I hope Rooster is okay...

[Shlomart Ben Yisrael]

U.S. Cargo plane crashes in Afghanistan

[LTS TRN 2]

It appears to have been overloaded with giant bales of opium.

[Cuda]

It appears to have been overloaded with giant bales of opium.

they were arriving, not leaving. those were giant bales of cash.

[Shlomart Ben Yisrael]

It appears to have been overloaded with giant bales of opium.

they were arriving, not leaving. those were giant bales of cash.

You don't suppose Rooster went all D.B. Cooper on us, do you?

:o

[Cuda]

Looks like my early information was wrong:

A National Air Cargo Boeing 747-400 freighter on behalf of US Mobility Command, registration N949CA performing cargo flight N8-102 from Bagram (Afghanistan) to Dubai Al Maktoum (United Arab Emirates) with 7 crew and cargo consisting of 5 military vehicles, has crashed shortly after takeoff from Bagram Air Base's runway 03 at 15:30L (11:00Z) and erupted into flames near the end of the runway within the perimeter of the Air Base

Witness statements are consistent with a scenario of cargo breaking loose and moving to the back of the airplane causing a stall/spin/crash. The video sure looks like that's the cause. Maybe it was huge bales of opium afterall.

[Left Seater]

Damn, looks like it was standing on its tail when it first enters the camera's vision. It looks like it wanted to roll left as the left wing was dropping early. They got it back wings level but then it went right hard and fast. The nose gear was still extended just before impact. I wonder if the CG shifted as they were rotating?

Prolly not much additional thrust available to those guys either. Damn.

[Derron]

Damn, looks like it was standing on its tail when it first enters the camera's vision. It looks like it wanted to roll left as the left wing was dropping early. They got it back wings level but then it went right hard and fast. The nose gear was still extended just before impact. I wonder if the CG shifted as they were rotating?

Prolly not much additional thrust available to those guys either. Damn.

Sounds like it. Pretty much unrecoverable at that point. Probably no control surface response when it pitched up like that, if the cargo was loose, then it rolled back forward and took it the other way. Probably would have needed 3,000 feet to recover and maybe not then. The unsecured cargo would be a problem no matter what. They have a pretty steep climb out angle there I believe also. Sucks.

But let's wait until LTard comes in with a conspiracy idea.

[mvscal]

If the loadmaster wasn't on the plane, he ought to be taken up to about 10,000 feet and tossed out the back. Absolutely no fucking excuse for something like this to ever happen.

[Bucmonkey]

Who gives a fuck.

[Shlomart Ben Yisrael]

Who gives a fuck.

Probably every dopesick slaphead this side of the Atlantic...

[Wolfman]

Guess they didn't believe in a balanced approach.

[Derron]

Not that it is accurate at all, but I put normal info and load on the aircraft in MS Flight Sim and no problem, stood it on its tail, up to over 7,000 before it stalled and easily recovered.

Change the CG to reflect putting the payload on the rear 40% of the aircraft and it did almost exactly the same thing as the one on the video. A little less violent than the video, but that plane was not going to fly with all that weight that far back. Stalled it before you could get the gear up, and went in the same way.

[Left Seater]

It was a private company so unlikely they had a loadmaster. Prolly 4 pilots, a flight engineer or two and a and A&P guy. The flight engineer is most likely responsible for overseeing how the plane was loaded, but that usually doesn't include checking each strap.

Here's hoping this wasn't loaded by the Afganies, as some sort of work training program.

Derron were you able to replicate the left wing stalling first? That sure looks to be the case since that one drops initially.

[Cuda]

At OAMS I've seen USAF ATOC personnel walk away from a NAC bird due to some shady stuff being done refusing to be part of it to protect themselves.

and

Yep, as was said, that quote was from USAF people who were involved in loading and unloading cargo at deployed locations downrange. They have no authority to 'report' it to anyone except in their own military chain, who could probably measure their care in micro give-a-craps.

Given all of the shady operators that haul in and out of Bagram (especially before FedEx and Atlas could get insured to fly in to there), I'm sure the AF loaders have seen every possible shade of good and bad operations there.

