ESPN Bowl Projections

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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by Adelpiero »

stinger33 wrote:Ya, I forgot that Mizzou would win the North, so they play 13 regular season games, not 12. My bad. But they aren't as balanced as far as who get how many yards. Washington is the only one gaining any serious yardage, and the only one that poses a real threat (I'd count Maclin, but he's not getting as many carries because they're utilizing him more as a receiver; he's certainly better than "slightly above average").
he is an excellent back, but when you only give him 12 carries, then completely go away from the run, cause chubby wants to force another 10 throws to Maclin in triple coverage, while 4 other players are wide open, it tends to give the back low carries and slants their numbers on the low side. Washington will get a quick 60ish yards and then he's completely gone from the backfield, he becomes a WR.

next year they will have to be more balanced, the run will be what sets up the pass. Unless Dalton comes in and wins the starting job, but even then, Dalton is more of a dual threat than chubby ever was.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by stinger33 »

Adelpiero wrote:
stinger33 wrote:Ya, I forgot that Mizzou would win the North, so they play 13 regular season games, not 12. My bad. But they aren't as balanced as far as who get how many yards. Washington is the only one gaining any serious yardage, and the only one that poses a real threat (I'd count Maclin, but he's not getting as many carries because they're utilizing him more as a receiver; he's certainly better than "slightly above average").
he is an excellent back, but when you only give him 12 carries, then completely go away from the run, cause chubby wants to force another 10 throws to Maclin in triple coverage, while 4 other players are wide open, it tends to give the back low carries and slants their numbers on the low side. Washington will get a quick 60ish yards and then he's completely gone from the backfield, he becomes a WR.

next year they will have to be more balanced, the run will be what sets up the pass. Unless Dalton comes in and wins the starting job, but even then, Dalton is more of a dual threat than chubby ever was.
That's what I was starting to get at. His average per carry is very good, but he doesn't get as many carries as he should, which nullifies his ability. If they gave him as many carries as Temple had, they could be sitting pretty well right now.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by Terry in Crapchester »

My updated bowl projections, subject to change, still . . .

FedEx BCS National Championship Game
(BCS No. 1 vs. BCS No. 2) Florida vs. Texas Tech
Tostitos Fiesta
(BCS vs. BCS) Texas vs. Utah
Allstate Sugar
(BCS vs. BCS) Alabama vs. Ohio State
FedEx Orange
(BCS vs. BCS) North Carolina vs. Cincinnati
Rose Bowl presented by Citi
(BCS vs. BCS) USC vs. Penn State
GMAC
(C-USA vs. MAC) East Carolina vs. Ball State
International
(Big East vs. MAC) Connecticut vs. Western Michigan
AutoZone Liberty
(C-USA vs. SEC) Tulsa vs. Mississippi
AT&T Cotton
(Big 12 vs. SEC) Oklahoma vs. LSU
Konica Minolta Gator
(ACC vs. Big 12/Big East/Notre Dame) Florida State vs. Missouri
Capital One
(SEC vs. Big Ten) Georgia vs. Michigan State
Outback
(Big Ten vs. SEC) Iowa vs. South Carolina
Chick-fil-A
(SEC vs. ACC) Kentucky vs. Georgia Tech
Insight
(Big 12 vs. Big Ten) Kansas vs. Illinois
Gaylord Hotels Music City
(ACC vs. SEC) Virginia Tech vs. Vanderbilt
Brut Sun
(Pac-10 vs. Big 12/Big East/Notre Dame) Oregon vs. West Virginia
Bell Helicopter Armed Forces
(Mountain West vs. C-USA) Air Force vs. Rice
Pacific Life Holiday
(Pac-10 vs. Big 12) California vs. Oklahoma State
Texas
(Big 12 vs. C-USA) Buffalo* vs. Houston
Roady's Humanitarian
(WAC vs. ACC) Boise State vs. Boston College
Valero Alamo
(Big Ten vs. Big 12) Northwestern vs. Nebraska
PapaJohns.com
(Big East vs. SEC) Notre Dame vs. Troy*
Independence
(SEC vs. Big 12) Louisiana Tech* vs. Rutgers*
Emerald
(Pac-10 vs. ACC) Arizona vs. Virginia
Champs Sports
(ACC vs. Big Ten) Miami (FL) vs. Minnesota
Meineke Car Care
(Big East vs. ACC) Pittsburgh vs. Wake Forest
Motor City
(MAC vs. Big Ten) Central Michigan vs. Wisconsin
Sheraton Hawaii
(WAC vs. Pac-10) Hawaii vs. Bowling Green*
San Diego County Credit Union Poinsettia
(Mountain West vs. Pac-10) BYU vs. Nevada*
R+L Carriers New Orleans
(C-USA vs. Sun Belt) Akron* vs. Louisiana-Lafayette
Eagle Bank Bowl
(ACC vs. Navy) Maryland vs. Navy
Pioneer Las Vegas
(Mountain West vs. Pac-10) TCU vs. Oregon State
St. Petersburg
(Big East vs. C-USA) South Florida vs. Memphis
New Mexico
(WAC vs. Mountain West) Fresno State vs. UNLV

* denotes at-large selection due to projection that conference with tie-in will not have enough bowl-eligible teams to fill the bid.

