Communism, working well

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Mister Bushice
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Communism, working well

Post by Mister Bushice »

With the emergency assistance of western democracies, that is:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/nkorea_us_aid" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

By BURT HERMAN, Associated Press Writer

SEOUL, South Korea - A U.S. ship carrying thousands of tons of food aid has arrived in North Korea, after the communist nation agreed to expanded international assistance for its impoverished people, the U.N. food agency said Monday.

The World Food Program said the American ship that arrived Sunday carried 37,000 tons of wheat, the first installment of 500,000 tons in promised U.S. aid that will be distributed by the United Nations.

The aid was not directly related to the ongoing nuclear talks between Washington and Pyongyang, as the U.S. says it does not use food as a means of diplomatic coercion. However, the shipment came just days after the North handed over its delayed atomic declaration and blew up the cooling tower at its main reactor site.

In exchange, Washington has removed some economic sanctions against the North and said it would remove the country from a U.S. State Department list of state sponsors of terrorism.

Sunday's wheat shipment will be enough for the WFP to expand its operations to feed more than 5 million people, up from 1.2 million people now getting international aid.

The increased aid comes as the WFP and other groups have issued increasingly dire warnings about the food situation in the North.

The country's regular annual shortages were expected to worsen this year due to floods last summer that decimated the North's agricultural heartland. The U.N. Food and Agricultural Organization has said North Korea's cereal crop will fall more than 1.5 million tons short this year, its largest food gap since 2001.

Shortages have already led to prices soaring at the markets to which North Koreans who can afford it turn to when public rations fail to provide enough food for their families.

The U.N. agencies are conducting a food survey expected to be ready in July to determine where to distribute the aid, but the WFP said preliminary reports "indicate a high level of food insecurity in the country."

The North has long bristled at the monitoring requirements of international donors to make sure that the food is reaching the needy. However, the WFP said that North Korea had permitted the agency to sent nearly 50 more international workers to the country for monitoring.

"The challenge will now be to put words into action and quickly expand distributions of badly needed food aid to the hungriest people" of North Korea, Jean-Pierre de Margerie, WFP's Pyongyang-based country director, said in a statement.

The U.S. is the largest donor to the WFP's aid program in North Korea, having pledged $38.9 million, followed by South Korea at $20 million.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Mister Bushice wrote:The aid was not directly related to the ongoing nuclear talks between Washington and Pyongyang, as the U.S. says it does not use food as a means of diplomatic coercion.
Q: Why does the U.S. ship grain as food aid to a country that has used rice as a staple for millennium?

A: Part of the IMF "economic hit-team" plan to make N. Korea dependent on Western food and strangle that country into submission.

"...it does not use food as a means of diplomatic coercion."

Half a million dead Iraqi children would beg to differ.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Martyred wrote:
Mister Bushice wrote:The aid was not directly related to the ongoing nuclear talks between Washington and Pyongyang, as the U.S. says it does not use food as a means of diplomatic coercion.
Q: Why does the U.S. ship grain as food aid to a country that has used rice as a staple for millennium?

I do believe that rice is a grain, dumbass. Also, we send them wheat because we grow alot of fukking wheat. We do not grow as much rice

A: Part of the IMF "economic hit-team" plan to make N. Korea dependent on Western food and strangle that country into submission.

same old tired ass "communism would work fine if the evil capitalist stopped fukking with it" routine.

"...it does not use food as a means of diplomatic coercion."

Half a million dead Iraqi children would beg to differ.
Who killed those kids again?
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Re: Communism, working well

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Martyred wrote:Q: Why does the U.S. ship grain as food aid to a country that has used rice as a staple for millennium?.
What... you're questioning the infallibiliy of Central Planning?
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Re: Communism, working well

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Martyred wrote:
Mister Bushice wrote:The aid was not directly related to the ongoing nuclear talks between Washington and Pyongyang, as the U.S. says it does not use food as a means of diplomatic coercion.
Q: Why does the U.S. ship grain as food aid to a country that has used rice as a staple for millennium?
Gee I don't know - a complete lack of rice paddies in the US maybe? Starving people don't complain much perhaps?
A: Part of the IMF "economic hit-team" plan to make N. Korea dependent on Western food and strangle that country into submission.
Which would not be necessary if North Korea wasn't so fucked up.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Uh...maybe you dolts didn't realize this but....rice is a grain.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Mister Bushice wrote:
Gee I don't know - a complete lack of rice paddies in the US maybe?
The US is the third largest rice exporter, behind Thailand and Vietnam.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Well they specified "Wheat"

But, oh shit. I forgot you were on Jeopardy. :)

Where do we grow all this rice, Alfred?
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Re: Communism, working well

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Monsanto is a covert defense contractor. Should be anyway :lol:

So they get hooked on American technology. Seems like a fair trade to me. We'll continue to be hooked on your watches that can turn into motorcycles while you in turn are hooked on our food.


