Mr. Tebow

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Thu Nov 03, 2011 5:38 pm

Someone will probably have to clue me in, to which I will likely respond with a facepalm, but this one almost made me piss myself, even though I didn't get it:

smelling marv albert's hand > tebow

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Thu Nov 03, 2011 5:42 pm

Van wrote:"Catching your dad blowing your boyfriend > Tebow"

Cuda's got an ESPN account?

Felix · Post by **Felix** » Thu Nov 03, 2011 5:49 pm

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote: Yeah, but you know how it goes. Players don't volunteer this stuff, they get a dozen mics stuffed in their faces, and sometimes they let out a little brutal honesty instead of the usual cliches.

hey look it's no skin off me-before this season ever started I knew Denver was going to suck-they're pretty much exactly what I thought they'd be....if other players want to bash the guy they should have at it....

R-Jack · Post by **R-Jack** » Sun Nov 06, 2011 10:49 pm

Seems like the Raiders are doing a fair ammount of bashing Teblow in the 1st half.

Van · Post by **Van** » Sun Nov 06, 2011 11:06 pm

Tebow did have that one excellent throw to Decker for the TD, but overall he's still all over the place in terms of accuracy. He's missed some by a mile, and in ways not normally seen with NFL QBs.

Once thing that's very telling is how conservative Fox has been with the play-calling in an attempt to limit the damage Tebow errors could cause his offense. Every time it's third-and-long, all they let Tebow do are screens and shovel passes. They're just not running the risk of letting him throw late, deep.

His ability to run remains his best weapon, by far. He's also decent when rolling to his left. Gotta say, the guy is tough as nails. He takes a pounding with the best of 'em. Huge balls, definitely.

On the other hand, Carson Palmer has looked pretty damn decent so far. His one pick was a well-thrown ball that turned into a mid-air scrum that Bailey won. His receivers have fallen down and/or cut off their routes on him a couple times. They've also dropped a couple. Overall, he's looked really good throwing the ball, exhibiting nice touch and sufficient drive on the longer passes. His second TD pass was a thing of beauty, one which most QBs likely would not have attempted much less completed.

And just as I'm typing all that, Tebow throws a solid TD pass on the heels of the previous play's nice scramble. He's looking a whole lot better than he did against Miami and Detroit, that's for sure.

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Sun Nov 06, 2011 11:21 pm

Van wrote: Every time it's third-and-long, all they let Tebow do are screens and shovel passes.

Those are the plays you run to help an offensive line not a quarterback. You've never played football, have you?

Van · Post by **Van** » Sun Nov 06, 2011 11:33 pm

Shut the fuck up, idiot. Those plays are called for no other reason than to limit Tebow's exposure. If they trusted him more, they'd let him air it out a bit. You think they'd be calling those same 'white flag' plays if Manning, Brees or Rogers were back there?

Of course not.

And here you are again, still without your schedule for his acceptable progress. It's not like you to puss out so blatantly like this, you know. Tebow's actually playing fairly well this game, so you should jump on this opportunity.

Van · Post by **Van** » Sun Nov 06, 2011 11:37 pm

Oh, and Palmer's arm seems just fine. His footwork is solid, his delivery is smooth, the touch is there, and his accuracy deep is simply uncanny. He looks fantastic today.

(Edit: Bwaaaaa! Just as I said that, he throws high down the middle for a tip/pick.)

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Sun Nov 06, 2011 11:42 pm

Van wrote:You think they'd be calling those same 'white flag' plays if Manning, Brees or Rogers were back there?

Absolutely. Are you saying the Packers, Colts and Saints don't run screens? They aren't "white flag" plays. Those plays are designed to take advantage of a fast pass rush. It looks like a jail break every time Tebow drops back or sets up in the shotgun. If you can slow down the pass rush a bit, then you can take some shots down the field.

You really don't know shit about football. I mean nothing.

Van · Post by **Van** » Sun Nov 06, 2011 11:52 pm

Now you're just trolling. There is no way you're this fucking stupid and/or oblivious. Yes, other teams will throw a screen as a change-up to slow down a pass rush, but they won't subsist on a consistent and utterly predictable diet of shovel passes and screens when it's third-and-nine. They will at least make an attempt now and then to convert. Denver was absolutely doing no such thing. They were conceding the possession every time, just to limit the potential damage.

