My personal conspiracy theory

[Rooster]

I haven't heard anybody else ever put this forward, but I am halfway convinced that this particular idea could be true: Obama, as the Muslim sympathizer he is, is purposefully involving the US in the various and sundry regional Muslim conflicts and intentionally screwing them up to drive these countries into radical Islamofascist arms. The proof? Egypt, Libya, Afghanistan, Iraq, Mali, Iran, and now Syria. Either he has snatched defeat from the jaws of victory like in Afghanistan or got us involved on the wrong side of a civil war against stable (even if unfriendly) governments and tilted the balance towards Al Qaeda infested insurgents.

As for Syria, having our enemies slaughter each other en masse is a good thing, but Bammy is about to insert the US into what should be a smile inducing hands-off pleasant civil war. It has been a massive black hole for Sunni and Shiite terrorist wannabes, sucking in these cockroaches when they'd otherwise be focused on us in Afghanistan. But, no, he is trying to arm the very people who, once things settle down, will re-engage us in a guerilla war.

He gets plausible deniability by half heartedly involving us thus gaining partial credit for "leading", but either cripples our involvement by the poor timing or the lack luster effort. Any other tinfoil hat wearers out there see merit in my conspiracy theory?

[Shlomart Ben Yisrael]

I always assumed you were just some creepy, opportunistic lowlife.

In actuality, you are a very stupid person, as well.

[R-Jack]

Some crackpot thinks we are sucking off Muslims. Other ones think we are sucking off the Jews.

The only thing for certain is this country has a lot of dumbfucks.....and is fat.

[Dr_Phibes]

There is logic to your logic.

My own personal theory is that your foreign policy is completely irrational, it's been counter-productive for over a decade and it's still pursued with zeal in one form or another.
The policy was employed in the early century and was idealogical rather than practical. It had ten years to filter through every bureaucracy that exists and it's impossible to root out, it's become naturalised, propaganda has taken on a life of it's own. Like an oil tanker heading towards a reef, you can't just spin the wheel and change it.

I wouldn't think Obama has ever had an original thought of his own.

The film Putin pointed out of the Syrian irregular commander eating the innards of a government soldier is disturbing.

[Shlomart Ben Yisrael]

.....and is fat.

Colonel Sanders was a Freemason. That's why shutyomouth knows all the secret, finger-lickin' handshakes.

[Wolfman]

uh-huh

[Rooster]

Take Benghazi for example. As CinC you'd expect Bammy to be informed of an attack on his consulate and act decisively to save the Libyan embassy, yet once the fate of his ambassador was nearly sealed, he gives a lackadaisical shrug, rolls over, falls back to sleep, and leaves his embassy personnel to die. Then to add insult to injury, he leaves the killers to brag about their exploits in various coffeehouses across Tripoli and then emboldens Al Qaeda further by giving them political cover with his anti-Muslim video story.

It's all these half steps and miscues which leave you with the option of deciding Obama is utterly incompetent or purposefully tanking the GWAT. Given that everyone under him can't be incompetents, this leaves you with the only real choice left: Obama is intentionally throwing the game and shaving points for the express purpose of losing globally to Muslim fanaticism.

So, Marty, DiS wants to know if when you do a brit milah you need to register as a sex offender, what, with all your Jewish expertise and experience and all.

[Diego in Seattle]

All of our troops in the middle east should leave that region of the planet and allow those dune coons and cave monkeys to waste each other. Why should the US get involved over there at all? Fuck policing the world, lets fix the problems here, secure our borders and then worry about other countries.

So you're good with $15/gal. gasoline?

[Shlomart Ben Yisrael]

All of our troops in the middle east should leave that region of the planet and allow those dune coons and cave monkeys to waste each other. Why should the US get involved over there at all? Fuck policing the world, lets fix the problems here, secure our borders and then worry about other countries.

So you're good with $15/gal. gasoline?

Why do you think gas would be $15/gallon if you weren't there?

[Screw_Michigan]

Rack Schmick!

Never thought he'd actually provide a reason to say that, except for when he's bending over Killitard in the BTPCFB forum.