Air is next. I think it was in a movie once, if I have Total Recall.
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Re: Communism, working well

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The country's regular annual shortages were expected to worsen this year due to floods last summer that decimated the North's agricultural heartland. The U.N. Food and Agricultural Organization has said North Korea's cereal crop will fall more than 1.5 million tons short this year, its largest food gap since 2001.
That's the qualifying bit of the article, there's a dearth of arable land and it's been decimated by rotating floods followed by drought, year after year since 1996. The climate is extremely harsh, an offshoot being that there are problems similar to the ones that California is experiencing from trying to adapt land that isn't suited to growing, resulting in mudslides, etc - I'd have to look up the details.

Also keep in mind that oil has been sanctioned and energy production has collapsed, it's affected every part of the economy resulting in a very limited inputs of fertilisers, quality seeds, fuel and energy and a limited capacity to import food on commercial terms. Most fundraising drives for the country go into funds for fertiliser production.

If energy supply in the United States were to be cut, I can only imagine the sort of chaos that would insue.
The author of the article doesn't qualify anything, it's fit for a comic book. The tiniest of paragraphs could give a background in full, it has very little to do with the fact that the country is communist.

It's trying to portray the DPRK as a hapless beggar when the fact of the matter is, the Bush administration is seeking a legacy and it's chosen to invent some sort of fictitious victory over the DPRK when the fact of the matter is, the DPRK has been calling the diplomatic shots and controlling it's political relationship with the United States for the past two years.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Dr_Phibes wrote: It's trying to portray the DPRK as a hapless beggar when the fact of the matter is, the Bush administration is seeking a legacy and it's chosen to invent some sort of fictitious victory over the DPRK when the fact of the matter is, the DPRK has been calling the diplomatic shots and controlling it's political relationship with the United States for the past two years.
Hilarious.

What color is the sky in your Orwellian world?
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Re: Communism, working well

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War Wagon wrote: Hilarious.

What color is the sky in your Orwellian world?
In terms of action/reaction, absolutely.

What I'm wondering is, how do you get removed from a 'state sponser of terror' list overnight? Either you are, or you aren't - either you sponser terror, or you don't. How does blowing up an irrelevant cooling tower make you 'not a terrorist', the next day? Every news report says that the destruction of the tower was 'symbolic' and a 'public gesture'. They've still got the weapons and the capacity to make more.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Dr_Phibes wrote: The climate is extremely harsh, an offshoot being that there are problems similar to the ones that California is experiencing from trying to adapt land that isn't suited to growing, resulting in mudslides, etc - I'd have to look up the details.
Yeah, you'd better look shit up before you spew. California has no problem with crop planting, given the LACK of mudslides in the relatively FLAT fertile central valley, productive napa valley, and northern central coast farmland.

P.H.D. my ass.


The mudslides you speak of only affect the dumbfucks with too much money who build homes where wildfires precede said mudslides, like Malibu, or the dipshits who build houses in high risk hillside brush areas in so cal.

Not too many crops growing there. Never have been.
If energy supply in the United States were to be cut, I can only imagine the sort of chaos that would insue.
We would fucking DRILL, DIG, sacrifice, and then prevail, as we always have.

http://minnesota.publicradio.org/displa ... /10/ndoil/

Try and focus on the part where they say "There's been speculation for years about a western North Dakota formation known as the Bakken Shale. The formation extends into Montana and Canada. Geologists have estimated the area holds hundreds of billions of barrels of oil....The USGS study says with todays technology, about 4 billion barrels of oil can be pumped from the Bakken formation."

and...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080630/ap_ ... ionaires_1
State and industry officials say North Dakota is on pace to set a state oil-production record this year, surpassing the 52.6 million barrels produced in 1984. A record number of drill rigs are piercing the prairie and North Dakota has nearly 4,000 active oil wells.
THAT is what we will do, professor.
It's trying to portray the DPRK as a hapless beggar when the fact of the matter is, the Bush administration is seeking a legacy and it's chosen to invent some sort of fictitious victory over the DPRK when the fact of the matter is, the DPRK has been calling the diplomatic shots and controlling it's political relationship with the United States for the past two years.
Blowing up your own nuclear cooling tower is only a step or two above bending over and asking to be fucked up the ass with a sharp stick by a foreign democracy you were threatening a few months earlier.

sayin'
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Re: Communism, working well

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Dr_Phibes wrote: What I'm wondering is, how do you get removed from a 'state sponser of terror' list overnight?
"You scrap a bunch of rusted out old car parts that you claim were part of a uranium-enriching centrifuge. That, and pretend that Pan Am Flight 103 never happened. After that, it's just a matter of letting the World Bank deep-dick your economy,
as you prepare your off-shore accounts."

