Looks like Reggie is definitely going to lose his trophy...

[indyfrisco]

What I find funny about that article is that the heading is "Reggie Bush to lose Heisman" and every quote from everyone in that article is that no decision has been made. We all know it is going to happen, but why put a heading like that with everything in the meat of the article refuting it?

Oh yeah....ESPN sensationalism...

[Mace]

If you ain't cheatin', you ain't tryin'.

Sin,

Petey

[indyfrisco]

must.....not......click......

- Van

[Carson]

Former USC players would have to commit double murder to have their Heismans taken away.

Oh wait...

[SoCalTrjn]

I was watching ESPN sportscenter the other day when the Yahoo report came out and the female reporter was talking to Andre Ware who was defending Reggie's Heisman saying he and other winners think he should keep it.

She went onto say that according to the report the Heisman will be taken back by the trust in about 5 weeks. She continued to say, "we will look forward to that happening."

I just find it so strange how much anger and resentment people hold toward USC. There is no evidence that anyone at USC knew he was taking benefits. They aren't even ripping Bush individually, they are going after USC for some reason. I just dont get it.

[SoCalTrjn]

The problem is that Nobody at USC knew what was going on with Reggie the 8 months or so he was on the take and nobody at or affiliated with USC was breaking any rules or providing any illegal benefits to Reggie or anyone else in the football program and while Reggie is getting a free pass it seems that everyone is trying to label USC as cheaters when there is no evidence or reason for doing so.

Look at the OP's post where he says "poor ole USC" or something inbred to that extent. How is it poor USC? USC was already ordered by the NCAA to give their copy of the Heisman trophy back so if the Heisman trust decides Reggie has to give his back, the school is not effected, the NCAA already broke all their own rules and standards trying to bust USC in the first place.

[Goober McTuber]

I think you're experiencing some of the "Finally! We got 'em!" attitude that Alabama had to deal with when we got slapped down.

More like "They finally got caught".

[indyfrisco]

What part of USC giving the finger to the NCAA don't you understand? The poodle gave the finger, knew he was going to get hammered and bailed. Isn't that a sign to you? If some stockbroker is doing some shady shit to earn himself and his company some money and his company does not know about it, his company is still liable for his actions.

Get over it, douche. Take your medicine.the USCheatmachine will be back in full force in a couplefew years.

[PSUFAN]

must.....not......click......

- Van

[SoCalTrjn]

What did Pete do to give the NCAA the finger? Show me anything that shows that the coaching staff and the school did not cooperate fully with the investigation. All the school had asked for was a fair and unbiased investigation and that all the evidence be put out there. This was a with hunt from the start and nobody has any proof to the contrary. Would I have liked Pete to have stayed, of course but maybe he left because he knew he was not going to get a fair or inpartial hearing in any of this and that the illinformed, like those posting on this board, would jump to their conspiracy theories because of a USC envy and hatred more than a proof of any USC wrong doing.
Lake went to Yahoo after Reggie had left USC, his "smoking gun" was a 90 second phone call to a USC assistant coach at 2 in the morning 3 days after Reggie left the school. Lake recorded the calls with Reggies step dad, where is this recording, how do we know that the USC assistant coach even answered the phone? At 2 in the morning maybe Lake just left a message and with the assistant coach not knowing who it was, he didnt do anything about it.
Pete Carroll said that the ruling was unjust, he likely left because he knew the ruling was going to be that way based on what the NCAA was saying to him in the first place. they went after Pete because he had open practices and allowed USC alumni and fans access to the team after practice was over. If the NCAA was going to paint something as innocent as little kids getting autographs and posing for pictures with players as a major infraction, why should he stay? the NCAA had an agenda with the investigation and they took the word of someone that was seeking financial gain in a lawsuit with a former player at the school. Then the NCAA added to that felons word to suit the NCAAs desires of stripping USC of its BCS title when there was no reason to do so.

USC already gave in to the NCAAs demands and disassociated itsself with Reggie Bush, USC already removed Bush's Heisman from Herritage Hall and sent it back to New York. If the Heisman Trust wants Reggie to return his copy, that has nothing to do with USC. This threads direction is just another example of haters trying to pile on to USC. Bush losing his Heisman now has nothing to do with USC, they already lost that.

[Harvdog]

There is a little something that the NCAA falls back on in this case and it is called "Lack of Institutional Control." This is a simple thing. Whether the coaches knew or not, Reggie Bush was on a Athletic Scholarship to USC and therefore it was up to the Institution to be involved in his day to day happenings. Did USC know that Reggie's parents were leeching off an agent and using his future earnings to finance their trips to all his home games? Were they not surprised when a kid who lived in an apartment shows up one day in a tricked out car? Why did they not know what his parents address was?

