Charles Weis WHACKED at ND

Paul · Post by **Paul** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:16 pm

Shocking.

PSUFAN · Post by **PSUFAN** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 3:15 am

I'll be honest - I'm not a big fan of ND and/or how they have gone about their coach hiring/firing decisions in the last few iterations...but I think this move is definitely the right one. I hope they right their ship soon, if only to spare my friends Killian, Terry and Lax any more undue woe...

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 4:50 pm

He's not getting 18 million.

Terry in Crapchester · Tue Dec 01, 2009 5:43 pm

mvscal wrote:That would depend on how his contract is structured. Have you reviewed it? Even if the only guaranteed money is base salary, it's still a $4 million kick in the pills.

I haven't reviewed it, and AFAIK the details have never been disclosed publicly. That having been said, I should point out that the high end buyout figure I was hearing last year was $20 million, and the real kicker was the number of years remaining on the contract. In light of that, I'd have a hard time believing that the buyout had been reduced by only $2 million off the high end estimate one year later.

If the buyout is $4 million, that's quite manageable. ND receives more than double that from the NBC deal alone on an annual basis.

But I tend to think that $4 million is a little low, given that Ty Willingham's buyout was more than that, and he only had two years to run on his contract, as opposed to five years for Weis. My best guess is that the buyout is somewhere between $4 million and $18 million.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 5:44 pm

Lazy journalists (read: ESPN) reported his buyout at 18 million by taking the 6 years left at 3 million per year. He's getting closer to 6 million.

Terry in Crapchester · Tue Dec 01, 2009 5:49 pm

Killian wrote:Lazy journalists (read: ESPN) reported his buyout at 18 million by taking the 6 years left at 3 million per year. He's getting closer to 6 million.

I could be wrong about this, but didn't Ty Willingham get about $6 million on his buyout? I seem to recall that he was being paid over a 2-3 year period, and that at one point, he was being paid more not to coach the team than Weis was being paid to coach the team.

If Ty got $6 million, I think Weis will get more, although not $18 million.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 5:59 pm

Different AD's negotiating the buy outs.

Terry in Crapchester · Tue Dec 01, 2009 6:07 pm

The buyout won't be calculated pursuant to the original contract? If it is, then the fact that White is no longer the AD isn't relevant.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 6:13 pm

Swarbrick renegotiated Weis's buyout last year.

Terry in Crapchester · Tue Dec 01, 2009 6:17 pm

I didn't know that, thanks.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 6:19 pm

mvscal wrote:Sorry guy, you're full of shit.

You keep thinking that

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 6:45 pm

Good point, because everything is released to the press. Including the contracts of employees at private universities.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:10 pm

mvscal wrote:Oh, but you have the secret inside scoop. Got it.

You are a laughable tard, though.

You keep thinking that

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 8:02 pm

Kevin White freaked out in 2005 and extended Weis's contract by 5 years after the USC game. He had a buyout option written into the contract that was essentially a poison pill if NFL teams wanted to hire Weis away. Kevin White, being the bumbling dolt that he is, didn't write in a provision on this buy out in case ND wanted to release Weis from duties. When White left for Duke, Swarbrick reviewed the contracts of all the coaches and saw this. Swarbrick then began negotiations with Bob Lamonte, Weis's agent, to restructure the deal so it was beneficial for both parties if either wanted to part ways. The buyout was a hinderance last year, and a major reason why Weis was not let go after the USC game last season. The buyout was restructured and the amout reduced substantially.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 10:43 pm

mvscal wrote:
Killian wrote:Kevin White freaked out in 2005 and extended Weis's contract by 5 years after the USC game.
He was extended for ten years, slappy, and his original deal was for six so any way you slice it, you're wrong. As I said, you pretty much don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

You wouldn't happen to have a source for the rest of your gibberish, would you? Are you sure that source isn't another "lazy journalist"? Oh, and why the fuck would Weis ever agree to restructure especially considering he was on the hot seat last fall also? Swarbrick had absolutely no leverage.

Time to put up or shut up, sport.

It was a 5 year extension on top of his original deal, dumb fuck. Go back and get your facts straight. Lazy journalists reported a "10 year extension". The extension gave him a total of 10 years left on his deal.

Swarbrick had the leverage of lowering his buyout and not scaring off NFL teams if they wanted to approach him for an NFL job, or if he wanted to resign to take an NFL job.

Here's a link:

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=2207478

As for my source, believe it or not. Clearly you don't. That's fine.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 1:56 am

You don't read very well. I get that now. That, and you back peddle like an NFL CB. Do you fold this easy in the political forum as well?