And how's that schedule of yours coming along? Just about got it ready for us yet? Oh, and while we're on the subject of you being a pussy, didja happen to notice that Texas won their game yesterday? That's like two in a row for them, or some such. Shouldn't that herald your triumphant return to the college football board?

Van · Post by **Van** » Sun Nov 06, 2011 11:54 pm

Goddamn, the Raiders are one stupid bunch of motherfuckers. 3rd and forever, Tebow is heading for the sideline having only gotten to the line of scrimmage, and Oakland just cannot resist giving him the idiotic late shove, drawing the personal foul flag.

They are so fucking...Oakland.

Van · Post by **Van** » Mon Nov 07, 2011 12:21 am

Nice way to finish off your total collapse there, Oakland D. Just...wow.

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Mon Nov 07, 2011 1:19 am

Great, another week of hearing about that guy. Thanks Raiders!

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Thu Nov 10, 2011 10:15 am

Van, in all honestly, I'm not sure this thread is working out so well for you - because in a bottom line business, Tebow is sort of... doing alright, all things considered.
He is still a "project" QB and has been pressed into duty as a starter before he's really fully ready for the gig.

Yes, the Raider defensive performance in the 2nd half was brutally AWFUL.

Fact is, Tebow is 2-1 as a starter - on a BAD offensive football team.
Poor line and below average skill players supporting him.

Yet he's led the offense to 22 pts a game.
He's gotten the ball in the end zone five times, while turning it over just twice.
That's the name of the game - put points on the board and WIN games.
Not how, but how many.

He's taken too many sacks (14), yes.

I'm not a fan of his and I actually hope he, being a Mule, fails, but to date, I'd say he's sort of getting the "last" laff.

Let's see what happens over the next few weeks.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Thu Nov 10, 2011 2:39 pm

Vince Young made the Pro Bowl his first year. How's that working out for him now?

Van · Post by **Van** » Thu Nov 10, 2011 6:26 pm

pop, he's looked utterly awful in two of these three starts. He was the reason Denver was getting killed at Miami for most of the game. He was a large part of the reason they got killed for the entire Detroit game. It was really only his running—aided immeasurably by McGahee's running—that afforded him his success against Oakland. His actual passing that game was still mostly unacceptable. He threw for less than 50% including a very low yards-per-attempt average despite the fact that Oakland was offering him man-coverage with barely a thought to his wide-open receivers.

The things that he has to be in order to become a successful NFL QB were still mostly lacking in evidence, even against Oakland. Judging by these three games, yep, he's still well behind the curve of where a second year NFL QB ought to be, especially a Heisman-winning first-round draft pick QB from a top-notch program like Florida.

Guys like that are not supposed to be mere rough-clay three-year 'projects.'

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Thu Nov 10, 2011 9:56 pm

Van wrote:Guys like that are not supposed to be mere rough-clay three-year 'projects.'

You're so full of shit it isn't even funny anymore. You're just sad and pathetic at this point.

Drew Brees who was:

Van wrote:...solid from the moment he stepped foot in the NFL.

and possesed of:

Killian wrote:...pinpoint accuracy in a pass heavy offense with multiple reads while in college.

nevertheless required:

Van wrote:2-Being in the league long enough to learn the ropes

Long enough to learn the ropes in Brees' case being three years as a starter. For some reason though, Tebow isn't afforded that same opportunity. I wonder why that is. I have to say that comes from one heaping portion of intellectual dishonesty.

You gush all over the "brilliant success story" of Cam Newton and I'm not taking anything away from Newton, I think he's going to be a fine QB, but the NFL is a bottom line business so let's take a look at that bottom line.

Newton is 2-6 with 11 passing TDs and 7 rushing TDs with 9 picks and 4 fumbles.
Tebow is 3-3 with 11 passing TDs and 7 rushing TDs with 4 picks and 5 fumbles.

They both play on shitty teams so that's a wash, though Newton has an All Pro receiver in Steve Smith, yet Tebow has won more games in fewer starts, has scored just as many points in fewer starts and has made fewer turnovers as well. This brings to mind another of your failed predictions regarding Tebow:

Van wrote:Tebow is a turnover waiting to happen, once that timing window goes from nearly infinity - the way it was for him at Florida - to infintesimal, the way it is in the NFL.

Or not...

Speaking of failed predictions here's another beauty from Killian regarding Colt Brennan's prospects in the same thread:

Killian wrote:I wouldn't expect too much from him right now until other areas of the Skins are addressed and you see how he performs against real NFL talent, but in Shannahan's system, I could see him being a serviceable pro.

