Business is cruel

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 2:12 am

As some here may know, I've worked for the same company for over 30 years. I am compensated fairly well. Not $cott well, but fair enough. I don't feel need to post pictures of cars and vacations to be satisfied.

I find out today that the guy they hired last year as my new boss... his position "has been eliminated".

This was a good man. My old boss, who is now VP of mfg, called me into his office this morning and told me the choice had come down to him or me. He got the short straw in the effort to cut overhead.

Mere details above, my real point being how fragile a job can be, take nothing for granted. I've always known that since day one and the trite but true statement being you have to "make the team every day".

Trust nobody.

Moving Sale · Post by **Moving Sale** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 2:34 am

Business is a concept. It is neither cruel nor compassionate. The people that run a business? Now that's a different story.

It's funny how these asshats never take responsibility for their actions. It's just business they say. Like a building and some inventory just fired your excoworker.

Left Seater · Post by **Left Seater** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 3:06 am

Moving Sale wrote:Business is a concept. It is neither cruel nor compassionate. The people that run a business? Now that's a different story.

It's funny how these asshats never take responsibility for their actions. It's just business they say. Like a building and some inventory just fired your excoworker.

Yes and no. I have had to let people go before. It was a decision that my wife and I struggled with for a few weeks. However, at the end of the day in order to keep the business viable we had to cut costs or increase revenue. When cutting costs no longer could keep up we faced a very tough decision. We ended up letting one back office person go and it was difficult. We knew she was the major income earner in her family. I didn't sleep well for a week thinking about it. But at the end of the day we were very good to her and her family while she was with us and we don't have an obligation to provide her employment until she decides to retire.

H4ever · Post by **H4ever** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 3:25 am

Left Seater wrote:
Moving Sale wrote:Business is a concept. It is neither cruel nor compassionate. The people that run a business? Now that's a different story.

It's funny how these asshats never take responsibility for their actions. It's just business they say. Like a building and some inventory just fired your excoworker.

Yes and no. I have had to let people go before. It was a decision that my wife and I struggled with for a few weeks. However, at the end of the day in order to keep the business viable we had to cut costs or increase revenue. When cutting costs no longer could keep up we faced a very tough decision. We ended up letting one back office person go and it was difficult. We knew she was the major income earner in her family. I didn't sleep well for a week thinking about it. But at the end of the day we were very good to her and her family while she was with us and we don't have an obligation to provide her employment until she decides to retire.

It's too bad people don't/are unable (check to check living) prepare for things like that better. Everyone should rat-hole away at least a 6 month reserve fund to stay afloat should something like that happen. I could kick back two or three years before I felt pressured to get a "real" job again and if it weren't for the wife and rugrats a lot longer. And that doesn't include dipping into 401k's or selling off investments I've made. I decided long ago to have sources of income other than what "the man" gives me. Blessed I suppose.

Left Seater · Post by **Left Seater** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 3:39 am

Agreed and USAToday had a story about savings rates today. Sadly it crosses all income levels and far to many people have almost zero saved.

Delayed gratification is something many people could stand to learn.

Diego in Seattle · Post by **Diego in Seattle** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 8:01 am

Left Seater wrote:Delayed gratification is something many people could stand to learn.

Going to Aspen to ski next week, or headed to the Bahamas?

Wolfman · Post by **Wolfman** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 12:00 pm

^^^^^^^^
Touche!
My Dad got canned from his job of 34 years. He was devastated, growing up in a world where you worked for a company for life. I finally got him to realize he had knowledge and skills that others would pay him to use. He went on to freelance/trouble shoot for other companies in other locations. Were the happiest years of his life.

Left Seater · Post by **Left Seater** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 12:57 pm

Diego in Seattle wrote:
Left Seater wrote:Delayed gratification is something many people could stand to learn.
Going to Aspen to ski next week, or headed to the Bahamas?

Hopefully Vail, but not if the temps stay in the 50s and 60s.

