Michigan - Michigan State

BlindRef · Post by **BlindRef** » Tue Feb 13, 2007 3:13 pm

Hey...Michigan and Michigan State play tonight...

Go Blue I guess.

(sigh)

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Tue Feb 13, 2007 6:02 pm

I'll be watching the Underachiever's Invitational tonight.

The win over Minny snapped Michigan's losing streak. MSU's is still going strong. Should be a close, ugly game.

MSU 68
Michigan 65

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Tue Feb 13, 2007 8:00 pm

I don't think Michigan State is underachieving, but Michigan is. There's not a lot of talent on Sparty this year. I see no shooters (besides Marshall Mathers) and no great inside players. I had courtside seats for the Iowa-Michigan State game a month ago, and from courtside, it sure as heck looked like Iowa was a much more talented team. And I've seen Sparty on TV quite a few times and have not been impressed with many players on that squad.

Now, Michigan on the other hand.......well, the only thing I can say is Tommy Amacker might be the worst coach ever. Has anyone ever been blessed with so much talent in a 5-6 year span and still not be able to make a single NCAA tournament? They play such uninspiring basketball. I remember after the Iowa game, one of our assistants commented on the radio that Michigan looks like an NBA team in warmups but once the game starts everything changes. Shows what lousy coaching Amacker has done.

Pick for tonight.......

Sparty 59
Meechigan 51

Teams shoot a combined 42% from the field and 30% from 3-pt. A combined 38 turnovers. Michigan quits down the stretch and Sparty pulls away at the end in a game that's close for 35 minutes.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Tue Feb 13, 2007 8:13 pm

TheJON wrote:I had courtside seats for the Iowa-Michigan State game

Just scored courtside seats for this Saturday's Iowa game at the Breslin...

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Tue Feb 13, 2007 8:19 pm

This is probably our best chance to win at the Breslin since 1993. We NEVER play well there. I'm curious to see the average margin of defeat in the last 10 games at the Breslin. Probably at least 18 points. But I think this year ends that streak. If we have ANY chance of making the tourney, we gotta win that game. And I think we will.

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Tue Feb 13, 2007 9:53 pm

This should be considered as an elimination game for both teams or if one team wins both games of this series, the other team will probably need to make plans for the NIT. Clearly both won't be going to the tournament and possibly neither will if Michigan doesn't pretty much win out the rest of the way and if State can't pull out of their tailspin and beat the likes of Wisconsin (home and home), Indiana and Iowa coming up. The game against Iowa at Breslin could determine that 4th bid coming out of the conference. State needs to get that conference record back over .500 to help their cause.

M Club · Post by **M Club** » Tue Feb 13, 2007 11:35 pm

uhhh... huge bball fan that i am, i just looked at umich's last six games. realistically, they should prolly go .500: split with state, beat minn, pull a mild upset over indiana or illi (you have to win one decent game during the season... the illi win was at home). yeah, realistically. too bad there's amakaristically: umich finishes out 1-5 and the douce gets an extension b/c 18-13 means we're on the right track.

state 118
umich 23 (avery mcqueen drops 17)

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Wed Feb 14, 2007 9:14 pm

I can't figure out why some folks around here are suddenly referring to Drew Neitzel as a "scorer."

He may have the most misleading stats in America. Sure, he has doubled his points per game, but he has done very little to increase his scoring "ability." He's just jacking up more jumpers. More 3s, mostly. That's about it. He's simply increasing his LOAs, which is turning into more points per night. He does do a decent job of creating space for these shots, so they're not ill-advised, but he's still no scorer of the basketball. He still doesn't have the muscle, or ability to really attack the basket. Team's know what he's going to do. He's still hesitant, and looks uncomfortable penetrating. It appears, sometimes, he makes good quick moves to the basket, moves that he'll finish, or at least draw a foul from, but he ends up kicking it out to a guy on the wing. That game winner against Texas was a total abnormality.

Shine · Post by **Shine** » Wed Feb 14, 2007 9:33 pm

To me it speaks volumes to how down MSU is this year that Neitzel is DA MAN for them. He's a nice player when he's the #2 or #3 guy but he just isn't the #1 of a dominant team.

