Teacher Pay...

Laxplayer · Post by **Laxplayer** » Wed May 30, 2018 2:24 pm

Hey Slappy...wishful thinking but as people have previously said.....I knew what I was getting into so why now reap the benefits......

Lefty...I couldn't agree more with that statement, however the biggest issue with high schools, especially where I am is that they think all kids are college bound. That couldn't be further from the truth. Certain kids don't want to go to college. They want to go to work. Kids have passions in a variety of fields. Kids have talents in a variety of fields. I recently began teaching a class in college and career readiness. We go over home loans, interest rates, principle, PMI, Property taxes etc....we also go over buying vs. leasing a car, do college and career research, do a family budget....all the stuff kids need. We should also have one school in our district converted to a school where kids can learn the trades. Auto mechanics, welding, electrical work, carpentry etc.....the bigger issue is the idiots that run the district. All they care about is the graduation rate. Hell even a principal I know very well has said, we don't care what happens to them after high school. All we need to do is graduate them. I've often challenged the curriculum and methodology of our teachers who just throw a computer in front of the kids and sit their fat asses at their desks, and say....they're not going to get that in college, how are we preparing them for college. College is lecture discussion....the answer is....well we're not preparing them for college, we're trying to get them out of high school. It's a fucking joke and I'm fortunate to say that I've got around 8 years left. Many comments in this thread are correct and I'm actually ashamed to say I'm a part of the system. The bigger issue is also if you challenge the system then you have a target on your back and you'll be out of a job shortly. I've seen it happen and it's a joke. I could go on and on but yes I knew what I was getting into and my retirement is going to be profitable, however I can honestly say that I love working with kids and the impact I've made in their lives over the years.

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Wed May 30, 2018 3:18 pm

I can remember years ago when teachers were paid really shitty salaries. The only people that went into teaching did so because they really wanted to teach (probably back when Lax started out). Now we pay them a decent wage plus great benefits and we have people entering the profession to make a living wage, so we're more likely to get some shitty teachers. Maybe if we went back to paying them dirt, we'd get better, more dedicated teachers.

Laxplayer · Post by **Laxplayer** » Wed May 30, 2018 3:28 pm

If you enter the teaching profession at a young age and do it right a person can set themselves up very nicely for their future. My daughter at 24 is finishing her 2nd year of teaching. She's at a private school teaching 1st grade. She already sees the stupidity and the politics involved. She's also getting 90% of her credential/masters paid for. Once shes done she's bailing the private school for public because of the retirement.
The bigger issue I see right now is the Janus case which the supreme court is ruling on shortly. That could throw everything for a loop if it's ruled in the favor of Janus which it probably will be.
I'm just glad I'm on the tail end of my career. I love the kids but hate 95% of the adults.

Joe in PB · Post by **Joe in PB** » Wed May 30, 2018 3:48 pm

Laxplayer wrote:I love the kids but hate 95% of the adults.

That's the way I felt coaching little league, youth basketball, and volunteering for the Boy Scouts.

Many parents suck and thought little league practice was really baby sitting, which it was when parents didn't show up on time to pick up their kids.

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Imus · Post by **Imus** » Wed May 30, 2018 3:51 pm

Laxplayer wrote: Many comments in this thread are correct and I'm actually ashamed to say I'm a part of the system. The bigger issue is also if you challenge the system then you have a target on your back and you'll be out of a job shortly. I've seen it happen and it's a joke. I could go on and on but yes I knew what I was getting into and my retirement is going to be profitable, however I can honestly say that I love working with kids and the impact I've made in their lives over the years.

Rack you. We should support and be involved with those who teach our kids. Not much more important for them I would think. And also for getting over on the "CA going broke" deal, you deserve.

As for the golf game, hope you can shoot your age . . .

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Wed May 30, 2018 3:53 pm

Hey Imus, are you bipolar?

