T1B

C'mon, citing Danny Gatton only makes my point--as an example of a real musician mastering the guitar as opposed to a Shred Boy geek fest of "Look, now I'm Jimi...now I'm playing 'bullitt blues'...and now I'm playing 'country'" etc. You apparently don't understand the difference. Okay...one last time. Consider how Shred Boy basically has all the chops of Danny Gatton. Not McLaughlin of course, but we'll allow that he could handle any of Gatton's technical requirements. Now...listen how Gatton actually plays music in this blues solo--notice how he actually structures it to peak right at the 4:00 mark, and mostly notice how it actually has continuity and real feeling. (same with Campalongo)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iYaPRMxusZ0

Now, try to find a single example of Shred Boy actually building a melody. You can't because he doesn't think or play in that fashion. He's a "musician" only in the strictest sense of the word. And that's why now--after all that woodshedding and jamming with his trusty drum machine--there's only six people listening to his karaoke act. Don't you wonder why such a chops-meister should be so completely boring--if slightly interesting at best?

As for the orca who said No More to being used as a six-ton clown, I propose that it be put in a special pool for special performances. You know, like having Bernie Madoff wearing a pink bikini trying to swim from one side of the pool to the other. Pay-per-view would raise millions for Haiti relief, etc.

Jsc810 wrote:None of these guys have 1/10 of the musical talent that Alex, Geddy, and Neil do.

RRACK

Sorry, S-Mich, but the Games are over, Canada's excuse for music is properly remanded to Joni Mitchell singing like an old lady and Neil Young looking like an old man. Rush--and the people who listen to Rush--don't actually exist. Sure, you're thinking "I like Rush, and I'm here in the present reality of what we reckon as '2010' and...yeah...I'm here.." But this is but a mirage brought on by lack of Blues in your spiritual diet. You see, just as the starving child in Somalia can't be expected to discuss Sondheim, so a Rush fan can't be expected to function in any capacity that isn't ridiculous at best.


I will choose a path that's clear
I will choose freewill

There are those who think
That they were dealt a losing hand
The cards were stacked against them
They weren't born in Lotusland



More cowbell!

Nick, so let me see if I have this straight...

When I mention someone I like, it somehow proves your point, even though I'm the one who mentioned him, and I'm the one who likes both players.

Hookay.

Next, when I compare your tuneless, soulless, robotic, monochromatic droning clip of McLaughlin to something which lives and breathes with humor, dynamics and melodic content from someone who has even more technical ability to boot, you somehow call it karaoke...even when he's playing original songs, not just pointless jams.

As for GG only being liked by me? Well, unless McLaughlin decides to get Mahavishnu back together again, he's confined to riding the coattails of Chick Corea or Al Di Meola if he ever wants to play before any sort of a decent-sized audience. He's not going to outdraw or out-sell GG at this point. GG could easily go on a G3 Tour (he's been asked, multiple times), at which point he'll be playing before much larger crowds than McLaughlin ever will anymore.

Moreover, many of the biggest names in the guitar world are lavishing praise on the guy. He was voted Best All Around Guitarist on bleedin' Earth by the most popular guitar magazines on the planet, and he's got the backing of quite a few heavyweights throughout the industry.

You may just want to educate yourself a little, since being educated about something is the main thing you seem to always want to boast about, and you clearly don't know jack about GG. You're clearly still working under the delusion that his little clips for a backing-track video company are all he does.

The irony in all this is that both McLaughlin and GG are the same player to 99% of the music-listening world. To those retards, they're both just mindless, shredding wankers. One of 'em looks like a hippy and he plays wild, inaccessible stuff, while the other looks like a British antique car-club member, and he plays equally inaccessible stuff which sounds like bees in a jar.

How did a story about killer whales turn into a Rush thread?

Oh well...I ain't complaining!



"...don't put him down as arrogant..."

LTS TRN 2 wrote: Rush--and the people who listen to Rush--don't actually exist.

You fucking tard.

A 3 man band producing that sound, with the lead singer singing,playing the bass with one hand and keyboards with the other probably don't have any following.

Your stupidity knows knows no limitations. Fuck off and die.

derron wrote:playing the bass with one hand and keyboards with the other

He doesn't actually do that, Derron. He uses pedals.

Jsc810 wrote:None of these guys have 1/10 of the musical talent that Alex, Geddy, and Neil do.

I can assure that where the likes of John McLaughlin and GG are concerned, Alex, Geddy and Neil would tell you you're an idiot. They know better than that. The day you see Alex Lifeson claim to be better than John McLaughlin (even in private...even in his sleep) is the day Les Miles wins a spelling bee.

Rush is a good, solid band. Neil Peart is great, but not world-class great. Geddy is Geddy. He's a good enough bass player, but he's never going to scare anyone except by looking at them or singing to them. Lifeson reads lots of books while owning a fuckload of expensive guitars and whole studios of guitar FX toys.

These guys aren't even in the same universe as John McLaughlin or GG, and they'd be the first ones to tell you so.

