Rushville wrote:
But I do have to take issue with HapDay. I cannot imagine Brady winning those championships without the likes of Willie McGinnest, Rodney Harrison, Ted washington, Teddy Brushi, Ty Law and co. back there to get the ball in his hands to win those championships.
They did it last year without Washington and Law, but I see your point. However, neither one of those players marched the field versus the Rams on the final drive to win their first Super Bowl.
Brady is clutch and Manning is not. When push comes to shove I would rather have a QB who can play outdoors AND is cool as cuucumber in the clutch. Manning is a great QB, but he still has a lot to prove.
Hapday wrote:
Manning is a great QB, but he still has a lot to prove.
No argument with that.
Sorry to break this to you, fat boy, but Manning will remain a big-game loser as long as he's playing for a coach who is a big-game loser.
Dungy was a big-game loser at Tampa Bay and he's still a big-game loser at Indy.
WacoFan wrote:Flying any airplane that you can hear the radio over the roaring radial engine is just ghey anyway.... Of course, Cirri are the Miata of airplanes..
Joe in PB wrote:Rate them by who's the best when it counts.
1. Tom Brady
2. The rest of the league.............
Is there a more overrated player?
Scott Rolen
John Boehner wrote:Boehner said. "In Congress, we have a red button, a green button and a yellow button, alright. Green means 'yes,' red means 'no,' and yellow means you're a chicken shit. And the last thing we need in the White House, in the oval office, behind that big desk, is some chicken who wants to push this yellow button.
mvscal wrote:Correct. He makes plays not mistakes.
I guess you're right. Nothing strikes me more about him as just how damned... uh... competent he is. The fact that he is so very competent makes him Hall of Fame material.
Tom Brady is the architect and genius of the 14th best passing game last year. When I think "the best" I think of "14th".
When I think "the best", I think "champion". When I think "elite" , I think "repeat champion".
John Boehner wrote:Boehner said. "In Congress, we have a red button, a green button and a yellow button, alright. Green means 'yes,' red means 'no,' and yellow means you're a chicken shit. And the last thing we need in the White House, in the oval office, behind that big desk, is some chicken who wants to push this yellow button.
I like Brady but on a pure physical level he doesnt compare to Dante, Donovan or Peyton. So in terms of raw talent, Tom cant compare. Buut, being that he has led his team to 3 SB's I cant really say that he is overrated. He makes plays when he needs to and he stays out of the way when he needs to. That is why he leaps over Dante and Donovan but Peyton is out of this world and will get a ring or two. He is just too good not to.
John Boehner wrote:Boehner said. "In Congress, we have a red button, a green button and a yellow button, alright. Green means 'yes,' red means 'no,' and yellow means you're a chicken shit. And the last thing we need in the White House, in the oval office, behind that big desk, is some chicken who wants to push this yellow button.
Hardly.
I truly can't fathom the argument you Tom Brady lusters are offering. When you think of the best quarterback, you go for the guy who offers nothing spectacular. Can't conceive of it.
When the Patriots beat the Colts 20-3, it wasn't Brady beating Manning. The defense and the coaches of the Patriots beat Manning. I guess you guys marvel at Brady's ability to not foul it up for the rest of the team, but if I was able to start a franchise with any QB available, I wouldn't think of taking Tom Brady.
If not for the above reasons, the fact that he dated Tara Reid should be reason enough to drop him 5 spots in the rankings.
Let me add another point from a Coltsfan standpoint. Going into this season, after what has transpired over the last 3 years, I am hoping the Colts can put together a record that awards them homefield throughout. I say that because they have shown that there is something about going to New England in January.
Now that's not to say that Peyton can't win in the cold. When he went to Kansas City the year before and won on the road when it counted, it wasn't exactly balmy there. If I remember right it may have been in the 20's in the sun. (I'm the KC folk here will have a more accurate memory) But you put him in Foxboro in the snow and it doesn't happen.
Whereas Pats fans (tell me if I'm wrong Neely) only have to worry that Tom and the boys just maintain the status quo because they were able to go to Pitsburgh last year, and they have won in the dome here. For them, location and turf matters not.
Manning: 3-5 in playoff games, with his defense surrendering an average of 24 pts per game.
Brady: 9-0 (8-1, actually) in playoff games, with his defense surrendering an average of 17 pts per game.
The pressure has been on Manning to do MORE for his team because his defense isn't getting it done like the Pats defense has for Brady, but still..... Brady has never LOST a game for his team with his play in a playoff game.
That is remarkable, folks.
Brady has averaged 216 yds passing per playoff game, and he's passed for 11 tds and only 3 picks.
It's not like he's just standing around watching his team win.
No, he's doing MORE than his share.
As mvscal is saying, he has GOTTEN IT DONE vs good defenses in playoff games......over and over.
When it was needed, he passed for 350 yds and 3 tds vs Carolina in the Super Bowl.
I don't see how anyone in their right mind rates Manning ahead of Brady at this point.
mvscal wrote:Brady shreds top rated defenses. Manning falls apart against them.
Would you like to pull your foot out of your mouth now?
When Brady plays a top rated D he turns in numbers that are just as average as any other QB. The difference is, he has a top ranked defense of his own to put pressure on the OTHER team's QB. Manning has no such luxury.
Since 2003, Manning has lit up the scoreboard like a Christmas tree against everybody BUT the Patriots.
BTW: Did you know that last year was the first time Brady has EVER averaged better than 7 yards per attempt? Manning has averaged 7.6 for his CAREER. That should tell you that the Pats coaching staff doesn't exactly call a lot of deep balls for Brady.