Laxplayer · Post by **Laxplayer** » Wed May 30, 2018 4:27 pm

I usually shoot my age on the front....53...... :grin:

Rooster · Post by **Rooster** » Wed May 30, 2018 5:40 pm

Imus wrote:
Laxplayer wrote: Many comments in this thread are correct and I'm actually ashamed to say I'm a part of the system. The bigger issue is also if you challenge the system then you have a target on your back and you'll be out of a job shortly. I've seen it happen and it's a joke. I could go on and on but yes I knew what I was getting into and my retirement is going to be profitable, however I can honestly say that I love working with kids and the impact I've made in their lives over the years.
Rack you. We should support and be involved with those who teach our kids. Not much more important for them I would think. And also for getting over on the "CA going broke" deal, you deserve.

As for the golf game, hope you can shoot your age . . .

The system, I assume, is the teachers union? Because that, largely, is the source of our school system’s problems in my view.

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Wed May 30, 2018 5:42 pm

Rooster wrote:
Imus wrote:
Laxplayer wrote: Many comments in this thread are correct and I'm actually ashamed to say I'm a part of the system. The bigger issue is also if you challenge the system then you have a target on your back and you'll be out of a job shortly. I've seen it happen and it's a joke. I could go on and on but yes I knew what I was getting into and my retirement is going to be profitable, however I can honestly say that I love working with kids and the impact I've made in their lives over the years.
Rack you. We should support and be involved with those who teach our kids. Not much more important for them I would think. And also for getting over on the "CA going broke" deal, you deserve.

As for the golf game, hope you can shoot your age . . .
The system, I assume, is the teachers union? Because that, largely, is the source of our school system’s problems in my view.

Your view tends to be extremely narrow and clouded.

Left Seater · Post by **Left Seater** » Wed May 30, 2018 5:56 pm

Unions aren't much of an issue here in Texas. In fact my mom wasn't part of the union for most of her teaching years. She didn't see any reason to pay dues after a year or two. Salary was set by the district based on years of experience and secondary degree or not. People often asked her to join the union. She told them she didn't get any return for paying her dues and disagreed with many of the candidates for office that the union supported.

So not sure that Unions are the problem here. In fact I think it is more what LAX touched on. Politicians and School Boards think they know what is best for teachers and students. Standardized test have become the end all be all of education.

Imus · Post by **Imus** » Wed May 30, 2018 7:27 pm

Goober McTuber wrote: Your view tends to be extremely narrow and clouded.

Well I expect the view you have from far within your hemorrhoid clogged and scar tissued ass hole is pretty fukkin' narrow, and likely clouded with more old jizz and condom debris than the contents of screwey's mop bucket.

And only myopic wish-I-had-a-hard-on old bastards post nekkid pic of themselves on a hetro board. Usually anyway, I'll give you that. Other then that, rack you.

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Wed May 30, 2018 7:40 pm

Imus wrote:
Goober McTuber wrote: Your view tends to be extremely narrow and clouded.
Well I expect the view you have from far within your hemorrhoid clogged and scar tissued ass hole is pretty fukkin' narrow, and likely clouded with more old jizz and condom debris than the contents of screwey's mop bucket.

And only myopic wish-I-had-a-hard-on old bastards post nekkid pic of themselves on a hetro board. Usually anyway, I'll give you that. Other then that, rack you.

I asked you a question, fuck-knuckle.

Imus · Post by **Imus** » Wed May 30, 2018 8:25 pm

You ask a lot of questions and make a lot of dumb statements. Doesn't mean normal folks pay attention.

Are you syphilitic?

Derron · Post by **Derron** » Wed May 30, 2018 9:06 pm

Laxplayer wrote: It's a fucking joke and I'm fortunate to say that I've got around 8 years left. Many comments in this thread are correct and I'm actually ashamed to say I'm a part of the system. The bigger issue is also if you challenge the system then you have a target on your back and you'll be out of a job shortly. I've seen it happen and it's a joke. I could go on and on but yes I knew what I was getting into and my retirement is going to be profitable, however I can honestly say that I love working with kids and the impact I've made in their lives over the years.