I think Izzo has done a great job this year personally, as before the season started I had MSU down for a 7-9 conference record and a trip to the NIT. They have a great class coming in next year so the "down period" will be brief.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Wed Feb 14, 2007 9:39 pm

Shine wrote:To me it speaks volumes to how down MSU is this year that Neitzel is DA MAN for them.

Exactly. Even more telling I think is that Naymick is a starter. If I was a captain of a pick-up basketball game in a gym full of mentally retarded paraplegics, I'd probably still pick him last.

Scratch that, I'd play a man short.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Wed Feb 14, 2007 9:52 pm

But yeah, JON's probably right about how State isn't actually underachieving. I just think State fans have been spoiled with what Izzo has been able to do with his teams in recent years. It seems at least getting a bid to the Tourney is a given, and shouldn't be questioned, even in rebuilding years where freshmen and sophomores are expected to play well. Losing Shannon Brown early was a real killer.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Thu Feb 15, 2007 3:59 pm

Yep, I think had Shannon Brown stayed, Sparty would have at least 2 more wins right now. The backcourt combo of Marshall Mathers and Shannon Brown would be very good.

Saturday's Iowa-Michigan State game could inevitably decide the #4 team from the Big-10. Michigan State has the upper hand right now because of their much better record, but the schedule the rest of the way is going to be very tough. I think if they lose to Iowa, they may not win more than 1 game the rest of the way. On the other hand, Iowa could get to 8-5 in the Big-10 (assuming we beat Northwestern tonight) with a win over Sparty and their schedule is much easier than State's. Illinois right now probably has a better resume than Iowa, but we get them at home to end the season and I cannot see them going into Carver and winning. So I think we could eliminate them with that win. Purdue is not dead either, especially if they beat Indiana tonight. But, like Illinois, we get them at home. I also cannot see them winning in Carver. So I think a win by Iowa against Purdue would give Iowa the edge over the Boilers. Our other game is Penn State in Happy Valley, and I doubt we lose that game. So, realistically, if we can beat MSU on Saturday, this team can go 11-5 in conference and that would seal a berth in the NCAA tournament. Now, if we end up 10-6, I think we'll need 2 Big-10 tourney wins to get in.

A win on Saturday by Sparty means they're probably only going to need 1 more victory to get in. A win by Iowa, and we'll be setting ourselves up nicely for a late run at the tourney. A lot on the line.

Prediction......

Close game most of the way, but Iowa has more perimeter shooters that can knock down shots late in the game and also better free-throw shooters down the stretch. Iowa pulls this one out 63-58.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Thu Feb 15, 2007 7:26 pm

Saturday's game, and the Michigan game are must wins for State, because they probably need 2 more wins to feel safe, and those are games they can actually win. I definitely see them losing to Wisconsin twice, as well as IU even though they've got them at the Breslin.

helmet · Post by **helmet** » Thu Feb 15, 2007 9:13 pm

Anyone else miss Babs?

I sure don't.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Fri Feb 16, 2007 5:12 pm

I miss Babs.......Iowa has a 4 game winning streak against Sparty and we can make it 5 tomorrow. So yeah, right now, I kinda miss him/her/whatever.

Shine · Post by **Shine** » Sat Feb 17, 2007 3:12 am

Since this thread has turned into a Big 10 thread of sorts, IU is in big trouble. Earl Calloway got hurt against PU and Lance Stemler was hurt in practice leading up to that game. Neither will be back for the game Saturday with scUM, so despite the talents of "coach" Amaker I think the Wolverines get the W. No chance even with those guys back they head into Breslin for the ESPN primetime game and get a W there. IU needs to beat NW to get to 10-6 in conference.

As for Illannoy, with their players driving drunk into trees and banging their teammates domes up and then failing to call for help for over 2 hours to try and sober up I'd expect them to falter down the stretch.

Oh and noJ can you please stop calling Neitzel Marshall Mathers since those guys look about as much alike as Ahnold and DeVito did in 'Twins'.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Sat Feb 17, 2007 11:36 pm

Shine wrote:Oh and noJ can you please stop calling Neitzel Marshall Mathers since those guys look about as much alike as Ahnold and DeVito did in 'Twins'.

No shit. They're both white. That's about the only similarity I see.

