T1B

Headhunter wrote:In all my years of going to church (and I've attended services in several denominations in several different countries) I've never heard anyone proclaim that God said to give them money.

I've heard some use strong arm and guilt tactics. Some I would consider shady. Some religions ask for percentages of income. But I've never heard them proclaim that God said to give them money.

They proclaim to be doing God's will with the money. To using the money to spread his word, and provide for the less fortunate, but they didn't say he told them to collect it!

The "God Said to give me your money" was a generalization.

The strong arm & guilt tactics you addressed are what irked me the most.
I've seen revivals where some of the congregation looked like they barely could scrape together enough for Sunday dinner at Denny's be extolled to give all they could so the Caddy driving preacher could "do the Lord's work".

In this particular case, the "Lords Work" was him fathering a child with a 17 year old who had grown up going to that church. Later she was "excommunicated" for having an abortion. He stayed on as pastor several more years.

Yea, that's an extreme case, but just points to the hypocracy that exists.

All religions, just like any other Business, need the cash flow simply to exist. I get that. And I'm sure there are many solid organizations that truly do practice what they preach.

Like I said at the begining, I guess I'm just jaded.

"If you can only send me $15, don't even BOTHER!"

-sin
Rev Gene Scott

Cuda wrote:"If you can only send me $15, don't even BOTHER!"

-sin
Rev Gene Scott

Gene Scott was "da bomb!"

Many a drunken 3 am was spent by my fraternity brothers and I laughing our asses off at that Colonel-Sanders'-lookin' freak, watching him staring back at us 'til someone sent him money, or watching footage of his horses (with DS's "Walk of Life" playing) or his unintentionally hysterical sermons.

More than a few times we tried to get past his call screeners to chat with him, but dangit, for some reason they had a thing against letting drunken, stoned, cynical frat boys on air....

KC Scott wrote:

Like I said at the begining, I guess I'm just jaded.

^^^The Truth.

He was probably just mostly dead.

JCT wrote:He was probably just mostly dead.

Princess Bride resets are always fresh.

Have a good time storming the castle!

As usual, you butt licks have shown what a piece of shit you are and how this board sucks.
eat a dick!!!

JCT wrote:He was probably just mostly dead.

I think he wanted to go for a walk.

Damn, when I logged off Sunday afternoon, this bitch was dying at page 2; what the hell happened??

Props to MTLR (et all), for keeping up the debate, although I don't know how it came to ET's from "did Jesus come back from the dead"?

This is the oldest debate around (Does God exist), and like all other cultures, ethnic groups, and societies; there are people of questionable values and morals in religion as well. Power corrupts; sad but true.

I thank everyone for the heated debate, as it provides points for everyone to ponder on both sides of the issue. The bible teaches that we are here to accept the kingdom of heaven of free will. It's not guaranteed to us; but a choice we are given. If I'm wrong for my beliefs, only time will tell, and by then it just won't matter anyway. One thing it does provide for my family and me, (if I am just being "foolish and niave"), is that my kids will grow up to be strong, honest, clean living individuals with a solid base of core values to pass on to their children. I don't see that as being anything but a bonus irregardless of the outcome.

As far as the spirited debate (pardon the pun): I don't claim to be the most educated or articulate one out here. Spell check is a gift from heaven. I can't cite chapter and verse from the bible to reinforce my arguement. I don't read it like I should (and that's something I need to fix myself). I'll leave the arguement to those better trained for it; again (like I posted before) I'm not here to push my beliefs on you, or to save your eternal soul. To me the arguing of semantics seems pointless. You believe as you do, and I believe as I do; we are different, we have a choice to believe it or not.
I believe that if the world ended today, we would not go to the same place; and that makes me sad. That is called compassion; another of those traits the bible hammers home repeatedly. But. it's still a choice that each person has to make on his/her own, hence the whole "free will" thang.

Props again to everyone involved, and I hope the whole Easter weekend (whether it be about jesus or generous bunnies) was joyous for everyone.