BSmack wrote:
And if the Panthers idiot kicker didn't jack the kickoff out of bounds....
And if the milkman had made it over your mom's fence ahead of the dog, you wouldn't have those long, floppy ears
WacoFan wrote:Flying any airplane that you can hear the radio over the roaring radial engine is just ghey anyway.... Of course, Cirri are the Miata of airplanes..
Whether it be from the nosebleed seats at the Edward Jones Dome or from noon until 6:15 every winter Sunday, yes I watch football.
I think the Patriots are a very well-balanced team. The defense is very good, the offense is very good and the special teams and coaching are great. This combination has led to consistent wins even in the salary cap era. Tom Brady's play is not the sole reason behind the success of the Pats. To use the team's success to explain why he is the best is stupid.
The fact may be that his abilities are hindered because he does not have to be the driving force for his team. Manning and the Colts have to score a buhzillion points to account for their defense, and maybe if the situation warranted Brady could score a buhzillion points. Fact is nobody knows if he can.
If you think Brady is a "don't fuck it up" quarterback, you honestly don't know shit about him or the game.
I believe it was page 2 of this thread where we addressed this first.
poptart wrote:Brady: 9-0 (8-1, actually) in playoff games, with his defense surrendering an average of 17 pts per game.
Excellent point that wasn't your point.
In each each playoff game that you guys keep bringing up, was Brady the star? Brady gets the MVP because there is nobody else on the Pats that stands out in these games and Tom is the prettiest.
2001 AFC title game... what did Tom do that was so special?
2001 Super Bowl... what did Tom do that was so special?
I've merely added a few points in this thread because, as I stated earlier, I've been through this argument countless times with Pats fans on the Colts board.
Bizzaro, it's amzing how you've actually played the role of Coltsfan in this thread. But I still can't put stats up against rings.
Where this argument had slid a little away from reality is when Tom Brady is put WAY ahead of everyone esle. Is he the best? Yes. I've already stated that. He has orchestrated 2 last-minute Super Bowl winning drives. Nothing beats that. But his defense did get him the ball back so he could run those drives. And Adam Vinatiari did make those kicks for the win. So it wasn't all him.
You could look at history to help the comparison look a little more clear. Terry Bradshaw has 4 rings. Was he the greatest ever? Dan Marino has none. Is he the worst?
Manning's "choker" label is still valid. Especially after last years game in Foxboro. Halftime score was 6-3 New England. At that point I, as well as all other Colts fans were thinking "Great! Our D had held them to 6 points. Now Manning can turn it on after the halftime adjustments and we'll win this." But of course, the adjustments were made by the Pats and Manning didn't score again. Actually, the Colts D played their best game of the last 5 season's that day, holding the defending champs to 20 points in their house, their weather. And remember that all season, Peyton and company were averaging, AVERAGING over 30 per game. So the D did it's job. Peyton blew that one.
I will defend Manning against those that say he's not good, that he's all about stats, or that he can't play in the cold. But I can't defend him against Brady and the Patriots.
Patriots:
Dillon
Who? What were we talking about again?
John Boehner wrote:Boehner said. "In Congress, we have a red button, a green button and a yellow button, alright. Green means 'yes,' red means 'no,' and yellow means you're a chicken shit. And the last thing we need in the White House, in the oval office, behind that big desk, is some chicken who wants to push this yellow button.
frodo_biguns wrote:
Favre @ #5? HAHHAHAHAHHAHAAAAAAAA! Tell me what has he done besides throw a few Hail-Mary's after his dad died. Since his Super Bowl loss, "NOTHING!"
Vick at 5, Pennington & Hasselbeck below Collins? Lay off the pipe a little man!
Talk to me at the end of the year. And Just remember how many championship games Collins has led average teams too. Not only that, Collins has the best deep ball arm in the NFL. And no I don't mean he can shove it up Nishlord's ass and stick it out his mouth either.
fraudo_biguns wrote:Talk to me at the end of the year.
As if you'd stick around to "talk" at the end of the year.
Save your football "insight" and all the rest of your pathetic bullshit for tarding up Main Street.
The last time you were around "at the end of the year" with any sort of coherent take on "football" will be your first.
You're lucky Q hasn't deleted your post, but I'm sure he'll find it in him to delete plenty of your epic "takes" when you're around to "talk" later in the season while offering your deep, introspective insight.
fraudo_biguns wrote:Talk to me at the end of the year.
As if you'd stick around to "talk" at the end of the year.
Save your football "insight" and all the rest of your pathetic bullshit for tarding up Main Street.
The last time you were around "at the end of the year" with any sort of coherent take on "football" will be your first.
You're lucky Q hasn't deleted your post, but I'm sure he'll find it in him to delete plenty of your epic "takes" when you're around to "talk" later in the season while offering your deep, introspective insight.
Fucking tard.
I don't know what makes you such a worthless poster, but it really works! Why is it that the people with the smallest minds always have the biggest mouths?
You still sore I tore you up last year?
You remind me of thos Anti-Bushies. What a Fucking jealous crybaby! Get over it!
Sincerely,
Frodo Biguns
2004 The Trolls Fantasy Football Champion
fraudo_biguns wrote:You still sore I tore you up last year?
You remind me of thos Anti-Bushies. What a Fucking jealous crybaby! Get over it!
Sincerely,
Frodo Biguns
2004 The Trolls Fantasy Football Champion
Congrats on beating a bunch of bots, fraudo.
We'll see if you're around for you to "talk" to BBMarley at the end of the year, especially if your beloved Vikes aren't in the playoffs.
Btw, whose dick are you longing for, now that Moss is with the Raiders?