Was it Bob Stoop's fault that he had players "working" at a car dealership and that they were being paid and didn't even show up? No. But, it fell under "Lack of Institutional Control". The rules are simple and all the schools have compliance offices that are in place to make sure that things like this do not happen. USC knew the rules and did not have someone in place to make sure players weren't cheating, like Reggie.

Fuck him. He deserves to lose it. He cheated and got caught. I feel bad for the current players that have to pay for his discretions. The award should have gone to Vince in the first place but ESPN was sucking USC's cock the whole year that Reggie was a lock for the award. People wonder why Houston passed on him in the draft......

[SoCalTrjn]

There is a little something that the NCAA falls back on in this case and it is called "Lack of Institutional Control." This is a simple thing. Whether the coaches knew or not, Reggie Bush was on a Athletic Scholarship to USC and therefore it was up to the Institution to be involved in his day to day happenings. Did USC know that Reggie's parents were leeching off an agent and using his future earnings to finance their trips to all his home games? Were they not surprised when a kid who lived in an apartment shows up one day in a tricked out car? Why did they not know what his parents address was?

Was it Bob Stoop's fault that he had players "working" at a car dealership and that they were being paid and didn't even show up? No. But, it fell under "Lack of Institutional Control". The rules are simple and all the schools have compliance offices that are in place to make sure that things like this do not happen. USC knew the rules and did not have someone in place to make sure players weren't cheating, like Reggie.

Fuck him. He deserves to lose it. He cheated and got caught. I feel bad for the current players that have to pay for his discretions. The award should have gone to Vince in the first place but ESPN was sucking USC's cock the whole year that Reggie was a lock for the award. People wonder why Houston passed on him in the draft......

No it wasnt Bob Stoops fault that an Oklahoma booster was paying Oklahoma players for work they never showed up to do. But Stoops wasnt stripped of a title he won before the Big Red Motors incident, the NCAA is going after USCs 2004/2005 title even though no rules were broken by the school or any of the players on that team until after that title had been won. Even by the NCAAs witness' accounts, Reggie didnt break any rules until March/April of 2005.

We have gone over the car thing, when reggie drove that car to school, it was not tricked out, it was just a red 4 door sedan. The work done to that car that made it "trick" was all done after Reggie had left USC

If USC is responsioble for 2 years and 30 scholarships of punishment for 1 player receiving illegal benfits, a school like North Carolina that has 4 or more players receiving illegal benefits from agents deserves 8 or more years of bowl bans and 120 or more scholarships to be taken and Oklahoma which had at least 3 players involved with Big Red Motors deserves at least three times the punishment that USC was given, correct?

ESPN was on USCs nuts because they were on Oklahomas buts the previous 2 years and then Oklahoma got shit hammered in their bowl and conference title games.

[Harvdog]

No it wasnt Bob Stoops fault that an Oklahoma booster was paying Oklahoma players for work they never showed up to do. But Stoops wasnt stripped of a title he won before the Big Red Motors incident, the NCAA is going after USCs 2004/2005 title even though no rules were broken by the school or any of the players on that team until after that title had been won. Even by the NCAAs witness' accounts, Reggie didnt break any rules until March/April of 2005.

They didn't go after any of Stoop's wins because the year it happened, 2005, they didn't win anything. Texas won the Big XII.

We have gone over the car thing, when reggie drove that car to school, it was not tricked out, it was just a red 4 door sedan. The work done to that car that made it "trick" was all done after Reggie had left USC

In the spring of 2005 New Era Sports gave Bush almost $13,000 to buy a pristine black-on-black 1996 Chevrolet Impala SS in Los Angeles. The car is subsequently outfitted with chrome rims and a stereo. This is a VIOLATION. This was before the season he was given the Heisman. He violated NCAA rules.

If USC is responsible for 2 years and 30 scholarships of punishment for 1 player receiving illegal benefits, a school like North Carolina that has 4 or more players receiving illegal benefits from agents deserves 8 or more years of bowl bans and 120 or more scholarships to be taken and Oklahoma which had at least 3 players involved with Big Red Motors deserves at least three times the punishment that USC was given, correct?

This is not up to me or you. It is up to the NCAA. What Reggie Bush did was despicable. He knowingly took the money and the benefits with no regard for the University or the players. I feel for them. He is a piece of shit. But rules are rules and I am sure that UNC will be dealt with. The difference is that the UNC players went to a party in Florida that was sponsored by an agent. Reggie Bush used his future to secure a home for his parents, a car for himself, money for trips and then didn't want to make good on his promise. If this moron would have just paid for what he was advanced, no one would have ever found out. This just proves what a total STUPID ASSHOLE Reggie Bush is.

