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Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 9:03 pm
by Goober McTuber
Papa Willie wrote:Goober McTuber wrote:I see another red X. Keep swinging for the fences, tubby.
I see it. Nobody else has complained about a red x.
I'm probably the only one reading your posts any more.
I have to head out for happy hour. You and Joe Blows can continue your tard-off.
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 11:38 pm
by Left Seater
Goobs, your denial runs deep. But whatever helps you sleep at night.
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 12:30 am
by Screw_Michigan
88 wrote:
For what its worth, I hate tariffs and favor free, open and fair markets.
Gee, that's nice!
But I understand that the trade deals the US has with its "allies" and trading partners are not free or fair. Our "allies" and trading partners impose tariffs and other protective actions that make it nearly impossible for our companies to compete with theirs. And we do not impose the same limitations. This results in a significant trade imbalance. The only way you can get these countries to stop fucking you and to return to the negotiating table so a free, open and fair trade deal can be obtained is to temporarily impose retaliatory tariffs. When you are the biggest donkey in the pen, you get to make the rules. We are the biggest donkey. And all we want to do is to make fair trading rules. We are not trying to screw anyone over.
If you disagree, point out how the current trade deals are fair to the US, and how it is unfair to renegotiate them. Should be easy for you, right?
BUT BUT BUT I thought you liked free markets and fair trade? :?
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 3:19 am
by Dr_Phibes
88 wrote:
If you disagree, point out how the current trade deals are fair to the US, and how it is unfair to renegotiate them. Should be easy for you, right?
A trade deal is a treatise, It's your word and your signature and your guarantee. Everyone who went into it was willing. The argument here is why a five year moratorium on any treatise, who would invest in something open to re-interpretation every five years? You cannot give your word, then take it back.
You sold out labour for finance capital, now labour is the key again. I think this is marvellous.
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 3:39 am
by Joe in PB
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 4:10 am
by Dr_Phibes
So that's it. If the President signs a binding paper, It's not on behalf of the United States, it's on the behalf of his administration. Every treaty is four years binding.
You're going to go out of business very quickly.
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 4:26 am
by Dr_Phibes
88 wrote:Dr_Phibes wrote:So that's it. If the President signs a binding paper, It's not on behalf of the United States, it's on the behalf of his administration. Every treaty is four years binding.
You're going to go out of business very quickly.
Your country should cease doing business with the US, then. Or start a trade war with us. Or, you could renegotiate the present trade deal that everyone knows puts your foot up our ass. You choose.
I agree, it started in 2008 - it was recognised. Never put your eggs in one basket. But when things calmed down - everyone slowed down. Now Northern Gateway is accelerated and everyone's fleeing to China and Britain. They need friends about now.
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 4:35 am
by Dr_Phibes
Skimmed the article, but it looks good. Context is important, it was a place in time. Canada with the resources, America with the smarts and Mexico with the labour. RACK the nineties.
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 6:58 pm
by Goober McTuber
Left Seater wrote:Goobs, your denial runs deep. But whatever helps you sleep at night.
Denial of what? Stick to the topic. Trump's trade war is a huge misstep.
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 7:03 pm
by Goober McTuber
88 wrote:What does TTL stand for?
TTL™ = Trump Taint Lickers
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 7:15 pm
by Rooster
Goober McTuber wrote:Left Seater wrote:Goobs, your denial runs deep. But whatever helps you sleep at night.
Denial of what? Stick to the topic. Trump's trade war is a huge misstep.
Kind of depends on how long the tariffs remain in place. If this mess gets sorted out, the lasting results will be short lived. On the other hand, if it escalates, there will be major trouble ahead, no question about it.
One thing which I believe Trump has wrong is that trade is not a zero sum game. Trade need not be balanced equally in terms of deficits and surpluses, as evidenced by the surplus of airliners for example, that we ship out across the world. We don’t hear Mexico complaining about the trade imbalance of our aircraft flooding their market. Personally, I don’t see a particular need for the US to dominate the cheap plastic toys and dinnerware market, but that’s just me.
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 7:42 pm
by Goober McTuber
Very reasonable take, Rooster. Color me shocked. But this does need to get resolved quickly.
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 9:11 pm
by Mikey
Rooster wrote:Goober McTuber wrote:Left Seater wrote:Goobs, your denial runs deep. But whatever helps you sleep at night.