Sincerely, Libya.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Dr_Phibes wrote: What I'm wondering is, how do you get removed from a 'state sponser of terror' list overnight?
Negotiations had been in progress for months, if not years, and also involved Russia, China, England, and Japan.

It didn't just happen "overnight".

Face it, Feebs. Your ideal utopian society can't even feed itself and is crumbling right before your very tear filled eyes. They're nothing more than a 3rd world country begging for scraps of humanitarian assistance and using their meager nuclear capabilties as a bargaining chip.

They were never really a threat to the U.S. itself but more to the region in general. You should be grateful that America has a big heart and a big wallet and is willing and able to help feed the starving hordes of proletariot.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Martyred wrote:
Dr_Phibes wrote: What I'm wondering is, how do you get removed from a 'state sponser of terror' list overnight?
"You scrap a bunch of rusted out old car parts that you claim were part of a uranium-enriching centrifuge. That, and pretend that Pan Am Flight 103 never happened. After that, it's just a matter of letting the World Bank deep-dick your economy,
as you prepare your off-shore accounts."

Sincerely, Libya.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Mister Bushice wrote: Yeah, you'd better look shit up before you spew.


Well I was thinking specifically about one in La Conchita caused by a massive downpour, it's comparable to things that have happened in the DPRK, albeit on a tiny scale. From the LA Times:
Huge mudslides cascaded into apartment buildings, rising to the third floor and entombing occupants like the victims of Vesuvius before they could think about fleeing. Torrential rains elsewhere in North Korea were said to have swept away cottages without a trace, and large buildings were left with only the supporting pillars still standing.

"The rainfall … was not so much higher than in the past, but there was a problem with soil erosion, they started terracing all the hills to grow crops. The hills are very steep and there is nothing to hold the soil."
My comment on Californian mudslides was an aside to illustrate a point, I have no interest in a pissing contest over who's got better farmland - California or the DPRK, it's irrelevant. It seemed like decent example to give a myopic Californian who can't see beyond the end of his nose.

We would fucking DRILL, DIG, sacrifice, and then prevail, as we always have.
Well I suspect the economy would collapse and you'd suffer from food shortages and the country would implode, but I have no interest in a pissing contest over whose got more oil under ground, that's not the point. The idea that anyone in either country would run out into their backyard and start constructing an oil derrick is bizarre.

Blowing up your own nuclear cooling tower is only a step or two above bending over and asking to be fucked up the ass with a sharp stick by a foreign democracy you were threatening a few months earlier.

sayin'
Not really, it's political theatre. It changes the strategic advantage in no way, shape or form, it means nothing. And the DPRK has never threatened the United States, there have been instances where they've stated that if they were attacked they would defend themselves using any means neccesary and that doesn't seem terribly unreasonable to me.
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Re: Communism, working well

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War Wagon wrote: Negotiations had been in progress for months, if not years, and also involved Russia, China, England, and Japan.

It didn't just happen "overnight".

Face it, Feebs. Your ideal utopian society can't even feed itself and is crumbling right before your very tear filled eyes. They're nothing more than a 3rd world country begging for scraps of humanitarian assistance and using their meager nuclear capabilties as a bargaining chip.

They were never really a threat to the U.S. itself but more to the region in general. You should be grateful that America has a big heart and a big wallet and is willing and able to help feed the starving hordes of proletariot.
Well one evening, the DPRK was on a 'state sponser of terror' list. The next day, they destroyed a cooling tower and they were removed from this list.
That seems odd to me, shouldn't they have been removed from the 'state owners of cooling towers' list?

Or is the label 'terrorist', or 'state sponser of terror' merely a political vehicle? There is quite a difference between owning a cooling tower and providing funds or facilitating 'terrorist' groups.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Dr_Phibes wrote:
Mister Bushice wrote: Yeah, you'd better look shit up before you spew.


