T1B

TheJON wrote:buckeye,

Brady got them downfield or Brady HELPED get them downfield? Because I simply do not recall Brady taking a snap and then running 50 yards. You'll at the very least (unlike Killian and Mgo) acknowledge the fact that there actually were other players on the field for New England during those drives, won't you???

You are the biggest fucking idiot I have ever come across, virtually or in real life. No where did I say that "Manning blows" nor did I ever imply that Brady did it all on his own. What I did state, that Brady won 3 Super Bowls with no where near the offensive talent that Manning has had surrounding him for most of his career. If the Pat's Super Bowls were a result of their defense, fine. But why hasn't Manning won a Super Bowl? After all, he is a QB that is the best in the league and can make every throw. If he can make every throw, why hasn't he put his team in position more often to make the Super Bowl? I also don't ever remember Brady leading his team to a 40+ point drubbing in the playoffs with his team failing to score a TD. Then again, I could be wrong. You have the only TV in America that tunes into the games.

Didn't Pittsburgh as the #6 seed last year upset the Colts in the first round?

Didn't the colts still have Edge, Wayne, Harrison and the White Football Jesus (sup Vince had to steal part of your title)...

just sayin

buckeye,

Yes, that is true. And that is my point about how the media overhypes these QB's. I don't wanna sit here and make it sound like I don't think the QB's are important because they are, but they're not AS important as the media likes to say. Look at Trent Dilfer, Ben Roethlisberger, Brad Johnson. Good teams CAN win Super Bowls with average QB's as long as that QB doesn't screw up and plays well within the system. Now, am I saying Brady isn't much better than those guys? Fuck no. He's a million times better. But he gets WAY too much credit for the success of the Patriots. He deserves plenty of it, but so do guys like Deion Branch, Ty Law, Teddy Bruschi, Richard Seymour, Adam Vinitieri, etc... Heck, if I were Ty Law I'd be pissed that Brady stole my MVP award from their 1st Super Bowl.

As for Smith, I won't argue he got too much credit. I can tell you from watching them in person that he was not even close to the best player on the field in that game. He played okay too, but Troy Smith didn't beat us. Gonzalez, Pittman, Wells, etc....those guys tore our D apart. They were so fast and so athletic. Then, on defense, Laurinitis and Jenkins were studs, and the guys up front were too much to handle for our O-line. I was amazed with how good tOSU was, but I did not leave the stadium thinking "man, that Troy Smith was amazing." Anthony Gonzalez, yes. But Smith was just pretty good in my mind. And I think he'll just be an average NFL QB.

Oh yeah, until he was hurt, Ty Law was considered the best CB in the league.

Killian,

He hasn't put his team in a position to win the Super Bowl?? Well, in a little over a week they'll most likely have a ring. And before this year, they've been very close. If Vanderjagt makes that kick, they probably win the Super Bowl. They were clearly the best team, but sometimes this little thing called an upset happens. In 2003, give him a defense, and things would have been different but they couldn't stop anyone. You can't win in the playoffs without playing defense ESPECIALLY on the road. In 2003 they beat Denver and then won at KC (both games in which Manning starred in), but eventually the D was gonna have to step up and make plays. Sure, Manning played poorly in the AFC Championship game that year, but it wouldn't have mattered because their D couldn't stop New England. When you go on the road, you better pack a defense.

The only position Vanderjagt was in that positon was because Bettis fumbled. Before that, Manning played like ass.

Your claim is that he is the best QB in the league and he can make all the throws. If that is the case, explain why he hasn't been to the Super Bowl before this year. If he can make all the throws, and he has All Pros around him on offense, he should be able to over come any defense.

And don't count your chickens before they hatch. As you said, there's these little things called "upsets".

TheJON wrote:Everyone says defense wins championships, but the QB gets all the credit?? How on earth does that make any sense?? I think QB's in general are overhyped and people claim 1 is better than the other simply because 1 has more rings than the other.

Regardless, you still have yet to offer up anything to convince me that Manning has been the better qb of the two. On top of that, you've been all over the fucking map with your "arguments." You may possess some knowledge, but you have no fucking clue how to convey a thought.

You say things like it isn't fair to cite big wins as a basis for "who's better" since it's a team game, yet you use Peyton's AFC Championship win as a key point to your overall argument, on the basis of "he got over the hump."