[Left Seater]

All of our troops in the middle east should leave that region of the planet and allow those dune coons and cave monkeys to waste each other. Why should the US get involved over there at all? Fuck policing the world, lets fix the problems here, secure our borders and then worry about other countries.

So you're good with $15/gal. gasoline?

Liberals would cave long before $15/gal. The north slope of Alaska would be opened up completely and other reserves here would lose their court battles about some species of frog or whatnot.

[Mikey]

I haven't heard anybody else ever put this forward, but I am halfway convinced that this particular idea could be true: Obama, as the Muslim sympathizer he is, is purposefully involving the US in the various and sundry regional Muslim conflicts and intentionally screwing them up to drive these countries into radical Islamofascist arms. The proof? Egypt, Libya, Afghanistan, Iraq, Mali, Iran, and now Syria. Either he has snatched defeat from the jaws of victory like in Afghanistan or got us involved on the wrong side of a civil war against stable (even if unfriendly) governments and tilted the balance towards Al Qaeda infested insurgents.

As for Syria, having our enemies slaughter each other en masse is a good thing, but Bammy is about to insert the US into what should be a smile inducing hands-off pleasant civil war. It has been a massive black hole for Sunni and Shiite terrorist wannabes, sucking in these cockroaches when they'd otherwise be focused on us in Afghanistan. But, no, he is trying to arm the very people who, once things settle down, will re-engage us in a guerilla war.

He gets plausible deniability by half heartedly involving us thus gaining partial credit for "leading", but either cripples our involvement by the poor timing or the lack luster effort. Any other tinfoil hat wearers out there see merit in my conspiracy theory?

My personal theory is that you've probably had one too many concussions.

[smackaholic]

I wish Obama was clever enough to do that. In reality, he is just utterly clueless and in way over his head. And we re-elected him anyway.

We're fuct.

[Smackie Chan]

No savior is coming in 2016. We are going to continue getting the shitty government and the shitty outcome that we deserve.

In your opinion, what have we done or failed to do as a society to "deserve" shitty government? Allowed deviation from the Constitution? If so, what should we have done to deserve good government?

What factors should be considered to determine if a country (any country) deserves a shitty government? Religion? Racial composition? History? Does Germany deserve a shitty government? Iraq? Iran? North Korea? Afghanistan? Mexico? Canada? South Africa? China?

What countries deserve good government, and why?

[BSmack]

I haven't heard anybody else ever put this forward, but I am halfway convinced that this particular idea could be true: Obama, as the Muslim sympathizer he is, is purposefully involving the US in the various and sundry regional Muslim conflicts and intentionally screwing them up to drive these countries into radical Islamofascist arms. The proof? Egypt, Libya, Afghanistan, Iraq, Mali, Iran, and now Syria. Either he has snatched defeat from the jaws of victory like in Afghanistan or got us involved on the wrong side of a civil war against stable (even if unfriendly) governments and tilted the balance towards Al Qaeda infested insurgents.

This is the dumbest paragraph ever written in the English language.

[smackaholic]

In your opinion, what have we done or failed to do as a society to "deserve" shitty government?

Elected a neighborhood rabble rouser who never ran anything. Then after proving his incompetence beyond a reasonable doubt, we re-elected him.

[Smackie Chan]

In your opinion, what have we done or failed to do as a society to "deserve" shitty government?

Elected a neighborhood rabble rouser who never ran anything. Then after proving his incompetence beyond a reasonable doubt, we re-elected him.

So before Obama was elected, we deserved good government, but deserve a shitty one after electing him? And we'd deserve a good government now if we had elected Romney? My guess is that 88's comment about deserving a shitty government pre-dates Obama's first election, but I could be wrong. 88 said there'd be no savior in 2016 - was Romney a potential savior? At what point did we go from deserving a good government to deserving a shitty one, and was it based on the outcome of a particular election? Obama certainly isn't the first incompetent President we've had. Did we deserve shitty government by virtue of electing James Buchanan? Herbert Hoover? JFK? Nixon? Reagan? Bubba? Either Bush?