Well I was thinking specifically about one in La Conchita caused by a massive downpour, it's comparable to things that have happened in the DPRK, albeit on a tiny scale. From the LA Times:
Bwahahaha!! Have you BEEN to La Conchita? do you KNOW What it is? It is a piss point on the map of California. You can drive past it in 15 seconds. There are maybe 175 small homes there, and no building has been allowed since 1995 when it was declared geologically unstable.

TINY scale is right. Next time don't use it as an example of what California is about. The "crops" there are grown in back yards by the few hundred people who still live there, for dinner. The state told them all to leave 12 years ago right after that first mudslide because the soil is unstable. They didn't leave, and ten people died in 2005. RACK CHUCK.

You believe the shit you read in the paper?
Huge mudslides cascaded into apartment buildings, rising to the third floor and entombing occupants like the victims of Vesuvius before they could think about fleeing. Torrential rains elsewhere in North Korea were said to have swept away cottages without a trace, and large buildings were left with only the supporting pillars still standing.

"The rainfall … was not so much higher than in the past, but there was a problem with soil erosion, they started terracing all the hills to grow crops. The hills are very steep and there is nothing to hold the soil."
You couldn't terrace that fucking hill if you wanted to. It's nearly vertical, the land above it is owned, and the mudslides are predictable:
"According to geologists, the La Conchita landslides that occurred in 1995 and 2005 are a small part of a much larger landslide complex called the "Rincon Mountain Slide" which started many thousands of years ago and will likely continue generating slides in the future"
My comment on Californian mudslides was an aside to illustrate a point, I have no interest in a pissing contest over who's got better farmland - California or the DPRK, it's irrelevant. It seemed like decent example to give a myopic Californian who can't see beyond the end of his nose.
umm HELLOOO??? Which country is sending the other one FOOD?
We would fucking DRILL, DIG, sacrifice, and then prevail, as we always have.
Well I suspect the economy would collapse and you'd suffer from food shortages and the country would implode, but I have no interest in a pissing contest over whose got more oil under ground, that's not the point.
Especially when you're pissing up a rope. North Korea is smaller than Mississippi, with only 14% percent of the land capable of growing crops, and one if the major imports is petroleum.

Oh yeah. WE sent them about 50,000 metric tons of fuel over there a few years back. THAT is the point.


The idea that anyone in either country would run out into their backyard and start constructing an oil derrick is bizarre.
Tell that to the new millionaires out in The Dakotas.

the DPRK has never threatened the United States, there have been instances where they've stated that if they were attacked they would defend themselves using any means neccesary and that doesn't seem terribly unreasonable to me.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2003/fe ... northkorea" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"North Korea is entitled to launch a pre-emptive strike against the US rather than wait until the American military have finished with Iraq, the North's foreign ministry told the Guardian yesterday."

:meds:
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Re: Communism, working well

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Mister Bushice wrote: Have you BEEN to La Conchita?
You believe the shit you read in the paper?
Well no - but I think you missed the second sentence in the article that mentioned that the terraced hill was in the DPRK, not La Conchita - leading to some confusion. I am pleased to know the geological trivia of La Conchita regardless.

Anyway, it's safe to say that we've both learned something from this thread Mr. Bushice - terracing hills in the DPRK when your farmland in under a foot of water and silt is not a communist phenomena, as mudslides in La Conchita are not a capitalist phenomena.

George Bush and capitalism did not murder those people in La Conchita.




"North Korea is entitled to launch a pre-emptive strike against the US rather than wait until the American military have finished with Iraq, the North's foreign ministry told the Guardian yesterday."

:meds:
That should be put in some sort of context as it was a response not an initiative - also from your article:
Anxiety in North Korea has been rising since Washington announced plans in the past week to beef up its military strength in the area. Additional bombers will be sent to the region, along with 2,000 extra troops who will serve alongside the 17,000 already stationed on the North-South border. USS Carl Vinson may also be deployed. The USS Kitty Hawk has already taken up strike position in waters off the peninsula.

[...]

the US cut off supplies of 500,000 tonnes a year of heavy fuel oil, a severe blow to a nation that is desperately short of energy. The north of the country is worst hit but power shortages are apparent even in the capital, where temperatures have fallen as low as -21C recently.

[...]

when the Pentagon planned a surgical strike on the Yongbyon nuclear plant, American generals were convinced that the North would rather launch a surprise attack than wait for a US military build-up.
I don't think there's room for arguement as to the aggressor is.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Didn't NK lob some missiles over SK into the sea of Japan a year two back?