Everybody could go on and on and say this is the problem, but hey, fucking rack you. I told my kids that working for the g man sucks, but get a government job. People in Oregon are collecting 100% and more of their salary. I know several people, one a very good friend who both him and his wife sucked the government tit for 30 fucking years and retired. I mean what the fuck, how can you possibly live on that combined $ 10K a month income in retirement.

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Thu May 31, 2018 3:32 pm

Imus wrote:You ask a lot of questions and make a lot of dumb statements. Doesn't mean normal folks pay attention.

Are you syphilitic?

Not any more.

Q. What do you give the man who has everything?

A. You could start with penicillin.

And really, Imus, there's nothing normal about you.

Laxplayer · Post by **Laxplayer** » Thu May 31, 2018 4:49 pm

Lefty, unions are the problem here in Cali. They are so powerful and love to get involved in the politics then tell me how to vote. That's what I despise about them. Our union has no balls but the one thing I like about them is the job protection. That's a two way street though. It does protect good teachers from a tyrannical principal who may just not like a person however it protects bad teachers. That's the problem. I know I do a good job and kids are learning but because I tend not to follow the status quo and do what the liberal women in education want me to do I'm looked on as too old school. My classes consist of lectures and note taking. I'm not fond of all that technology crap that people shove in front of kids to just pacify them and not interact with them. Because I don't do that I'm looked down upon but the kids love my class and way of teaching. My union protects me from someone who may not like my methods. That's it. That's all I need my union for. Other than that, they're worthless.

Left Seater · Post by **Left Seater** » Thu May 31, 2018 6:12 pm

Valid points, and exactly why I said unions in Texas. No clue what they are doing in other states.

smackaholic · Post by **smackaholic** » Sun Jun 03, 2018 12:52 pm

Goober McTuber wrote:I can remember years ago when teachers were paid really shitty salaries. The only people that went into teaching did so because they really wanted to teach (probably back when Lax started out). Now we pay them a decent wage plus great benefits and we have people entering the profession to make a living wage, so we're more likely to get some shitty teachers. Maybe if we went back to paying them dirt, we'd get better, more dedicated teachers.

This gets a rack, even if Goobs said it.

My HS physics teacher, who was also the backpacking club teacher told me during a backpacking trip that after finishing his BSME at UConn, he could have become an Engineer and made decent coin, but he wanted to have his summers off so he could grab his canoe and backpack and disappear into the Adirondack for a month or two every summer. He willingly traded high pay for the schedule and security of a teaching gig.

Of course, a few years after I graduated was when the teaching unions started calling the shots. So, he ended up being reasonably well paid and has a retirement deal that most anyone here, short of maybe lax player would trade for.

The part that really pisses me off is the argument the teachers unions use today- “our teachers deserve higher pay because the have Masters degrees.”

When I was in HS, many of the older teachers that went to college in the 40-50s went to “teachers colleges” and got 2 year degrees.

Then they got jobs teaching.

This crop of barely edumacated folks ran a public ed system that was the envy of the world.

So why was it changed?

Because it’s hard to argue for
Mo money with an associates.

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Rooster · Post by **Rooster** » Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:00 pm

The meat and potatoes of the teachers unions are regular folk, who, for better or worse, have thrown in with the unions for any number of reasons which would include more pay and job security— things we all would like to have regardless of the merits —but it is the upper echelon of the unions which are pernicious: Union leaders. These are the former 60s radicals who recognized the truth that if you can teach the youngsters early enough, you own them in their adulthood. Thus Marxism infiltrated our university and college system first and is now being taken the next step further by introducing it at the high school and elementary school level.

This is not happenstance. It is a result of the very purposeful implementation of ideas which have finally found rich and fertile ground after four decades of preparation.

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 1:57 pm

Rooster wrote:The meat and potatoes of the teachers unions are regular folk, who, for better or worse, have thrown in with the unions for any number of reasons which would include more pay and job security— things we all would like to have regardless of the merits —but it is the upper echelon of the unions which are pernicious: Union leaders. These are the former 60s radicals who recognized the truth that if you can teach the youngsters early enough, you own them in their adulthood. Thus Marxism infiltrated our university and college system first and is now being taken the next step further by introducing it at the high school and elementary school level.

