Obama's Gun Talk

Mace · Post by **Mace** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 6:45 pm

You're right, Scott. You can find very few guns and very little ammo at the Des Moines Bass Pro Shop or Scheels. They've been sold out for weeks, pretty much since Sandy Hook, and the stores have been packed with people trying to buy.

Wolfman · Post by **Wolfman** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 6:52 pm

They forgot to outlaw tape so you can't do this. I almost renewed my NRA membership. I was a hunter safety instructor at one time and an NRA member. Pathetic show today with little kids as a backdrop.
Obama, Biden, et al are nothing but a bunch of drama queens, having orgasms about how this will prevent the next mass shooting/killing. I had a sick thought yesterday. The next one will be in a nursing home followed by a lot of posturing with some old folks as back drop.

Mace · Post by **Mace** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:05 pm

Wolfman wrote:The next one will be in a nursing home followed by a lot of posturing with some old folks as back drop.

On the positive side, Wolfman, at least we'll be shooting back at the bastards.

Cuda · Post by **Cuda** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:06 pm

did he say anything about Eric Holder going to prison?

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:07 pm

President Obama: "Second: Congress should restore a ban on military-style assault weapons, and a 10-round limit for magazines."

Right...because it accomplished so much the first time.

Of course this is all theater for low synaptic function shiteaters like S_M. It won't prevent jack shit but it will present the appearance of the political class "doing something about the problem."

Mace · Post by **Mace** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:13 pm

I don't have a problem with universal background checks to keep convicted felons and the mentally ill from purchasing guns....even though it won't keep them from having access to them (as happened in New Town, CT)...but the rest is all smoke and mirrors that won't prevent other shootings. We have a lot of sick individuals in our society who don't need to be counseled, they need to be shot.

smackaholic · Post by **smackaholic** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 8:05 pm

Oh, c'mon, you fukkers know those six year old were just waiting for him to reload so they could rush him.

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 8:19 pm

smackaholic wrote:Oh, c'mon, you fukkers know those six year old were just waiting for him to reload so they could rush him.

Yes, we all know what a great challenge it is to change magazines whilst massacring helpless, unarmed people in a 'gun-free' zone.

Shlomart Ben Yisrael · Wed Jan 16, 2013 11:14 pm

Any legislation is bound to fail.

Obama knows it. As a matter of fact, he's counting on it. He just tossing an imaginary bone to the libs. It has absolutely no traction.

Wolfman · Post by **Wolfman** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:41 am

Anyone remember this?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brady_Hand ... ention_Act

Today's political theater is destined for the same fate. Full of hot air and posturing with no impact. Sadly over half the population will think it is going to succeed.

kcdave · Post by **kcdave** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:52 am

I applaud Obama's effort today, although I doubt it will actually make much difference. Now, a few questions for those that are bashing his decisons.

What the hell should the Pres do right now in your opinion?

Why should it be so easy for people to buy assault style rifles? (Semi-auto that have the capabilities of large mags.)

If there is nothing wrong with people owning assault style rifles, then why should't everyone be allowed to buy grenades, C4,
fully automatic rifles, claymores, or any other weapon available to law enforcement and the military?

Left Seater · Post by **Left Seater** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:17 am

kcdave wrote:I applaud Obama's effort today, although I doubt it will actually make much difference.

You applaud his effort but don't think anything will come of it. In other words he did nothing to make anyone safer, which I agree with.

What should he have done, I suggest nothing since that is better than than a farce for the cameras.

Dinsdale · Post by **Dinsdale** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:39 am

Lost in all this is the sudden witch hunt for the "mentally ill" (which there's no solid definition of... be very afraid, you could be labeled next).

I guess certain people don't have the basic right to keep their medical records private. Rights will now be applied on a case-by-case basis.

Dinsdale · Post by **Dinsdale** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:45 am

kcdave wrote:Now, a few questions for those that are bashing his decisons.

What the hell should the Pres do right now in your opinion?

Try to shrink the federal government, rather than expanding it. And he should put that constitutional law degree to work by restoring rights, rather than curtailing them.

Why should it be so easy for people to buy assault style rifles? (Semi-auto that have the capabilities of large mags.)

Why should it be so easy to vote? Why don't we impliment poll taxes?

It's called the 2nd Amendment.

If there is nothing wrong with people owning assault style rifles, then why should't everyone be allowed to buy grenades, C4...

Because those are weapons of war, not personal defense... and they're not all that difficult to make, anyway.

fully automatic rifles

They should be able to.

claymores, or any other weapon available to law enforcement and the military?