This assumes, of course, that the Gator and the Sun Bowl both do the right thing when it comes to us. That's a pretty big assumption, though.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by King Crimson »

Jsc810 wrote:Rack Terry.
yeah, i'm impressed. However, he does pick Tech to beat OU in Norman...and it may happen since OU can't defend the chair i'm sitting in....but, i can't get on board with it.

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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

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Jsc810 wrote:And if he's right, it will be Oklahoma vs LSU in the Sugar Bowl. The collective ass of LSU is still raw from the plungering administered by Florida, Georgia, and Alabama, so maybe this year would be a good one for LSU to play someone like Hawaii instead.
naw, TinC's projection has OU-LSU in the "AT&T" Cotton Bowl. nice regional matchup.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by SoCalTrjn »

Only did a few

FedEx BCS National Championship Game
(BCS No. 1 vs. BCS No. 2) Florida vs. Texas
Tostitos Fiesta
(BCS vs. BCS) Oklahoma vs. Utah
Allstate Sugar
(BCS vs. BCS) Alabama vs. USC
FedEx Orange
(BCS vs. BCS) North Carolina vs. Cincinnati
Rose Bowl presented by Citi
(BCS vs. BCS) Oregon State vs. Penn State
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by Terry in Crapchester »

I'll update again, although still subject to change, . . .

FedEx BCS National Championship Game
(BCS No. 1 vs. BCS No. 2) Florida vs. Texas Tech
Tostitos Fiesta
(BCS vs. BCS) USC vs. Utah
Allstate Sugar
(BCS vs. BCS) Alabama vs. Texas
FedEx Orange
(BCS vs. BCS) Maryland vs. Cincinnati
Rose Bowl presented by Citi
(BCS vs. BCS) Oregon State vs. Penn State
GMAC
(C-USA vs. MAC) East Carolina vs. Ball State
International
(Big East vs. MAC) Notre Dame vs. Western Michigan
AutoZone Liberty
(C-USA vs. SEC) Tulsa vs. Mississippi
AT&T Cotton
(Big 12 vs. SEC) Oklahoma vs. LSU
Konica Minolta Gator
(ACC vs. Big 12/Big East/Notre Dame) Florida State vs. Missouri
Capital One
(SEC vs. Big Ten) Georgia vs. Ohio State
Outback
(Big Ten vs. SEC) Michigan State vs. South Carolina
Chick-fil-A
(SEC vs. ACC) Vanderbilt vs. Georgia Tech
Insight
(Big 12 vs. Big Ten) Kansas vs. Wisconsin
Gaylord Hotels Music City
(ACC vs. SEC) Virginia Tech vs. Kentucky
Brut Sun
(Pac-10 vs. Big 12/Big East/Notre Dame) Arizona vs. West Virginia
Bell Helicopter Armed Forces
(Mountain West vs. C-USA) Air Force vs. Rice
Pacific Life Holiday
(Pac-10 vs. Big 12) Oregon vs. Oklahoma State
Texas
(Big 12 vs. C-USA) Buffalo* vs. Houston
Roady's Humanitarian
(WAC vs. ACC) Boise State vs. Wake Forest
Valero Alamo
(Big Ten vs. Big 12) Iowa vs. Nebraska
PapaJohns.com
(Big East vs. SEC) Connecticut vs. Akron*
Independence
(SEC vs. Big 12) Louisiana Tech* vs. Rutgers*
Emerald
(Pac-10 vs. ACC) UNLV* vs. Boston College
Champs Sports
(ACC vs. Big Ten) Miami (FL) vs. Northwestern
Meineke Car Care
(Big East vs. ACC) Pittsburgh vs. North Carolina
Motor City
(MAC vs. Big Ten) Central Michigan vs. Minnesota
Sheraton Hawaii
(WAC vs. Pac-10) Hawaii vs. Bowling Green*
San Diego County Credit Union Poinsettia
(Mountain West vs. Pac-10) BYU vs. Nevada*
R+L Carriers New Orleans
(C-USA vs. Sun Belt) Southern Mississippi vs. Troy
Eagle Bank Bowl
(ACC vs. Navy) Virginia vs. Navy
Pioneer Las Vegas
(Mountain West vs. Pac-10) TCU vs. California (call it the JSC810 Bowl, if you prefer)
St. Petersburg
(Big East vs. C-USA) South Florida vs. Memphis
New Mexico
(WAC vs. Mountain West) Fresno State vs. Colorado State

* denotes at-large selection due to projection that conference with tie-in will not have enough bowl-eligible teams to fill the bid.

