T1B

88 wrote:

Felix wrote:an AR-15 (like the ones used in the last few massacres) was designed for one purpose, and that's to kill human beings....

anybody that would argue that point is a fucking imbecile, or an NRA shill

Mine was specifically designed for the national rifle match course. It has a two-stage trigger, a match barrel with a twist-rate designed for accuracy at long distances, match sites, a free-floating front hand guard, which prevents deflection of the barrel when in the prone position, and other changes designed to improve its accuracy. Yes, you could kill someone with it. But it wasn't designed for that purpose. In that sense, it is very much like an automobile. If used improperly, it is very dangerous. But if it is used as intended, no one gets hurt and great fun is had by all.

the m-1 garand was originally designed as a military weapon....

Felix wrote:the m-1 garand was originally designed as a military weapon....

So was the Brown Bess. What's your point?

mvscal wrote: So don't bother trying? Is that your "take"? Needless to say, you're simply talking straight out of your ass.

if you haven't wounded or killed somebody intent on doing you harm in 3 shots that's about all the time you're going to have....

I guess you had better notify every organized military, militia and para-military group on planet earth, you fucking braindead simpleton.

I didn't say they weren't effective weapons, but as a self defense weapon for a civilian, they're useless.....

It makes a great varmint rifle, though. And, of course, you can take a deer with a .223. What makes you think something that is so deadly to 180 pound human being can't take a 150 lbs deer?

obviously you're not a hunter because if you were you'd know that unless you execute a kill shot on a deer with something as light as a .223 round, they tend to take off and run.....usually for a couple of miles before the loss of blood finally does them in....but if you want to chase a deer for a couple of miles over mountainous terrain, knock yourself out.....oh don't forget you've got to gut it and quarter the carcass and drag it back over those miles of mountainous terrain you just crossed chasing it down....like I said, no hunters I know would use a gun like that for hunting deer....and I worked in a gun store for 10 years bud-4 years in the blacksmithing shop and 6 years on the sales floor.....I've worked on, shot and sold a wider variety of guns than you've ever been exposed to....

So? Has the world suddenly run out of people who need to be killed?

the AR-15 is a very effective weapon for military use.....

but I'll ask again:

why does a civilian need a gun like an AR-15 with 30 round magazines (or 3 ten round magazines)

88 wrote:
I though we were talking AR-15's.

we were, I just referenced the M-1 because of an earlier post you made.....but the same thing applies to an AR-15-it too was originally designed as a military weapon....

But since you mentioned the M1 Garand, I own three of them. They do not use a detachable box magazine. And I cannot recall the last time one was used in the commission of a crime. Mine are maintained within military specifications, so they can be used in sanctioned Garand matches.

the M-1 is probably the best military rifle ever built...the M-1 is not an assault rifle-sorry for the confusion

Felix wrote:sorry for the confusion

I think you should make this your sig.

88 wrote: I think you might be channeling Gen. George S. Patton, who called the M1 Garand "the greatest battle implement ever devised."

the longevity of the m-1 is a testament to just how good of a design it was....
I've shot various incarnations of the M-1 (including the M-1D from about 600 yards) and it's a great rifle, very accurate...

Felix wrote:
I didn't say they weren't effective weapons, but as a self defense weapon for a civilian, they're useless.....

Really ? So if a soldier is in the field facing a threat and he has an AR platform they are effective?? But if a civilian is in the same or similar situation facing a threat, and the only weapon he has in his hands is a .223 AR platform, it is useless ?? That is quite possibly the most stupid thing I have ever read in this cesspool of lies and bullshit. I would feel very comfortable defending myself with a .223 AR platform. Set yourself up against some one with a AR and see how useless they are against your ass...

obviously you're not a hunter because if you were you'd know that unless you execute a kill shot on a deer with something as light as a .223 round

A good hunter gets a kill shot in the first shot or he does not take the shot. In Oregon, .243 is the smallest caliber you can use for big game hunting by law. And I will agree, I want a heavier round than the .223 for deer hunting. But I saw a 800 pound buffalo dropped in its tracks with one well placed shot with a .223 from about 110 yards.

they tend to take off and run.....usually for a couple of miles before the loss of blood finally does them in....but if you want to chase a deer for a couple of miles over mountainous terrain, knock yourself out.....oh don't forget you've got to gut it and quarter the carcass and drag it back over those miles of mountainous terrain you just crossed chasing it down....like I said, no hunters I know would use a gun like that for hunting deer....and I worked in a gun store for 10 years bud-4 years in the blacksmithing shop and 6 years on the sales floor.....I've worked on, shot and sold a wider variety of guns than you've ever been exposed to....