He could see him being a serviceable pro? Hmmm. Well, nobody else could and Brennan is now out of pro football entirely. Interesting that nothing much is expected of Brennan due the lack of surrounding talent yet Tebow isn't afforded any latitude for the lack of talent surrounding him. Looks like another case of intellectual dishonesty to me.

You're both done on this topic. You were wrong, period. You are both hypocrites with double standards, period but, being pathetic last word whores desperately attempting to salvage the tattered remnants of your credibility, I'm sure you'll both continue to flop around some more and dig yourself in deeper. It's not like you have anything left to lose, right?

Van · Post by **Van** » Fri Nov 11, 2011 12:30 am

Dumbass, the learning curve for Drew Brees merely entailed adjusting to the speed of the NFL game and picking up on more complicated defensive schemes. That's the normal learning curve for any NFL QB. What isn't normal is when a three-year starter/Heisman winner/first-round draft pick from a major program enters the league still needing to be shown how to correctly set his feet and deliver an accurate pass without the enitire process being measured by a sundial.

Face it, you've been a fraud from Day One on all of this, and like I said in the other thread when you once again pussed out on delivering your Tebow Schedule...

I've asked you to back up your shit with specifics, what, four times now? It's clear that you're too much of a coward to stand and deliver. Whatever. This is becoming boring.

"Credibility."

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Fri Nov 11, 2011 1:14 am

Van wrote:Dumbass, the learning curve for Drew Brees merely entailed adjusting to the speed of the NFL game and picking up on more complicated defensive schemes.

Oh, I see. And that learning curve for Brees was a "mere" three years as a starter. It does; however, beg the question of why you are judging Tebow a failure after only six games as a starter despite the fact that he has won fifty percent of his starts, is putting a lot of points on the board and has taken care of ball.

That's the normal learning curve for any NFL QB.

Except for Tebow, right? No "adjusting to the speed of the NFL game and picking up on more complicated defensive schemes" for Tim. If he isn't an instant all-pro, he's a categorical failure according to you.

That's why you and your shit take are such a fucking joke.

Van · Post by **Van** » Fri Nov 11, 2011 5:36 am

Baby steps, asshat. Before one becomes an All-Pro QB, they must first master the basics of playing the position. Brees came into the league with those basics down. He didn't have to spend his first few seasons being tutored on remedial things any good QB coming out of Mater Dei HS can already execute.

Running QBs do not win in the NFL. You and others have correctly said so for years. Tebow will never be a shadow of a Michael Vick as a runner, and even Vick still hasn't done dick in terms of any real winning. Along the way, he's also had to force himself into more of a pass-first mindset, but at least he already had those passing skillsets in his arsenal. Same with Steve Young.

Tebow doesn't possess anything like that. All he has are a fullback's legs and a delivery that is a sack or pick waiting to happen. As long as they keep him throwing almost nothing but screens and check-downs, sure, he won't throw many picks. He also won't move many chains, score many points, or win many big games. Take away an uncharacteristically huge effort from McGahee and the offensive line, and what would we see?

The Detroit game, that's what we'd see.

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Fri Nov 11, 2011 6:01 am

Van wrote:Baby steps, asshat.

Yes, I see you taking baby steps backwards. That's OK.

War Wagon · Post by **War Wagon** » Sun Nov 13, 2011 10:11 pm

KC Scott wrote:Of course what is really pathetic is the Chiefs can't stop it

With both Magahee and Moreno out in the 1st qtr, even.

Tebow completed 2 passes all day, one of which was a 56 yard bomb that somehow KC let a WR get behind them on 3rd and 12.

Simply unbelievable. What a gutless, heartless effort that was today. Sickening.

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Sun Nov 13, 2011 10:41 pm

War Wagon wrote:, one of which was a 56 yard bomb that somehow KC let a WR get behind them on 3rd and 12.

That's odd. We were all assured that Tebow was only capable of 3 yard dink and dunk passes. There must be some mistake.