My wife and I know the term delayed gratification well. But good to see you are concerned about us. Don't worry though we are in good financial shape.

BSmack · Post by **BSmack** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 1:30 pm

My pops was a parts/sales manager at a mid sized company that specialized in making huge injection molding machines. Back in the early 80s, the company folded. At first he went into survival mode. He worked under the table at a local garage turning a wrench, cleaned offices and carpets and whatever else would put food on the family. He was literally Hardy Greave's father beating back adversity with a broom (watch Bagger Vance fools). Eventually he got a job in equipment sales, then truck sales. He learned the art of selling to municipal governments, of having the customer write the specs for your product and not the other guy's product. And now? He sets his own hours, goes on vacations all the time and is making more money that he ever dreamed possible. And he retires at the end of the year.

Well played pops.

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 1:39 pm

Left Seater wrote:Delayed gratification is something many people could stand to learn.

I believe the kids call it "edging".

R-Jack · Post by **R-Jack** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 1:45 pm

Left Seater wrote: But at the end of the day we were very good to her and her family while she was with us and we don't have an obligation to provide her employment until she decides to retire.

Fair enough, but what happens when her kids go trick or treating in your hood?

Left Seater · Post by **Left Seater** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 1:59 pm

R-Jack wrote:
Left Seater wrote: But at the end of the day we were very good to her and her family while she was with us and we don't have an obligation to provide her employment until she decides to retire.
Fair enough, but what happens when her kids go trick or treating in your hood?

They will prolly get candy, just not at our house. Saturday night, no way we will be sitting at home. I likely won't even be home from my game and my wife will likely have gone to watch a college football game in CS or Austin with friends.

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 1:59 pm

War Wagon wrote:My old boss, who is now VP of mfg, called me into his office this morning and told me the choice had come down to him or me. He got the short straw in the effort to cut overhead.

Wow. Dude must be a nuclear grade fuckup.

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 2:00 pm

Hey, I kid because I care.

R-Jack · Post by **R-Jack** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 2:03 pm

Goober McTuber wrote:
War Wagon wrote:My old boss, who is now VP of mfg, called me into his office this morning and told me the choice had come down to him or me. He got the short straw in the effort to cut overhead.
Wow. Dude must be a nuclear grade fuckup.

Or he just makes more than Wags

Go Coogs' · Post by **Go Coogs'** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 2:11 pm

H4ever wrote:
It's too bad people don't/are unable (check to check living) prepare for things like that better. Everyone should rat-hole away at least a 6 month reserve fund to stay afloat should something like that happen. I could kick back two or three years before I felt pressured to get a "real" job again and if it weren't for the wife and rugrats a lot longer. And that doesn't include dipping into 401k's or selling off investments I've made. I decided long ago to have sources of income other than what "the man" gives me. Blessed I suppose.

I don't think it's that cut and dry. Sure, people aren't saving because we as Americans consume way too much. However, I don't save 10% of my check like I should because 14% goes into my 401k and another 5% goes to the church. Roughly, the wife and I save 3-4% of our paycheck, but its used from time to time and it doesn't build like it should. It's enough to get us by for two three months, but I'd rather stash more of it in my 401k than put it in a savings account. Just my .02

Mikey · Post by **Mikey** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 3:00 pm

Go Coogs' wrote:
H4ever wrote:
It's too bad people don't/are unable (check to check living) prepare for things like that better. Everyone should rat-hole away at least a 6 month reserve fund to stay afloat should something like that happen. I could kick back two or three years before I felt pressured to get a "real" job again and if it weren't for the wife and rugrats a lot longer. And that doesn't include dipping into 401k's or selling off investments I've made. I decided long ago to have sources of income other than what "the man" gives me. Blessed I suppose.
I don't think it's that cut and dry. Sure, people aren't saving because we as Americans consume way too much. However, I don't save 10% of my check like I should because 14% goes into my 401k and another 5% goes to the church. Roughly, the wife and I save 3-4% of our paycheck, but its used from time to time and it doesn't build like it should. It's enough to get us by for two three months, but I'd rather stash more of it in my 401k than put it in a savings account. Just my .02

The fact that the cost of living has gone up a lot faster than the average wage earner's salary may have something to do with it as well. There are a lot of people living paycheck to paycheck while not spending on vacations, ATV's etc.

