T1B

the RATE at which they came into the country was a piss-dribble compared to the rate southern ILLEGALs are flooding in.

Are you sure about that? At various times in our history, immigration happened on a massive scale.

Also...hispanic people that come here and work have done a lot of community building, when given a chance. Ask folks in Nebraska, if you get a chance.

When you're only here to work a bit and then get the fuck out, yeah, you're not interested in bettering your surroundings. If you plan on staying, you feel differently.

BTW - Dins and RadioFan are totally rackable...

From the U.S. Census Bureau



Immigration numbers

History shows the U.S. has traditionally allowed relatively small numbers to immigrate,
thus allowing for decades of assimilation. After the peak of about 8.7 million in the first
decade of the 20th century (the "great wave"), numbers went steadily down. Immigration
averaged only 195,000 per year from 1921 through 1970.

These numbers are LEGAL numbers.

I might note, my wife was a legal immigrant.
Went through all the proper channels to become a proud American citizen.
Time, effort, family support, and money.

Now a bunch of law-breakers are going to be granted amnesty?

x infinity


DE-FUCKING-PORT

poptart wrote:Now a bunch of law-breakers are going to be granted amnesty?

x infinity


DE-FUCKING-PORT

Here's the problem I have with that argument.

Conservative (as in on the low end, not politically conservative) estimates are that there are 12 million illegal immigrants in the country. How on earth do we come up with the necessary means to deport every single last one of them?

Didn't we put a man on the moon?

If there's a will there is a way.
Right now, obviously, the 'leaders' have no will.


Lock & load, baby!

Terry in Crapchester wrote:
Conservative (as in on the low end, not politically conservative) estimates are that there are 12 million illegal immigrants in the country. How on earth do we come up with the necessary means to deport every single last one of them?

that stands side by side with the "they do the jobs nobody else is willing to do" argument....

meanwhile the members of Congress are assuring us this will be the absolute last time for sure they'll grant amne....er....give illegals a pathway to citizenship.....

I know they've said the same thing before, but I believe them this time.....

Terry in Crapchester wrote:How on earth do we come up with the necessary means to deport every single last one of them?

Americans eat a lot of beef. Something like 1/3rd of the beef consumed in the world is consumed in America.

If you'll remember back a couple of years ago, there was a problem with some diseased beef.

In the span of a couple of days, officials were able to determine exactly which cows were diseased. They were able to determine where those cows came from. Not only that, they were able to determine which stall those cows occupied at a little ranch in Washington. On top of that, they were able to determine what truck that cow rode in when it came to the USA from canada. Not only that, but with the help of the canadian government, they were able to determine which ranch in canada the cow came from, and which stall it lived in at that particular ranch in canada. On top of that, they were able to determine what food the cow ate while there, and which supplier the food came from. All of this data, when there's millions and millions of cows passing through slaughterhouses and grocery stores in this country.

All of this important information about the cows was collected in about two days.

The solution seems quite simple -- give every illegal immigrant a cow.

Terry in Crapchester wrote:
Conservative (as in on the low end, not politically conservative) estimates are that there are 12 million illegal immigrants in the country.

The 12 million figure is at least a decade old. If there were only 12 million of the bastards, we wouldn't be pressing 1-for-English on the fucking telephone all the goddam time; we wouldn't be pissing money away on bi-lingual education in the schools; we wouldn't have half the fucking radio stations on the dial playing mariachi music & beaner commercials; beer & cigarette billboards would be in english, and cinco-de-mayo would be just another fucking day. 12 million, my ass. The real number is more like 25-30 million

How on earth do we come up with the necessary means to deport every single last one of them?

By attrition. What makes you think it has to be done all at once?

Close the borders, cut off the social welfare goodies, and most of them will self-deport. Deport the rest as they're caught.

Cuda wrote:

Terry in Crapchester wrote:
Conservative (as in on the low end, not politically conservative) estimates are that there are 12 million illegal immigrants in the country.