ESPN was on USC's nuts because they were on Oklahoma's nuts the previous 2 years and then Oklahoma got shit hammered in their bowl and conference title games.

[/quote]

ESPN did a deal before the Rose Bowl in 2006 and said that this USC team was the best of all time. They gave Texas no chance. We all saw how that turned out.

[M Club]

why does toejam keep putting forth the excuse usc didn't know? i think that was listed in the report for why they got shit hammered: that they should have. i think it was the poodle who said something about how only one person was working in compliance and how can she track everyone's shit down? uh, hire an actual compliance department.

and next time you reply with some more of your tears don't forget to bring up oj mayo. sc probably skates if this was just about reggie bush.

[Dinsdale]

First, M, USC fully admitted to a lack of institutional control with Mayo, and punished themselves, which became an almost-non-issue to the NCAA.

But on to football -- where the wannabe agents used to brag to prospective clients with their pics of them posing with Cheatey.

And what Toejam wants to gloss over, is one of USC's assistant coaches physically handed Riggie a bag full of money... but that doesn't support his whinefest, so he conveniently omits it from his whining.

He also omits that Cheatey welcomed agents into practices and the locker room with open arms, which is freaking unheard of.

If you read through the NCAA report, they said something to the aeffect of "you were begging for agents to start bargaining with players early."

And they were.

This took the concept of "lack of institutional control" and... made an institution out of it.


They wanted the glitz and the aura of agents, celebs, and everything else they could "bigtime" with for a recruiting advantage, including their stars having pimp rides, shady internships, and every other improper benefit that they thought they had "plausable deniability" from to work to their recruiting advantage...

Then it came time to pay the piper, and suddenly the university that had such massive balls to make a mockery of "institutional control" grew a massive vagina.

There's an addage that says "you've got to pay to play."

USC played... HARD... and now it's time to pay.


I'm not sure which letters in "SMU" that USC didn't understand... was it the "S"?.... the "M"?... the "U"?... or the DEATH PENALTY part they didn't quite get?


I actually think the NCAA went VERY easy on their West Coast Cash Cow, and for this, USC should be VERY thankful... but that's not their way... I think Toejam sums up their petulence quite well. For these tards to even try and to deny that they were WAY outside the rules of the NCAA, common decency, and common sense is fucking hilarious.

[M Club]

First, M, USC fully admitted to a lack of institutional control with Mayo, and punished themselves, which became an almost-non-issue to the NCAA.

the same thing going on with a program's bball team was also going on with its football team. just because the ncaa accepted their self-imposed sanctions doesn't mean it became a non-issue when deciding what to do with usc football. in fact, mayo was one of the players mentioned in the ncaa's report, albeit as 'student-athlete 1 or 2 or something.'

[SoCalTrjn]

No it wasnt Bob Stoops fault that an Oklahoma booster was paying Oklahoma players for work they never showed up to do. But Stoops wasnt stripped of a title he won before the Big Red Motors incident, the NCAA is going after USCs 2004/2005 title even though no rules were broken by the school or any of the players on that team until after that title had been won. Even by the NCAAs witness' accounts, Reggie didnt break any rules until March/April of 2005.

They didn't go after any of Stoop's wins because the year it happened, 2005, they didn't win anything. Texas won the Big XII.

and the year that reggie Bush took money from the agent wanna be's, Texas won the National Title, the NCAA went after the title from the year before when no rules had been broken

We have gone over the car thing, when reggie drove that car to school, it was not tricked out, it was just a red 4 door sedan. The work done to that car that made it "trick" was all done after Reggie had left USC

In the spring of 2005 New Era Sports gave Bush almost $13,000 to buy a pristine black-on-black 1996 Chevrolet Impala SS in Los Angeles. The car is subsequently outfitted with chrome rims and a stereo. This is a VIOLATION. This was before the season he was given the Heisman. He violated NCAA rules.

yes, Reggie violated NCAA rules, 3 months after USC beat Oklahoma 55-19 fair and square in the National Title game

If USC is responsible for 2 years and 30 scholarships of punishment for 1 player receiving illegal benefits, a school like North Carolina that has 4 or more players receiving illegal benefits from agents deserves 8 or more years of bowl bans and 120 or more scholarships to be taken and Oklahoma which had at least 3 players involved with Big Red Motors deserves at least three times the punishment that USC was given, correct?