What do we need to do to once again (if we ever did) deserve a good government?

[Python]

What do we need to do to once again (if we ever did) deserve a good government?

Kill Justin Bieber.

[Shlomart Ben Yisrael]

What do we need to do to once again (if we ever did) deserve a good government?

Make them fear you and not the other way around.

[Wolfman]

Sadly I believe that nothing will get changed until the economy crashes. Real solutions like term limits, abolition of the federal tax code and the IRS replaced by a sales/use tax, repeal of the 17th Amendment, etc. are not going to happen. The folks with the power are not about to give it up. I just hope it waits till I'm in my columbarium in Maitland Ontario. Like I said in a conversation with 88, we shouldn't end up like Mad Max, but it could get ugly. My grandchildren will not live the life style that I have been fortunate to have.

[War Wagon]

In your opinion, what have we done or failed to do as a society to "deserve" shitty government? Allowed deviation from the Constitution? If so, what should we have done to deserve good government?

What factors should be considered to determine if a country (any country) deserves a shitty government? Religion? Racial composition? History? Does Germany deserve a shitty government? Iraq? Iran? North Korea? Afghanistan? Mexico? Canada? South Africa? China?

What countries deserve good government, and why?

I don't have the answers to your questions and neither does anyone else here (including 88) I suspect, but I am wondering where you're trying to go with this.

[Derron]

Sadly I believe that nothing will get changed until the economy crashes. Real solutions like term limits, abolition of the federal tax code and the IRS replaced by a sales/use tax, repeal of the 17th Amendment, etc. are not going to happen.

Exactly. When the people in government both elected and worker drones are finally impacted in a very negative way, only then will things start to change. When those push button government mother fuckers, when their checks stop coming, when their retirement funds crash and die, when they are finally hit with some of the financial pain, and the resulting emotional toll is taken, then change will happen.

Only it will be to fucking late to do any good. This shit is going to fall hard, real fucking hard, and stay down for period while this shit sorts itself out. Your Mad Max postulation is not very far off in my opinion. When things collapse that hard, shit is going to get real weird for a long time.

Fuck you in advance to all the usual prepper and doomsday bullshit.

[Smackie Chan]

In your opinion, what have we done or failed to do as a society to "deserve" shitty government? Allowed deviation from the Constitution? If so, what should we have done to deserve good government?

What factors should be considered to determine if a country (any country) deserves a shitty government? Religion? Racial composition? History? Does Germany deserve a shitty government? Iraq? Iran? North Korea? Afghanistan? Mexico? Canada? South Africa? China?

What countries deserve good government, and why?

I don't have the answers to your questions and neither does anyone else here (including 88) I suspect, but I am wondering where you're trying to go with this.

Since the question asked for an opinion, not only can 88 answer it, but so can you or anyone else.

Where I was initially going with this was to address the word deserve in the context that 88 used it. At the individual and small group levels, and to highly simplify the discussion, we commonly use the word as it relates to good and bad. In the religious context, "good" people deserve to bask in the eternal glory of Heaven, while "bad" people deserve to forever rot in Hell. Professionally, individuals who work hard and produce desired results deserve to be promoted and rewarded, while slackers don't. In the sporting world, teams who draft, trade, and sign free agents wisely, are well managed and coached, play hard and fair, and win lots of games are considered deserving of championships. But how should we apply the word to, in our case, a "group" of >300 million people and its government? Are we as a society so bad & evil that we deserve a shitty government, and how should that be assessed? mvscal is fond of saying that "stupid should hurt," and I don't disagree with him. 88 says the answer is education - if we were smarter, we'd deserve better government. But smarter than whom? Contemporaries living elsewhere? Our American ancestors? An arbitrary ideal? And how should this "smartness" be measured?