Yeh, They're not aggressive at all. :meds:
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Re: Communism, working well

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mvscal wrote: No, there isn't.
So says your blog?

Remember, there were literally hundreds of engagements along the border in less than a year before the Northern offensive. 'Reconnaissance Order No. 1' has never been released or seen by the public and is officially misplaced. I think the US ambassador told the UN when asked to produce the documents, he said that they 'were in his other pants' and would have them the next day - when unfortunately, his dog ate them.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Mister Bushice wrote:Didn't NK lob some missiles over SK into the sea of Japan a year two back?

Yeh, They're not aggressive at all. :meds:
When you test fire a missile, generally the object is to hit an unpopulated target.

The sea seems very practical and it doesn't violate the republics airspace.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Dr_Phibes wrote:
Mister Bushice wrote:Didn't NK lob some missiles over SK into the sea of Japan a year two back?

Yeh, They're not aggressive at all. :meds:
When you test fire a missile, generally the object is to hit an unpopulated target.

Force of habit on Bushice's part.

American's are used to their missiles hitting pharmaceutical plants, hospitals, weddings...etc...
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Re: Communism, working well

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Dr_Phibes wrote:
Mister Bushice wrote:Didn't NK lob some missiles over SK into the sea of Japan a year two back?

Yeh, They're not aggressive at all. :meds:
When you test fire a missile, generally the object is to hit an unpopulated target.

The sea seems very practical and it doesn't violate the republics airspace.
When you have half the world objecting to your plans which include firing a test missiles over another country into the sea, and those test missiles have shown zero reliability in the past IE they failed all the fucking time, and you want to send a message to the rest of the world not to fuck with you, THAT is aggression.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Martyred wrote:
Dr_Phibes wrote:
Mister Bushice wrote:Didn't NK lob some missiles over SK into the sea of Japan a year two back?

Yeh, They're not aggressive at all. :meds:
When you test fire a missile, generally the object is to hit an unpopulated target.

Force of habit on Bushice's part.

American's are used to their missiles hitting pharmaceutical plants, hospitals, weddings...etc...
Ahhh, those were the days...
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Re: Communism, working well

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I guess it's hard to aim when you're eyes aren't completely open.
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Re: Communism, working well

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Mister Bushice wrote: When you have half the world objecting to your plans which include firing a test missiles over another country into the sea, and those test missiles have shown zero reliability in the past IE they failed all the fucking time, and you want to send a message to the rest of the world not to fuck with you, THAT is aggression.
I think you're confusing the sort of rhetoric that exists in world of newspapers and political speeches with reality.

The DPRK's missiles have never failed, they're a bit of a player in the international arms market - they export missiles to countries that enjoy friendly relations with the United States and no-one complains about their performance.

You might not be aware, but the DPRK fired a Taepodong-2 in 1998 in order to put a satellite in orbit - they pre-warned the Russian and Chinese governments of the launch and the Russian space agency tracked it and it was widely reported by Itar-Tass and Xinhua, but no-one managed to pick up the signal the satellite was supposed to broadcast.

In the US the news was quite different, they reported that the rocket failed and blew up, but didn't mention the fact that the Taepodong-2 is equipped with a third stage solid fuel booster that detonates when the rocket is spent so it can't be fished out of the sea by foreign powers. Technically not a lie, but not true either.

It was the same story a year or two ago. In the US, it was reported that the launches were failures and those silly commies can't do anything right.
In the foreign press, the story was presented quite differently, the Scuds were fired into the sea and landed in the sea - as is the object of a test firing. The Taepodong-2 was reported to have 'sputtered out and exploded after forty seconds - when Itar Tass and the Russian goverment who were warned of the launch - had it pegged at one hundred and twenty seconds. Again remember, they detonate their rockets and it was a political display for the benefit of the US. They weren't shooting at anything in particular.

I think it's more a matter of the DPRK being posed as a threat when it's politically expedient and being fobbed off as bumblers when it's politically inconvenient.
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Mister Bushice
Drinking all the beer Luther left behind
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Re: Communism, working well

Post by Mister Bushice »

English.gov muthafucker. speak it?

http://english.gov.cn/2006-07/11/content_332990.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://english.people.com.cn/200607/01/ ... 78869.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/world/2006 ... 634120.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Feel free to link all the pro dprk articles you can find NOT written by dprk news sources. At some point you have to realize that the impression they give to the rest of the world is one of aggression, regardless of what the intent actually is.
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