WS:call it

Adelpiero · Post by **Adelpiero** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 10:39 am

all i know, is the fuckers better go to game 5.

my sister has game 4, father has game 6. if i get hosed like the red sox series(had game 5 tix), and get stuck with a useless ticket again, i will punch Felix right in his pussy.

somehow the cards continue to roll, tigers lose momentum from rest, and:

cards win in 6

rozy · Post by **rozy** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 12:08 pm

I would love to see Edmonds get a well-deserved ring.

However, Tigers in 5. I just can't see the Cards matching the pitching. Hope I'm wrong...

Eaglebauer · Post by **Eaglebauer** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 1:53 pm

Easy 4-0 sweep for El Redbirdos.

Mikey · Post by **Mikey** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 3:35 pm

Los Tigres en seis.

Dinsdale · Post by **Dinsdale** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 3:55 pm

rozy wrote:I would love to see Edmonds get a well-deserved ring

To reward him for all those years of being the biggest asshole he could possibly be, or to reward him for the outstanding use of syringes?

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Fri Oct 20, 2006 5:19 pm

Easy 4-0 sweep for El Redbirdos.

Easy sweep? Bwahahaha. Allllllllllllrighty, dude.

Tigers in 5. Leyland will be able to have his rotation set precisely how he wants, and all his arms will be rested and ready to go.

Eaglebauer · Post by **Eaglebauer** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 5:26 pm

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:
Easy 4-0 sweep for El Redbirdos.
Easy sweep? Bwahahaha. Allllllllllllrighty, dude.

Tigers in 5. Leyland will be able to have his rotation set precisely how he wants, and all his arms will be rested and ready to go.

Melt noted. Mission accomplished. Damn that was easy.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Fri Oct 20, 2006 5:31 pm

Eaglebauer wrote:Melt noted.

Oh. You're one of those posters.

Clever stuff.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 5:41 pm

Dinsdale wrote: To reward him for all those years of being the biggest asshole he could possibly be, or to reward him for the outstanding use of syringes?

Is that why he never played for the Yankees?

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 6:42 pm

Sig bet, CardFan...you know you want to. :wink:

Lots of nice plots lines for this Fall Classic...in other words, there's plenty of crap for the media to discuss even though it doesn't involve two big TV markets. These are still two of the premier sports towns and fan bases in the midwest. This could be the first World Series in a while where the two managers could be the biggest stars. The Leyland-LaRussa friendship is well-documented and we'll surely be hit over the head with it. I didn't realize that this series will feature two managers with the most combined wins in the history of the World Series. Both are very accomplished guys with multiple teams but only one ring each. Both managers' decisions throughout the series will be looked under the magnifying glass and I think the one who pushes the right buttons, their team will win. I don't think either team can win by themselves.

The rematch of 1968 and 1934 are another nice subplot. Only a few players were even born when they played in '68. It doesn't affect the play on the field but at least there is a built-in history between the Tigers and Cardinals in the World Series. I don't know if it's quite like the Yankees-Dodgers or Reds-A's rivalries but this is a nice historical matchup. I don't think we'll see a starting pitcher win 3 games like Mickey Lolich or see someone come from down 3-1 to win the series. That series had several greats of the game...Gibson, Kaline, Brock...this series at least has Pujols and Pudge.

Former Tigers and Cards on both sides...Weaver and Encarnacion, two former highly-touted prospects with the Tigers face their old foes. There's a possibility of a Weaver-Bonderman matchup at some point...both guys were traded for each other. On the Tigers, Pujols' old buddy Polanco is coming the high of winning ALCS MVP.

Onto the series itself...one team coming off a tough 7-game series that came down to the 9th inning to decide it and another team that is on probably its best roll of the season but has had a week to rest. The Tigers have only gone twice through their 4-man rotation...while the Cardinals' top starters will have their 5th starts in the first go-around. The rest vs. rust factor will be in question for the Tigers until that first game. Casey and Zumaya were able to nurse their injuries and are ready for the start of the series. Also playing at home should help them out...they've yet to lose at Comerica in the playoffs. The pressure will be on them to win both at home with 3 games in a row at NEW Busch Stadium. Win both games at home so the pressure won't be on them if they lose two or three in St. Louis.

Rotations are fairly even...at least from the standpoint that Carpenter is the best pure pitcher in the series and Weaver and Suppan have been strong in the playoffs. Rogers is the best pitcher in the playoffs...yet to yield a run or earned run. The rotation is set for him to start twice at home...Games 2 and 6. Verlander is an interesting choice for Game 1. He and Robertson have the highest ERAs on the team through the first two rounds and has average just 5-1/3 innings in his starts. I guess with the rest, Leyland can use his 'pen in the opener with the new working-class hero Rogers following up in Game 2 and his ability to go 7-8 strong innings. Verlander is more than able to go long into a game but he just hasn't pitched well enough for Leyland to allow him to.