Van · Post by **Van** » Sun Nov 13, 2011 11:00 pm

mvscal wrote:

Felix · Post by **Felix** » Sun Nov 13, 2011 11:26 pm

the guy mostly looks terrible trying to throw the ball (except that 56 yd bomb, which was right on the money) but fuck me running, he wins games....say what you want, but victories in the NFL are what matters....

now, when they run up against a defense that can actually stop the run, it'll be a different story....but no doubt, the entire Denver team looks substantively different than they did in the first part of the season....how long will it last-that's anybody's guess...

miller is about as good as any rookie linebacker I've seen for some time....that cat is a fucking nightmare....reminds me a lot of derrick thomas, but I think he's definitely better against the run

trev · Post by **trev** » Mon Nov 14, 2011 3:43 am

Everytime I see Tebow play I continue to say he's going no where in this league. Tebow is terrible. He's a goner. He'll end up as a 2nd or 3rd stringer (or worse) sooner or later. I hope he continues to play for the Bronco's as long as possible. That would make my day because he's hilarious to watch. How anyone can think this guy is any good is beyond me. First of all, I don't think he has the intellect to be an NFL quarterback. There is something wrong with this boy. I can't put my finger on it. Maybe some sort of disorder they aren't telling us about. His coach and GM are aware of it, he's just the best thing they have right now. Can't wait for Denver to play the Jets. Sanchez vs. Tebow, then the Tebow lovers will see what a difference these two are. One can play QB, one is pretending.

Paul · Post by **Paul** » Mon Nov 14, 2011 4:13 am

War Wagon wrote:Tebow completed 2 passes all day, one of which was a 56 yard bomb that somehow KC let a WR get behind them on 3rd and 12.

Simply unbelievable. What a gutless, heartless effort that was today. Sickening.

We got beat by a high-school offense. Arguably the most embarassing loss in franchise history. With any luck Tyler Palko will be the starting QB against the Patsies next Monday night. I'm done with Cassel and his noodle arm.

Felix · Post by **Felix** » Mon Nov 14, 2011 4:21 am

trev wrote:Can't wait for Denver to play the Jets. Sanchez vs. Tebow, then the Tebow lovers will see what a difference these two are. One can play QB, one is pretending.

have some more liquor and calm yourself....I can see this whole tebow thing has you pretty upset....

Screw_Michigan · Post by **Screw_Michigan** » Mon Nov 14, 2011 4:35 am

Sanchez can play? He got embarrassed by the league's worst defense tonight.

trev · Post by **trev** » Mon Nov 14, 2011 5:05 am

Yes, I'm pretty sure Sanchez has already proven himself. His team got beat tonight. What does that have to do with his comparison to Tebow?

trev · Post by **trev** » Mon Nov 14, 2011 5:06 am

Felix wrote:
have some more liquor and calm yourself....I can see this whole tebow thing has you pretty upset....

Yes, I'm real upset. So upset that I'm giddy at the thought of watching him play out the rest of the season. It's called entertainment.

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Mon Nov 14, 2011 5:34 am

Part of being a successful QB is... intangible.
Sometimes you can't put your finger on it and it often doesn't show up on the stat sheet.

There is no doubt that Tebow has, for whatever reason, given the team a lift.
Give him some credit.

3-1, but Miami is a losing team.
KC is floundering very badly.
Oakland has a habit of shitting the bed right when it looks like they might be turning the corner.

Not murderer's row.

Felix · Post by **Felix** » Mon Nov 14, 2011 12:50 pm

trev wrote:
So upset that I'm giddy at the thought of watching him play out the rest of the season. It's called entertainment.

so I'll assume you're "giddy at the thought" of tebow facing the jets because
a. you want to see him fail
b. you want to see him humiliated
c. you want to see him hurt

hate to tell you this, but if your giddiness fits any of the three options above, maybe you'd better check yourself....exactly what is your vested interest in tebow's performance anyway?

poptart wrote:
3-1, but Miami is a losing team.
KC is floundering very badly.
Oakland has a habit of shitting the bed right when it looks like they might be turning the corner.

Not murderer's row.

but still better IMHO than Orton would have done as the starter....the team had given up with orton starting....they've found some new life behind tebow

Van · Post by **Van** » Mon Nov 14, 2011 7:47 pm

pop, I know you're just trying to be Mr. Reasonable here, but please. Denver is winning despite Tebow, not because of him. He's not a pitcher who gets credit for winning 2-1 games by shutting out the other team through eight innings. Fox is doing every last thing possible to minimize his negative effect on the offense. In the meantime, they're winning with defense and a solid running game, most of which isn't Tebow's doing. Denver ran for something like 250 yards yesterday, and Tebow was maybe 1/5th of that. The game against Oakland? Defense and Willis McGahee.

In both cases it's the O-Line and the defense pulling the freight here, not Tebow's three-yards-and-a-pile-of-punts.