Vito Corleone · Post by **Vito Corleone** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 3:00 am

When John Machovic turned Texas into a cluster back in 97, he also had a huge buyout at Texas, so Deloss Dodds chose not to buy him out rather he reassigned him to designing the University golf course. He basically told him if he decides to go to another program it would be by quitting his job. Mack II actually stayed and lived off his salary, thus ending his career as a coach.

If I were the ND AD I would do the same thing to Weiss, reassign him to manage the Athletic dorms or some shit job like that, if he wants to coach again in the next 8 year he has to quit his job at Notre Dame.

SoCalTrjn · Post by **SoCalTrjn** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 3:02 am

Not a good week to be at a school called Notre Dame. Sherman Oaks Notre Dame got whacked by the school my sons are going to.

Go Mission!

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 3:40 am

Vito Corleone wrote:When John Machovic turned Texas into a cluster back in 97, he also had a huge buyout at Texas, so Deloss Dodds chose not to buy him out rather he reassigned him to designing the University golf course. He basically told him if he decides to go to another program it would be by quitting his job. Mack II actually stayed and lived off his salary, thus ending his career as a coach.

If I were the ND AD I would do the same thing to Weiss, reassign him to manage the Athletic dorms or some shit job like that, if he wants to coach again in the next 8 year he has to quit his job at Notre Dame.

That's unpossible Vito! Dodds had no leverage. How could he do something like that? Or maybe he said you can take your buyout now and not coach, or restructure it so its beneficial for both parties and coach again next year. No, once a buyout is put in place the AD loses all leverage.

And why the fuck would I tell you my source? Don't like it, keep lapping up what ESPN spoon feeds you.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 4:05 am

Mmmmmm, mmmmmm! Keep giving it to me ESPN!

You're throwing around that 10-15 million like its a firm number, yet you didn't see any contract either.

You're the kid that really wants to be in-the-know, and hates it when someone else is and knows more than you. You keep thinking you know what's going on.

indyfrisco · Post by **indyfrisco** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 4:28 am

mvscal,

Killian isn't full of shit. He subscribes to the ND Nation websites I believe where some posters do have that intimate knowledge. And he may have some other inside link if I can recall. He's not a bullshitter. I take what Killian says at face value. Just because he does not reveal his sources does not mean he is full of shit. Trust me, I know this on a T1B level right now. He doesn't owe it to you. Once the info comes out and he is "vindicated", will you be here to say props or lucky guess?

indyfrisco · Post by **indyfrisco** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 5:13 am

Well, I do remember talk about how Weis got this big extension at the cost of a lower buyout. Google for yourself the links. I ain't doing it.

At this point, who knows what ND will pay his fat ass to GTF outa dodge, but 5-6 Mil seems about right from what I have seen and heard too.

indyfrisco · Post by **indyfrisco** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 2:16 pm

The "secrecy" behind it all I believe is because they are a private institution and do not have to reveal the specifics of any contract. And we may never know the specifics of the final buyout because of this, nor do I care. I fucking hope it is 18 million. Every time ND loses, an angel gets its wings.

Terry in Crapchester · Wed Dec 02, 2009 2:32 pm

IndyFrisco wrote:mvscal,

Killian isn't full of shit. He subscribes to the ND Nation websites I believe where some posters do have that intimate knowledge.

ND Nation isn't a pay site, fwiw. But I believe he subscribes to Mike Frank's website, which is a pay site. With respect to ND Nation, you're correct that there are a number of posters there who are really plugged in to the program. The problem is that you have to separate the wheat from the chaff, and that's not always an easy task.

And he may have some other inside link if I can recall. He's not a bullshitter. I take what Killian says at face value. Just because he does not reveal his sources does not mean he is full of shit. Trust me, I know this on a T1B level right now. He doesn't owe it to you. Once the info comes out and he is "vindicated", will you be here to say props or lucky guess?

Knowing mvscal, my guess is that he'll just ignore this thread.

Vito Corleone wrote:If I were the ND AD I would do the same thing to Weiss, reassign him to manage the Athletic dorms or some shit job like that, if he wants to coach again in the next 8 year he has to quit his job at Notre Dame.

There are no athletic dorms at ND, so that particular suggestion isn't an option. Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing him become a Recruiting Coordinator a la Vinny Cerrato circa mid-late 80's, or even stay on as offensive coordinator under the next coach, but those aren't realistic options.