Didn't realize law enforcement used C4 and Claymores. As far as sidearms... everyone should, by right, be able to own the same sidearms as the military and law enforcement (which none of you grabbers seem to realize that the armed forces all but quit using full auto sidearms a looooong time ago, since they waste ammo to the point of being less effective on the battlefield).

Cuda · Post by **Cuda** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:52 am

kcdave wrote:What the hell should the Pres do right now in your opinion?

he should tell his wife that she's a buck-toothed, fat-assed fugly she-monkey that should be living in a tree house with the rest of her troop, far enough away from civilization so that her stinky gash doesn't make everybody gag

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:02 am

kcdave wrote:I applaud Obama's effort today, although I doubt it will actually make much difference.

Why would you applaud his effort when you doubt that it will actually make any difference? Are you retarded? Easily distracted?

Atomic Punk · Post by **Atomic Punk** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:07 am

Cuda wrote:
kcdave wrote:What the hell should the Pres do right now in your opinion?
he should tell his wife that she's a buck-toothed, fat-assed fugly she-monkey that should be living in a tree house with the rest of her troop, far enough away from civilization so that her stinky gash doesn't make everybody gag

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:14 am

kcdave wrote:If there is nothing wrong with people owning assault style rifles, then why should't everyone be allowed to buy grenades, C4, fully automatic rifles, claymores, or any other weapon available to law enforcement and the military?

Fair question. Why shouldn't they?

kcdave · Post by **kcdave** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:01 pm

Just because you can buy them at Walmart doesn't make them any less a weapon of war.
Why can't I roll down to Bass Pro and see a line of 155 Howitzers displayed next to the pontoon boats?

Wolfman · Post by **Wolfman** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:12 pm

There ya go. now it''s no longer a scary "military-style assault" weapon.

Rooster · Post by **Rooster** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:25 pm

"What the hell should the Pres do right now in your opinion?" --kcdave

Make it easier to own and operate firearms. Encourage weapons handling courses. Encourage CCW permits. Operate a far, far more transparent Admnistration-- almost to the point of ridiculousness --and stop hiding your agenda. Fire Eric Holder.

How 'bout those items for a start?

Felix · Post by **Felix** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:18 pm

Rooster wrote:
Make it easier to own and operate firearms.

how much easier does it need to be?

Encourage weapons handling courses. Encourage CCW permits.

yes no doubt if there had been six or seven concealed carry people shooting in the darkened Aurora theater through scambling hoards of people the carnage would have been significantly different (I'm guessing probably higher)....the average person who's gone through the basic concealed weapons class is not prepared to deal with a lunatic armed with a semi-automatic high capacity assault rifle.....

Derron · Post by **Derron** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:35 pm

Felix wrote:the average person who's gone through the basic concealed weapons class is not prepared to deal with a lunatic armed with a semi-automatic high capacity assault rifle.....

Much easier to be completely unarmed and cowering in fear with no way to defend yourself. Consider there just might be some people who are trained at a higher level than the "average" concealed carry holder. Like people who take training several times a year in threat scenarios and shooting, former military etc.

Just better to let somebody else take out the trash in those situations. After all, the police will be there shortly to help you. Looks like the average response time is about 8 minutes.

kcdave · Post by **kcdave** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 12:10 am

My ax try to grind focuses on assault weapons. Semi-auto with the ability to accept high capacity magazines.
I have no problem with conceal carry. Most concealed weapons are handguns. Hand guns don't typically
have taped ass to ass clips. Hand guns can't normally kill 50 people or more in one minute. An AR-15, Bushmaster, Uzi
or your garden variety assault rifle is no different than a hand grenade. They are all weapons of war, and should be treated as such.
We have too many kooks running loose in the US. We also have too many gun nuts hiding behind the 2nd amendment enabling the kooks
to get their hands on these weapons and wreck havoc. I played army as a kid. I WAS Army as a young adult. I know what its like to
fire an M-16. I know that if I plan to protect myself, thats the last gun Im reaching for. Give me a .357 or .44 magnum any day.

smackaholic · Post by **smackaholic** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 1:06 am

kcdave wrote:My ax try to grind focuses on assault weapons. Semi-auto with the ability to accept high capacity magazines.
I have no problem with conceal carry. Most concealed weapons are handguns. Hand guns don't typically
have taped ass to ass clips. Hand guns can't normally kill 50 people or more in one minute. An AR-15, Bushmaster, Uzi
or your garden variety assault rifle is no different than a hand grenade. They are all weapons of war, and should be treated as such.
We have too many kooks running loose in the US. We also have too many gun nuts hiding behind the 2nd amendment enabling the kooks
to get their hands on these weapons and wreck havoc. I played army as a kid. I WAS Army as a young adult. I know what its like to
fire an M-16. I know that if I plan to protect myself, thats the last gun Im reaching for. Give me a .357 or .44 magnum any day.