The Cardinals have a much better lineup than they've been showing. Edmonds and Rolen aren't helping Pujols that much. Spiezio is a great postseason hitter...I'd imagine he'll be the DH for the games in Detroit. With Casey's return, the Tigers can return to their everyday 8 with Thames or Gomez as the DH. They won't miss a beat in the games in St. Louis since their DH isn't their best hitter and Leyland is a long-time NL manager and knows how to handle a lineup with the pitcher hitting and juggling the bullpen and pinch hitters. There really isn't any trick you can slip by the gray-haired one. The Cardinals seem unsettled in the corner outfield spots. Leyland alternating lefty-righty-lefty-righty with his starters makes it so LaRussa might have to change his lineup for each situation. I just think Leyland is making all the right moves so far in the playoffs and LaRussa has not had great success in the World Series. Leyland has been there only once but he's won that one appearance. Both guys know each other's tendencies but Leyland is doing the better job of leading his club to this point.

The Cardinals have been unfortunate to run into the Red Sox buzz saw two years ago and now this year's darlings, the Tigers, in the World Series. They've been the forgotten side but I don't anticipate the Tigers looking past them like most of the nation and TigerFans are doing. It should be a well-pitched series where I think the games could ultimately come down to the bullpens and the ability for both teams to hit in the clutch and drive in runs when they have the opportunity. Neither side is a bloop and a blast team...they play the game the right way with situational hitting and sacrificing runners over. You've got to be able to drive in those runners on second and third with less than 2 outs or pay for it later. I'm picturing a few 3-2 and 2-1 games in this series but I just think the Tigers are riding a great high and will complete their storybook season with their 5 world championship.

Tigers in 6

GO TIGERS!

JCT · Post by **JCT** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:15 pm

Tigers 4-0.

25 dead, 30 million in damages in the ensuing riots.

Bizzarofelice · Post by **Bizzarofelice** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:55 pm

Tigers pitching = hard throwers
Cards hitting = impatient

Is Comerica still a pitcher's park? I know they drew the fences in, but by how much? Also, the ball won't carry much in the snow. This should help the 4th err opening game starter Reyes/Marquis.

The DH will be Dead Red Duncan. Throw him a fastball for fun.

Adelpiero · Post by **Adelpiero** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:22 pm

you cardinals better go 5, cocksuckers.

im always in for sig bet

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:36 pm

Rotations have been announced:
Game 1 - Verlander vs. Reyes (Advantage: Tigers)
Game 2 - Rogers vs. Weaver (Advantage: Tigers)
Game 3 - Robertson vs. Carpenter (Advantage: Cardinals)
Game 4 - Bonderman vs. Suppan (Advantage: PUSH)

Adelpiero · Post by **Adelpiero** » Fri Oct 20, 2006 10:24 pm

people are getting bids of 500-700 for SRO tickets.

fuck this, i might put my game up for sale sec 172 should fetch 12-1500+ for 2 tickets.

nsh, haven't been to WS since 87, and with this ownership, it could be a long time before they get back again. the blues might win a stanley cup before the cards get back

i am selling 2 of my 4 seats to frozen 4 in stl. hopefully michigan,boston, bc, etc all make it, the tickets will be worth some nice coin, for the 3 game set.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Fri Oct 20, 2006 11:58 pm

Adelpiero wrote:hopefully michigan,boston, bc, etc all make it

Heh. Good luck on that one. The CCHA has pretty much become the MAC of college hockey.

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 9:02 am

Tigers in 5

fix · Post by **fix** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 3:11 pm

Tigers in 6

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 3:35 pm

Not a JaysFan anymore? :wink:

fix · Post by **fix** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 3:55 pm

Shoalzie wrote:Not a JaysFan anymore? :wink:

Not until next season. They've made great strides this year. But there's the matter of resigning Vernon Wells that's going to have a huge effect on just how good they'll be next year.

If they can't sign him.. they have to trade him for someone of equal value.
And that's going to be hard to do...

Justa Heel · Post by **Justa Heel** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 4:36 am

JCT wrote:Tigers 4-0.

Wrong buttfuck.

JCT · Post by **JCT** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 2:07 pm

Oh look some jackoff following me around looking for a cock to suck.