This still assumes, of course, that the Gator and the Sun Bowl both do the right thing when it comes to us. That's a pretty big assumption, though.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

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Mace wrote:
War Wagon wrote:
stinger33 wrote:I wouldn't even know what the hell "transparent troll" meant if I hadn't just asked my dad, who posts on this site, what it means.
umm... who's your daddy?

Sorry, couldn't resist.
Well, in case you haven't figured it out, and I suspect you have, he's Mace Jr.
I don’t know, Mace, he sure reminded me an awful lot of theJON when he started posting. You might want to find out where theJON was 18 years ago.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by MgoBlue-LightSpecial »

stinger33 wrote:If they win out, Iowa will go to the Outback, not Northwestern.
MSU will be in the Outback.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by Terry in Crapchester »

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:
stinger33 wrote:If they win out, Iowa will go to the Outback, not Northwestern.
MSU will be in the Outback.
Depends on whether the Big 10 gets an at-large BCS bid.

If they do, MSU is in the Capital One, and Iowa is in the Outback. If not, MSU is in the Outback, and Iowa is in the Alamo.

At least that's the way it looks to me.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by MgoBlue-LightSpecial »

Terry in Crapchester wrote:
MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:
stinger33 wrote:If they win out, Iowa will go to the Outback, not Northwestern.
MSU will be in the Outback.
Depends on whether the Big 10 gets an at-large BCS bid.

If they do, MSU is in the Capital One, and Iowa is in the Outback. If not, MSU is in the Outback, and Iowa is in the Alamo.

At least that's the way it looks to me.
I'm aware of that.

If Stinger is operating under the assumption that Iowa is going to the Outback because he believes MSU will be in the Capital One, then that's cool. I just hope he doesn't believe Iowa would jump MSU if they win-out. Iowa Fan can be pretty delusional, as they believe they're god's gift to bowl games.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

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If Stinger is operating under the assumption that Iowa is going to the Outback because he believes MSU will be in the Capital One, then that's cool. I just hope he doesn't believe Iowa would jump MSU if they win-out. Iowa Fan can be pretty delusional, as they believe they're god's gift to bowl games.
Actually, I don't think it matters. It's happened before. Iowa finished tied for 3rd in the Big 10 in 2005 with Michigan, Wisconsin, and Northwestern. They went to the Outback, even though they had lost to both Michigan and Northwestern. Michigan had beaten both Iowa and Northwestern, and lost a nail-biter to Wisconsin, 23-20 early in the year. So there is a history of Iowa jumping teams that should be slotted ahead of them, mainly because their fans travel very well. That may not be the right way to do things, but it is the way they are done. Iowa's fans I'm sure still travel well. The Outback and Capital One Bowl had reps at both the Penn State and Purdue games, so obviously they are looking at the Hawks. The Capital One is a long shot (They would need Oregon State or one of the non-BCS undefeateds to lose so Ohio State gets an at large, as well has Michigan State getting pounded by Penn State), but making the Outback appears likely. Michigan State is GUARANTEED to finish ahead of Iowa in the standings. Yet the Outback is still sending reps to see them, as well as the Capital One.It's only basic logic that asks why a bowl would waste their time looking at a team they aren't considering picking?
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by Terry in Crapchester »

stinger33 wrote:
If Stinger is operating under the assumption that Iowa is going to the Outback because he believes MSU will be in the Capital One, then that's cool. I just hope he doesn't believe Iowa would jump MSU if they win-out. Iowa Fan can be pretty delusional, as they believe they're god's gift to bowl games.
Actually, I don't think it matters. It's happened before. Iowa finished tied for 3rd in the Big 10 in 2005 with Michigan, Wisconsin, and Northwestern. They went to the Outback, even though they had lost to both Michigan and Northwestern. Michigan had beaten both Iowa and Northwestern, and lost a nail-biter to Wisconsin, 23-20 early in the year. So there is a history of Iowa jumping teams that should be slotted ahead of them, mainly because their fans travel very well. That may not be the right way to do things, but it is the way they are done. Iowa's fans I'm sure still travel well. The Outback and Capital One Bowl had reps at both the Penn State and Purdue games, so obviously they are looking at the Hawks. The Capital One is a long shot (They would need Oregon State or one of the non-BCS undefeateds to lose so Ohio State gets an at large, as well has Michigan State getting pounded by Penn State), but making the Outback appears likely. Michigan State is GUARANTEED to finish ahead of Iowa in the standings. Yet the Outback is still sending reps to see them, as well as the Capital One.It's only basic logic that asks why a bowl would waste their time looking at a team they aren't considering picking?
Coupla points:

1. One of the non-BCS undefeateds needs to lose? Actually, all of them do for Iowa to get a shot at the Capital One (which I don't think they get in any event, anyway). If any of them (Utah, Boise State or Ball State) wins out, they're looking at being an automatic qualifier for the BCS. If more than one wins out, the highest-ranked team is an automatic qualifier.