Just take a break. Calm down, and work on your "tone of voice" when you type, and rationally try to explain your argument. I seriously have no idea where you're going at this point. Every time you hit submit, you break off a whirlwind of long-windedness that's all so disconnected.

Figure out exactly what it is you're trying to argue, and get back to me.

I'm not counting my chickens before they hatch, that's why I said he'll "probably" have one. I hope I'm wrong, but I just see very little chance for the Bears to win. I have absolutely no confidence in Grossman. I think he'll wet his pants in this game. If Freeney gets any pressure on him whatsoever, the Bears are fucked. And even though the Colts don't have the best run defense, I do not think Thomas Jones and Cedric Benson will have huge games. But I do think that Manning will get off to a slow start and perhaps throw a pick and maybe that can keep the Bears close early or even in the lead. After that, I have no idea how they'll win because I think Manning will then get going and the Colts D will settle in. There is a possibility that Devin Hester can be the X-factor in this game. Look what Ellis Hobbs did to them. If the Pride of Moo U can get returns like that against the Colts, then Hester could be in for a big game and perhaps keep the Bears in the game. If not, I think the Bears have almost no chance to win this game. I'm expecting a 10-25-125 and 2 INT performance out of Grossman. Possibly Jones and Benson combine for 110 yards. But without some big returns by Hester, that won't be enough.

Colts 34
Bears 24

So you're just done debating the whole Manning v. Brady thing, right? Noted.

Mgo,

Give me a break, I'm typing this crap up in about a minute while actually trying to get some work done and have no cheat sheets in front of me so I'm typing everything staight off the top of my head. You can't expect a Pulizter Prize winning piece of work in 1 minute. You just have to understand my style of writing. I like to write out some crap real quick, review it, then make the changes. But I just hit submit here since this is not graded nor is it for work. Don't have the time to actually take this serious enough unless one of you wants to pay me for my work!!

Killian,

Yes, I am done debating the Manning v Brady thing. There's no point. We can just agree to disagree. I respect the Brady crowd and why they think he is the best QB, but I simply disagree with it. That is all. Is there really any point to continuing the argument? If so, I'd be more than obliged to continue on...

TheJON wrote:Don't have the time to actually take this serious enough unless one of you wants to pay me for my work!!

As long as the price accurately reflects the value, sure.

TheJON wrote:I'm typing this crap

TheJON wrote:I like to write out some crap

Just as long as you're honest enough to recognize it for what it truly is.

Yep, I recognize that. Ya know what's really fucked up? I actually somehow managed to get a degree in Journalism from a state university and I am a complete moron that can't write. Not only that, but I graduated with honors. God bless the public school system!!!

You're obviously better qualified to deliver newspapers than to write for them.

Good point Goober. Perhaps maybe I could tag along someday with you on your route then I could use you as a reference on my job app.

Brilliant use of the IKYABWAI comeback. Tard.

Maybe you could tag along with Irie Lagos, he actually does claim to deliver papers. Maybe he’ll even introduce you to his wife.

No. We're currently dicussing the level of the JON's tardishness. Rack you for showing up to provide a point of reference.

TheJON wrote:I am done debating the Manning v Brady thing.

TheJON wrote:I'd be more than obliged to continue on...

See?

Another shining example of just how entertaining JON can be.

And no, pal, we're not laughing with you.

TheJON wrote:I actually somehow managed to get a degree in Journalism from a state university

time for me to take the gre

TheJON wrote: Not only that, but I graduated with honors.

And I bet you were Salutatorian too. Not bad for home schooling...

IndyFrisco wrote:And I bet you were Salutatorian too. Not bad for home schooling...

i could see JON being one of the kids at jesus camp and becoming born again...at age six. with his propensity for fighting to the death over complete bullshit, it would make sense.

Nice to see an NFL thread go 6 pages in the "College Football" forum.

Does this place have any mods, that do anything other than ban nic's?

Shut up, dunce.

What mod banned a nic? What nic was banned by a mod?

all this shit about manning reminds me of our brief manning to harrison romp on the playground. in the shadow of brady's old home, no less.

Looked more like Flutie to McCaffrey from where I was standing.

Rack mgo's initial take on Manning. I guess I have nothing to type on the matter.

m2ool, the folks in here can discuss whatever they want - your sojourn is a little more tenuous.