Anyway, just got back from East Lansing where I saw State beat up on Iowa at the Breslin...yet again. Good lord, what a drubbing. The Hawks were never in the game, even remotely, at any point. That was by far the best I've seen MSU play all year - especially offensively. This game was just a classic case of shots falling from anywhere on the floor for State, while Iowa was tossing up bricks, and all-around poor shots on every possession. I was extremely unimpressed with Haluska for Iowa. Freshman Raymour Morgan really stepped up huge. Hopes are much higher now going into the Wisconsin game.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Sun Feb 18, 2007 6:26 pm

Mace wrote:Haluska's poor performance reflected the great defense being played by the Spartans, not his lack of ability.

It was a combination of both. Yeah, State had the clamps down on him, but he still chose to force up horrible shots that had no chance.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Sun Feb 18, 2007 6:45 pm

Nope, not saying Haluska isn't a good player. Just that he didn't impress me that day. He missed open looks, as well. Just one of those days, I guess.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Feb 19, 2007 2:59 pm

All I know is that was fucking pathetic and completely inexcuseable for a team that is trying to make it to the tournament. There was no hustle, poor shot selection, poor passing, and we played absolutely no defense. Michigan State is a terrible offensive team and to allow them to start the game 23-32 from the field is ridiculous. This team needs to forget about this one and go out and win the last 3 games and then get a minimum of 1 game in the BTT. Otherwise, NIT here we come.

Nice game Sparty.......now tell me why the fuck they have to play their best game of the year every fucking year against Iowa at home??? Everytime we go into the Breslin, all Sparty has to do is fire up a shot at the rim and it goes it. It's like it's Pleasantville or something. Iowa has had a lot of success lately in Carver or on a neutral court against MSU but we go into the Breslin and lose by 20+ points every year. It's one of those unexplainable things.

Shine · Post by **Shine** » Mon Feb 19, 2007 8:43 pm

TheJON wrote:Iowa has had a lot of success lately in Carver or on a neutral court against MSU but we go into the Breslin and lose by 20+ points every year. It's one of those unexplainable things.

Yeah that's a real head scratcher. Why is it that a team fares better at home than they do on the road?? Truly baffling. I'm just glad that bizarre phenomenon doesn't apply to IU.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Feb 19, 2007 9:10 pm

You're misunderstanding, Shine.....

We've actually played decent on the road as of late. But it makes no sense for a team to go on a neutral court or home court the last couple of years and clearly be superior to another team and then go on the road to that team and lose by 30+ points. Last year, Iowa was 2-0 vs Michigan State away from the Breslin and a MUCH better team. We go to the Breslin and lose 85-55. This year, we were clearly a better team at Carver and lose 81-49 at the Breslin. Now, I realize there's going to be a difference between home, road, and neutral........but come on, losing by 30 points to a team you are either better than or equal to??? We haven't won there since 1993 and lose by about 20 or more points every year. This just makes no sense to me. We go up there and Sparty can't miss. It's like that every year. Their best game of the season is when Iowa comes to town and I can't quite figure that out.

I'm sure you've watched Michigan State multiple times this year.........so if I were to tell you that Sparty started the game 23-32 from the field (9-13 from 3pt range), your response would be "no way, no how." We'll probably face them in the BTT and beat them by 10. I've just never seen such a disparity between home, road, and neutral that I do in the Iowa-Michigan State series over the past 10-15 years.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Mon Feb 19, 2007 9:14 pm

The only conclusive thing I can tell you JON, is that, quite simply...

The Breslin is in Iowa's dome.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Tue Feb 20, 2007 11:55 pm

Yeah, that's a big part of it, Mgo.........but what's with Sparty shooting out of their minds everytime Iowa comes to town?

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Wed Feb 21, 2007 3:15 am

RACK STATE! (won over wisky)

Turning it on late in the season. That's how Izzo rolls.

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Wed Feb 21, 2007 4:22 am

If they aren't in now with that win, they should really lock up a spot with a win over Indiana this weekend.

Shine · Post by **Shine** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 3:09 am

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote: Turning it on late in the season. That's how Izzo rolls.

While I mostly agree I think it should be pointed out that more often than not in recent years MSU has had a road heavy front portion of their B10 schedule and a home heavy second half. That in and of itself would lead to better records down the stretch. Again, Izzo is a great coach but some of the apparent late season boom can be attributed to home games.

