Bizarro Education in Denver

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In bizarro education world, geography teachers are told to take down flags of foreign countries...

Teacher Placed On Leave For Hanging Foreign Flags

LAKEWOOD, Colo. -- A Jefferson County geography teacher was placed on paid administrative on the second day of school for hanging several flags from other countries in his classroom.

Eric Hamlin said the flags were part of a world geography lesson plan at Carmody Middle School and refused to take them down. The school's principal escorted Hamlin out of class Wednesday morning after he refused to remove the flags of China and Mexico.

*BOGGLE*

[Mike the Lab Rat]

It's a stupid rule and the administrator is an idiot.

BUT

The teacher was incredibly stupid in refusing to comply with the direct request of his principal. What the teacher should have done was comply and then go through the appropriate channels to get his flags OK'd. Instead, he was insubordinate and therefore earned the suspension. He has a valid argument but went about things the wrong way.

[PSUFAN]

The teacher was incredibly stupid in refusing to comply with the direct request of his principal.

While I'll stop far short of comparing America to the Third Reich, your statement certainly brings that era to mind.

Is it at all sensible to require this teacher to remove those flags? Absolutely not. I say...rack the guy for refusing to buckle to an insanely misguided administrator's foolishness.

You think he should have gone through the "appropriate channels"...bullshit. He would have never received a fair shake unless this was in the glare of public scrutiny. So perhaps he'll be placed on leave or even fired...a permanent mark on his career.

[Diogenes]

Just more evidence of the need for school choice.

[indyfrisco]

I say...rack the guy for refusing to buckle to an insanely misguided administrator's foolishness.

Come on, man. Not at the cost of putting food on the table. Yeah, it said the teacher was put on paid leave, but how long will that last? You don't do this kind of insubordinate shit to your boss. You go through the proper channels.

[Diego in Seattle]

Just more evidence of the need for school choice.

Yes, because all the teachers in private schools are perfect. :roll:

Way to melt, dumbfuck.

[Mike the Lab Rat]

While I'll stop far short of comparing America to the Third Reich, your statement certainly brings that era to mind.

Is it at all sensible to require this teacher to remove those flags? Absolutely not. I say...rack the guy for refusing to buckle to an insanely misguided administrator's foolishness.

Wrong, wrong, wrong.

The teacher is an EMPLOYEE.

The principal is his SUPERVISOR.

The SUPERVISOR was directing the EMPLOYEE to follow COMPANY POLICY.

Whether or not the employee agreed with the supervisor's decision to enforce policy is irrelevent. It is not a frigging democracy. His boss told him to do something in accordance with district policy and he refused. Case closed.

To compare an employee's punishment for insubordination to Nazi Germany is the height of stupidity. His boss gave him a direct order, he refused, and he was suspended. He's at least going to get union help and a hearing. In most private sector jobs, I'm pretty sure that being insubordinate to your boss and refusing to follow company policy gets you shitcanned without the niceties this guy is getting.

You think he should have gone through the "appropriate channels"...bullshit. He would have never received a fair shake unless this was in the glare of public scrutiny. So perhaps he'll be placed on leave or even fired...a permanent mark on his career.

"Fair shake?" The teacher is a frigging EMPLOYEE. The classroom does not belong to him, it belongs to the district, which has the right to set policy within it. It is the district's decision on how to approach curriculum and whether or not to adornments in THEIR classroom meet THEIR rules.

The guy forgot his place.

Here is how my union president explained similar situations to me:

If your boss (principal, vice principal, superintendent, etc.) tell you to do something with which you disagree, ask yourself the following questions -
1 - is it illegal?
2 - is it dangerous?
3 - does it violate our contract?

If #1 or #2 are answered "yes," then disobey and then report the illegal/dangerous order to the boss's superior(s)

If #3, comply and then report incident to the union for filing of grievance

If you have any question about whether the request violates 1 through 3, then comply immediately and then report to your union rep.

Like I said before, the policy is stupid and his boss is being a dink, but the guy fucked up by being insubordinate.

[RadioFan]

Just more evidence of the need for school choice.

Private schools have far more latitude in making these type of idioic, arbitrary decisions than do public schools.

[PSUFAN]

MtLR,

I agree with what you've said, from a labor relations perspective...but I'll still rack the guy for responding to foolishness in this way. Maybe it's not the smartest thing to do as an EMPLOYEE, but as a principled individual, he has my respect.

Either way, looks like the union will have more than enough to work with.

At the end of the day, idiots like this have no business being administrators...although "idiot" surely seems to be a common job qualification for school admins.

[Diogenes]

Just more evidence of the need for school choice.

Private schools have far more latitude in making these type of idioic, arbitrary decisions than do public schools.