This is not happenstance. It is a result of the very purposeful implementation of ideas which have finally found rich and fertile ground after four decades of preparation.

You really are a fucking idiot. Kill yourself.

smackaholic · Post by **smackaholic** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 2:13 pm

That was a very eloquent rebuttal Goobs. Well done.

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:23 pm

smackaholic wrote:That was a very eloquent rebuttal Goobs. Well done.

You're buying his Marxist conspiracy bullshit? Talk about the blind leading the stupid.

Rooster · Post by **Rooster** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 10:21 pm

Ah, so you believe that Marxists just happened to conveniently clog up the universities’ teaching positions because... why again? Perhaps because the sanitation engineer jobs were already filled? That you don’t recognize the problem simply demonstrates your willful blindness in that regard. But then you’d probably attribute Bernie Sanders startling rise in national politics and support by Millenials to merely because he reminds them of their crazy uncle who drops by for Thanksgiving dinner.

In all seriousness, what do you attribute the admiration for Marxism by the rank and file across our university system to then?

BSmack · Post by **BSmack** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 11:09 pm

Rooster wrote:In all seriousness, what do you attribute the admiration for Marxism by the rank and file across our university system to then?

You seriously think that a bunch of 30 - 50 something professors are going to turn some hayseed from Macon into a clone of Leon Trotsky? You're high.

Dr_Phibes · Post by **Dr_Phibes** » Mon Jun 04, 2018 11:17 pm

BSmack wrote:
Rooster wrote:In all seriousness, what do you attribute the admiration for Marxism by the rank and file across our university system to then?
You seriously think that a bunch of 30 - 50 something professors are going to turn some hayseed from Macon into a clone of Leon Trotsky? You're high.

The modern academic left wouldn't know Marxism if the man himself hit them with a truck. Serious western academic work on Marx ended in the sixties, it was rejected and random elements now pilfered to suit the flavour of the day.

Shlomart Ben Yisrael · Mon Jun 04, 2018 11:48 pm

Accusing academia of allegiance to Marxism isn't merely just dumb...it's lazy.

The real names you're looking for are the Post Modernists...Foucault, Adorno, Marcusse...assuming you'd do any work investigating it.

But it's okay, just say "Marxism". It's quaint.

Rooster · Post by **Rooster** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:36 am

It's also succinct.
The funny thing is each of you are telling me I'm wrong, but none of you have an explanation for why academia is full of these... whatevers who are pushing socialism.

Dr_Phibes · Post by **Dr_Phibes** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:42 am

It stands to reason. The American left reflects the nature and contradictions of America. Egotism, freedom, individuality. In any definition of socialism - that is anti-socialist behaviour. It's at odds with socialism, perverting it is all you can do.

Now you're stuck with the Identity Politics crowd and all the fun that encompasses. Marxism was full of meanies with guns, not cool dude.

Shlomart Ben Yisrael · Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:45 am

Rooster wrote:It's also succinct.
The funny thing is each of you are telling me I'm wrong, but none of you have an explanation for why academia is full of these... whatevers who are pushing socialism.

Classical liberalism has an appeal to the intellect, going back to the Greeks.
Concepts like logic and reason nourish the mind and Socialism pre-dates even Marx, having roots in the Enlightenment.

Shlomart Ben Yisrael · Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:51 am

Dr_Phibes wrote:It's at odds with socialism, perverting it is all you can do.

Like Social Democrats. But I'll be a

nice guy

and make sure there's fresh hay in the cattle cars when we ship them off to the gulag.

Rooster · Post by **Rooster** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 3:05 am

Shlomart Ben Yisrael wrote:
Rooster wrote:It's also succinct.
The funny thing is each of you are telling me I'm wrong, but none of you have an explanation for why academia is full of these... whatevers who are pushing socialism.

Classical liberalism has an appeal to the intellect, going back to the Greeks.
Concepts like logic and reason nourish the mind and Socialism pre-dates even Marx, having roots in the Enlightenment.