PS- rack JCT for the Princess Bride reset. Classic.

^^^ Very Well said! Rack it!

RACK Tiny

Drive by racks for mvscal, fester, and 88.

Myself, I don't agree with a literal interpretation of the Bible. I think there is much of allegorical value there, but much of the value is obscured in the ill-fated attempt to establish a literal interpretation.

I agree with basic "Christian" tenets, or more specifically, The Golden Rule.

I just don't see the relevance of whether or not Jesus was resurrected. There is a point, much larger and all encompassing, to the tale.

PSUFAN wrote:I just don't see the relevance of whether or not Jesus was resurrected. There is a point, much larger and all encompassing, to the tale.

Jesus claimed to be GOD, for crying out loud.

If He did not resurrect then He was not some "good, kind, compassionate teacher."

No, in that case He was a deceitful, lying POS.

Hardly the kind of person that should be followed or listened to.


EVERYTHING depends on whether He rose or not.



He was just a gooooooood man........a gooooooooood teacher.


Bunk.

Jesus sure resurrected this board that's for sure. And to think all Jesus wanted to do was go to Venus leaving Levon and his Cartoon Balloons far behind.

Roger_the_Shrubber wrote:Princess Bride resets are always fresh.

Especially when you quote them correctly. Count Rugen is your bitch when it comes to sucking.

Someday.. I suggest you watch the movie again... so you may get it "right" next time. But in the meantime, rest well, and dream of large women...

mvscal wrote:

PSUFAN wrote:I just don't see the relevance of whether or not Jesus was resurrected.

Accepting the divinity of Christ through his Resurrection is the central tenet of Christianity.

If you don't believe that, you aren't a Christian.

What I'm saying is that the fable doesn't have to be true to have merit. It can just be a story and still be effective.

Y2K wrote:Jesus sure resurrected this board that's for sure. And to think all Jesus wanted to do was go to Venus leaving Levon and his Cartoon Balloons far behind.

But then Levon would slowly die.

I always liked the story -- at least selected parts of it -- much more than the religion.

mvscal wrote:

PSUFAN wrote:What I'm saying is that the fable doesn't have to be true to have merit. It can just be a story and still be effective.

If it's just a story then it isn't a religion.

You said it yourself...bickering about how literally it should be interpreted has a way of weakening the message. That's all I'm saying.

Tiny wrote: One thing it does provide for my family and me, (if I am just being "foolish and niave"), is that my kids will grow up to be strong, honest, clean living individuals with a solid base of core values to pass on to their children. I don't see that as being anything but a bonus irregardless of the outcome.

raising your kids up Christian insures good values?

Voice of Reason wrote:

Tiny wrote: One thing it does provide for my family and me, (if I am just being "foolish and niave"), is that my kids will grow up to be strong, honest, clean living individuals with a solid base of core values to pass on to their children. I don't see that as being anything but a bonus irregardless of the outcome.

raising your kids up Christian insures good values?

What a moronic fucking take!

Does teaching them not to steal insure they'll never steal?

Does teaching them to be honest insure they'll never lie?

You may not believe in the resurection of Christ, but to denounce the core values of Christianity as a poor way to raise solid citizens is about as moronic a take as I've seen posted here. Even those who don't believe in Christ still raise their children with MANY of the core beliefs of Christianity.

This Christian guy who went to our church and lived down the street from us beat his wife and cheated on her regularly.

Those aren't core Christian values, are they?

Their kids went to our catholic school and were the worst ones there, always in trouble, always beating up on others.

Gee, wonder where they learned that?

Point being that it's not merely the method used, it's the parents who teach and live it that make the kids grow up to be strong, honest, clean living individuals with a solid base of core values.

There are just as many kids who aren't brought up under christian values that are honest, clean living individuals.

Just sayin'

My point being that the core Christian values are not those of Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson. They're the values that teach you to be kind to your fellow man. Treat your Mom and Dad well, don't steal your neighbors shit, don't cheat on your wife, don't fuck ten year old boys, etc.