Your point ?

Felix wrote:
but I'll ask again:

why does a civilian need a gun like an AR-15 with 30 round magazines (or 3 ten round magazines)

It's because it looks so cool.

You can dress up in cammies (helmet optional) and imagine that you're a real soldier, and feel really bad-ass while defending your constitutional rights against Bambi and other liberals.

Felix lives in mule deer country, Scott - 'bout twice the size of our whitetails. I would imagine quartering those animals to be fairly SOP.

KC Scott wrote:
When you say you worked in the "blacksmithing shop" at the gun store - what did you do?

Wondered about that too...my father who was a aerospace machinist by trade and my son, 5 years as a Marine Corps armorer, and currently working building custom tactical weapons, both of them always said it was a "machine shop".

Where is Todd when we need him ?

KC Scott wrote:When you say you worked in the "blacksmithing shop" at the gun store - what did you do?

And we thought Goober was old...

KC Scott wrote:
I've shot more deer than I can count - all with either a .270 or .30-06
3 dropped on spot - I had to track the rest

well I noticed there wasn't a .223 mentioned there......a .270 is big enough to drop anything on the north american continent, but I wouldn't suggest hunting a bear with it....30.06 or a .308 is the preferred weapon by most.....a .243, a .280 a .308 or a .338 are also fine choices

We would hang the deer once we got them back to camp before / after we took them to check in - if that's what you're referring to

no, I'm talking about shooting a deer, having it take off on you and you tracking it down to gut it....leave a deer hanging around here and it likely won't be there tomorrow so it's best you haul it back to your camp.....

When you say you worked in the "gunsmithing shop" at the gun store - what did you do?

gun smithing shop....I disassembled rifles, cleaned them for rebluing, learned to build guns from the ground up (I built a .357 caliber rifle which I still own)....helped the main gunsmith construct .50 cal blackpowder rifles as he was the president of the Idahy long rifles association and constructed custom made black powder guns for hundreds of people in the state....I've disassembled almost every conceivable mainstream caliber rifle....I've shot every major caliber of hunting rifle and still think the 30.06 springfield is the most versatile round made....I've shot big bore rifles including the .458 and .460. I've shot the Barrett 50 cal sniper rifle....there have been so many exotics introduced since I quit working there, but I still attend gun shows and stay in touch with people I worked with there.....

I've owned a Sako 85 chambered for a .270 and a Mannlicher Schonar Model 52, a Weatherby Vanguard chambered for for a .300 mag, and a Winchester Model 70....

I'm not a hunter, but those guns were such great deals, I bought them for trading purpose....that's how I acquired my Kimber Ultra Carry and my Baretta 92fs...I'm working on a deal to acquire a Ruger Super Black Hawk.....

KC Scott wrote:
If not, What, if anything have you hunted?

Hunted snipe on a few occasions, no doubt.

http://www.feinstein.senate.gov/public/ ... lt-weapons
I think I love this chick. Is she hot? Probably not, but at least she has some common sense.
Unfortunately, the NRA kooks will rip this to shreds, and we will end up with some watered down
version comparable to what we had 94-04.

Lol, the M-1 isn't an assault rifle?!? I don't know what planet you're living on, but in every respect that rifle could probably be considered the granddaddy of assault rifles unless you threw in the Sharps Repeater for nostalgia's sake. :grin:

The latest technology in a salt rifle.

Diane is just attempting to take another step in complete firearms bans.

Any single characteristic test is a non starter.

KC Scott wrote: I was asking what you meant when you said quartering it

gutting it, cutting it up into 4 manageable sized pieces....as was said, the predominant deer in this area is a mule deer, and it's necessary to cut it into quarter size sections in order to pack it out....unless your hunting with horses

Have you ever hunted deer?