2. With the possible exception of the Meatgrinder, the Big Ten is the easiest conference to slot its bowl-eligible teams in terms of merit this season:

1. Penn State
2. Ohio State
3. Michigan State
4. Iowa
5. Northwestern
6. Wisconsin
7. Minnesota
8. Illinois (needs to beat Northwestern to be bowl-eligible)

That having been said, you're right that the bowls aren't selected on the basis of merit. ND fan knows that only too well. Matter of fact, with a win against Syracuse (likely), we're probably looking at a bid in either the Gator or the Sun Bowl, even though we really don't deserve it. Iowa may travel well to bowl games, but they're certainly not ND with respect to national TV audience impact.

Iowa certainly doesn't deserve to jump Michigan State on merit, and even on the considerations you mentioned I'm not 100% sure that they should be selected ahead of Michigan State. But you know more about that than I do.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

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stinger33 wrote:So there is a history of Iowa jumping teams that should be slotted ahead of them, mainly because their fans travel very well.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

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Terry in Crapchester wrote:That having been said, you're right that the bowls aren't selected on the basis of merit. ND fan knows that only too well. Matter of fact, with a win against Syracuse (likely), we're probably looking at a bid in either the Gator or the Sun Bowl, even though we really don't deserve it. Iowa may travel well to bowl games, but they're certainly not ND with respect to national TV audience impact.
Seriously, this is the arrogance that makes ND so hated. Dude never mentions ND or even references them. You agree to his point that bowls aren't selected on the basis of merit. Yet you still have to make your plug about ND > Iowa. So what? Did he SAY Iowa travels better than ND? Did he say Iowa is more relavant in the national scope? Nobody fucking cares. With a MSU loss to PSU, I can easily see Iowa jumping them simply because their fans do travel well [completely irrelavant]even if ND fans would travel better.[/completely irrelavant] :meds:
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by Terry in Crapchester »

IndyFrisco wrote:
Terry in Crapchester wrote:That having been said, you're right that the bowls aren't selected on the basis of merit. ND fan knows that only too well. Matter of fact, with a win against Syracuse (likely), we're probably looking at a bid in either the Gator or the Sun Bowl, even though we really don't deserve it. Iowa may travel well to bowl games, but they're certainly not ND with respect to national TV audience impact.
Seriously, this is the arrogance that makes ND so hated. Dude never mentions ND or even references them. You agree to his point that bowls aren't selected on the basis of merit. Yet you still have to make your plug about ND > Iowa. So what? Did he SAY Iowa travels better than ND? Did he say Iowa is more relavant in the national scope? Nobody fucking cares. With a MSU loss to PSU, I can easily see Iowa jumping them simply because their fans do travel well [completely irrelavant]even if ND fans would travel better.[/completely irrelavant] :meds:
Arrogance? I'm pretty sure I said that ND doesn't deserve the bowl game they'll likely get this year.

I was actually agreeing with his overall point, that bowl game selections aren't made on merit alone. The main reason why I got into specifics is that the way ND represents at bowl games is not the same way that most other schools represent. We don't have 20-30,000 fans traveling en masse from in and around campus to the bowl game site. We do have an alumni club pretty much at any possible bowl game site, who will host events for ND's fanbase, and often provide tickets for sale to ND fans who do travel. ND also brings enhanced TV ratings, certainly at least for any non-BCS bowl in which they play, on a national basis.

I didn't mean to make a comparison between ND and Iowa, although after re-reading, I can understand where that's what you took out of it. Anyway, ND's bowl game tie-in is with the Big East, not the Big Ten (Cotton Bowl also has the option of inviting ND once every four years). So a comparison between ND and Iowa from the standpoint of bowl game appeal is irrelevant, unless you're talking about the BCS.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

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Actually, I'm pretty sure only one of the non-BCS teams has to lose for Iowa. Take a look at the rankings. You'll find that all three (Utah, Boise State, and Ball State) rank ahead of Cincinatti and North Carolina, the current leaders in the Big East and ACC. If things stay as they are, the Big East and ACC might not get their automatic bids, thanks to the clause stating that if a non-BCS team is ranked in the top 16 of the BCS and is ahead of a conference champion, they get a BCS bid. Ball State sits at #17, and with a Michigan State loss at Penn State (#15), they would move into the picture. So as things stand, two of the three possible (likely) non-BCS bids are actually fillers for the Big East and ACC, plus an at-large. If any one of them lose, they miss their chance, and an at-large is open. And that would go to Ohio State, opening the door for Iowa to either Tampa or Orlando. The ACC and Big East champions, whoever they may be, are the ones who need more than one non-BCS team to lose.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