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Sun Oct 22, 2006 2:47 pm

Props to Reyes...I'm sure I wasn't the only person that sold him short as being a legitimate Game 1 starter. Verlander is only a rookie and likely the AL Rookie of the Year but this guy has not really impressed me much in the postseason. I look at this as a blown opportunity for the Tigers...the Cards throw their 4th or 5th starter in Game 1 and steal a win on the road. I'm almost glad they smoked the Tigers last night...hopefully that's a huge wake up call for them. Gotta hope for another gutty effort by Rogers tonight to avoid going putting themselves in a hole possibly too big to climb out of.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Mon Oct 23, 2006 1:52 am

Eckstein really needs to learn how to throw the ball to 1st base.

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 1:20 pm

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:Eckstein really needs to learn how to throw the ball to 1st base.

He does put quite a hump on his throws, doesn't he?

Props to Rogers on another stellar effort. All speculation aside about the substance on his hand...he still kicked ass after the umps had him clean off hand...he was still dealing out there. He was the perfect guy to throw following that bad loss in Game 1. The momentum somewhat turns back in the Tigers' favor heading to St. Louis. Maybe not quite like when they lost Game 1 and won Game 2 against New York but this is a decent position to be in with 3 straight games at NEW Busch. Win at least one game there to get it back to Detroit and win this thing at home.

Bizzarofelice · Post by **Bizzarofelice** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 2:17 pm

Shoalzie wrote:he still kicked ass after the umps had him clean off hand

It was the glove that had it. The hand just got residual.

Pine tar hype takes away any momentum either team had.

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 2:45 pm

Bizzarofelice wrote:
Shoalzie wrote:he still kicked ass after the umps had him clean off hand
It was the glove that had it. The hand just got residual.

Pine tar hype takes away any momentum either team had.

It's the hot topic on Detroit radio this morning...I'd imagine radio in the STL is ready to riot is something isn't done. This situation could get ugly. Just have to wonder why Rogers wasn't called out on against New York and Oakland and why did Fox have the footage and pictures already prepared showing the evidence from those other two starts. The whole idea of Leyland and LaRussa being friends is being put in question...would LaRussa had ratted out Rogers if he and Leyland weren't close friends. The talk over the next 36 hours will clearly be about Rogers and not about Carpenter vs. Robertson.

jiminphilly · Post by **jiminphilly** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 2:55 pm

Shoalzie wrote: Just have to wonder why Rogers wasn't called out on against New York and Oakland and why did Fox have the footage and pictures already prepared showing the evidence from those other two starts.

No joke.. I fell asleep during the game.. did Fox have footage showing his brownish hand from his other starts?

Bizzarofelice · Post by **Bizzarofelice** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 3:01 pm

In the 314 they're replaying McCarver talking about it and in the 9th inning McCarver talking about how Rogers isn't letting go of his glove. Also that the ump was asked to look at a ball but before the ump got it Pudge threw that ball not to the ballboy but to the Tigers dugout.

Press has one unnamed cardinal player saying that he and John Rodriguez noticed a lot of discolored balls as well as strange movement. John Rodriguez, when directly asked, said that he was following Tony's lead on not pressing the issue.

Callers are saying they say a big discolored smudge on the back of the guy's hat.

I guess the Cards have some crooked pitchers that Tony doesn't want exposed. Lord knows Leyland knows our pitchers well.

Mikey · Post by **Mikey** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 3:12 pm

jiminphilly wrote:
Shoalzie wrote: Just have to wonder why Rogers wasn't called out on against New York and Oakland and why did Fox have the footage and pictures already prepared showing the evidence from those other two starts.
No joke.. I fell asleep during the game.. did Fox have footage showing his brownish hand from his other starts?

Is Rogers Muslim?

jiminphilly · Post by **jiminphilly** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 3:39 pm

Bizzarofelice wrote:In the 314 they're replaying McCarver talking about it and in the 9th inning McCarver talking about how Rogers isn't letting go of his glove. Also that the ump was asked to look at a ball but before the ump got it Pudge threw that ball not to the ballboy but to the Tigers dugout.

Press has one unnamed cardinal player saying that he and John Rodriguez noticed a lot of discolored balls as well as strange movement. John Rodriguez, when directly asked, said that he was following Tony's lead on not pressing the issue.

Callers are saying they say a big discolored smudge on the back of the guy's hat.

I guess the Cards have some crooked pitchers that Tony doesn't want exposed. Lord knows Leyland knows our pitchers well.

Though this whole thing with Rogers smells fishy, the only counterpoint I have is this. If Rogers did have pinetar or some other substance in his glove and washed it off his hands the first time, wouldn't his hand continually gotten dirty/smudged each time he put his hand back in the glove to get the ball? It seemed to stay clean the rest of the game. I'm sure Fox had a camera on that hand the entire game and likewise I, sure the Cardinals were watching him like a hawk. Once a pitcher starts changing the nuisances of his windup, he's asking for trouble. Rogers still pitched a great game which makes me think he changed nothing.