This is not up to me or you. It is up to the NCAA. What Reggie Bush did was despicable. He knowingly took the money and the benefits with no regard for the University or the players. I feel for them. He is a piece of shit. But rules are rules and I am sure that UNC will be dealt with. The difference is that the UNC players went to a party in Florida that was sponsored by an agent. Reggie Bush used his future to secure a home for his parents, a car for himself, money for trips and then didn't want to make good on his promise. If this moron would have just paid for what he was advanced, no one would have ever found out. This just proves what a total STUPID ASSHOLE Reggie Bush is.

Reggie did pay for what he was advanced, that was why Michaels wouldn't testify. Lloyd Lake felt betrayed because he didnt get anything and went to the press after Reggie decided to use another agent and paid Michaels back for the 8 months of rent his parents hadnt paid.

ESPN was on USC's nuts because they were on Oklahoma's nuts the previous 2 years and then Oklahoma got shit hammered in their bowl and conference title games.

ESPN did a deal before the Rose Bowl in 2006 and said that this USC team was the best of all time. They gave Texas no chance. We all saw how that turned out.[/quote]

ESPN did the same deal the 2 years prior to that in favor of Oklahoma. the Sooners got stomped in their own conference game and ESPN still lobbied for them to be in the title game since they were clearly the best team in the nation. the next year every single analyst on ESPN picked Oklahoma to roll USC in the Orange Bowl because Oklahoma was a bigger, stronger and faster team that had the experience of playing in big time games vs big time opponents and USC didnt. They gave USC no chance and we all know that 55-19 is a larger example of the ESPN not knowing shit than a 3 point loss in a back and forth game.

[SoCalTrjn]

First, M, USC fully admitted to a lack of institutional control with Mayo, and punished themselves, which became an almost-non-issue to the NCAA.

But on to football -- where the wannabe agents used to brag to prospective clients with their pics of them posing with Cheatey.

And what Toejam wants to gloss over, is one of USC's assistant coaches physically handed Riggie a bag full of money... but that doesn't support his whinefest, so he conveniently omits it from his whining.

not true, nowhere was that in the NCAA report on the violations at USC, the "bag of money" was handed to Mayo by someone in basketball, no assistant coach handed reggie any money

He also omits that Cheatey welcomed agents into practices and the locker room with open arms, which is freaking unheard of.

If you read through the NCAA report, they said something to the aeffect of "you were begging for agents to start bargaining with players early."

again, not true, Carroll did not welcome agents in to the locker room or beg them to bargain with USC players early. If this was true, what other players signed with agents while they were still playing at USC and recieved free gifts, if it was as common as you say, then you and the NCAA found other players doing it right?

And they were.

This took the concept of "lack of institutional control" and... made an institution out of it.


They wanted the glitz and the aura of agents, celebs, and everything else they could "bigtime" with for a recruiting advantage, including their stars having pimp rides, shady internships, and every other improper benefit that they thought they had "plausable deniability" from to work to their recruiting advantage...

wrong, agents had nothing to do with any of USCs recruiting, what the players drove also had nothing to do with any of their recruiting, nor internships. show me in the NCAA's report that this was the case.

Then it came time to pay the piper, and suddenly the university that had such massive balls to make a mockery of "institutional control" grew a massive vagina.

There's an addage that says "you've got to pay to play."

USC played... HARD... and now it's time to pay.

USC had 1 player who was approached through his step father by shady agent wannabe's who secretly provided that players family with a place to live for 8 months in return for that player signing with them after leaving the school early. There was no massive lack of control running rampant through the program that was so obvious to be seen that the school had to have known about it. Let me ask you this, if it was so obvious that all of this wrong doing was going on in the program, why did it take 5 years for the NCAA to finally find enough dirt to implicate one player of any wrong doing? and why was their only witness to this wrong doing a felon who had already been convicted of perjury and extortion in the past?

I'm not sure which letters in "SMU" that USC didn't understand... was it the "S"?.... the "M"?... the "U"?... or the DEATH PENALTY part they didn't quite get?


I actually think the NCAA went VERY easy on their West Coast Cash Cow, and for this, USC should be VERY thankful... but that's not their way... I think Toejam sums up their petulence quite well. For these tards to even try and to deny that they were WAY outside the rules of the NCAA, common decency, and common sense is fucking hilarious.

from a guy whose schools largest booster (Phil Knight) provides every player in the program with free lap tops, clothes, game systems and whatever else they need just to get them to go to the sticks and play for them

[Dinsdale]

When did the University of Oregon move to "the sticks"?

I must have missed that part, and I could have sworn the last time I went to a game, it was in a metro area of 300K+.