The 12 million figure is at least a decade old. If there were only 12 million of the bastards, we wouldn't be pressing 1-for-English on the fucking telephone all the goddam time; we wouldn't be pissing money away on bi-lingual education in the schools; we wouldn't have half the fucking radio stations on the dial playing mariachi music & beaner commercials; beer & cigarette billboards would be in english, and cinco-de-mayo would be just another fucking day. 12 million, my ass. The real number is more like 25-30 million

Again, it's a function of where you live. Where I am, I just don't see most of what you cite.

1-for-English? Yeah, I can relate to that. But then again, it's not just illegals who have brought about that change.

Bi-lingual education in the schools? I don't see that. My son had a girl in his class who came here from Mexico. He tells me they're holding her back. I don't know the specifics, of course, but if I had to venture a guess, I would say that it's because of language deficiencies. The class is taught in English, and according to my son, there was never a Spanish interpreter for her. She was pulled out of class on occasion for more intensive instruction in the language, but even that was given to her in English, apparently.

Mariachi music on the radio? I haven't noticed, and I spend a lot of time on the road. Then again, my musical tastes are pretty much one-dimensional (classic rock), so unless a station I listen to switched format, I probably wouldn't notice.

Beer/cigarette billboards not in English? Dunno, don't pay much attention to those. Come to think of it, I don't recall seeing beer/cigarette billboards lately in any language, so maybe the legislature has restricted the way in which they can advertise.

Cinco de mayo? It's started to catch on here, but we're relatively late in the game. Ten years ago, I was probably the only person living here who was over the age of 25 or so who had ever heard of it.

jeezus Terry, do you reside in hooterville.......

Earth to Terry ...............

Yes, it's a product of where you live, and it's all moving northward.

Do you think those of us in 'border' states are making all this shit up?

I can almost pin it down to the week that this recent anti-immigrant hysteria "spontaneously" erupted.

You dopes get played sooooo easily.

Swift Boat Redux.

Immigrants or law-breakers.

Which is it, douche?

poptart wrote:Immigrants or law-breakers.

don't confuse him.....

poptart wrote:Immigrants or law-breakers.

Which is it, douche?

Machine-gun them crossing the border...taxpayer pays for the bullets.

Jail them...taxpayer pays for the 3 hots and a cot.

Deport them...taxpayer pays the bus fare.

Here's a crazy idea...why don't you just let them pick your lettuce?
Or has the racist mass-hysteria gripped you to the point were you tremble at the thought of seeing a brown-skinned
person earning a buck?

For fuck's sake...you married a moon-faced dog eater. I would've expected a deeper understanding from you.

Marty, as mvscal pointed out, illegals COST California alone 10 billion dollars a year.

And you're talking about deeper understanding?? haha

Hey, oh wise one, suppose you tell us why we need the illegals here.

Give that a shot.

poptart wrote: Hey, oh wise one, suppose you tell us why we need the illegals here.

Give that a shot.

Martyred wrote:Here's a crazy idea...why don't you just let them pick your lettuce?

...or words to that effect.

They are the Chinese coolie railroader equivalent of the leaf-blowing, fruit picking world.
You may get all bent about their illegal status, but the factory farming corporatists don't seem to have a problem.

I'll make you a deal, okay? For every illegal an agricultural corporation hires, the CEO can be incarcerated in a federal pen
for 1 year. That's "top-down" responsibility, right?


Won't happen. Never happen.
Now, I hope you have come away with a more robust appreciation of Bush's "amnesty".

Marty is spot on. If you don't want illegals, then don't let them work - don't draw up business plans that depend on them.

This reminds me of the Drug War. Don't want the cancer of illegal drugs to fester in this country? Start by NOT TAKING DRUGS.

Face it, Marty, you've got nothing.

The illegals are VERY bad for America's financial bottom line, and as such, the gov needs to halt the bullsheet.

PSU, the only way the illegals stop pouring in is for the gov to say NO to it.

The PEOPLE overwhelmingly oppose the invasion.

The PEOPLE overwhelmingly oppose the invasion.

The first thing the people should do is tell it to the employers. If there are no job opportunities, then illegals will not come.