The baseline cost of living in today's modern world has gone up dramatically. When I was a kid, and even in my 20s and 30s, you needed a land line phone that cost maybe $10/month. Even the first dial up internet service was around $20/month. You may think that broadband and cellphones are a luxury but they are pretty much a necessity to get anything at all done anymore. Four cell phones and basic broadband service is running me almost $300/month now. Oh, and there's the land line that costs about $70.

atmdad · Post by **atmdad** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 3:04 pm

Left Seater wrote:
My wife and I know the term delayed gratification well.

You know Lefty, there are drugs like Viagra and Cialis out there.

Left Seater · Post by **Left Seater** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 4:14 pm

atmdad wrote:
Left Seater wrote:
My wife and I know the term delayed gratification well.
You know Lefty, there are drugs like Viagra and Cialis out there.

I laffed.

H4ever · Post by **H4ever** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 5:35 pm

Go Coogs' wrote:
H4ever wrote:
It's too bad people don't/are unable (check to check living) prepare for things like that better. Everyone should rat-hole away at least a 6 month reserve fund to stay afloat should something like that happen. I could kick back two or three years before I felt pressured to get a "real" job again and if it weren't for the wife and rugrats a lot longer. And that doesn't include dipping into 401k's or selling off investments I've made. I decided long ago to have sources of income other than what "the man" gives me. Blessed I suppose.
I don't think it's that cut and dry. Sure, people aren't saving because we as Americans consume way too much. However, I don't save 10% of my check like I should because 14% goes into my 401k and another 5% goes to the church. Roughly, the wife and I save 3-4% of our paycheck, but its used from time to time and it doesn't build like it should. It's enough to get us by for two three months, but I'd rather stash more of it in my 401k than put it in a savings account. Just my .02

I agree with what your doing there. People can do the same as you AFTER they build that 6 month reserve fund. If it takes 3700 a month to pay your bills and cover food, fuel, etc well then you save up about 24k and then resume what you were doing. 401k contributions are generally pre-tax anyway. Even low-wage earners with kids can do this. THey need to start with half of their annual 12k IRS windfall return and then leave it alone while the rest of us are scratching checks to pay in.

BSmack · Post by **BSmack** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 6:05 pm

The #1 thing people can do is to live below their means. I survived being unemployed because I bought a house with the idea that I wanted to be able to make the my bills with a salary of $10.00 an hour if necessary. Why $10.00 an hour? Because that is what unemployment is before taxes. Unfortunately, I had to test that theory. And it worked.

smackaholic · Post by **smackaholic** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 7:13 pm

[quote="BSmack"]The #1 thing people can do is to live below their means. I survived being unemployed because I bought a house with the idea that I wanted to be able to make the my bills with a salary of $10.00 an hour if necessary. Why $10.00 an hour? Because that is what unemployment is before taxes. Unfortunately, I had to test that theory. And it worked.[/

Rack the fuck outta that. The OL and I have had that philosophy for over 20 years. I have been fortunate in that I haven't had to test the theory by being jobless. Now, our place is paid off. It is a damn nice feeling being in a position where our income could get cut in half and we'd survive it

Derron · Post by **Derron** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 9:07 pm

You guys have it all wrong. You are just not buying into the American way of living. You must have at least 2 nice cars, on payments of at least $ 600 per month each. New I phones every year at $ 300 each, no less than 3 vacations per year at $ 10,000 a pop, the latest in big ass mother fucking TV's, 3 at least with complete theater systems (sup Indy ??), granite counter tops in your kitchen and baths, Mexicans mowing your yard, way more house than you can possible afford, be making no contributions to your own retirement and be about 2 paychecks away from foreclosure.

