I don't know anything about Ariton Church of Christ.
But faith doesn't begin where reason stops.
Faith begins by hearing the Word of God.
Romans 10:17
So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
But I understand the point there.
A LOT of things come crashing in on us in our life.
Things we can not find reason or rationale for.
Things we just don't know.
But God IS and He knows.
That's more than good enough.
Worthy of Its Own Thread
Moderator: Jesus H Christ
Re: Worthy of Its Own Thread
Human, secular reason alone brings us wonderful things. Avoiding discussion how human nature, fear, lack of reason, quest for power and the use of religion to oppress and achieve the same, there is no real evidence of a society that methodically attempts to devalue and eradicate religion - through human reason - available. Or is there ?
Marx, believed that religion and belief in an illusion - God - was a collective sigh of oppressed people. Economically oppressed, of course. That in order to fully eradicate religion a society must remove the NEED for religion. In order to achieve what you seek to achieve - removal of religion - and the height of human reason, Marx will lead us to the "promised land".
Eliminate class struggle.
Level the playing field.
It has worked in the Soviet Union, Cuba, China, North Korea, and is working in Europe - slowly - and we've just begun the vital work here.
I applaud your dedication to the cause. With your motorbike and your photography skills, perhaps you will be used to document the struggle and the victory, and serve the Party until such time the Party no longer needs you (like during the Great Purge II, we won't need any evidence of that)
I'm psyched at what the prospects of only depending upon Human Reason can get us, you ?
Marx, believed that religion and belief in an illusion - God - was a collective sigh of oppressed people. Economically oppressed, of course. That in order to fully eradicate religion a society must remove the NEED for religion. In order to achieve what you seek to achieve - removal of religion - and the height of human reason, Marx will lead us to the "promised land".
Eliminate class struggle.
Level the playing field.
It has worked in the Soviet Union, Cuba, China, North Korea, and is working in Europe - slowly - and we've just begun the vital work here.
I applaud your dedication to the cause. With your motorbike and your photography skills, perhaps you will be used to document the struggle and the victory, and serve the Party until such time the Party no longer needs you (like during the Great Purge II, we won't need any evidence of that)
I'm psyched at what the prospects of only depending upon Human Reason can get us, you ?
Re: Worthy of Its Own Thread
I didn't say you were a communist. But your attitude towards the faithful is not unlike the father of Communism, Karl Marx.
Re: Worthy of Its Own Thread
Well, these discussions always tend to concentrate on Christianity. Seems "atheists" would deride ANY religion. To include those of the Romans, Egyptians, Mesopotamians, etc.. etc..
In fact, trying to find an era in human history - even before Christianity - where some deity or deities weren't acknowledged or worshipped is impossible.
Perhaps it's part of human nature.
In fact, trying to find an era in human history - even before Christianity - where some deity or deities weren't acknowledged or worshipped is impossible.
Perhaps it's part of human nature.
Re: Worthy of Its Own Thread
Why not ?
Science does NOT answer all our questions and logic applied to the illogical situations "life" presents at times is impotent.
Therefore, "faith" begins where "reason" stops. You apply reason and logic to many situations but due to the mercurial and unpredictable nature of things - ultimately you're putting your faith in a "SWAG".
And I'm not simply talking about faith in a "God". How about "Faith" that the preparation an athlete has undertaken, his effort, and ready for the big match ? Does he "know" he will win ? Can he "reason" his way into victory ? No, he takes a leap of faith at some point and enters the ring and comes out either winner or loser.
Faith starts ... where Reason ends. It would be unreasonable to enter the ring based on faith alone. No, reason was applied throughout the preparation for the match, when the match starts, a scientific leap of "faith" into the ring occurs.
Science does NOT answer all our questions and logic applied to the illogical situations "life" presents at times is impotent.
Therefore, "faith" begins where "reason" stops. You apply reason and logic to many situations but due to the mercurial and unpredictable nature of things - ultimately you're putting your faith in a "SWAG".
And I'm not simply talking about faith in a "God". How about "Faith" that the preparation an athlete has undertaken, his effort, and ready for the big match ? Does he "know" he will win ? Can he "reason" his way into victory ? No, he takes a leap of faith at some point and enters the ring and comes out either winner or loser.
Faith starts ... where Reason ends. It would be unreasonable to enter the ring based on faith alone. No, reason was applied throughout the preparation for the match, when the match starts, a scientific leap of "faith" into the ring occurs.
Re: Worthy of Its Own Thread
Tom, this is a really interesting piece of Scripture, if one reads it slowly and lets it sink in.
Romans 1:18-32
18: For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
19: Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20: For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
21: Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22: Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23: And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24: Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25: Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
26: For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
27: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
28: And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
29: Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
30: Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31: Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
32: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.
Romans 1:18-32
18: For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
19: Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20: For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
21: Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22: Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23: And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24: Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25: Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
26: For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
27: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
28: And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
29: Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
30: Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31: Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
32: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.