PSUFAN wrote: Looked more like Flutie to McCaffrey from where I was standing.

From the middle of the street?

There were only instants of standing at that point. None worthy of gridiron analysis, surely.

Killian wrote:
It's weird that the year after he leaves Tennessee, they win the MNC. He must have had some hand in that, too.

Irrelevant. NU won after Frazier left. Two different teams. Not defending Manning(0-4) vs UF, but that's unfair.

0-3 vs UF. He came off the bench in 94.

T REX wrote:

Killian wrote:
It's weird that the year after he leaves Tennessee, they win the MNC. He must have had some hand in that, too.

Irrelevant. NU won after Frazier left. Two different teams. Not defending Manning(0-4) vs UF, but that's unfair.

First, I was mocking JON.

Second, the title they won was shared. But I see your point.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:0-3 vs UF. He came off the bench in 94.

He played, they lost.....0-4.

Dude came into the game inheriting a pretty sizeable deficit, as a freshman, and you're attributing the loss to him?

You're a tough customer.

Well, he had three more tries and didn't do any better. I'm going with the 0-4....it looks better.

Fair enough.

His college days were really pretty similar to his pro days. Racked up all kinds of stats, records, and even has his number retired already, yet just couldn't win the "big one," despite having a very good all-around record as a starting qb.

Certainly a lot will change if he can win a Super Bowl, but I don't see how anybody could argue that the guy has been coasting on anything more than raw statistics since his days in orange.

Who says he's "coasting on raw statistics?" I'm actually not much of a stats guy because stats can be misleading. Sometimes, stats do tell the tale, but with Manning it's more than JUST stats. It's the 10-13 wins his team gets every year with him being the biggest star on that team. It's the throws he makes. With Manning, stats do tell a lot, but not everything. When you put up numbers like Marino and Manning have done, you have to be an unbelieveably talented and successful QB. You can't just be an average QB and tear apart the record books. And to do this for as long as they have is unreal in my mind. There's a good possibility that in 50 years, Manning, Marino, and Favre will be 1-2-3 on just about every all-time or single season passing record still. The guy comes to play every game, never gets injured, and plays at the absolute highest level just about every game. And has been doing so for 9 years. And in 5 days, he'll most likely have a Super Bowl ring to show for his hard work. The fact of the matter is, when I watch Peyton Manning play I am amazed at what he does. After many games I see of him, I think to myself "wow, he's fucking amazing." When I watch Tom Brady, I'm not amazed. I think "okay, solid performance out of him." If you take away the rings from Brady and keep everything else (ie stats, regular season recrd, etc), he'd be considered an average QB. Now, Manning has zero rings and is still considered one of the best of all-time by most football experts/fans. And I do not believe Brady could be successful as a QB in any NFL system. I don't think the Patriots are the only team he could put up numbers with, but I do not believe there are as many places he could go and still be successful as there are for Manning.

The way I see it is this. Brady is a good looking guy. Dates models. Smiles for the camera. I'd say that if there's one famous QB of all-time that couldn't get laid, it would be Manning. And I think a big part of the reason that the media likes to overhype Brady is because of his good looks. He's a media darling. Every chick digs him. Yes, I know a big part of the reason they talk him up is his rings. But he wouldn't be getting this much love if he looked like, well, Peyton Manning. Perfect example.....Troy Aikman. Chicks LOVED Troy Aikman. Michael Irvin.....coke addict from The U. Aikman in the HOF, Irvin not. How anyone could say that Aikman should be in but not Irvin is beyond me. Aikman was a decent QB, but he's another guy that got overhyped because of how much of a good looking, All-American white guy he was. Irvin was the star of that offense (along with Emmitt, of course). If you ask me, Aikman was maybe the 5th or 6th most valuable player to that offense. He, along with Brady, are guys that the media has a hard-on for and loves to overhype and then the fans buy into that hype without actually sitting back and watching what they're doing.

TheJON wrote:The way I see it is this. Brady is a good looking guy.

NOOOOOO!!!!! I CAN'T QUIT YOU!!!!

Sin,

While I didn't predict the Ryan Hansen smack, after I typed that I knew you'd be all over that. I was hoping you put that up in your sig, but at least you noticed the comment and jumped all over that. Props.

I can't help it if you toss the softballs (no pun intended), but I gotta swing if you do.