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stinger33 wrote:Actually, I'm pretty sure only one of the non-BCS teams has to lose for Iowa. Take a look at the rankings. You'll find that all three (Utah, Boise State, and Ball State) rank ahead of Cincinatti and North Carolina, the current leaders in the Big East and ACC. If things stay as they are, the Big East and ACC might not get their automatic bids, thanks to the clause stating that if a non-BCS team is ranked in the top 16 of the BCS and is ahead of a conference champion, they get a BCS bid. Ball State sits at #17, and with a Michigan State loss at Penn State (#15), they would move into the picture. So as things stand, two of the three possible (likely) non-BCS bids are actually fillers for the Big East and ACC, plus an at-large. If any one of them lose, they miss their chance, and an at-large is open. And that would go to Ohio State, opening the door for Iowa to either Tampa or Orlando. The ACC and Big East champions, whoever they may be, are the ones who need more than one non-BCS team to lose.
I understand the clause you're referring to, but I think you misunderstand it.

As I understand it, the automatic qualification for a non-BCS team is (a) top 12 finish; or (b) top 16 finish and finish ahead of at least one team entitled to an automatic bid from a BCS conference. But that automatic selection for a non-BCS team works against the at-large selections, not against the otherwise automatic selections.

Example: 2006 season. Boise State finished #8 and was an automatic qualifier for the BCS. Wake Forest won the ACC and finished #14 in the final regular-season BCS rankings, but still received an automatic BCS bid.

There are other ways for teams to get an automatic BCS bid outside of winning one of the BCS conferences. ND gets an automatic BCS bid with a top 8 finish. Any BCS conference team that doesn't win its conference gets an automatic bid if they finish in the top 3, or the top 4 if each of the teams in the top 3 is the champion of a BCS conference. Any team that finishes in the top 2 gets an automatic bid even if they wouldn't receive an automatic bid otherwise.

These bids come out of the at-large pile, they don't work against the automatic bids for BCS conference champions.

Lefty started another thread about BCS bids. Here's how I see it shaking out.

The conference champions from the BCS conferences each will get an automatic bid. At-large bids will be determined as follows:

1. Highest-ranked non-BCS team gets a bid (automatic).

2. One bid each to the loser of the SEC championship game and the 2nd-place team from the Big XII South. I suspect one will be automatic, the other will not.

That leaves one remaining at-large BCS bid, which, I believe, would be awarded in the following order of priority:

1. USC, if both USC and Oregon State win out.

2. Ohio State, if both Ohio State and Penn State win, and either USC or Oregon State loses. Also a possibility, albeit less likely, that the BCS at-large bid could go to Michigan State (with a Michigan State win and Ohio State win), or Penn State (with a loss to Michigan State plus an Ohio State loss), if either USC or Oregon State loses.

3. If Ohio State loses, Penn State wins, and either USC or Oregon State loses, the last remaining at-large bid goes to a second non-BCS team.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by MgoBlue-LightSpecial »

stinger33 wrote:Actually, I don't think it matters. It's happened before. Iowa finished tied for 3rd in the Big 10 in 2005 with Michigan, Wisconsin, and Northwestern. They went to the Outback, even though they had lost to both Michigan and Northwestern.
That's all well and good, except Iowa will have no opportunity to tie MSU this year.

Look, go ahead and point me to just one reputable sports website that predicts Iowa jumping MSU for any bowl. Your fans travel well, but not well enough to jump a team that A) will be ranked, B) will have a better conference record than you, C) will have a better overall record than you, and D) beat you head-to-head. I understand it's not all about merit, but you can't ignore those gaudy factors stacked against Iowa.

In addition, MSU has a nice little alumni base in the state of Florida, Tampa in particular. So they won't need to send droves of people down from Michigan, although plenty will still show. MSU also has greater marquee value this year and is a better story from the media perspective.

I give Iowa zero chance of jumping MSU.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by stinger33 »

I don't know if Iowa isn't a marquee value team. Sure, they're 7-4, but they have lost by an average of 3 points per game. Beat Penn State. They have the better running back. And even though Iowa was tied with three other teams in 2005, two of those teams beat them, and Michigan both was ranked at the time of the selections and beat Iowa in Kinnick.