As for the IU game tomorrow, I'm just hoping IU can keep it respectable.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Sat Feb 24, 2007 5:44 pm

True, the two road games @ Michigan, and @ Wisconsin to end the regular season will be more telling.

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Sun Feb 25, 2007 4:21 am

Put in stone, State is in the tourney. Another great win...

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Sun Feb 25, 2007 7:23 pm

Huge win. Missed most of the game, unfortunately.

I'll be tuned in to Wisconsin-OSU. Should be a good one.

Shine · Post by **Shine** » Mon Feb 26, 2007 8:33 pm

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:Huge win. Missed most of the game, unfortunately.

Best/quick summary.

IU aggressive early forcing lots of TO's. Walton out with foul trouble helps limit Neitzel early. IU hot from the outside. IU 10 point halftime lead.

MSU the aggressor now and Neitzel heating up. IU now making the careless TO's. MSU controls IU's outside looks and continues to dominate DJ White inside. MSU runs away with the thing.

I really hope Calloway is able to come back healthy and SOON because IU just isn't an effective offense without him running the show. For a true frosh I LOVE the heart Bassett has but he's a shoot first kid and doesn't initiate the offense well right now. We prolly still would have lost to MSU with Earl in the lineup but we'd have beaten scUM with him for sure.

Given the mess POS Mike Davis left behind if IU can win their final 2 to go 20-9/10-6 that is a great start to the Coach Sampson era at IU. The talent level amps up starting next year.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Tue Feb 27, 2007 11:33 pm

Michigan - Michigan State part deux, tonight at 7 EST...

Whattya say Wolverine-ees? Do you give your boys a chance?

Michigan St - 63
Michigan - 57

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Wed Feb 28, 2007 12:45 am

Didn't know Neitzel was under the weather. Don't know how much, if at all, that would've changed my prediction though.

Michigan's hitting some real tough baskets, with State draped all over them, as per usual on defense.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:06 am

Jaysus. A 100% Neitzel wouldn't have made a huge difference. Harris was a beast tonight. That was the most spirited I've seen Michigan play all year.

Funny how (basically) being on the brink of elimination will do that to a team.

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Wed Feb 28, 2007 3:07 am

Michigan definitely needed that game more than the Spartans. That middle pack of 6 teams in that 9 to 7 wins range will need any extra win they can squeeze out of this season. At this time of year, all wins are huge.

Shine · Post by **Shine** » Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:16 pm

Mgo- Neitzel was under the weather for the IU game as well and it didn't seem to bother him much that game.

As for that game I'm sort of glad that scUM won because it increases the chances that Tommy Amaker will be back next year. Anything that keeps him in Ann Arbor for as long as possible is a good thing.

Quick Big 10 note-

The conference is pretty easy to peg this year: top 2, middle 6, bottom 3. Take away the top 2 and this is how the rest have fared against one another.

There has only been 1 loss by a middle 6 team to a bottom 3 team, PU at Minnesota.

There has only been 1 middle 6 team to win a road game against a fellow middle 6 team, Iowa at Michigan.

M Club · Post by **M Club** » Wed Feb 28, 2007 9:22 pm

Shine wrote:As for that game I'm sort of glad that scUM won because it increases the chances that Tommy Amaker will be back next year. Anything that keeps him in Ann Arbor for as long as possible is a good thing.

dick.

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 7:20 pm

I guess this has become the unofficial State thread...

Great finish between the Spartans and Badgers. Clutch shot by Taylor and Neitzel had a chance at the very end to win it. Even with back to back losses to end the year...I think State is in the Dance. That would've been a great notch in their belt to have the season sweep over Wisconsin and end their home winning streak at Kohl Center.

I have to admit...without Babs around, it's much easier to give compliments to State. Obnoxious fans make it difficult to say nice things about a rival team. I'm not hesitant to give State props when they earn it.

WolverineSteve · Post by **WolverineSteve** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 7:43 pm

Fuck State.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Sat Mar 03, 2007 7:49 pm

Looks like I'm going to the Michigan-Ohio St game this afternoon.

This bend-over-fest should be comical.

Fuck Michigan.