Van wrote:I can assure that...

I can't wait for the day when you trick some poor woman into dating you, so you disappear from this board and my eyes can get a rest from your inane, high-school, 12-sided dice guitar jibberish.

a Rush fan can't be expected to function in any capacity that isn't ridiculous at best

heh heh

Van wrote:

Jsc810 wrote:None of these guys have 1/10 of the musical talent that Alex, Geddy, and Neil do.

I can assure that where the likes of John McLaughlin and GG are concerned, Alex, Geddy and Neil would tell you you're an idiot. They know better than that. The day you see Alex Lifeson claim to be better than John McLaughlin (even in private...even in his sleep) is the day Les Miles wins a spelling bee.

Rush is a good, solid band. Neil Peart is great, but not world-class great. Geddy is Geddy. He's a good enough bass player, but he's never going to scare anyone except by looking at them or singing to them. Lifeson reads lots of books while owning a fuckload of expensive guitars and whole studios of guitar FX toys.

These guys aren't even in the same universe as John McLaughlin or GG, and they'd be the first ones to tell you so.

neeeeguh please.

perhaps alex can not out shred GG or mac, but, if you look at the entire package (save your irie resets) alex is a fukking god. dude is in the top 5 in my book, of geeetar heros if you use his body of work as part of your yard stick.

his shredding here ain't too bad and his musicality and tone are as good as anyone's. and that gibson is fukking shweet.



and geddy is "good enough"? pfffftttttt. he is right there at the top of the bass player world. maybe a half step behind john paul jones.

as for neil, i have always been a huge fan and thought he was the end all be all of rock drummers until drummer (where the fukk has be been?) pointed out that neil, while technically very gifted, swung like a rusty gate. i had to agree with him and my ranking of neil has diminished a bit as a result.

as for your thing with mac, van, i don't agree. i do agree though that he's pretty damn good when he's got al and paco to play along with.



i do see what you mean about the bumblebee in a jar thing though. I guess he is best here when he's playing rhythm while paco and al attempt to make their guitars burst into flames.

of course if you want real rhythm playing, there's your girl fliend.....



"crazy shit".

smackie, as much as I love JPJ, he's not even on the totem pole of the world's greatest bassists, nor is Geddy. Neither of them are even in the discussion, unless the discussion centers someone's favorite players - not best, but favorite. Same goes for Lifeson. Nice player. Competent. He's in a good band, and he's got nine million bucks worth of FX helping him to sound the way he does, but no, he's not even close to Top 5...or Top 55. He's just someone you like, and that's fine.

As for my thing with McLaughlin with which you don't agree, what thing would that be? I've said a lot of things about him, and other than for his plinkity-plinking tone, his disdain for melody, his utter contempt for phrasing or dynamics of any kind and his horrible misuse of the whammy bar I've said almost nothing but good things about him. He's a serious badass when he plays flamenco, where he's forced to play melodically. If you want to talk about the greatest players in the world, he's at least someone who can be in the discussion. That's about the best thing one can say about a player, innit?

i guess "great guitar player" to me means more than just "player". i figure creative ability into the package. this is why i consider guys like page and lifeson right at the top. and of course there's SRV who, to my ear is in a class by himself as he has creative ability out the ass, ridiculous chops and tone that god himself wishes he could replicate.

of course, they all pale to you know who.......



he puts them all on ice.

Well, I'm with you there, since SRV is my favorite player. Obviously he's not John McLaughlin, Paco, Di Meola, Steve Morse, Vai or GG, but so what?

That's a different topic, though, especially once you begin comparing makers of instrumental music with makers of conventional, vocals-based songs.

LTS TRN 2 wrote:a Rush fan can't be expected to function in any capacity that isn't ridiculous at best.

Ok, that's funny.

I like Rush, but I don't understand the need to compare a rock band to standalone jazz guitarists. Apples and oranges. No, Rush are not world class instrumentalists, but who cares? It's rock and roll, not serious wankery. Action flick, not a drama. Totally different things.

Van wrote:Nick, so let me see if I have this straight...

When I mention someone I like, it somehow proves your point, even though I'm the one who mentioned him, and I'm the one who likes both players.

Hookay.

Next, when I compare your tuneless, soulless, robotic, monochromatic droning clip of McLaughlin to something which lives and breathes with humor, dynamics and melodic content from someone who has even more technical ability to boot, you somehow call it karaoke...even when he's playing original songs, not just pointless jams.

As for GG only being liked by me? Well, unless McLaughlin decides to get Mahavishnu back together again, he's confined to riding the coattails of Chick Corea or Al Di Meola if he ever wants to play before any sort of a decent-sized audience. He's not going to outdraw or out-sell GG at this point. GG could easily go on a G3 Tour (he's been asked, multiple times), at which point he'll be playing before much larger crowds than McLaughlin ever will anymore.