As for the non-BCS teams: if the clause only applies for at-large selctions, then shouldn't USC be sweating right about now? No matter how it pans out, it's crap. Because either USC is going to get left out of the BCS (because more than one non-BCS met the requirements to get in as an at-large) while Pitt/Cincy and UNC get in. And if they do get in, they you have non-BCS teams who met the requirements to get in, and instead watch Pitt/Cincy and UNC go instead, even though they are ranked lower than Ball State, Utah, and Boise State. If they are going to make that clause, then it should either be fulfilled or reworked. No way should USC be left out, and no way should non-BCS teams who met the requirements get jumped by BCS conference champions that are ranked lower (especially when their conferences are just as weak as the non-BCS, in some cases weaker).
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by Goober McTuber »

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:
stinger33 wrote:Actually, I don't think it matters. It's happened before. Iowa finished tied for 3rd in the Big 10 in 2005 with Michigan, Wisconsin, and Northwestern. They went to the Outback, even though they had lost to both Michigan and Northwestern.
That's all well and good, except Iowa will have no opportunity to tie MSU this year.

Look, go ahead and point me to just one reputable sports website that predicts Iowa jumping MSU for any bowl. Your fans travel well, but not well enough to jump a team that A) will be ranked, B) will have a better conference record than you, C) will have a better overall record than you, and D) beat you head-to-head. I understand it's not all about merit, but you can't ignore those gaudy factors stacked against Iowa.

In addition, MSU has a nice little alumni base in the state of Florida, Tampa in particular. So they won't need to send droves of people down from Michigan, although plenty will still show. MSU also has greater marquee value this year and is a better story from the media perspective.

I give Iowa zero chance of jumping MSU.
Plus MSU gets a chance for a quality loss this weekend, so they've got that going for them.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by MgoBlue-LightSpecial »

stinger33 wrote:I don't know if Iowa isn't a marquee value team.
I said MSU has greater value this season. Why wouldn't they? It'll be a (potentially) 3 loss ranked team with an up and coming head coach facing a South Carolina team that he played for. They'll be a bigger draw and a better story than your band of thugs.
Sure, they're 7-4, but they have lost by an average of 3 points per game.
Only problem with that is...nobody fucking cares. Besides, you have some BAD losses on your resume.
They have the better running back.
I don't think that's the general consensus, my friend, that's your hawkeye homer opinion. In any event, Ringer has received more national exposure. Greene is great, but is not touted outside of the Big Ten...which I think is a shame, but nevertheless that seems to be the case.
And even though Iowa was tied with three other teams in 2005, two of those teams beat them, and Michigan both was ranked at the time of the selections and beat Iowa in Kinnick.
Who gives a fuck? Like I said, they won't even tie MSU.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

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Goober McTuber wrote:Plus MSU gets a chance for a quality loss this weekend, so they've got that going for them.
Too bad Bucky shit the bed this year - that would've been a quality win.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by Goober McTuber »

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:
Goober McTuber wrote:Plus MSU gets a chance for a quality loss this weekend, so they've got that going for them.
Too bad Bucky shit the bed this year - that would've been a quality win.
On a positive note, I believe we had numerous quality losses.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by stinger33 »

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:
stinger33 wrote:I don't know if Iowa isn't a marquee value team.

I said MSU has greater value this season. Why wouldn't they? It'll be a (potentially) 3 loss ranked team with an up and coming head coach facing a South Carolina team that he played for. They'll be a bigger draw and a better story than your band of thugs.
I grow weary of hearing the jokes about the arrests. Do you want to know what most of those arrests amount to? PAULA's, public intox, etc. Wow, college kids drinking in a town that has 56 bars? Who'd a thunk they'd drink? It's college, they are going to drink, and police in Iowa City love to catch athletes and stick it to them for nothing. Those shouldn't count for an "arrest watch". That just comes with college. BTW, any MSU fans ought to remember Cedric Everson. You know, the guy in the sexual assault case that everybody likes to point out? I seem to remember him decommitting from MSU on Signing Day. Gee, he was litterally a couple hours away from being a Spartan. I wouldn't talk too much smack, because it's not like you didn't want him.
Sure, they're 7-4, but they have lost by an average of 3 points per game.

Only problem with that is...nobody fucking cares. Besides, you have some BAD losses on your resume.
We've got one. Northwestern isn't good, and we were beat at home by them. Pitt could be headed to the BCS, Illinois is still a dangerous team, and I doubt that you would consider Michigan State to be a BAD loss. The 3 pt average margin of defeat only stands to say that Iowa is better than a 7-4 record would suggest.
They have the better running back.

I don't think that's the general consensus, my friend, that's your hawkeye homer opinion. In any event, Ringer has received more national exposure. Greene is great, but is not touted outside of the Big Ten...which I think is a shame, but nevertheless that seems to be the case.
Doesn't make Ringer the better back. The numbers don't lie. And if anyone sits down and watches HOW Greene puts up his stats, it's not hard to figure out that he's the best back in the Big 10.
And even though Iowa was tied with three other teams in 2005, two of those teams beat them, and Michigan both was ranked at the time of the selections and beat Iowa in Kinnick.