Jack · Post by **Jack** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 3:48 pm

jiminphilly wrote: Rogers still pitched a great game which makes me think he changed nothing.

I wouldn't be shocked if Rogers cheated but he did pitch a MONSTER of a game.

You know the umps were checking his balls throughout the night and they didn't see anything!

Mikey · Post by **Mikey** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 3:50 pm

Jack wrote:
You know the umps were checking his balls throughout the night and they didn't see anything!

Doesn't that go just a little bit beyond what an umpire should be expected to do?

jiminphilly · Post by **jiminphilly** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 5:49 pm

Ok, talked to a friend who has some connections with the Phillies ground crew.. here is what he told me.. the dirt they use on the field is called Dimatex (its a mixture of dirt and other materials..) Rosin mixed with that dirt will make the dirt turn yellow, much like it looked on Rogers' hand. It wasn't pine tar. PT is blackish-brown and a pitcher would need a lot of it to have it do anything to the ball. (but a little bit would give a better grip).

It had rained that night and Buck said it could be snowing by the end of the night so there was moisture thus making trips to the rosin necessary.

My feeling? Rogers wasn't trying to do anything to the ball. Was he trying to improve his grip? Probably and pitchers throughout history have tried different concoctions to give them a better grip.

Rogers is an asshole and isn't well liked by fans outside of Detroit and the media would like nothing more than to get this guy going b/c he is an emotional basketcase. Had this been Glavine it wouldn't be as big a deal.

Eaglebauer · Post by **Eaglebauer** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 5:57 pm

jiminphilly wrote: It had rained that night and Buck said it could be snowing by the end of the night so there was moisture thus making trips to the rosin necessary.

Well, Fox did have footage of the same thing from the last three outings.

Also, Rogers' fishy reactions make me more suspicious of the whole thing than I would have been otherwise.

JCT · Post by **JCT** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 7:17 pm

Shiny greasy looking dirt... OK.

Adelpiero · Post by **Adelpiero** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 10:36 pm

larussa is a pussy for not pressing it

fuck leyland and his freindship, if rogers is cheating burry him.

larussa makes me so ill.

Adelpiero · Post by **Adelpiero** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 10:39 pm

to say larussa found out later isa sham. as soon as fox noticed it, i know larussa and the gang were notified.

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Mon Oct 23, 2006 11:46 pm

Here's my overall take on this...

If Kenny is cheating, that definitely puts a damper on what has been a pleasant surprise in the playoffs. It would really be no different than a corked bat. Pitchers are allowed to do certain things in cold weather that they can't do in warmer weather...such as go to their mouth or blow into their hand while on the mound or the rubber. Under no circumstance should you be allowed to put a sticky substance on your hands to improve your grip. Untiil it is proven that is what he did, I won't pound on him for it. It's no different than holding out judgement when a player is rumored to be on the juice. Until they are caught and punished, they haven't done anything wrong under the law of baseball. Whether the substance was washed away after the second inning or not, the issue wasn't protested by LaRussa or the Cardinals. CardinalFan should be just as upset at their own team and the umps for not punishing Rogers as they should be upset at Rogers himself. I'm sure he's not the only pitcher who has done this but he is in question because the he was caught brown-handed, so to speak. If in Game 6 he's still doing the same thing and LaRussa and the umps flag him for it and throw him out, than it is shame on Kenny. I don't want this World Series to be tainted by this but given the media really has no interest in either team, the biggest story probably to come out of this matchup will be whether not Rogers was doctoring the baseball with the mysterious substance. Fox and ESPN are taking it upon themselves to try to get to the bottom of this and in the end, it is possible that Rogers hadn't done anything wrong. Selig hasn't done a good job at taking care of problems like this and he's got to deal with the public outcry of another scandal if he's allowing these sorts of things to go unchecked.

Bizzarofelice · Post by **Bizzarofelice** » Tue Oct 24, 2006 2:03 pm

Shoalzie wrote:It's no different than holding out judgement when a player is rumored to be on the juice.

Actually, players are thrown out of games for mere suspicion for doctoring the balls. They don't have a great big scientific study of the event. The ump throws them out and MLB backs it up with a suspension based solely upon the discretion of the ump. In 2004 Julian Tavarez was thrown out and suspended despite the ump not confiscating the hat. Later tests proved Tavarez's hat was dirty but not doctored. This did not reverse the suspension.

Obviously, the juice can't be determined without blood or piss tests. Kind of a different scenario.

And yes, Cardsfan is more upset at LaRussa than anybody. Getting Rogers kicked out would have meant the Tigers going to another starter not expected or straining their bullpen. Tactical advantage was to be had, and LaRussa played "happy old timey baseball guy" instead.