The American people are riding on a razors edge of financial ruin. We made it through the recession of 2008 reasonably intact. Having paid for everything helps. No car payments, no big ass TV's, no granite counter tops. About ready to scratch a check for the last mortgage payment next year. Wife works a managers job, with OK wages, I keep 2 home based business gigs going. We take a couple of reasonable vacays a year, we have about a 3/4 funded retirement plan. Wife could get laid off tomorrow and we would be just fine.

So Wags, when that bullet whizzed by your dome and lodged squarely in your boss's melon, did you hear it as it went by " Wags..you could be next ..."

Rack you for being the survivor though.

Mikey · Post by **Mikey** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 9:38 pm

Wags -

Sucks for your old boss.

Congratulations on the promotion, BTW.

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 10:43 pm

R-Jack wrote:
Goober McTuber wrote:
War Wagon wrote:My old boss, who is now VP of mfg, called me into his office this morning and told me the choice had come down to him or me. He got the short straw in the effort to cut overhead.
Wow. Dude must be a nuclear grade fuckup.
Or he just makes more than Wags

Undoubtedly. It's a pure numbers game. Professional competence is totally irrelevant at least in a publicly traded corporation.

The State · Post by **The State** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 10:49 pm

Seems I'm the only one on this board that runs a company that operates in four different states.

Let me tell you something... that can be a logistical nightmare.

The worst state to do business in... hands down. Is Kansas.

My taxes were paid to the state of Kansas and had documents to back it up (deposited checks by the state and forwarded to the state) and these fuckers in Wichita would call me on the phone weekly saying I needed to pay up or I would lose my license ?

3 times I faxed (yes, it was old school) the deposited checks to the state and was told it would be taken care of only to have these midwestern fucks... call me the next week on the phone saying I haven't paid my taxes ?

This went on for around three months... till, I finally told them to go fuck themselves and I was going to file a grievance with my tax attorney in Bonner Springs, Kansas.

Never heard from these leaches again.

There's a reason people live in the "Midwest'... they're not very bright (or flat out criminals/slackers trying to extort money from businesses they think they can fuck over.

Don't even get me started on trying to build a building in that state with the local city government (Bonner Springs).

I was told... I could NOT use extension cords... while building a building.... huh ???

Oh yeah, I had to tear down the ceiling fans we put up in the building because I didn't use "bubba" the guy that was approved to do electrical shit in the city/town.

I could go on for the next month on how unfriendly Kansas is business wise.

The Midwest... is a fucking shithole.

trev · Post by **trev** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 11:09 pm

They don't need your business in Kansas.

The State · Post by **The State** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 11:13 pm

Hoyt got it right... Speed Trap

Go to Kansas on vacation... leave on probation.

Jay in Phoenix · Post by **Jay in Phoenix** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 11:14 pm

Tools, running a chime booth at various Ren Faires does not constitute having "a company" in four different states.

Gay, transient and stupid is no way to go through life son.

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 11:14 pm

R-Jack wrote:
Goober McTuber wrote:
War Wagon wrote:My old boss, who is now VP of mfg, called me into his office this morning and told me the choice had come down to him or me. He got the short straw in the effort to cut overhead.
Wow. Dude must be a nuclear grade fuckup.
Or he just makes more than Wags

I damn sure hope he does. He's salaried but is there every morning before 5 and doesn't leave most nights until after 6. Whatever they pay him, he's worth every dime of it. This is a family owned company on about the 4th generation. They do their best to take care of their people, but the bottom line always comes first.

As for my old and now again boss, he's the first person since the company was founded in 1955 to not be a member of that family and hold the job title of VP. Good for him I guess. I couldn't do those hours or handle that amount of stress. I have enough as is.

Myself, I'm hourly and every minute over 40 is time and a half. I've learned over the years that a salary employee is most likely to get the ax before an hourly one.