I hate to say it, but the crew may well have survived the pancake crash and burned to death in the fire. I'd have to hope that the crash landing rendered them unconscious, but that's not a sure thing.

[Shlomart Ben Yisrael]

If Rooster did indeed burn up in that crash, maybe his remains should be sent to shutyomouth.





He'd have no problem paying the freight. Just throw in a little hot sauce...and we're good.

[mvscal]

The flight engineer is most likely responsible for overseeing how the plane was loaded, but that usually doesn't include checking each strap.

Sure it does. I worked ground handling for air freight for several years. The engineer always checked to see that the load was properly secured.

[Derron]

It was a private company so unlikely they had a loadmaster. Prolly 4 pilots, a flight engineer or two and a and A&P guy. The flight engineer is most likely responsible for overseeing how the plane was loaded, but that usually doesn't include checking each strap.

Here's hoping this wasn't loaded by the Afganies, as some sort of work training program.

Derron were you able to replicate the left wing stalling first? That sure looks to be the case since that one drops initially.

No ...the sim wanted to go with the torque roll to the right, but it was fairly minor drop on the right wing. The whole fucking thing started falling at that point. The sim just allowed me to move the weight back at takeoff, not have a kinetic movement of it after rotation. Still rotated sluggish, hit about 183 knots, never got close to the gear switch, and it was pretty much all over with at that point. Maybe made 1700 feet at the most...No control surface response at all, just mushing / falling downwards, even at 106% power. Pretty fucked up feeling.

Had to be fairly catastrophic inside, I played with it on several different weight scenarios, and had to move a lot back towards the tail, probably 33,000 # or more before I was unable to at least get straight and some what level, albeit low speed handling. Landing would have been problematic at best.

[Dr_Phibes]

He might have stressed the load beyond capacity in an effort to climb, I know Soviet aircraft were in a panic to get height there, as they were in rocket range. Not sure if that's the case now, but I can't imagine it would change.

[Diego in Seattle]

There was a last-minute addition to the payload by neojews for clear-cutting forests that brought down the plane.

-LTSTard

[Derron]

http://www.nycaviation.com/2013/05/nati ... YEp2MrJKW9

[Left Seater]

Can't argue with that, but as he says it is all an assumption.

I also can't wait for LTS to come in and tear that apart since the author is clearly drinking the kool-aid.

[mvscal]

I know Soviet aircraft were in a panic to get height there...

That's because the Muj were duck hunting with Stingers. They would sit in hills outside the airfields and they (or their CIA handlers) would wait for a plane to land or take off.

Not sure if that's the case now, but I can't imagine it would change.

The Taliban don't have Stingers so, yes, things have changed.

[smackaholic]

I think we need a new policy regarding aid to third world shitholes.

If getting there by ground is out of the question because they will blow you the fukk up, maybe we don't really need to be there.

[Dr_Phibes]

Only ten known attempts in how many years and one hit, that's unbelievable. There's a virtual army dedicated to cleaning them up

[mvscal]

Only ten known attempts in how many years and one hit, that's unbelievable. There's a virtual army dedicated to cleaning them up

When the insurance industry squawks, DC listens.

[Rooster]

/peeks up and checks that the coast is clear of debris and flaming JP-8
Yep, wasn't me. I'm doing a hybrid human/robotic helicopter thing west of Kabul. Word on the street is that the cargo tie-down straps were not correctly secured and when plane rotated they worked loose and the load shifted aft resulting in a massive CG shift rearward. Something like this happened at the former Mather AFB outside of Sacramento some years ago with identical results.

However, we 've got our own hilarity going on near us. An Afghan compound just had their ammo dump go up like it was the Chinese New Year an hour ago. I picture a turbin headed ANA named al-Curly spinning around on the ground yelling, "Allah akbar wub-wub-wub-wubwub! Nyuck-nyuck!"

[Mikey]

I'll RACK any Stooges reset. Especially al-Curly, nyuk nyuk.

[Smackie Chan]

I'll RACK any Stooges reset. Especially al-Curly, nyuk nyuk.

I'm down with The Stooges, too. But I prefer al-Iggy.

[Wolfman]

Yikes. Someone should tell James Iggy to keep his shirt on.