:
Terry in Crapchester wrote:2. Notre Dame. Like I said, I think it's pretty clear that ND doesn't want the Big Ten, but as long as the Big Ten thinks there's a ghost of a chance that ND will change their minds about that, I'm not sure they will invite another school to join their conference.
Can't they always just kick out Northwestern?

J/k. I know that NW is their private school. Something to do with acocunting I beilieve...

Actually, I heard it has to do with conference meetings being open to the public if all its members are public schools. Then again, the Big 8 was entirely state schools but apparently didn't have that problem.

And btw, if ND joined the Big Ten they could kick out Northwestern, since ND would replace Northwestern as a private school member. That having been said, ND is not interested in joining any conference to replace an existing member.

Jimmy Medalions · Post by **Jimmy Medalions** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 8:49 pm

The Pac 10: only conference dumb enough to hire Ty Willingham. Twice.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 8:50 pm

Jimmy Medalions wrote:The Pac 10: only conference dumb enough to hire Ty Willingham. Twice.

Rack

Sky · Post by **Sky** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 4:53 am

Terry in Crapchester wrote:Miami would be a good fit in the Big Ten

No fucking way. Have you ever been to Miami? Have you ever seen their stadium? While they have a beautiful campus, they only carry 13000-15000 students per year. Not near enough to fill a stadium and be even a mid-tier Big10 school. I know NW only has like 18000 buy why would we want to add another primarily academic school?

Plus, for every good year, they have 3 or 4 down years. Not an option IMO.

If I were to pick, I would say Pitt, Louisville or WVU. Plus, we could use some teams with more E Coast influence to avoid canabilazing the MWest more than we already do (along with the Big12).