Then go ahead and buy yourself that 44, dirty harry, but, who the fukk are you to tell others that they can't arm themselves with the weapon of their choice

Cuda · Post by **Cuda** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:05 am

kcdave wrote: I have no problem with conceal carry. .

that's pretty goddam white of you.

Dinsdale · Post by **Dinsdale** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:38 am

kcdave wrote:Most concealed weapons are handguns.

You didn't really just type that, did you?

Let me think... I know a whole buncha permit holders... give me a second to remember how many of them carry wheelies...

That's right, ZERO.

Go ahead and make up more "facts," dude.

Except maybe some of the S&W J frames and their like, a wheelie is too freaking wide to put in your pants/shirt/wherever. Heck, a lot of people don't like the staggered mags, and go with the 7 shot singles in their autos.

Dinsdale · Post by **Dinsdale** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:45 am

Felix wrote: yes no doubt if there had been six or seven concealed carry people shooting in the darkened Aurora theater through scambling hoards of people the carnage would have been significantly different

You didn't get your ass handed to you badly enough last time we went through this?

Why don't you go ahead and cite an instance of a permit-holder causing "carnage" in a mass shooting situation?

Should I hold my breath?

Last time this came up, there were multiple citations of instances where packing fuckers didn't open up, due to a lack of a clear backdrop (sup Aurora, Clackamas), and multiple instances of packing fuckers stopping the carnage (sup Clackamas, although mainstream news sure doesn't want to report it, it's common knowledge locally)...

so why don't you go ahead and list all this "carnage" that CCWs have caused in mass shooting situations?

Because it never happened. Why don't you can your histrionic hypotheticals, since the exact opposite of what you claim might happen is what actually happens.

Dinsdale · Post by **Dinsdale** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:03 am

88 wrote:Obama's blatant use of children to promote his agenda was not?

You mean like pretending they are dead, that sort of "use"?

Dinsdale · Post by **Dinsdale** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:04 am

KC Scott wrote:the wife is a lot more comfortable shooting the SW 66 than the Glock - she doesnt have the hand strength to pull the slide back

So, you and yours exercise your freedom of choice in such matters?

Shame on you. You should let the Grabbers decide what's best for you and your family... the way it should be.

Felix · Post by **Felix** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 7:59 am

Dinsdale wrote: You didn't get your ass handed to you badly enough last time we went through this?

you must be thinking of somebody else moron.....
I'm the guy that has five hand guns, has a concealed weapons permit, worked in a gun store for a number of years, has been through countless numbers of gun training classes, has shot almost every kind of gun there is, and has probably forgotten more about firearms than you'll ever know....I'm pretty well trained but I have no idea how I might react in a situation like that......I've seen experienced police officers freak out when confronted with an armed perpetrator.....

in a situation like Aurora, it's impossible to know how even the most highly trained individuals might react...

there aren't any examples of your every day concealed weapons carriers getting into shootouts with people packing high powered weapons in closed quarters like a movie theater......but if you come across any, let me know....

smackaholic · Post by **smackaholic** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:56 pm

Felix wrote:
Rooster wrote:
Make it easier to own and operate firearms.
how much easier does it need to be?

Encourage weapons handling courses. Encourage CCW permits.
yes no doubt if there had been six or seven concealed carry people shooting in the darkened Aurora theater through scambling hoards of people the carnage would have been significantly different (I'm guessing probably higher)....the average person who's gone through the basic concealed weapons class is not prepared to deal with a lunatic armed with a semi-automatic high capacity assault rifle.....

here's a little hypothetical for you, feelsdicks.

you are told you must go into a full theater and watch a movie. at some point during the movie a crazy fukk is gonna enter the theatre and attempt to punch everyone's ticket. you have the option of going in unarmed, armed (just you), armed with others armed as well and trained in handgun self defense.

whatcha gonna do?

i'm going in with a 9mm with a sizable clip and will sit on the right end of the isle. and i will want plenty others similarly armed, so when the crazy fukk opens up, he will recieve return fire from multiple directions. will unfortunate fukks stabd up and catch some of this return fire in the back? possibly, but i still like my chances over dieing huddled behind a seat in my own shit.

