T1B

There are a shitload of reasons why the R&R HoF is a joke. At the heart of it is its glaring contradiction of the supposed criteria used for eligibility and induction, and its definition of "rock & roll." A more accurate name for the place would be "Pop Music Hall of Fame." I'm sure I'm not alone in believing that rap and hip-hop are not rock & roll, and that bands like Yes and ELP, who aren't members, are closer to R&R than NWA and Run DMC, who are.

The R&R HoF Powers That Be wrote:We shall consider factors such as an artist's musical influence on other artists, length and depth of career and the body of work, innovation and superiority in style and technique, but musical excellence shall be the essential qualification of induction.

Not sure what criteria are used to determine "musical excellence," and I freely confess that I don't know, or care to know, a helluva lot about rap & hip-hop. But from what I have heard, there isn't much vocal or instrumental excellence that my admittedly untrained ear has been able to discern. I have listened to a lot of punk rock, however, and while I like, for example, The Ramones, and believe they deserve to be members, I wouldn't say that vocal or instrumental prowess are abundantly evident in their music. So what, then, constitutes musical excellence?

The Hall has always had a bias against progressive rock. I'm not a huge fan of it, but certainly would say that far more "musical excellence" emanated from Steve Howe, Keith Emerson, and Carl Palmer than from Joey Ramone, Johnny Ramone, or Ice Cube.

Failure to induct The J. Geils Band is an egregious omission. They were outstanding interpreters of other people's music (First I Look at the Purse, (Ain't Nothin' But A) Houseparty, Serves You Right to Suffer, Dead Presidents, Lookin' for a Love, to name a few of their covers), as well as writing and performing many great original songs. I emphasize performing because, while their studio recordings were great, few musicians could match their live performances. Without question, they are far more worthy of induction than many artists already in the Hall.

The MC5 aren't getting much love, and it's unlikely they will be inducted anytime soon. I believe they should be in based on "musical influence on other artists." The list of bands and artists citing them as a primary influence is long and impressive, including (but by no means limited to) Alice Cooper, The New York Dolls, The Sex Pistols, The Ramones, The Clash, Mudhoney, The Dead Boys, Dead Kennedys, Henry Rollins, Jon Spencer, The Melvins, Patti Smith, Primal Scream, Richard Hell, Soundgarden, Generation X, Hüsker Dü, The Misfits, Motörhead, Queens of the Stone Age, The Vines, The White Stripes, and Joan Jett. While no artist or band should be inducted based on one song, Kick Out the Jams should almost be enough on its own to get them inducted.

Carry on...

^^^^^^^^^

I pretty much agree with all of that.

I've never been a fan of "grunge" but I can see where some of the bands have been influential.

I'm not sure why Joan Baez is on the list. Very influential as a folk singer / songwriter / activist. But Rock and Roll? Her biggest "hit" was written by Robbie Robertson.

Mikey wrote:I'm not sure why Joan Baez is on the list.

I'm not sure why Laura Nyro is already in.

Smackie Chan wrote:

Mikey wrote:I'm not sure why Joan Baez is on the list.

I'm not sure why Laura Nyro is already in.

Probably as a songwriter. Her list of songs recorded by other artists is pretty impressive. Maybe not HOF material, but she had friends in high places I guess.

The Ramones are not punk. Other than that completely wack assertion, your post was mostly garbage. Tnx for playing.

To whoever says Soul and Funk aren't rock and roll, technically, you may be right, but they are both direct descendants of the Blues, so they are pretty damn close and a hell of a lot of R&R artists were huge fans of Soul and Funk. So, I really don't see a problem with someone like James Brown being in the hall. Madonna or Tupac, on the other hand.....

smackaholic wrote:To whoever says Soul and Funk aren't rock and roll, technically, you may be right, but they are both direct descendants of the Blues, so they are pretty damn close and a hell of a lot of R&R artists were huge fans of Soul and Funk. So, I really don't see a problem with someone like James Brown being in the hall. Madonna or Tupac, on the other hand.....

While I'm not advocating for Tupac's induction (as previously mentioned, I'm opposed), nor do I advocate rap/hiphop/R&B artists being in (but that genie is out of the bottle), I just wanted to point out that you're pretty ignorant.

While Madonna is nothing more than bubblegum pop, if you think someone like James Brown qualifies due to direct descent from Blues, and ties to Soul and Funk...





I'm not really a fan, just pointing out the utter ignorance you posted. Sounds like a whole buncha Blues, Funk, and Soul influence to me (and anyone else with ears).

The hip-hop stylings of the MC5, punk rock from Joe Tex, and many other of this year's nominees for the Hall will be celebrated in TuneTown this evening. There'll be a couple tunes paying tribute to this year's World Series teams. And it'll be all scary & stuff because of Halloween. You'll prolly wanna not be there.

I had practically forgotten that T1B posters were capable of 3 page thread worth (for the most part) reading. Nice work, boys.

Definitely agree that J. Giles belongs and that ELO is a no brainer as well.

Dinsdale wrote:

smackaholic wrote:To whoever says Soul and Funk aren't rock and roll, technically, you may be right, but they are both direct descendants of the Blues, so they are pretty damn close and a hell of a lot of R&R artists were huge fans of Soul and Funk. So, I really don't see a problem with someone like James Brown being in the hall. Madonna or Tupac, on the other hand.....

While I'm not advocating for Tupac's induction (as previously mentioned, I'm opposed), nor do I advocate rap/hiphop/R&B artists being in (but that genie is out of the bottle), I just wanted to point out that you're pretty ignorant.

