Now here's a debate I would LOVE to see

[Uncle Fester]

Mankind is the wildcard, the unknown variable, the proverbial wrench in the engine.

Stick that in your 5 gazillion years of geology.

[PSUFAN]

BTW--whatever happened to "acid rain" ??
I remember when it was the topic de jour
of the enviro-doomsday folks !!

The acid rain situation has been improving, thanks to the efforts of the enviro-doomsday folks that you've been wagging your tongue at for decades.

http://www.epa.gov/airmarkets/cmprpt/arp03/summary.html

Which take is yours, wolfman:

-a denial of the existence of acid rain
-a denial of the adverse effects of acid rain
-a distaste for those who would warn you about acid rain
-pack your bags, we're moving to florida

[PSUFAN]

Did I say it was, halfwit?

[PSUFAN]

Care to show me where?

[Uncle Fester]

Man is a part of this planet. Nothing we do or add is unnatural. It makes no fucking difference at all if CO2 comes from a volcano, warming oceans or SUVs. The result is the same.

I'm not arguing in support of the "Earth as Venus" comment.

I'm saying never underestimate a man's ability to fukk up his own backyard.

Your comment that "nothing we do [to the planet] is unnatural" is delusional. You've obviously never been to Wisconsin Dells.

[PSUFAN]

mvscal is the Lance Armstrong of spin on this issue. He flits from "our influence on the climate is natural" to "we have no influence over the climate whatsoever". Whatever page he's on for a particulat post, though, it's everyone else's opinion or data that is worthless, not his.

[PSUFAN]

Care to show me where?

^^ get to that one first. I'll then respond in kind.

[Uncle Fester]

Uncle Fester wrote:
I'm saying never underestimate a man's ability to fukk up his own backyard.

mvscal wrote: Sure we can do that. That's a far cry from being able to alter the global climate, though.

Not really. We know human activities affect local climates. Everything is ultimately connected.

[Uncle Fester]

"Changes in terrestrial ecosystems through natural vegetation dynamics and through human land uses and land management are important mechanisms of climate change."

http://www.cgd.ucar.edu/tss/staff/bonan ... /index.htm

[Uncle Fester]

Everything is ultimately connected.

Man is a part of this planet. Nothing we do or add is unnatural.

You're too hung up on global warming politics. Like I said before, mankind is the unknown variable. We can and do affect climate change all the time and the Earth is the sum of its parts.

Claiming that "nothing we do or add is unnatural" is an ignorant statement.

[PSUFAN]

Care to show me where?

^^ get to that one first. I'll then respond in kind.

yep, that's what I figured.

[Smackie Chan]

The fossil record is pretty clear on that point.

Now why bring Luther into this discussion?

[Uncle Fester]

The human contribution to climate change is about as significant as a fart in a tornado.

The human contribution to planetary change is hardly insignificant. God himself must be wowed by our ability to devour, despoil, and develop every inch of Eden we can get our hands on. Don't sell mankind short in the climate change business. If we haven't fukked it up already we'll get there eventually.

Time to face facts here. The climate is going to do whatever it is going to do and there isn't a goddamn thing we can do about it except roll with it.

Throwing up your hands with a great big "Golly Gee, it's all too difficult to understand," is why you wound up being a mvscal on a message board instead of a scientist. For me it was all the pesky math involved.

When some people rent a place to live they like to leave it in reasonably good shape for the next person. Others spill grape juice on the rug, punch holes in the wall, and leave a giant mountain of shit behind. I guess it all comes down to how you are raised.

[Mister Bushice]

The human contribution to climate change is about as significant as a fart in a tornado.

Spread one of my farts over a large area via a tornado and you'll change your tune right quick.