And classical liberalism is conservative in nature allowing for intellectual curiosity and critical thinking, yet holding to tried and true principles and behavior. It is the antithesis of what is being taught by... those people in our university system.

Isn’t what you guys are doing to me Marxist terminology shaming? It seems like something you should be against. :wink:

Dr_Phibes · Post by **Dr_Phibes** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 4:19 am

well you fukkin started it.

smackaholic · Post by **smackaholic** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:18 pm

All this nitpicking over the particulars of different flavors of socialism is ridiculous.

As for the Americanized version, it is where we are because good old fashioned, jack booted, line up all the faggots and shoot them in the head socialism wasn't politically viable. So what we have now from socialist leaders is a hodge-podge of groups that think they've been abused by mean old capitalist whitey. Rather than sell the alleged advantages of socialism, they put all their energy into telling each of these groups how badly they've been repressed.

It has worked very well with the LGBT crowd. It has worked with the illegal aliens. Up til now, it's most important group, balck folks have stayed on the plantation as well.

But, I think this last, most important bunch may just think about bolting, if the current economic trends continue. Balck employment is at record highs. And I still think that a lot of blacks are naturally drawn to Trump. They like his style. Trump is a Pimp, not a hoe. Mit Romney was a hoe. Add to this, the fact that the over the top pandering to the LGBT community really doesn't play well in the hood.

Of course the libs are painfully aware of this and have done everything in their power to paint him a racist. But these attacks are getting stale.

If Trump can ever get to anything better than 10-20% balck support, the other 80% might just re-examine things as well and there could be a rush to the exits of the dem. party. If this happens, you can stick a fork in the democrat party.

Left Seater · Post by **Left Seater** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:00 pm

Not sure I would say that way but Holic does have a point.

Here in SAT the local black leadership has been very outspoken about illegal immigration. Their point is why should the country support those here illegally when actual US citizens are still in so much need? The same black leadership complains that they are in line behind illegal aliens for limited government resources. Will this lead them to pull the R lever, who knows, but it doesn’t make them want to run out to support the D’s.

Further much of the black community is closer to the R’s outside of social service programs.

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:46 pm

Rooster wrote:It's also succinct.
The funny thing is each of you are telling me I'm wrong, but none of you have an explanation for why academia is full of these... whatevers who are pushing socialism.

I've lived in Madison for almost 50 years, since I came here to go to college in 1970. I've known a number of professors who teach at the University of Wisconsin. I still socialize with a few. None of them are or were Marxists. There is no ominous plot by college professors to turn their students into Marxists. Most of the professors I've known encourage their students to think for themselves. You are an even bigger idiot than I previously thought.

smackaholic · Post by **smackaholic** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:59 pm

How many would you characterize as libertarian, or even middle of the road conservative?

L45B · Post by **L45B** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 2:05 pm

Left Seater wrote:Here in SAT the local black leadership has been very outspoken about illegal immigration.

In the coming years watch out also for the shift in how the black community views gun control vs 2A. Lots are waking up to the fact that strict gun control laws typically negatively affect their communities the hardest. Law abiding folks who happen to share street corners with the drug thugs (who will always find ways to get guns) should rightfully be able to defend themselves.

Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 5:44 pm

smackaholic wrote:How many would you characterize as libertarian, or even middle of the road conservative?

There's a few that I believe are Libertarians. Conservatives? None. These are people with PhD's. Really smart individuals.

This discussion was really about tinfoil hat Rooster's ridiculous premise that there's this broad conspiracy among these educators to indoctrinate all their poor students in the joys of socialism.

Joe in PB · Post by **Joe in PB** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 5:53 pm

Goober McTuber wrote:Conservatives? None.

Thanks for clarifying that your professors were all liberals. When that is the case moderate thinking is not the norm, but the exception. Hence your belief that CNN is fair and balanced news, which it is not.

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Goober McTuber · Post by **Goober McTuber** » Tue Jun 05, 2018 6:08 pm

Snowflake in PB wrote:
Goober McTuber wrote:Conservatives? None.

Thanks for clarifying that your professors were all liberals.

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That was a joke. Which, of course, sailed over your misshapen head.