2-8 for 60-something yards when the other team knows you're going to run is all the proof anyone should ever need that this has become an utter joke. With the defense stacked that heavily against the run any QB worth a bucket of spit would've torched man-coverage all over the field. It's gotten so bad that Fox won't even let the guy throw dinks-and-dunks now.

2-8, for sixty-some yards. For a whole game. Not a single drive, or even a half...an entire game. This is simply unheard of in the NFL.

Yeah, good luck with that, Denver.

poptart · Post by **poptart** » Mon Nov 14, 2011 9:30 pm

Van wrote:The game against Oakland? Defense and Willis McGahee.

Tebow rushed for 118 yds in that game.

As "strange" as his play has been, Van, the one thing he hasn't done is ---> turn the ball over.

Job #1 for a QB is to take care of the ball.

Shit, he's a 44% passer for this season, so of course he's deficient, and what is happening (some wins) won't happen over any long haul.

I'm just giving him his just due, I think.

He's obviously doing a few things right, along with many things wrong.

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Mon Nov 14, 2011 10:02 pm

Van wrote:Denver is winning despite Tebow, not because of him. .

Really? The 20 touchdowns he has scored in 7 games as a starter have nothing to do with any of their wins? I'll repeat that. 20 touchdowns in 7 games. I don't care who you are. That's is elite level scoring.

Yes, you have sailed right off the cliff into complete, stone cold stupidity.

ChargerMike · Post by **ChargerMike** » Mon Nov 14, 2011 10:17 pm

...dog and a cold one over here.

Van · Post by **Van** » Tue Nov 15, 2011 12:52 am

poptart wrote:
Van wrote:The game against Oakland? Defense and Willis McGahee.
Tebow rushed for 118 yds in that game.

Yes, and McGahee rushed for a lot more than that. The offensive line carried that day, not Tebow.

As "strange" as his play has been, Van, the one thing he hasn't done is ---> turn the ball over.

Nor have you. The two of you have had nearly the equal cause ----> effect as it relates to Denver winning.

Yeah, when you only run the ball you're not likely to turn it over much.

Job #1 for a QB is to take care of the ball.

Like I said, when all you're asked to do is turn and hand it off to a RB in between the occasional zone-read scramble, nope, you're probably not going to turn it over much.

Let's see how 2-8 for sixty yards plays out when the opponent isn't Miami, a Kyle Boller-led Raiders minus Darren McFadden, and the K.C. freaking Chiefs. I'm thinking the QB's new job description will entail just a bit more than not turning it over, especially since we're not exactly talking about a Trent Dilfer/2000 Baltimore Ravens situation here with Denver.

This has been the definition of smoke and mirrors, with only the Detroit game being any real harbinger of things to come. Put it this way: In all your years of watching NFL football, have you ever seen an offense go as blatantly out of their way to hide their QB's obvious shortcomings as what we're seeing right now in Denver? There have been plenty of eighth-round draft pick rookies pressed into emergency service who were entrusted with more than this. Fox has almost literally scrapped his playbook in deference to his QB's liabilities. There simply is no precedent for this...and we're talking about a Heisman-winning first-round pick, not some scrub free agent recently rescued off the waiver wire.

mvscal · Post by **mvscal** » Tue Nov 15, 2011 1:51 am

Van wrote:I'm thinking the QB's new job description will entail just a bit more than not turning it over,

Which part of 20 touchdowns in 7 games flew over your head? I understand. You're an intellectually dishonest pile of shit who has invested all of your credibility into a failed premise. Sucks to be you.

Scoring points and taking care of the ball are the two most important tasks for an NFL QB. Tebow has done a pretty goddamn good job of doing both of those by any measure. Now he has to learn to sustain drives and improve his completion percentage. That's all part of the ordinary learning curve of a young QB "adjusting to the speed of the NFL." You know...the learning curve you have extended to everybody except Tim Tebow.

What your problem? Did he fuck your mother and shoot your dog?

Van · Post by **Van** » Tue Nov 15, 2011 3:11 am

Running for touchdowns will not get it done for a QB in the NFL, troll. Never has...never will. His learning curve is a Tebow Specific Learning Curve, which is another way of saying Endless Excuses For A Guy Who Simply Isn't Skilled Enough To Play The Position. His "learning curve" bears no resemblance to that of any of other rookie QB in the NFL, much less any other first-round draft pick QB.

Oh, wait. That's right, he's not a rookie. He doesn't even have that excuse.