If not, What, if anything have you hunted?

I hunted deer back in the day, but quit about 25 years ago....
the only time I hunt now is for elk and my buddy and I pack in with horses and and a mule....haven't been in two years though.....I've been on bear hunts, but gave that up after I saw a bear skinned....looks too much like a human....I've tracked mountain lions, but only for photographing....I've accompanied a couple of guys on some trips for Dahl sheep, and mountain goats but never shot one.....but other than an occasional elk, I don't hunt anymore

nothing against it and I recognize it's a necessity especially after seeing an over populated deer count and watching deer die of starvation.....

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/12 ... s-say?lite

Birds today, people tomorrow. Might as well get the jump on this and start banning vehicles with excess horsepower, more than the two gears needed for conveyance: Slow and Park, extra seating capacity, and sporting black plastic fenders. And don't laugh at the notion, Lefties, this past week in China some guy drove his car laden with explosives into a crowd of people, only it didn't go off.

Guns = vehicles = indiscriminate death

Roach wrote:Hey Felix, nice to hear about your firearms experience and knowledge.

what's interesting is that never once did I say any guns should be banned....and Derron took the bait hook line and sinker....Scott's original question is what constitutes an assault weapon....I offered my opinion on what the feds might consider and assault weapon and the next thing I'm assailed by idiots like Derron naturally assuming that I want to ban guns....

I don't see much point in civilians owning military style weapons, but at the same time I know how much fun they are to shoot.....I think they should be regulated to higher extent, but that's not going to stop somebody hellbent on inflicting damage to the unsuspecting public

I own five handguns right now, and have a concealed carry permit...I own a couple of shotguns, but haven't taken them out for years....the only usable rifle I own right now is a Winchester model 94 lever action....

Felix wrote:I don't see much point in civilians owning military style weapons, but at the same time I know how much fun they are to shoot.....I think they should be regulated to higher extent, but that's not going to stop somebody hellbent on inflicting damage to the unsuspecting public.

Could you define higher extent?

If it doesn't stop nut-jobs, what is the point?

smackaholic wrote:

Felix wrote:I don't see much point in civilians owning military style weapons, but at the same time I know how much fun they are to shoot.....I think they should be regulated to higher extent, but that's not going to stop somebody hellbent on inflicting damage to the unsuspecting public.

Could you define higher extent?

If it doesn't stop nut-jobs, what is the point?

What if it stopped half the nut-jobs?
One out of four nut-jobs?

Would it only be worthwhile if it stopped every nut-job?

Banning very single "assault rifle" or "mega clip" will not stop one fukking idiot out there. It may limit their choices of weapon, but, so fukking what?

In an earlier post I posited a theme that vehicles should be considered deadly assault weapons and banned. I offer more evidence to this idea:

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/12/27/po ... =obnetwork

" A central Pennsylvania man is charged with suffocating his 17-year-old girlfriend after injuring her by intentionally driving into a guardrail at about 100 miles per hour in the middle of the night."

C'mon, Lefties, where's the outcry about the violence being visited upon us by deadly assault vehicles?

Rooster wrote:...Lefties...

I think you mean "liberals".

The "lefties" I know have absolutely no objection to firearms...

Martyred wrote: The "lefties" I know have absolutely no objection to firearms...

Really? Just about every lefty I know has a problem with semi-automatic weapons -- left-handed models are hard to come by, and standard versions chuck the brass right across a lefty's face.

Most just suck it up and shoot right-handed.

Dinsdale wrote:

Martyred wrote: The "lefties" I know have absolutely no objection to firearms...

Really? Just about every lefty I know has a problem with semi-automatic weapons -- left-handed models are hard to come by, and standard versions chuck the brass right across a lefty's face.

Most just suck it up and shoot right-handed.

Cheap leftie bastards should spend @ 20 bucks for a brass deflector... :wink:

Dinsdale wrote:...every lefty I know...

You don't know any "lefties".




Oh...took a while...I gets it...

Best read on the subject in a long time. Pretty much shreds the rights-grabbers arguments with facts and data, not wild speculation.

http://larrycorreia.wordpress.com/2012/ ... n-control/