Who gives a fuck? Like I said, they won't even tie MSU.
The point I was making was that Michigan had way more of a claim to the slot based on logic. They finished the regular season 7-4 also, with an average margin of defeat of a little more than 4 points. Close loss against Ohio State (Fiesta Bowl winner), close loss to Notre Dame (Fiesta Bowl loser), close loss to Wisconsin (finished 2005 ranked #15), and a close loss to Minnesota (). Plus wins over 3 ranked teams (Michigan State, Northwestern, and Penn State). And they got jumped. Iowa's resume was nowhere near as impressive. For all intents and purposes, looking at the resumes from that year, Michigan could just as well have been sitting in MSU's shoes right now.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by stinger33 »

Goober McTuber wrote:
MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:
stinger33 wrote:Actually, I don't think it matters. It's happened before. Iowa finished tied for 3rd in the Big 10 in 2005 with Michigan, Wisconsin, and Northwestern. They went to the Outback, even though they had lost to both Michigan and Northwestern.
That's all well and good, except Iowa will have no opportunity to tie MSU this year.

Look, go ahead and point me to just one reputable sports website that predicts Iowa jumping MSU for any bowl. Your fans travel well, but not well enough to jump a team that A) will be ranked, B) will have a better conference record than you, C) will have a better overall record than you, and D) beat you head-to-head. I understand it's not all about merit, but you can't ignore those gaudy factors stacked against Iowa.

In addition, MSU has a nice little alumni base in the state of Florida, Tampa in particular. So they won't need to send droves of people down from Michigan, although plenty will still show. MSU also has greater marquee value this year and is a better story from the media perspective.

I give Iowa zero chance of jumping MSU.
Plus MSU gets a chance for a quality loss this weekend, so they've got that going for them.
If they can be competitive. If it's a repeat of the Ohio State game, then they have only one quality loss (California). Maybe that's not how the computers will see it, but any human would not call a 45-7 loss a quality loss. Royal ass-kicking would be more appropriate.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

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WTF is a quality loss? Someone ask m2ool when he wakes up.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by indyfrisco »

PSUFAN wrote:WTF is a quality loss? Someone ask m2ool when he wakes up.
I beleive dotm2 would say a quality loss is when Kal scores 30 and the other team scores 20 yet the other team has more rushing yards and fewer turnovers.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by Goober McTuber »

PSUFAN wrote:WTF is a quality loss? Someone ask m2ool when he wakes up.
When you lose by three touchdowns but it was due to a series of bad calls by the officiating crew, that’s a quality loss.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

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stinger33 wrote:As for the non-BCS teams: if the clause only applies for at-large selctions, then shouldn't USC be sweating right about now? No matter how it pans out, it's crap. Because either USC is going to get left out of the BCS (because more than one non-BCS met the requirements to get in as an at-large) while Pitt/Cincy and UNC get in. And if they do get in, they you have non-BCS teams who met the requirements to get in, and instead watch Pitt/Cincy and UNC go instead, even though they are ranked lower than Ball State, Utah, and Boise State. If they are going to make that clause, then it should either be fulfilled or reworked. No way should USC be left out, and no way should non-BCS teams who met the requirements get jumped by BCS conference champions that are ranked lower (especially when their conferences are just as weak as the non-BCS, in some cases weaker).
In any given season, a maximum of one non-BCS team can be an automatic qualifier. If more than one non-BCS team meets the requirements for automatic qualification, the highest-ranked team is the automatic qualifier. The other(s) is/are eligible for at-large bids if any remain after application of the automatic qualifier process, but is/are not guaranteed a BCS bid.

If USC wins out, they're in the BCS either way -- as the Pac-10 champ (if Oregon State loses), or as an at-large team (if Oregon State wins out).
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by Killian »

PSUFAN wrote:WTF is a quality loss? Someone ask m2ool when he wakes up.
Ask Charlie Weis. He's been living off of his since 2005.

Also, if ND beats Syracuse, they will go to the Gator.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by stinger33 »

Terry in Crapchester wrote:
stinger33 wrote:As for the non-BCS teams: if the clause only applies for at-large selctions, then shouldn't USC be sweating right about now? No matter how it pans out, it's crap. Because either USC is going to get left out of the BCS (because more than one non-BCS met the requirements to get in as an at-large) while Pitt/Cincy and UNC get in. And if they do get in, they you have non-BCS teams who met the requirements to get in, and instead watch Pitt/Cincy and UNC go instead, even though they are ranked lower than Ball State, Utah, and Boise State. If they are going to make that clause, then it should either be fulfilled or reworked. No way should USC be left out, and no way should non-BCS teams who met the requirements get jumped by BCS conference champions that are ranked lower (especially when their conferences are just as weak as the non-BCS, in some cases weaker).
In any given season, a maximum of one non-BCS team can be an automatic qualifier. If more than one non-BCS team meets the requirements for automatic qualification, the highest-ranked team is the automatic qualifier. The other(s) is/are eligible for at-large bids if any remain after application of the automatic qualifier process, but is/are not guaranteed a BCS bid.