Actually what they have is accountability to the consumers, as opposed to having the Unions dictate their agenda and protect incompetent idiots. If parents want their kids educated in this type of environment, fine. If not, their ability to obtain a decent education shouldn't depend on their income.

[Goober McTuber]

It shouldn’t depend on mine either. I don’t mind paying for public schools because I regularly get to vote on the folks that run them.

[RadioFan]

as opposed to having the Unions dictate their agenda and protect incompetent idiots.

In this case, it's not the teacher who is the idiot, but the administrator. One of the purposes of the union is to help protect teachers against this seemingly arbitrary and ludicrous bullshit.

[Diogenes]

It shouldn’t depend on mine either. I don’t mind paying for public schools because I regularly get to vote on the folks that run them.

And yet the board members who fail to support the union's agenda usually find themselves being outspent 100-1 come election time. As long as unions are allowed to influence the elections of the Board members they end up 'negotiating' with and have a virtual monopoly on public education, it will continue to be substandard, especially for those who need it most, have the least financial ability to do anything about it, and who leftist swine like you don't give a shit about.




Why do leftists hate poor children?

[PSUFAN]

Just more evidence of the need for school choice.

Private schools have far more latitude in making these type of idioic, arbitrary decisions than do public schools.

Actually what they have is accountability to the consumers, as opposed to having the Unions dictate their agenda and protect incompetent idiots. If parents want their kids educated in this type of environment, fine. If not, their ability to obtain a decent education shouldn't depend on their income.

Folks who are dismayed by available school choices have the option to home school. Obviously they'll have the opportunity to attend to every detail of the educational process...should they be so inclined. Most folks who home school find this burden to be too onerous, and return to educational organizations.

No school environment is or ever will be perfect. Education is about challenging the learner. Obviously some challenges should not be presented the learner, but the learner will learn from them either way. I think that education takes forms that even the best administrators or teacher can never foresee or control.

All told, education is something you survive, endure, and come to terms with. It's not something that can be controlled at the microscopic level. Higher education is inevitably self-directed. Facing challenges and surmounting them...that's an important skill that begins at the primary level.

[Goober McTuber]

It shouldn’t depend on mine either. I don’t mind paying for public schools because I regularly get to vote on the folks that run them.

And yet the board members who fail to support the union's agenda usually find themselves being outspent 100-1 come election time. As long as unions are allowed to influence the elections of the Board members they end up 'negotiating' with and have a virtual monopoly on public education, it will continue to be substandard, especially for those who need it most, have the least financial ability to do anything about it, and who leftist swine like you don't give a shit about.

Sorry you live in such a shitty town.

[Diogenes]

as opposed to having the Unions dictate their agenda and protect incompetent idiots.

In this case, it's not the teacher who is the idiot, but the administrator. One of the purposes of the union is to help protect teachers against this seemingly arbitrary and ludicrous bullshit.

A)The only purposes of the union are to maximize political clout, control over the school agenda and dues.

B) The administrator was mearly doing his job and enforcing the law.

Hamlin said that the school district is not only depriving him of a teaching tool but also taking away from his students' education.

"The major problem I see here is with the law that limits educators," Hamlin said.

"We have to uphold state law. We really have no discretion when it comes to upholding the law," Setzer said.

Hamlin said he understands that the school district is only following state law so he's met with the American Civil Liberties Union and, if necessary, plans on fighting the constitutionality of the law.

[PSUFAN]

Good educators - and apt students - must rise above and beyond the polemics that surround them. The real enemy of education is ignorance...and that straddles the political spectrum.

There are a lot of LAZY-ASSED MOTHERFUCKERS that have permeated the educational system we all pay for - be they teachers, admins, students or parents. Traditionally, education has been a place where nepotism and institutional incompetence have flourished.

That has to change...and prattling on about the Left and the Right has very, very little to do with that necessary change.

[Diogenes]

It shouldn’t depend on mine either. I don’t mind paying for public schools because I regularly get to vote on the folks that run them.

And yet the board members who fail to support the union's agenda usually find themselves being outspent 100-1 come election time. As long as unions are allowed to influence the elections of the Board members they end up 'negotiating' with and have a virtual monopoly on public education, it will continue to be substandard, especially for those who need it most, have the least financial ability to do anything about it, and who leftist swine like you don't give a shit about.

Sorry you live in such a shitty town.

I'm pretty certain it's the same in whatever POS town you live in, you're just to stupid to realize it.

[Diogenes]

That has to change...and prattling on about the Left and the Right has very, very little to do with that necessary change.

I agree.

What we need is school choice, actually.

[RadioFan]

A)The only purposes of the union are to maximize political clout, control over the school agenda and dues.