While Madonna is nothing more than bubblegum pop, if you think someone like James Brown qualifies due to direct descent from Blues, and ties to Soul and Funk...





I'm not really a fan, just pointing out the utter ignorance you posted. Sounds like a whole buncha Blues, Funk, and Soul influence to me (and anyone else with ears).

I'm not just pretty ignorant, I am pretty much wags scale ignorant when it comes to hip-hop. And I didn't say that hip-hop didn't have ties to soul or funk. I guess what I am saying is that hip-hop is a third or fourth cousin to say Grunge, but what JB was doing in the mid 60s was a first cousin or even a brother to what the stones were doing at the time. Who the fukk do you think mick jagger was copying?

And Robert Plant thought JB was g0d.

War Wagon wrote:I had practically forgotten that T1B posters were capable of 3 page thread worth (for the most part) reading. Nice work, boys.

Thank Goobs and Jay for not fucking it up with their endless IKYABWAI shit.

Pearl Jam
MC5
Kraftwerk
Yes
Jane’s Addiction

Mikey wrote:

Smackie Chan wrote:

Mikey wrote:I'm not sure why Joan Baez is on the list.

I'm not sure why Laura Nyro is already in.

Probably as a songwriter. Her list of songs recorded by other artists is pretty impressive. Maybe not HOF material, but she had friends in high places I guess.

C'mon..she's the greatest of the Great Quartet of women who wrote and performed Big hits--defined by the simple criteria of basically everyone everywhere knowing the songs...and besides Nyro, there was Joni Mitchell (in), Carol King (in) and Carly Simon (in)...sure Kate Bush belongs in that group..

Dinsdale wrote:

Thank Goobs and Jay for not fucking it up with their endless IKYABWAI shit.

Move over "At-least-you're-not-AP"...there's a new kid in town...

:o

LTS TRN 2 wrote:
C'mon..she's the greatest of the Great Quartet of women who wrote and performed Big hits--defined by the simple criteria of basically everyone everywhere knowing the songs...and besides Nyro, there was Joni Mitchell (in), Carol King (in) and Carly Simon (in)...sure Kate Bush belongs in that group..

Not even in the same league with either Joni Mitchell or Carole King.

Sorry but that's just the way it is.

Shlomart Ben Yisrael wrote:
Move over "At-least-you're-not-AP"...there's a new kid in town...

Which, if you'll remember, I coined as well.

Damn, I'm a fucking bastion of originality around here.

Bastion?

Yes, bastion.

In this case, the word "bastion" is defined as "the word a really drunk and stoned guy uses when he meant to type 'paragon.' "

I was going to go with "font" but paragon works.

Good word.

Dinsdale wrote:"...a really drunk and stoned guy..."

:CAUTION:







^^^^^^^
She would probably be an Edmonton "6"...

Or a Missouri 12.

whoa


:|

No offense to the candanianianian.....but my mom sat on his lap in 1939.

What you got, Einstein?

Mikey wrote:

LTS TRN 2 wrote:
C'mon..she's the greatest of the Great Quartet of women who wrote and performed Big hits--defined by the simple criteria of basically everyone everywhere knowing the songs...and besides Nyro, there was Joni Mitchell (in), Carol King (in) and Carly Simon (in)...sure Kate Bush belongs in that group..

Not even in the same league with either Joni Mitchell or Carole King.

Sorry but that's just the way it is.

Have you ever considered or even questioned...how you became so blinded?...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQT0KbqcFxE

LTS TRN 2 wrote:

Mikey wrote:

LTS TRN 2 wrote:
C'mon..she's the greatest of the Great Quartet of women who wrote and performed Big hits--defined by the simple criteria of basically everyone everywhere knowing the songs...and besides Nyro, there was Joni Mitchell (in), Carol King (in) and Carly Simon (in)...sure Kate Bush belongs in that group..

Not even in the same league with either Joni Mitchell or Carole King.

Sorry but that's just the way it is.

Have you ever considered or even questioned...how you became so blinded?...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQT0KbqcFxE

No doubt she makes my mom's music HoF along with Carole King, James Taylor, Cher and Helen Reddy.

KC Scott wrote:
Pearl Jam ( Yep - they get in and deserve to get in one of the best of the Seattle grunge bands)

you had me until...


Journey (hate pop ballads.... hated them.... still feel RAGE whenever lovin touchin squeezin comes on for being on the radio every 5 minutes in '79)
Journey was really good and put on great live shows

Depeche Mode (Had a unique sound and some decent songs... I'd vote for em)

WTF Depeche Mode are you fucking serious?

The J. Geils Band (Hell No .... more pop garbage for those who think Huey Lewis and Hootie are too edgy)

speaking of not knowing what the fuck you're talking about....one of the best live bands I've ever seen....

Jeff Lynne from ELO is probably one of the best music producers working these days....ELO is a definite yes....

Felix wrote:
WTF Depeche Mode are you fucking serious?

Probably one of the best (and heaviest) shows I saw in the mid-90's. They hit harder that all these Depends rockers you guys have come up with so far.

This tour:

Depeche Mode should be in on Violator alone.

Screw_Michigan wrote:Depeche Mode should be in on Violator alone.

Screw_Michigan wrote:Depeche Mode should be in on Violator alone.

I've had two copies of that CD stolen from my collection at separate parties.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:

Screw_Michigan wrote:Depeche Mode should be in on Violator alone.

That gif would be better with a set of beats headphones wytched onto his dome.