Most of the limited research I've done indicates that Americans are more highly educated today than ever before. The scientific output of American universities is unparalleled. The average American IQ today is reportedly higher than ever, and has jumped 3 points per decade since the early 1900s according to this report. So if there is a correlation between education/intelligence and quality of government, shouldn't our government have gotten progressively better and be at its best now? If reports such as the one I linked are to be believed and it's accepted that we are getting smarter, and it's also accepted that our government is getting worse, than I would have to reject the hypothesis that a better educated populace results in, and is deserving of, better government. Besides, at least as 88, mvscal, and most posters here are concerned, better equates to more conservative. Yet the overwhelming criticism of academia is that it leans far to the left, so it would appear that getting smarter would lead those getting educated to become more liberal. It's hard for me to reconcile how a society getting more educated in a liberal environment would lead to government becoming more conservative.

On at least one occasion, mvscal identified himself as a nationalist, which I assume most of us would consider ourselves to be. We're proud to be Americans, and believe our Constitution provides the framework for a system of government that is superior to all others. After all, we enjoy benefits such as freedom, liberty, opportunity, and the pursuit of happiness. (Doesn't mean we are guaranteed happiness - just that we are free to pursue it within limits. Don't North Koreans, at least implicitly, also have that?) We hold opportunity in high regard, without really analyzing why. If I buy a lottery ticket, I have an opportunity to become very rich very fast. Of course, that opportunity is rather slim, but it's there. I realize the opportunity of achieving success & happiness through more traditional routes (education, hard work, entrepreneurialism, etc.) is what we're talking about here, and that the odds of achieving more modest goals than lottery wealth are better than those of buying a winning ticket, but how much better? I submit that the opportunity we as Americans take great pride in having by virtue of our system of government is not unique, and is overrated.

I'm guessing there are citizens of many countries who take the same, and perhaps a higher, degree of nationalistic pride in their homelands & systems of government as we do. Why? For the same reasons we do - it's natural to take pride in something over which you have no control (i.e., the country in which you are born and/or educated), and each country's educational system will instill in its young people a sense that their form of government is the best around. Essentially, we're brainwashed into believing it, and few of us seriously question it. Sure, there are all sorts of easily swallowed justifications as to why ours is better than anyone else's, even in the face of data showing there are other countries who enjoy better standards of living and quality of life than we have, despite our abundance of resources and advantages. So why do we continue to believe our system is the best? Basically, because we don't want, and refuse, to believe otherwise, and blame our woes not on the system, but on our deviation from it, with the implication being that we at one time did abide strictly to the Constitution, and that our government was “better” then than it is now, but we have drifted away from it since then (whenever that was).

Right or wrong, we associate the quality of government with the quality of the President. While Congress is getting all-time low marks in most of the recent polls I’ve seen, we still judge our government based on who’s sitting in the Oval Office.

I don't know much about Buchanan, Hoover or JFK. I was around for the rest. And they were all shitty in most respects.

Let’s say it’s fair to judge the quality of government on the quality of the President, even though an inherent problem of doing so is that there is no single definitive source for ranking Presidents. More than one poster on this board have expressed that Obama is by far the worst President we’ve ever had, and are sure that historians will validate that opinion. One recent poll ranked him as 15th best overall, so it’s clear that opinions vary wildly. So I’ll take the liberty of choosing US News & World Report as a source of determining who the worst Presidents of all-time were, regardless of whether it’s fair to do so. Its results are consistent with many I’ve seen, and ranks Buchanan as the worst. Only one President in my lifetime cracked its “bottom 10” list – Nixon. If this list is anything close to being “fair” (whatever that means), it indicates that most of the worst Presidents were elected long before our government supposedly went to hell in a hand basket. This doesn’t seem to square with the opinion that our Presidents, and therefore our government, are progressively getting worse. If this is a fair assessment, does it mean that we’ve deserved shitty government for > 150 years?

We elect the same assholes to occupy the same offices over and over and over. We never hold them accountable for anything by throwing the bums out and demanding appropriate government.

By what processes & mechanisms should we hold them accountable, other than not re-electing them? Are “we” convinced that the losers of the elections that resulted in the occupation of the same offices by the same assholes would not have been assholes themselves? Or are assholes our only choices when it comes to candidates? This is an important question, since the answer will be an indicator of whether the problem lies with the system, or deviation from the system.