"School agenda" also includes classroom codes of conduct and a right to teach without being micromanaged by administrators.

B) The administrator was mearly doing his job and enforcing the law.

Foreign flags aren't conducive to geography class?

[Diego in Seattle]

That has to change...and prattling on about the Left and the Right has very, very little to do with that necessary change.

I agree.

What we need is school choice, actually.

And what "choice" do poor kids have with "school choice?"

[Goober McTuber]

And yet the board members who fail to support the union's agenda usually find themselves being outspent 100-1 come election time. As long as unions are allowed to influence the elections of the Board members they end up 'negotiating' with and have a virtual monopoly on public education, it will continue to be substandard, especially for those who need it most, have the least financial ability to do anything about it, and who leftist swine like you don't give a shit about.

Sorry you live in such a shitty town.

I'm pretty certain it's the same in whatever POS town you live in, you're just to stupid to realize it.

I'm pretty certain that you're an idiot, you're just to stupid to realize it.

[Diogenes]

The administrator was mearly doing his job and enforcing the law.

Foreign flags aren't conducive to geography class?

No, the teacher in this case was deliberatly violating a law he disagreed with-and admits it.

[PSUFAN]

Do you have kids? I'm not trying to :rts: you...I'm just wondering.

No schools...even the ones you "choose"...are going to be perfect - especially if you are a reactionary, overly emotional knee-jerker. Parents grow thick skins...or else they have a LOT of trouble.

[Mike the Lab Rat]

A)The only purposes of the union are to maximize political clout, control over the school agenda and dues.

Mmmm.....nope.

Unions are primarily for protecting teachers from the caprices and politics of administrators, school board members, and parents. As someone who once had a superintendent who developed a nasty moody streak as she was undergoing cancer treatment, I appreciated knowing that her "off with their heads" attitude was being reigned in. The bitch went around dispensing the harshest punishments for student rules she would devise on a daily basis, rearranged the classroom assignments of teachers (which is *not* something contractually protected), and more than once said that she wished she could fire certain folks who "rubbed her the wrong way." Toss in the demands from some parents who don't want their kids taught anything about non-Christian religions or evolution, students who make false claims of sexual harassment/abuse, etc., and it is nice to have the help of a union.

I'm not particularly fond of the national teachers' unions' leftist political bent, but that crap doesn't filter down to our local (we use NYSUT, not NEA), which is run by conservative dudes. Our teachers, by and large, happen to be of a conservative/libertarian bent. Not too many liberals outside of the English and Social Studies departments.

[Mikey]

Why do leftists hate poor children?

They don't hate them. They simply want to perpetuate their condition.

Unlike right-wingers who would prefer they be eaten by other poor people.

I'm pretty sure it wasn't the "leftists" in Colorado who enacted such an enlightened law - no "permanent" displays of foreign flags in public schools?

We used to have a map of the world with little 1" x 2" pictures of all the flags around the border. I guess it's illegal to put something like this on the wall in a Colorado classroom now. Eh, fuck it anyway. Who cares if our kids don't know the difference between the flags of Sweden, Italy and PRC. It don't matter anymore 'cause if they're not with us they're against us.

[Goober McTuber]

Our teachers, by and large

Sounds good to me.

Sincerely,

[RadioFan]

Eh, fuck it anyway. Who cares if our kids don't know the difference between the flags of Sweden, Italy and PRC.

Exactly. Most of our students can't find fucking Africa on map anyway, so why bother.

[Y2K]

If I remember correctly wasn't it in Denver that they had all the problems with Mexican Flag waving on
"Support your local illegal's day last spring? Some white boys burned one on campus or some shit like that.
Teacher knew the rules and took a stand regardless of District Policy so sucks for him. Telling the boss to get fucked is never a great idea.

[Diego in Seattle]

Why do leftists hate poor children?

They don't hate them. They simply want to perpetuate their condition.

This from the party that refuses to give the working poor the first raise in the minimum wage in ten years. :roll:

[Y2K]

Why do leftists hate poor children?

They don't hate them. They simply want to perpetuate their condition.

This from the party that refuses to give the working poor the first raise in the minimum wage in ten years. :roll:

Bullshit, it was layed out in Congress but the Democrat's killed it......

Sucks for them

[Diogenes]

I'm not particularly fond of the national teachers' unions' leftist political bent, but that crap doesn't filter down to our local (we use NYSUT, not NEA), which is run by conservative dudes.

So you're paying to help elect this idiot?

[Diego in Seattle]

They don't hate them. They simply want to perpetuate their condition.

This from the party that refuses to give the working poor the first raise in the minimum wage in ten years. :roll:

Bullshit, it was layed out in Congress but the Democrat's killed it......