If USC wins out, they're in the BCS either way -- as the Pac-10 champ (if Oregon State loses), or as an at-large team (if Oregon State wins out).
Just one more reason that the BCS is a crap system. The automatic bids are about the stupidest things ever created. The best team should be rated #1, etc. Instead, you have the #20 team jumping teams in the top 10, just because they won a shitty conference like the Big East or ACC (neither of which have been relevant since the Miami/VA Tech transition).
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by Adelpiero »

i remember when Illinois looked like a quality win :oops:

Will Gator take a 5 loss Notre Dame team? If they do, the gator bowl is a sham and should be boycotted. way more deserving teams, even Nebraska is a more deserving team than Notre Dame to go to the Gator, and Nubs will fill in as many seats as Domers would. Nubs travel extremely well
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by MgoBlue-LightSpecial »

stinger33 wrote:I grow weary of hearing the jokes about the arrests.
Doesn't matter - it's a stigma attached to this team, whether fair or unfair. Remember, we're talking about national perception here. To be fair though, it won't really affect Iowa's bowl placement one way or the other.
We've got one. Northwestern isn't good, and we were beat at home by them. Pitt could be headed to the BCS, Illinois is still a dangerous team, and I doubt that you would consider Michigan State to be a BAD loss. The 3 pt average margin of defeat only stands to say that Iowa is better than a 7-4 record would suggest.
Not everybody buys into that whole "better than our record indicates" stuff. Some people think you are EXACTLY what your record indicates, and if you feel you're anything beyond that, you should have proved it on the field. At 7-4, Iowa has played well enough to earn an Alamo Bowl bid (assuming MSU doesn't go to the Capital One). I'd be happy with that if I were you.
Doesn't make Ringer the better back. The numbers don't lie. And if anyone sits down and watches HOW Greene puts up his stats, it's not hard to figure out that he's the best back in the Big 10.
I wasn't suggesting that a bigger name makes you a better back. We were talking about national perception and marquee, and how that benefits you in the bowl selection process. I think Greene is an excellent back, but he hasn't had the national exposure Ringer has had.

For what it's worth though, I think they're equally talented backs, but get it done in different ways. I'd love to see what Ringer could do with Iowa's stout offensive line. And vice versa.
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Re: ESPN Bowl Projections

Post by Terry in Crapchester »

Adelpiero wrote:Will Gator take a 5 loss Notre Dame team? If they do, the gator bowl is a sham and should be boycotted. way more deserving teams, even Nebraska is a more deserving team than Notre Dame to go to the Gator, and Nubs will fill in as many seats as Domers would. Nubs travel extremely well
Strictly a guess, and I could be wrong, but my hunch is that the Gator Bowl takes ND if ND is 7-5. The other likely available candidates would be Missouri, Oklahoma State and Nebraska (one of the former two will be gone by the time the Gator selects) from the Big XII, and Cincinnati, Pitt, West Virginia and UConn (although one of those teams will be in the BCS) from the Big East.

Not saying that ND is the best team of this bunch, far from it. But bowl games are more about maximizing revenue than anything else. That shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone who's paid any attention at all to bowl games in recent years. In this case, the difference ND brings to the table is increased TV ratings on a national basis.

Also, let's assume for a moment that the Gator Bowl decided it wanted one visit each from ND and Nebraska over the course of the current four-year deal (which expires after next season). Realistically speaking, they have a much better chance of getting Nebraska next season than they do of getting ND (BCS bid will be minimum expectation for ND next season).


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Upon further review, as I mentioned above, one of the Big XII teams will be gone before the Gator selects. If the Holiday takes Nebraska, that eliminates the one Big XII team that is at least a comparable draw to ND from an historical standpoint.

And speak of the devil . . .

Cotton, Gator, Sun Bowl still interested in Irish

I knew the Cotton had the option to pick ND, but I pretty much discounted that as a possibility. Given the way the Meatgrinder probably will shake out, that would leave LSU in the Cotton, and LSU has to be one of the more desirable, if not the most desirable, of the Meatgrinder teams from the Cotton's perspective.

The Sun Bowl also expressed an interest in ND if the Gator passes, even if ND is 6-6. I thought the 6/7 win rule would prevent us from going to the Sun Bowl at 6-6, but maybe not. In any event, ND figures to beat Syracuse, so that consideration is probably moot.

If ND somehow pulls off the upset against USC and finishes 8-4, I think they'd be all but a lock for the Gator.
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