Denial of what? Stick to the topic. Trump's trade war is a huge misstep.
Kind of depends on how long the tariffs remain in place. If this mess gets sorted out, the lasting results will be short lived. On the other hand, if it escalates, there will be major trouble ahead, no question about it.
One thing which I believe Trump has wrong is that trade is not a zero sum game. Trade need not be balanced equally in terms of deficits and surpluses, as evidenced by the surplus of airliners for example, that we ship out across the world. We don’t hear Mexico complaining about the trade imbalance of our aircraft flooding their market. Personally, I don’t see a particular need for the US to dominate the cheap plastic toys and dinnerware market, but that’s just me.
Nailed it.
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 10:03 pm
by Screw_Michigan
Rooster wrote:
Kind of depends on how long the tariffs remain in place. If this mess gets sorted out, the lasting results will be short lived. On the other hand, if it escalates, there will be major trouble ahead, no question about it.
One thing which I believe Trump has wrong is that trade is not a zero sum game. Trade need not be balanced equally in terms of deficits and surpluses, as evidenced by the surplus of airliners for example, that we ship out across the world. We don’t hear Mexico complaining about the trade imbalance of our aircraft flooding their market. Personally, I don’t see a particular need for the US to dominate the cheap plastic toys and dinnerware market, but that’s just me.
Rack this take
What aircraft are you flying over the Cali fires?
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 10:16 pm
by Shlomart Ben Yisrael
Screw_Michigan wrote:
What aircraft are you flying over the Cali fires?
whoa
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 12:05 am
by Shlomart Ben Yisrael
88 wrote:Consuming economies, like the US, will purchase far more goods from others than they will purchase from us.
Remember when you guys were a manufacturing economy? Can you remember that far back?
Mood rings.
Lava lamps.
Roller Disco.
The Chiefs winning Super Bowls... :|
Those were good times, weren't they?
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 12:07 am
by Shlomart Ben Yisrael
Shlomart Ben Yisrael wrote:
The Chiefs winning Super Bowls... :|
WAR ~
Wags
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 12:12 am
by smackaholic
Rooster wrote:Goober McTuber wrote:Left Seater wrote:Goobs, your denial runs deep. But whatever helps you sleep at night.
Denial of what? Stick to the topic. Trump's trade war is a huge misstep.
Kind of depends on how long the tariffs remain in place. If this mess gets sorted out, the lasting results will be short lived. On the other hand, if it escalates, there will be major trouble ahead, no question about it.
One thing which I believe Trump has wrong is that trade is not a zero sum game. Trade need not be balanced equally in terms of deficits and surpluses, as evidenced by the surplus of airliners for example, that we ship out across the world. We don’t hear Mexico complaining about the trade imbalance of our aircraft flooding their market. Personally, I don’t see a particular need for the US to dominate the cheap plastic toys and dinnerware market, but that’s just me.
No one, Trump included, thinks that every industry should have balance. Of course we will have an aircraft trade surplus and a soybean surplus. But, when totaled up, we should be in the ballpark. What is our current deficit with China? I have seen numbers as high as 320 billion, but I read an article that said, if you factor in the parts that go to a cell phone sold to us, which might have actually started in the US, the number is around 200 billion.
Whatever it is, it's a lot. It needs to come down.
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 2:14 am
by Goober McTuber
HuckabeeSandersaholic wrote:No one, Trump included, thinks that every industry should have balance.
So now you speak for President Chucklehead?
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 2:20 am
by Dr_Phibes
In order to 'make America great again' you have recover a manufacture base and that would have to drive wages below the price of an Asian worker to compete. It's a ridiculous non-starter. Auto manufacture only seeks Canada because the Government pays the benefits the company would pick up in the US. Tariff away, it'll jack up the price of everything no matter what - permanently.
It's all a shiny object for the plebs to stare at.
Re: Question for the TTL brigade
Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 3:31 am
by Dr_Phibes
It shall be, the European economy is more advanced than North America, you cannot de-evolve an economy. The government pays benefits through taxes to a central location, something you're adverse to. The third point I'll concede, at least for Ontario - historically, the province's economy now exists somewhere around 1910.
The plebs sometimes need a good boot. And someone to look out for their interests. 'To each according their ability' does not imply equality in skill sets.