Sucks for them

How convenient that you should leave out the part regarding repblicans tagging on a rider giving tax breaks for millionaires. If the republicans really wanted to increase the minimum wage they would have left it alone.

Using your logic, if the democrats had attached a rider on a defense spending bill raising the minimum wage to $9.00 and the repblicans vetoed the bill, republicans could then be viewed as hating America & the military.

[Mike the Lab Rat]

I'm not particularly fond of the national teachers' unions' leftist political bent, but that crap doesn't filter down to our local (we use NYSUT, not NEA), which is run by conservative dudes.

So you're paying to help elect this idiot?

I'm in western NY.

AFAIK, NYSUT hasn't given any of my money to that guy.

Go fishing in some other pond.

[Diogenes]

Do you have kids? I'm not trying to :rts: you...I'm just wondering.

No schools...even the ones you "choose"...are going to be perfect - especially if you are a reactionary, overly emotional knee-jerker. Parents grow thick skins...or else they have a LOT of trouble.

No, but I've had ex-gfs with kids in the local school system, I've seen how the system 'works' close up. Besides, I don't base my opinions on how things affect me personaly, but on how they affect society at large.

And the point isn't to find 'perfect' schools, but to offer competition to make those that are severly substandard either reform or close.

[Cuda]

If I remember correctly wasn't it in Denver that they had all the problems with Mexican Flag waving on
"Support your local illegal's day last spring? Some white boys burned one on campus or some shit like that.
Teacher knew the rules and took a stand regardless of District Policy so sucks for him. Telling the boss to get fucked is never a great idea.

The teacher was suspended for insubordination- not for expressing his political views- although U&L style politics isn't anything new to that particular school. Earth Day was always a huge celebration, so that should give you some idea of the traditions there.

I went to that school in 7th & 8th grades- only it was Carmody Jr. High back then- the "middle school" bullshit hadn't yet become fashionable. It was physically designed for the latest, cutting-edge, mid-60's educational theory- and always remained firmly rooted in the left's glory days. They even used to have movable classroom walls so they could combine up to 8 classrooms into one, big room to have teach-ins or whatever the fuck they call it.

They also cut some corners on the construction and the built-in cabinets in some of the upstairs rooms weren't sealed off and you could climb up inside all the way into the school's attic and roam around. That lasted until some kid took a wrong step & ended up with his leg sticking out through a ceiling tile.

[Y2K]

This from the party that refuses to give the working poor the first raise in the minimum wage in ten years. :roll:

Bullshit, it was layed out in Congress but the Democrat's killed it......

Sucks for them

How convenient that you should leave out the part regarding repblicans tagging on a rider giving tax breaks for millionaires. If the republicans really wanted to increase the minimum wage they would have left it alone.

Using your logic, if the democrats had attached a rider on a defense spending bill raising the minimum wage to $9.00 and the repblicans vetoed the bill, republicans could then be viewed as hating America & the military.

I left it out because I didn't see a problem with it, The dumbass Demo's could have used it as some serious campain fodder against the GOP but those idiots could fuck up a wet dream.... I think it was hella funny.

[Diogenes]

I'm not particularly fond of the national teachers' unions' leftist political bent, but that crap doesn't filter down to our local (we use NYSUT, not NEA), which is run by conservative dudes.

So you're paying to help elect this idiot?

I'm in western NY.

AFAIK, NYSUT hasn't given any of my money to that guy.

I just got his name because he brags about being the first primary candidate supported by your union. Maybe they are 'conservative' compared to the NEA or CPUSA (not much differance there ideologicly).


BTW 'raising the minimum wage' translates to 'you're fired' for those at the bottom of the food chain. Of course, it raises the bar for everyone else, letting union bosses shakedown the taxpayers for even more money and benefits, inflation and the economy be damned.

[Diego in Seattle]

Bullshit, it was layed out in Congress but the Democrat's killed it......

Sucks for them

How convenient that you should leave out the part regarding repblicans tagging on a rider giving tax breaks for millionaires. If the republicans really wanted to increase the minimum wage they would have left it alone.

Using your logic, if the democrats had attached a rider on a defense spending bill raising the minimum wage to $9.00 and the repblicans vetoed the bill, republicans could then be viewed as hating America & the military.

I left it out because I didn't see a problem with it, The dumbass Demo's could have used it as some serious campain fodder against the GOP but those idiots could fuck up a wet dream.... I think it was hella funny.

At a time of war you have no problem giving tax breaks for millionaires? What's the deficit up to now? Republican's loyalty isn't to their country....it's to themselves.

Trust me....repubs have given dems plenty of ammo for this year's mid-terms.

[Cuda]

BAN that dumbfuck for misusung the quote feature