Moreover, many of the biggest names in the guitar world are lavishing praise on the guy. He was voted Best All Around Guitarist on bleedin' Earth by the most popular guitar magazines on the planet, and he's got the backing of quite a few heavyweights throughout the industry.

You may just want to educate yourself a little, since being educated about something is the main thing you seem to always want to boast about, and you clearly don't know jack about GG. You're clearly still working under the delusion that his little clips for a backing-track video company are all he does.

The irony in all this is that both McLaughlin and GG are the same player to 99% of the music-listening world. To those retards, they're both just mindless, shredding wankers. One of 'em looks like a hippy and he plays wild, inaccessible stuff, while the other looks like a British antique car-club member, and he plays equally inaccessible stuff which sounds like bees in a jar.

Bullshit, Van.. I address your examples directly and pose several examples of my own, NONE of which you have dealt with. For example, despite your opinion on the Mclaughlin solo, you fail to explain why the large audience is loving it--and why the great musicians like Corea are loving it. You seem to forget that McLAughlin was given full God treatment at the Crossroads Festival--and needless to say the only way Shred Boy was getting in was buying a ticket.

Moreover, you have failed to provide a single example of Shred Boy actually playing a real song--not just a shred progression from his drum machine sessions. Where is an actual melody he builds (like the examples I provided) as opposed to jizzing all over the place for three minutes straight. Seriously--where is ANY example of any kind of real music from Shred Boy? Any style--jazz, rock, blues? And further, I asked you to provide the name of ANY prominent musician who props Shred Boy as you do. Who?

Is this some kind of one man circle jerk for you? Do you ACTUALLY listen to Shred Boy? I don't believe it...though....now that I think about it...you probably do!

Nick, I posted two of his full-length, original songs. "Wonderful Slippery Thing" is a normal song, with melody, a bridge, a chorus, etc.

I can't help it if you're choosing to skip them.

As for your other points, christ, how simple are you? Of course the guys McLaughlin played with in that clip appreciated having him up there. They would've also appreciated having GG or Di Meola up there. They were having fun playing their music. They would've totally gotten off on what GG would've played there, and he would've been note-perfect, no problem.

Meanwhile, you completely glossed over what I did with that clip. I went through every second of it. You've not only not done the same thing with the GG clips, you haven't even watched them, yet you still talk out of your ass about 'karaoke'.

You also attempted to appropriate Danny Gatton!

That's called 'spin' Nick, and it's what you do when you can't win. You move the goalpost and change the topic.

Face it, as good as McLaughlin is, and he's absolutely one of the very best to ever walk the planet, GG is now just as good and maybe even better. McLaughlin is also sixty-eight, so he really doesn't have too much left to say, while GG has only recently come to the public's attention. He's still got his whole career ahead of him, and he's already ahead of McLaughlin in a number of areas.

Speaking of McLaughlin, does he still regularly tour? If he does, I'd love to catch him live some time before he retires or dies. Do you know whether he makes it to NoCal much anymore?

Yeah, the Slippery Thing is a blazing homage to jazz fusion whatever, but tedious--would you really want to listen to it again? To learn it? The whole point is that he's got absolutely no soul. You seem to ignore this fact. It's amusing to consider the what if scenario if somehow Shred Boy could walk into a 1967 British blues club and have all the fellows check him out. But believe it or not, each of the greats--Page and Beck...Clapton...and Jimi...would recognize him as the world's greatest guitar groupie wannabe. They'd chuckle with mild amazement.

Think of this way: Shred Boy is the the pelican and McLaughlin/Gatton/Campilongo is the orca.....Geddy Lee is the ponytailed trainer...and the 1100 Tea Baggers who paid to see Palin are literally the ones calling for Hebraic Sharia in the USA!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52o5yV6G7tY

If you can listen to the opening of Slippery Wet Thing, as funky as it is, and say that it has no soul, well, you're pretty much hopeless.

GG stepping into a time machine and walking into a blues club in '67...with the skills he has now? He'd be so far above their heads that they wouldn't even know what to make of him, other than that they'd dig his look. They'd elect him God, right there on the spot.

Your inane logic seems to know no bounds. Do you really suppose the Brits were enthralled with Robert Johnson's chops? Or Howling Wolf's triple whammy tap-solo? Of course not. Only tiny dick guitar geeks go gaga for hyper-riffage jizz fests.

What part of music don't you understand?

Think of it this way....

Shred Boy is highly intelligent and highly trained...like a dolphin in a Marine World show. And he dutifully performs his amazing tricks and the kids go "OOoooohh!" and he's given a fish.

McLaughlin/Gatton/Campilongo are represented by orcas in the wild...diving deep, actually living in the sea.

Okay?....now hurry along because Shred Boy is going "AK AK AK AK AK" as he goes up on his tail...look, he's smiling!

They liked McLaughlin back then, didn't they? They sure as hell would've also liked GG then too, especially Hendrix and Jeff Beck.

Still, hell, you're posting with a modicum of good humor right now, so even if you are more blind than a syphilitic Stevie Wonder, go on with your bad self.