They aren’t all lettuce-pickers, BTW. I know that in this area, a lot of the drywall being hung is now being hung by Mexicans. Don’t know how many are illegal, but I do know that they will work for a lot less than journeymen in this area were being paid. They don’t expect to get health benefits, because that’s what the emergency rooms are for.

Yeah, I am in favor of deporting every last illegal. Once that is done, if we need some new lettuce-pickers and none of our legal residents are willing to take the jobs, then we start issuing green cards.

Martyred wrote:
Machine-gun them crossing the border...taxpayer pays for the bullets.

Jail them...taxpayer pays for the 3 hots and a cot.

Deport them...taxpayer pays the bus fare.

why would we shoot, jail, or deport legal immigrants so long as they abide by the law?

why are you confusing immigrants with illegals.....

Felix wrote:jeezus Terry, do you reside in hooterville.......

Where I live, "Hispanic" generally means Puerto Rican, not Mexican.

That's a completely different set of issues, of course. There's not much common ground between the two other than the language.

Felix wrote:
why are you confusing immigrants with illegals.....

Me?

That's a line that your reactionary media gleefully blurs every day.

Cuda wrote:If there were only 12 million of the bastards, we wouldn't be pressing 1-for-English on the fucking telephone all the goddam time;

Worse than 1-for-English is the fact that after you do that, you wind up connected to a call center in fucking India where they can't even speak English.

Terry in Crapchester wrote:...a call center in fucking India...

Phibes with free market diatribe in 3...2...1...

poptart wrote:

RadioFan wrote:

OCmike wrote:The problem is that they're bringing their uneducated families HERE and dragging down our infrastructure, overloading our highways and filling up our emergency rooms with cases of the sniffles because they have no insurance. While I don't begrudge someone trying to make a better life for themselves or their family, I *do* begrudge them that when it's at the expense of me, my quality of life and that of *my* family.

Hey this argument sounds familiar.

Sincerely,

The Irish.
The Italians.
The Jews.
The Chinese.

Those people didn't break into the country.

That argument is bullshit, as I've said before. That's like saying marijuana wasn't bad until it was made illegal in the 1930s. Therefore, "Well, lawbreakers are lawbreakers." :roll:

Allowing in only 100,000 or so people into this country each year legally is a joke. Change that as part of the solution. Oh, and reform ICE from the top down.

poptart wrote:Also, the RATE at which they came into the country was a piss-dribble compared to the rate southern ILLEGALs are flooding in.

We need serious talks with Mexico, as the reasons for this are complex. It's like PSUFAN said, it's analogous to the "drug war." We deal with other governments in trying to solve that problem, but we seem to go it alone on this one. Doesn't make sense. Nor does it make any sense that no one in talk radio or in politics seems to be bringing this up, starting with the President.

poptart wrote:Finally, those groups, for the most part, WANTED to assimilate to American society.
The illegal wetties, for the most part, don't see it that way at all.

Totally disagree. The vast majority of folks who come here just want a better life. Nobody is trying to bribe police officers and judges, because everybody knows that shit, for the most part, doesn't fly here. And if they're hanging on to bits of their culture, who the fuck cares? To me, it makes the country richer with a little variety -- given it's our nature as Americans. Oktoberfest? I'll eat some brats. St. Pats? I'll find my green. A Greek celebration? Pass the Ouzo. Cinco de Mayo? Hand me a Dos Equis dark and let's Cumbia (even though that is from Columbia).

Allowing in only 100,000 or so people into this country each year legally is a joke

Why?


How about bilingual horseshit in the public schools?
Not one red cent of my tax money ought to be going to pay for that trash.
It's a total joke.

Again, mvscal pointed to the financial disaster the illegal invasion is for our country.

I guess that is a-ok with you so long as we have more di-v eeeeee r-sity, and you can tune in a beaner station on the a.m. dial if the mood strikes ya.

Liberalism definitely IS a mental disorder.

RadioFan wrote: Totally disagree. The vast majority of folks who come here just want a better life. And if they're hanging on to bits of their culture, who the fuck cares?