The State · Post by **The State** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 11:26 pm

Jay in Phoenix wrote:Tools, running a chime booth at various Ren Faires does not constitute having "a company" in four different states.

Gay, transient and stupid is no way to go through life son.

You're not very bright are you Jay ?

Have you ever been to "Apache Junction" ?

Let me help you out here... simpleton.

My friend just sold his booth in Plantersville... for $250,000 dollars... and it cost him about $20,000 to build just outside of Magnolia.

Like I said, "have you ever been to 'Apache Junction' "???

He has a booth there... and is now in Waxahachie, TX. ... counting his money at Scarborough Faire.

But, who am I kidding... what the fuck would you know about making money ?

You live in America's armpit.

Moving Sale · Post by **Moving Sale** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 11:30 pm

mvscal wrote:Professional competence is totally irrelevant at least in a publicly traded corporation.

Don't worry the free market will sort it out.

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Wed Apr 01, 2015 11:35 pm

Derron wrote:So Wags, when that bullet whizzed by your dome and lodged squarely in your boss's melon, did you hear it as it went by " Wags..you could be next ..."

Absolutely, I heard that.

But I've always known it as well. I haven't lasted there almost 32 years not knowing that.

We did our fiscal year end inventory on Saturday 3/28 - I was right in the middle of that total clusterfuck from 5 am to 7:45 pm until the VP said we were done and thanked those who had stayed for the duration. He had total everyone up front not to ask to leave early, he'd let people go as it wound down. My old boss sneaked out of there about 5. While that may not be the entire reason, it's at least part of why I still have a job and he doesn't.

That, and I know a fuckload more about this business than he did.

Jay in Phoenix · Post by **Jay in Phoenix** » Thu Apr 02, 2015 12:01 am

Tools, Apache Junction is a shithole. If your buddy is in business there, well, that speaks volumes.

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Thu Apr 02, 2015 12:12 am

Moving Sale wrote:
mvscal wrote:Professional competence is totally irrelevant at least in a publicly traded corporation.
Don't worry the free market will sort it out.

Yes, it does.

I was laid off after ten years with a Fortune 50 corporation in Socal but I was well prepared and now we're doing quite well in Omaha. We're making more money nominally than we did in California and the cost of living is much lower. Enjoy your weather...or whatever it is you fags do to convince yourself that it's actually worth it to live in a tard managed train wreck.

It's supposed to rain here tonight. You remember rain, don't you?

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Thu Apr 02, 2015 12:14 am

The State wrote:My taxes were paid to the state of Kansas and had documents to back it up (deposited checks by the state and forwarded to the state) and these fuckers in Wichita would call me on the phone weekly saying I needed to pay up or I would lose my license ?

I've had my share of problems with Kansas income taxes as my wife works there while we live and I work in Missouri.

Double taxation, much?

Wichita, you say?

That's odd, since every dealing we've had with the KDOR has emanated from Topeka, being as how it's the state capital.

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Thu Apr 02, 2015 12:17 am

The State wrote: his booth in Plantersville...

trev · Post by **trev** » Thu Apr 02, 2015 12:19 am

The State wrote:. ... counting his money at Scarborough Faire.

parsley, sage, rosemary and thyme.......

The State · Post by **The State** » Thu Apr 02, 2015 1:28 am

War Wagon wrote:
That's odd, since every dealing we've had with the KDOR has emanated from Topeka, being as how it's the state capital.

You're right. Topeka.

I was thinking Wichita... since I donated some of my pieces to the PBS station there to be auctioned off for fundraising.

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Thu Apr 02, 2015 1:51 am

Papa Willie wrote:I seriously doubt he's ever even been to Kansas.

I don't.

He's too familiar with the area and who would admit they had been there if they hadn't?

I hate Jayhawks and Kansas in general with a passion, but I did get to see BTO at Sandstone amphitheater in Bonner Springs so it does have some redeeming value.

Best concert ever next to Foghat at Starlight, in the rain.