Felix · Post by **Felix** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:55 pm

KC Scott wrote:Go look at the videos I posted - multiple instances of people doing exactly that

The cyber cafe is packed with people when a 71 yr old takes on two armed robbers - no one is hurt but the robbers

the only problem with those videos scott is that with the exception of the crazy marine, all of those videos were robberies and not instances of some whack job bent on killing people.....robbers are there for the money, so when someone pulls a gun on them and shoots back, they're taken totally by surprise and react the same way I alluded to earlier....they weren't expecting it and when it came they freaked out.....

smackaholic wrote: here's a little hypothetical for you, feelsdicks.

you are told you must go into a full theater and watch a movie. at some point during the movie a crazy fukk is gonna enter the theatre and attempt to punch everyone's ticket. you have the option of going in unarmed, armed (just you), armed with others armed as well and trained in handgun self defense.

whatcha gonna do?

i'm going in with a 9mm with a sizable clip and will sit on the right end of the isle. and i will want plenty others similarly armed, so when the crazy fukk opens up, he will recieve return fire from multiple directions. will unfortunate fukks stabd up and catch some of this return fire in the back? possibly, but i still like my chances over dieing huddled behind a seat in my own shit.

your hypothetical scenario is full of holes......no one knows in advance that some crazy fuck is going to enter a theater and start mowing people down.....but lets put a little different spin on your scenario.....lets say there are five or six concealed weapons carriers in the theater and some guy comes in blasting....you are one of those carrying a gun.....when people hear gun shots, most everyone will dive for cover including the ones carrying the weapons....now lets say that of those six people packing weapons, two of them saw the shooter while the other four (you included) didn't see the shooter before you took cover.....all those carrying guns pull their weapons and begin to search for the guy doing the shooting.....you spot some guy with a gun and believing he's the shooter you clock him with a shot to the head and kill him.....but the shooting doesn't stop and you come to the realization you've killed a person that turns out to be one of the other concealed weapons carriers.....assuming you make it out alive, your going to have to face the reality that you killed someone by mistake

what are you going to tell the family of the person you killed?

when I worked at the gun store, we had loaded weapons placed strategically behind counters throughout the store.....the store owner was adamant that in the event the store was ever robbed, we were to simply give the robber the money....the guns were only to be used in a worst case scenario wherein the robber started roughing people up or started shooting.....

btw, the two places you never want to attempt an armed robbery is at a gun store or a pawn shop

Python · Post by **Python** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:03 pm

Felix wrote:btw, the two places you never want to attempt an armed robbery is at a gun store or a pawn shop

Bring out the Gimp.

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:41 pm

Felix wrote:and not instances of some whack job bent on killing people.....

That's because whack jobs bent on killing people always do it in 'self-defense free zones' like schools and malls, you fucking idiot.

Derron · Post by **Derron** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:53 pm

Felix wrote:

your hypothetical scenario is full of holes......no one knows in advance that some crazy fuck is going to enter a theater and start mowing people down.....but lets put a little different spin on your scenario.....lets say there are five or six concealed weapons carriers in the theater and some guy comes in blasting....you are one of those carrying a gun.....when people hear gun shots, most everyone will dive for cover including the ones carrying the weapons....now lets say that of those six people packing weapons, two of them saw the shooter while the other four (you included) didn't see the shooter before you took cover.....all those carrying guns pull their weapons and begin to search for the guy doing the shooting.....you spot some guy with a gun and believing he's the shooter you clock him with a shot to the head and kill him.....but the shooting doesn't stop and you come to the realization you've killed a person that turns out to be one of the other concealed weapons carriers.....assuming you make it out alive, your going to have to face the reality that you killed someone by mistake

His scenario is watertight compared to yours. You set up a very unlikely scenario. And based upon your own quote here:

Feelsdicks wrote:in a situation like Aurora, it's impossible to know how even the most highly trained individuals might react...

So that just kills your scenario right there. You allude that there will be uniform reaction amongst the CCW against the active shooter. There will not be. You assume that everyone will go for the kill shot on the shooter. No going to be the case. There will be as many different reactions as you have possible defenders. You think there will be 5 or 6 carries in a theater at any one time ? Possibly, highly unlikely.

smackholic wrote:i'm going in with a 9mm with a sizable clip and will sit on the right end of the isle.