You apparently haven't visited too many small central california towns lately. Hard to tell if you're in Mexico or The US. It's not "bits of their culture" anymore. Hell, some Mexicans in LA took down the US flag from a post office and replaced it with a mexican one. Don't tell me "Bits"

To me, it makes the country richer with a little variety -- given it's our nature as Americans. Oktoberfest? I'll eat some brats. St. Pats? I'll find my green. A Greek celebration? Pass the Ouzo. Cinco de Mayo? Hand me a Dos Equis dark and let's Cumbia (even though that is from Columbia).

Mexicans aren't here for a fucking holiday.

Will you drive down the street with mexican flags waving off your car, never learn to speak English, never try to learn it, and insulate yourself in a community that mirrors your life in Mexico as if you aren't even in the United States?

Mister Bushice wrote:

RadioFan wrote: You apparently haven't visited too many small central california towns lately. Hard to tell if you're in Mexico or The US. It's not "bits of their culture" anymore. Hell, some Mexicans in LA took down the US flag from a post office and replaced it with a mexican one. Don't tell me "Bits"

What is it with you California fucktards?

Too many Paris Hylton sightings? Too much dope or is it whine?

Jesus, Bushice, you sound like Cuda.

Mister Bushice wrote:Will you drive down the street with mexican flags waving off your car, never learn to speak English, never try to learn it, and insulate yourself in a community that mirrors your life in Mexico as if you aren't even in the United States?

Sounds like ICE to me.

Their efficiency is only matched by Mexico's bureaucracy. Thanks, W. :huge thumbs up:

Since we're talking about illegal immigration, in this particular thread, let's address the federal "agency" that is ICE, shall we?

Or is that a taboo subject from the "reply" button?


Think about it, morons.

They keep keep LEGAL folks in jail for a WEEK, in Tulsa, Okla., but can't deport criminals.

Hello?

RadioFan wrote:

Mister Bushice wrote:

RadioFan wrote: You apparently haven't visited too many small central california towns lately. Hard to tell if you're in Mexico or The US. It's not "bits of their culture" anymore. Hell, some Mexicans in LA took down the US flag from a post office and replaced it with a mexican one. Don't tell me "Bits"

What is it with you California fucktards?

Too many Paris Hylton sightings? Too much dope or is it whine?

What? You think I'm making shit up? Seriously, there are many, many towns in cencal where nary an english store sign is in sight. And few speak English.

And the flag story? Check it out:

http://michellemalkin.com/2006/08/28/ho ... st-office/

It's one thing welcoming other cultures, but replacing the one here with the one you left? Sorry. Sell crazy somewhere else.

Mister Bushice wrote:What? You think I'm making shit up?

Pretty much, yes.

You have absolutely no personal experience with anyone who is illegal, nor anyone who is legal -- but has a green card -- for that matter.

Which pretty much puts you in the mvscal category of ignorant fucktard when it comes to the "aliens" argument.

California's fucked up legal system has nothing to do with national politics, when it comes to this issue nor anything else for that matter, outside of warping this NONissue.

Lie in your beds or get the fuck out.
Or better yet, elect better LOCAL politicians so you idiots don't whine as much.

Bbbbbut, I don't speak Spanish and I find their culture strange and hurtful.



Get a grip, Will.

And yes, compared to the "War on Terror," this whole "issue" is like a "piss squirt in the ocean."

RF, why should California pay 10 billion dollars a year for the privilege of having illegals in the state?

Of course that number will be doing nothing but going up .... WAY up, as the illegals continue to procreate, .... and the taxpayers continue to educate and provide hospital care (among other things) for lawbreakers.

Let's hear some compelling reasons why the state should absorb such an obscene financial hit.

Surely you must have something to offer.


GO ..........

poptart wrote:

Allowing in only 100,000 or so people into this country each year legally is a joke

Why?

Here's why.

Sunday's events included several speakers that met privately before a rally for strategic planning to discuss concerns for the welfare of undocumented families.

Among those attending was a 20-year-old nursing major at Tulsa Community College.

He was born in Mexico but graduated from Union High School. He has lived illegally in the U.S. for more than 17 years, he said.