They are the values of being a decent human being.

They are not exclusive to the Christian faith.

But to say that raising a kid on those values insures anything, good bad or otherwise is truly moronic.

I'm sure Voice Of Reason's folks raised him to not be an ignorant fool, but those values didn't take, now did they?

I think a lot of you mistake the actions of Catholic ( a denomination of Christianity) Priest and intertwine it with what you believe most Christians are like.

Headhunter wrote:My point being that the core Christian values are not those of Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson. They're the values that teach you to be kind to your fellow man. Treat your Mom and Dad well, don't steal your neighbors shit, don't cheat on your wife, don't fuck ten year old boys, etc.

They are the values of being a decent human being.

They are not exclusive to the Christian faith.

But to say that raising a kid on those values insures anything, good bad or otherwise is truly moronic.

True.

I think a lot of you mistake the actions of Catholic ( a denomination of Christianity) Priest and intertwine it with what you believe most Christians are like.

Also probably true, although no great effort seems to be in the making to alter that impression. All I ever see are so called Christian televangelists and preachers taking advantage of peoples gullibility and taking their money along the way, catholic priests molesting young boys, baptists fighting over gay priests, christians threatening/killing/bombing abortion centers. Hard to see any other side with all that.

Mister Bushice wrote:Also probably true, although no great effort seems to be in the making to alter that impression. All I ever see are so called Christian televangelists and preachers taking advantage of peoples gullibility and taking their money along the way, catholic priests molesting young boys, baptists fighting over gay priests, christians threatening/killing/bombing abortion centers. Hard to see any other side with all that.

Are all Muslims terrorists?

rozy wrote:

Mister Bushice wrote:Also probably true, although no great effort seems to be in the making to alter that impression. All I ever see are so called Christian televangelists and preachers taking advantage of peoples gullibility and taking their money along the way, catholic priests molesting young boys, baptists fighting over gay priests, christians threatening/killing/bombing abortion centers. Hard to see any other side with all that.

Are all Muslims terrorists?

Depends on who you ask. :)

Nice side step Babs.

Mister Bushice wrote:christians threatening/killing/bombing abortion centers.

Some of the most vile acts in History have been done in Gods name. Doesn't mean he wanted them done, nor does it mean that those who worship him condone those actions.

mvscal wrote:

Headhunter wrote:

Mister Bushice wrote:christians threatening/killing/bombing abortion centers.

Some of the most vile acts in History have been done in Gods name. Doesn't mean he wanted them done, nor does it mean that those who worship him condone those actions.

What's wrong with killing abortionists?

Somehow I knew that was where you would go with that one...

mvscal wrote:
What's wrong with killing abortionists?

They deserve to live you know, just like rapists, murders, and child molesters.

It's only fetuses and people on feeding tubes that deserve to die.

mvscal wrote:

Headhunter wrote:

Mister Bushice wrote:christians threatening/killing/bombing abortion centers.

Some of the most vile acts in History have been done in Gods name. Doesn't mean he wanted them done, nor does it mean that those who worship him condone those actions.

What's wrong with killing abortionists?

But most of them are Jewish, you fucking anti-semite.

But I'm right about the doctors.

Headhunter wrote:

Mister Bushice wrote:christians threatening/killing/bombing abortion centers.

Some of the most vile acts in History have been done in Gods name. Doesn't mean he wanted them done, nor does it mean that those who worship him condone those actions.

No, it means is that every major religion has its share of freaks and fanatics who will find away to interpret the law of their god to kill others in his name. None are any better or worse than others in that respect.

Jesus.......

Please end this thread.....

He hasn't been around in almost 2000 years, you expect him to come back just for that?

Mister Bushice wrote:He hasn't been around in almost 2000 years, you expect him to come back just for that?

Don't be too sure there......

rack all william butler yeats widening gyre resets in this thread.

I bet my Dad could beat up your Dad