Fucking word. 9mm with a 9 hot clip and a back up magazine. Additionally, I will sit on the far left hand side of the theater in the back row on the aisle. Assuming some one comes in from the bottom facing back, I want to move to the shooters left as I make my way to cover. Most people are right handed and a left hand moving shot is hard for them to do. If they come in from the top, I get to see everyone who enters. I only go to the movies on Monday afternoon matinees, so there are not many people there anyway.

I still use the same basic sitting position in any public place. If I think I have the ability to stop the shooter, I will take it. I hate criminals, I hate tweakers other low lifes, and crazy mother fuckers too. I have had a good life, and if I can go sheep dog on some shit head who intends to harm others, I will.

You go to great pains to set up a possible scenario. You don't get that choice in most situations. You are in a reactionary mode when faced with an active shooter. You have to change who has control of the situation and if you have to kill someone to do it , so be it. Much better off to plan reasonable scenarios that you can react too.

Cuda · Post by **Cuda** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 7:10 pm

Python wrote:
Felix wrote:btw, the two places you never want to attempt an armed robbery is at a gun store or a pawn shop
Bring out the Gimp.

RACK!

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:40 pm

Senile Sam wrote:
Wolfman wrote:The next one will be in a nursing home
NOOOOO!

Sin,

Goobs

You're just about as old as I am, and a hell of a lot more decrepit. Glass houses and whatsuch.

Felix · Post by **Felix** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 9:07 pm

mvscal wrote:
That's because whack jobs bent on killing people always do it in 'self-defense free zones' like schools and malls, you fucking idiot.

always?

lets take a look

February 22, 2012—Five people were killed in at a Korean health spa in Norcross, Georgia (not a gun free zone)

February 26, 2012-multiple gunmen shoot up a nightclub crown in Jackson, Tennessee (not a gun free zone)

February 27, 2012—Three students at Chardon High School in rural Ohio were killed (gun free zone)

March 8, 2012—Two people were killed and seven wounded at a psychiatric hospital in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania (unknown but likely a gun free zone)

March 31, 2012—A gunman opened fire on a crowd of mourners at a North Miami, Florida, funeral home, killing two people and injuring 12 others. (not a gun free zone)

April 2, 2012—A 43-year-old former student at Oikos University in Oakland, California, walked into his former school and killed seven people, “execution-style.” Three people were wounded. (gun free zone)

April 6, 2012—Two men went on a deadly shooting spree in Tulsa, Oklahoma, shooting black men at random in an apparently racially motivated attack. Three men died and two were wounded. (not a gun free zone)

May 29, 2012—A man in Seattle, Washington, opened fire in a coffee shop and killed five people and then himself. (not a gun free zone)

July 9, 2012—At a soccer tournament in Wilmington, Delaware, three people were killed, including a 16-year-old player and the event organizer, when multiple gunmen began firing shots, apparently targeting the organizer. (unknown, but likely not a gun free zone)

July 20, 2012—James Holmes enters a midnight screening of The Dark Knight Rises and opens fire with a semi-automatic weapon; twelve people are killed and fifty-eight are wounded. (gun free zone)

August 5, 2012—A white supremacist and former Army veteran shot six people to death inside a Sikh temple in suburban Milwaukee, Wisconsin, before killing himself. (unknown, but probably not a gun free zone)

August 14, 2012—Three people were killed at Texas A&M University when a 35-year-old man went on a shooting rampage; one of the dead was a police officer. (gun free zone)

September 27, 2012—A 36-year-old man who had just been laid off from Accent Signage Systems in Minneapolis, Minnesota, entered his former workplace and shot five people to death, and wounded three others before killing himself. (unknown, but probably not a gun free zone)

October 21, 2012—45-year-old Radcliffe Frankin Haughton shot three women to death, including his wife, Zina Haughton, and injured four others at a spa in Brookfield, Wisconsin, before killing himself. (not a gun free zone)

December 11, 2012—A 22-year-old began shooting at random at a mall near Portland, Oregon, killing two people and then himself. (gun free zone)

December 14, 2012 twenty-six people killed in Newtown, Connecticut, including twenty children, before killing himself. (gun free zone)

so there were sixteen multiple shootings and of those, seven occurred in gun free zones

those are just the multiple shootings that occurred in 2012, should I go back a few years or would you care to retract your idiotic statement now.....

Mikey · Post by **Mikey** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 9:21 pm

Sudden Sam wrote:
Most likely to soon be committed to a nursing home was my criteria.

That would be criterion.

You're welcome, and carry on.