M Club · Post by **M Club** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 2:40 pm

Terry in Crapchester wrote:
Vito Corleone wrote:If I were the ND AD I would do the same thing to Weiss, reassign him to manage the Athletic dorms or some shit job like that, if he wants to coach again in the next 8 year he has to quit his job at Notre Dame.
There are no athletic dorms at ND, so that particular suggestion isn't an option...

literal much?

Terry in Crapchester · Wed Dec 02, 2009 2:53 pm

M Club wrote:
Terry in Crapchester wrote:
Vito Corleone wrote:If I were the ND AD I would do the same thing to Weiss, reassign him to manage the Athletic dorms or some shit job like that, if he wants to coach again in the next 8 year he has to quit his job at Notre Dame.
There are no athletic dorms at ND, so that particular suggestion isn't an option...
literal much?

Just pointing out that one particular suggestion. If you were being a little more intellectually honest, you would have included the remainder of my post, where I mentioned another possibility, albeit an unrealistic one.

Terry in Crapchester · Thu Dec 03, 2009 12:37 pm

Another problem with Vito's suggestion is from a legalistic standpoint. Weis was fired on Monday, which act terminated his employment contract with Notre Dame. Therefore, I don't think reassignment is an option for Swarbrick at this juncture. The only option available is the buyout clause, and I would suspect that any attempt to bypass the buyout clause at this point almost certainly guarantees litigation between Weis and ND.

SunCoastSooner · Post by **SunCoastSooner** » Thu Dec 03, 2009 4:02 pm

Vito Corleone wrote:If I were the ND AD I would do the same thing to Weiss, reassign him to manage the Athletic dorms or some shit job like that, if he wants to coach again in the next 8 year he has to quit his job at Notre Dame.

And you think they have trouble finding a coach now? Are you on drugs?

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Mon Dec 07, 2009 6:36 pm

Kelly to reportedly interview for the ND job on Tuesday. The way he's been handling the ND questions, I think he's as good as gone.

CintiBearcat92 · Post by **CintiBearcat92** » Mon Dec 07, 2009 7:29 pm

Hope he doesn't let the door hit him in the ass on the way out. The table is set for the next Cincinnati coach, the guy who wants to be here long term and make this a perennial top 20 program. Construction is about to begin on a new indoor practice facility, the stadium is going to be expanded, and we now have a recent history of success to build on. Cincinnati is getting serious consideration from recruits that would've never even considered us 5 years ago and we've been to the Orange and Sugar Bowls in consecutive years. If Kelly wants to move on to perceived greener pastures then let him go. There will be plenty of attractive candidates to take over this program.

CintiBearcat92 · Post by **CintiBearcat92** » Mon Dec 07, 2009 7:40 pm

This is pretty funny though.

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/b ... aaf,207121

SunCoastSooner · Post by **SunCoastSooner** » Mon Dec 07, 2009 7:43 pm

CintiBearcat92 wrote:Hope he doesn't let the door hit him in the ass on the way out. The table is set for the next Cincinnati coach, the guy who wants to be here long term and make this a perennial top 20 program. Construction is about to begin on a new indoor practice facility, the stadium is going to be expanded, and we now have a recent history of success to build on. Cincinnati is getting serious consideration from recruits that would've never even considered us 5 years ago and we've been to the Orange and Sugar Bowls in consecutive years. If Kelly wants to move on to perceived greener pastures then let him go. There will be plenty of attractive candidates to take over this program.

Wow, you really do have delusions of grandeur don't ya? You don't even realize that right now you're nothing more in BTPCFB than what Tulsa was to the NCAA basketball tournament for much of the 90s and early part of this century?

Laxplayer · Post by **Laxplayer** » Mon Dec 07, 2009 7:52 pm

I was trying to give the Bearcats a little respect, but giving up 44 to Pitt lost me. You gotta play a little defense to be considered a good team and that was pitiful.

Which is why as an ND fan I don't want Kelley. He's not an upgrade over what they just got rid of.

Laxplayer · Post by **Laxplayer** » Mon Dec 07, 2009 7:59 pm

...and therin lies the problem Mace. They're going to settle once again for a guy who really hasn't proven anything. Yes he's done well at Cincy but have they played top notch competition week in and week out. Their defense just gave up almost 50 points to Pitt. ND's problem is defense so how does this guy help? How is he going to sway recruits? I'm not buying it.