Though he does not have the legal documents to be a citizen, he said he considers himself an American.

"You live here so long that you feel like you are a part of this country," said the man, who asked that his name not be used.

One thing that keeps him from living the typical life of a citizen is not being able to obtain a driver's license, he said.

"I don't smoke. I don't drink. I don't have a criminal record," he said.

Without a license, it is hard for him to get a job and he is not able to receive scholarships for school, he said.

"One of the hardest things for me to see is people that do have papers but don't graduate," he said.

The government should be more willing to give citizenship to immigrants who earn it, he said.

"It's not just me that is in this situation. I have friends and family that are trying to go to school and to college," he said.

"They are just good, honest, hard-working people that are trying to make a life for themselves."

Yeah, a BIG threat to this country, both economically and obviously, in a terroristic way. Quick, someboby PM RackFu.

Jesus.

poptart wrote:RF, why should California pay 10 billion dollars a year for the privilege of having illegals in the state?

If your problem is with California, have them elect politicians who will deal with the problem. Texas has a lot of illegals as well, but they don't pay for them to the extent California does.

BTW, pop, you don't live in California, do you? So why do you care?

Are you for real?

Hey, Texas is getting hosed too.
The whole southwest is, and it's moving northward.
At any rate, if California is taking it up the @ss it's bad for the WHOLE country.
There is NO positive to it.

You're passing the buck with your answer to my question.
Don't tell me who to vote for, tell me why YOU think the flood of illegals is beneficial to us.

As for the 20 yr old illegal nursing major, as soon as he graduates and starts his nursing career he ought to have 40% of his paycheck stripped until he pays back about $60,000 in free public education the TAXPAYERS provided him with.

Instead, after breaking the law by coming in to the country illegally, and getting a complete educational free ride, he has the nerve to carry on about his misfortune.

Too funny.

If he came in illegally, he needs to get the hell out, pronto.

RF, like many others, are stuck in an idealistic "wouldn't it be nice" world where everyone gets to live the American dream. Guess what, it doesn't work like that. Some of us get to live in SoCal, while others are destined to a life of back-breaking labor. It's called the birth lottery. Some win, some lose.

poptart wrote:As for the 20 yr old illegal nursing major, as soon as he graduates and starts his nursing career he ought to have 40% of his paycheck stripped until he pays back about $60,000 in free public education the TAXPAYERS provided him with.

Just 40%???

How does he get off so easy?

sin

American taxpayers

RadioFan wrote:

Mister Bushice wrote:What? You think I'm making shit up?

Pretty much, yes.

You have absolutely no personal experience with anyone who is illegal, nor anyone who is legal -- but has a green card -- for that matter.

And you know this how? This is a completely ignorant statement based on nothing, and also completely untrue.

My wife and I legally adopted an infant 5 years ago from the philippines. He's six years old now. He's still over there. The government won't let him come here, because we have to live with him for 2 consecutive years in order for him to qualify for a visa, despite the fact we have over 5 years of correspondence, financial support information, and have made yearly documented visits to see him. The Phillipino government gave the OK 5 years ago. Homeland security rejected it. So in order to live with us, he has to be here, but he can't come here without a visa, which they won't give him until he lives with us.

So don't shovel your ignorant shit my way.

California's fucked up legal system has nothing to do with national politics, when it comes to this issue nor anything else for that matter, outside of warping this NONissue.

Pull your head out of your ass. This isn't a states issue. It is a national one. The only reason California and Texas are so adversely affected now is because the illegal fuckers can walk, crawl and swim here directly.

But don't worry. Things will continue in this direction for some time. It is a silent invasion heading your way.

Lie in your beds or get the fuck out.
Or better yet, elect better LOCAL politicians so you idiots don't whine as much.

Oh? Try telling the Mexican majority in this state not to vote their own people into office, or the Mexican majorities on the city councils and school boards who vote to have us pay for bilingual documents of everything generated by any governmental agency.

The Mayor of Los Angeles out front should have told ya. He used to be a member of a radical group that supported illegals.