Since “you” are, by definition, part of the “we” you reference, are you at least partly to blame for the shitty shape of our government? Or is the blame to be placed on others who comprise “we”? Do you believe in the saying, “If you’re not part of the solution, you’re part of the problem”? How can you & I do what you’ve proposed be done to become part of the solution?

The most important thing is that the citizens have to be well educated and informed. If the people were well read and engaged, rather than stupid and entertained, this shit would never have happened.

I’ve addressed the education part. As far as the availability of, and access to, information, it’s certainly better now than it was a century or more ago. So why haven’t things gotten any better?

We need to return to first principles. Limit the power of the federal government and make the most important government in your life the local government, which you most directly have a say in. To do this, we need to educate the population to understand what is happening now, and how completely stupid, wasteful, inefficient and disfunctional it is. Then, we need to amend the Constitution (or at least scare the justices sitting there) to demand that the People and their local governments should govern themselves, and not some faceless beaurocrat in Washington D.C.

Sounds like some good ideas there, counselor. Let’s get right on it. How do you propose we do this?

My bottom line is this: there is no ideal form of government. It’s a necessary evil, and all forms (democratic, authoritarian, socialist, communist, monarchies, etc.) have their pros & cons. Ours might not be the best available option, even though we’ve been programmed to believe it is. While I certainly won't argue the merits of having a better-educated and informed citizenry, I don't believe having one necessarily results in better government. I’m not sure it’s appropriate to advance the argument that simply having the opportunity for individual success & happiness afforded by a hands-off central government absolutely outweighs the potential benefits of higher standards of living and quality of life that certain types of socialist governments may be able to provide, although an argument can be made that high standards of living/quality of life in socialist countries like Norway may not be sustainable over the long term. And finally, I don’t believe we, or any country, “deserves” whatever quality of government it gets stuck with. Societies are comprised of individuals, and there are good and bad individuals in every society. On balance, I believe most people are for the most part good, with bad apples scattered throughout. From that perspective, ALL countries “deserve” good government. Not sure why anyone would say our country in particular, or any country in general, deserves shitty government.

[War Wagon]

at risk of having my head explode, I read all that.

And while I don't have the time nor inclination to respond to every well reasoned point, suffice to say that I agree... in that we don't necessarily deserve a shitty government. At least I don't. I work hard, pay my taxes, obey most laws and just want to be left the fuck alone while I mind my own business.

I don't worry that maybe somebody has got it better than me because I know that many have it much worse.

[Derron]

At least I don't. I work hard, pay my taxes, obey most laws and just want to be left the fuck alone while I mind my own business.

I don't worry that maybe somebody has got it better than me because I know that many have it much worse.

Rack. Well said.

[Mikey]

I deserve a raise.

[Derron]

I deserve a raise.

The taxpayers are already paying for your solar panels. Shut the fuck up.

[Mikey]

I deserve a raise.

The taxpayers are already paying for your solar panels. Shut the fuck up.

Bullshit. Smackaholic paid those off last year.

I think it may be time to buy an electric car and let some other taxpayers help out with that one.

[Atomic Punk]

I think it may be time to buy an electric car and let some other taxpayers help out with that one.

I'm all in!

-Pedo in Seattle

[MgoBlue-LightSpecial]

Hey AP.

Location: MgBl0w is a racist white devil

Dude...

What's up with that? I thought we were broskis? :?

[Mikey]

Racist white devil broskis.

[mvscal]

At what point did we go from deserving a good government to deserving a shitty one,

We bend over backwards to ensure that there are absolutely no obstacles in the way of letting the dumbest bags of shit on planet earth cast their vote for the filthiest scumbag who will promise them the most free shit. What the fuck did you expect to happen? In contrast, go ahead and try to get a concealed carry permit...if you can.

Universal suffrage is a complete joke and an inevitable death sentence to any society stupid enough to implement it.

[smackaholic]

What mvscal said. Not only do we give them a vote, we subsidize their existence and provide breeding incentives.

Unfortunately the fox is now guarding the henhouse. About all we can do is wait till it runs out of hens.