CintiBearcat92 · Post by **CintiBearcat92** » Mon Dec 07, 2009 8:20 pm

SunCoastSooner wrote:
CintiBearcat92 wrote:Hope he doesn't let the door hit him in the ass on the way out. The table is set for the next Cincinnati coach, the guy who wants to be here long term and make this a perennial top 20 program. Construction is about to begin on a new indoor practice facility, the stadium is going to be expanded, and we now have a recent history of success to build on. Cincinnati is getting serious consideration from recruits that would've never even considered us 5 years ago and we've been to the Orange and Sugar Bowls in consecutive years. If Kelly wants to move on to perceived greener pastures then let him go. There will be plenty of attractive candidates to take over this program.

Wow, you really do have delusions of grandeur don't ya? You don't even realize that right now you're nothing more in BTPCFB than what Tulsa was to the NCAA basketball tournament for much of the 90s and early part of this century?

Tell me what I said that was incorrect. I'll be waiting. Everything I said is true, every word. A program is about more than a coach. I appreciate what Brian Kelly has done at Cincinnati and I hope he decides to stay but I don't want him here if he'd rather be at ND. Like I said, there will be plenty of good coaches interested in the position if it opens up. BK isn't the only guy who can succeed at Cincinnati. I'll be waiting for you to point out to me anything I said that is incorrect or somehow overly building up the position if it were to open up.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Mon Dec 07, 2009 8:39 pm

Laxplayer wrote: Which is why as an ND fan I don't want Kelley. He's not an upgrade over what they just got rid of.

While I'm not gung ho in the pro Kelly camp, I don't agree with this. The one thing the guy has proven is that he can develop players and coach the hell out of them. My main concerns are with his staff/recruiting, and his defense. Defense can be fixed if ND allows him to hire someone good ($$$$). Rumor is that he may consider GVSU HC Chuck Martin as DC if he comes. Yuck.

Terry in Crapchester · Mon Dec 07, 2009 8:46 pm

Killian wrote:
Laxplayer wrote: Which is why as an ND fan I don't want Kelley. He's not an upgrade over what they just got rid of.
While I'm not gung ho in the pro Kelly camp, I don't agree with this. The one thing the guy has proven is that he can develop players and coach the hell out of them. My main concerns are with his staff/recruiting, and his defense. Defense can be fixed if ND allows him to hire someone good ($$$$). Rumor is that he may consider GVSU HC Chuck Martin as DC if he comes. Yuck.

How about Tuberville? I wouldn't want him as HC, but he'd be a helluva DC.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Mon Dec 07, 2009 8:53 pm

I think Tubberville would be a great choice as DC. Not sure if the ND admin will be kosher with it. Therein lies the problem.

SunCoastSooner · Post by **SunCoastSooner** » Mon Dec 07, 2009 9:13 pm

CintiBearcat92 wrote:
SunCoastSooner wrote:
CintiBearcat92 wrote:Hope he doesn't let the door hit him in the ass on the way out. The table is set for the next Cincinnati coach, the guy who wants to be here long term and make this a perennial top 20 program. Construction is about to begin on a new indoor practice facility, the stadium is going to be expanded, and we now have a recent history of success to build on. Cincinnati is getting serious consideration from recruits that would've never even considered us 5 years ago and we've been to the Orange and Sugar Bowls in consecutive years. If Kelly wants to move on to perceived greener pastures then let him go. There will be plenty of attractive candidates to take over this program.

Wow, you really do have delusions of grandeur don't ya? You don't even realize that right now you're nothing more in BTPCFB than what Tulsa was to the NCAA basketball tournament for much of the 90s and early part of this century?
Tell me what I said that was incorrect. I'll be waiting. Everything I said is true, every word. A program is about more than a coach. I appreciate what Brian Kelly has done at Cincinnati and I hope he decides to stay but I don't want him here if he'd rather be at ND. Like I said, there will be plenty of good coaches interested in the position if it opens up. BK isn't the only guy who can succeed at Cincinnati. I'll be waiting for you to point out to me anything I said that is incorrect or somehow overly building up the position if it were to open up.

Tulsa started believing their program was larger than the coaches it brought in because it started recruiting better and was building better facilities too... they returned to obscurity as soon as that started to effect what they were looking for in a coach and really believed that it was a "long haul" program for some coach.

Laxplayer · Post by **Laxplayer** » Mon Dec 07, 2009 9:30 pm

Killian, I hope you're right. Now, I do know a DC who has midwestern ties who has a wife that wants to get back to the midwest. Granted I'd be out one good drinking buddy but I'd have a line on tickets.