Well, when Reggie Bush called me last night...

**Brutal blows to McKnight's ribs from the coaching/AD staff ensue**

UHM, what I MEANT TO SAY, was that Reggie Bush DID NOT call me last night, and...

[indyfrisco]

Well, when Reggie Bush called me last night...

**Brutal blows to McKnight's ribs from the coaching/AD staff ensue**

UHM, what I MEANT TO SAY, was that Reggie Bush DID NOT call me last night, and...

Yeah, funny that. Dude who gets bankrolled a car tells recruit to go to U$C and that same dude is caught driving around some chick's Land Rover who could not afford it. Toejam's head in the sand response in 3...2...1..

Toejam...in the absense of Jon and mJew (for now, but he'll be here shortly), has his sights set on Board Bitch 2010 early. Odds are 7:5 right now he wins.

[SoCalTrjn]

When did the University of Oregon move to "the sticks"?

I must have missed that part, and I could have sworn the last time I went to a game, it was in a metro area of 300K+.

Thats the size of Fontucky.... you know..... the sticks

[SoCalTrjn]

When did the University of Oregon move to "the sticks"?

I must have missed that part, and I could have sworn the last time I went to a game, it was in a metro area of 300K+.

Well, when Reggie Bush called me last night...

**Brutal blows to McKnight's ribs from the coaching/AD staff ensue**

UHM, what I MEANT TO SAY, was that Reggie Bush DID NOT call me last night, and...

Oh - he didn't tell you you're an inbred yet? That seems to be his "go to" phrase when he's getting the shit kicked out of him. :D

or if your a web footed "y'all" spewing banjo playing sister fucker from the south like papa wheelie

[SoCalTrjn]

Well, when Reggie Bush called me last night...

**Brutal blows to McKnight's ribs from the coaching/AD staff ensue**

UHM, what I MEANT TO SAY, was that Reggie Bush DID NOT call me last night, and...

Yeah, funny that. Dude who gets bankrolled a car tells recruit to go to U$C and that same dude is caught driving around some chick's Land Rover who could not afford it. Toejam's head in the sand response in 3...2...1..

Toejam...in the absense of Jon and mJew (for now, but he'll be here shortly), has his sights set on Board Bitch 2010 early. Odds are 7:5 right now he wins.

McKnights babies moms car that he drove her and his newborn baby home from the hospital in? Go ahead and make wild accusations, just make sure you dont trip over the details.

[Dinsdale]

Damn, look at all this smoke everywhere...

I doubt there's a fire though.

Sin,
Toejam



BTW -- you need to get your regional insults straight -- I'M a Webfoot. It's slang for a native Oregonian.

[SoCalTrjn]

Don't know of much inbreeding going on in Oregon, thats a southern trait.



the way it works is.... the media gets word that a USC player and his girlfriend have just had a baby, the reporters ascend on the hospital to get a sound bite or some photos, Bill Plaschke or the hacks from Yahoo only report that Joe was seen driving her car out of the parkinglot while she sat in the back seat with the new born baby.
What you have is media hacks running around throwing matches around the program and then screaming "smoke, smoke, there must be fire"
That cunt Shelly Smith reports during the Hawaii game that its amazing to be on the USC sideline and not see Snoop Dog, this bitch has been covering USC for ESPN for years and she doesnt know that Snoop has never been on the USC sideline for a home or an away game? you have reporters talking about a rapper, who had only ever had an endzone pass and never a sideline pass, "always" hanging out on the sidelines and then by the time message board haters get to it, its the coach introducing his players to agents and having his assistants hand them "sacks of money".
Take the USC hate glasses off and you will see that the Reggie Bush/his step dad/Lloyd Lake was a unique situation within the program and was done so far enough away that nobody involved with the school could have known it was going on. When Reggie first went pro Lloyd Lakes story was, this was all done hush hush, Reggie and Lamar didnt want it to happen near the school, Reggie was given 5,000 to purchase a car in April of 05, thats what Lloyd said in his interviews on HBO. Cut to 3 years later, and after Lake felt he was frther disrespected by Bush who paid Michaels for the 8 month lease his mom and stepdad didnt pay for the hous they stayed in for 8 months and the story is, "an assistant coach or 2 had to have known, Reggie was driving around a 13,000 dollar car."
Like I asked, if USC was paying so many of its players to come to USC and play for the Trojans like you say the school was, why did it take 5 years for the NCAA to find one example of any USC player getting paid by anybody and then why were they only able to show that he was paid to leave USC early and be represented as a professional and not paid to go to and play for USC? The NCAA busted USC for what they felt USC should have known was going on, not for what USC did.