T1B

Oh... I see mvscal decided to delete his post in which he proved beyond any and all doubt that Clackamas County, Oregon indeed doesn't even rank among the top ten horses-per-capita counties in the State of Virginia.


BTW -- I do believe there's some sort of minimum population qualifier on the horses-per-capita thing, but I can't recall what it is.

Dinsdale wrote:Oh... I see mvscal decided to delete his post in which he proved beyond any and all doubt that Clackamas County, Oregon indeed doesn't even rank among the top ten horses-per-capita counties in the State of Virginia.

Yea, but how many of them have you taken home?

smackaholic wrote: Measuring things can be helpful....sometimes. But, when the act of measuring takes as much time as what it is you are measuring, it doesn't take a rocket surgeon to figure out you are being wasteful.

Amen!

The bean counters want to know how efficient you are operating. Nevermind that the measuring itself takes away from productivity yet doesn't add one oz. of value to the customer.

Mace wrote: My personal vehicles are also Fords, and my F-150 would kick ass on OCmike's Siverado and, just because I'm such a good guy, I'll volunteer to hook on a tow rope to Mike's rig the next time he gets it stuck in a mud puddle. ;)

Mace

My Silverado is a Z71 4X4 with the off-road package and tow package. Haven't had any problems with mud puddles yet...:D It was listed in the high 30's, but because it was an '04 and they were closing out the model year, I got it at 0% and $7,000 off sticker.


Haven't owned a Ford, other than an Excursion that we traded in when gas prices went through the roof. It was a decent vehicle, though we did have to take it in twice to get two recalls fixed in the first three months we had it. One had to do with the steering rack and the other had to do with the seatbelts . Nice products you put out there, Ford.

The OL had owned nothing BUT Fords before I met her, but will never buy a car from them again after the way they tried to shaft her on financing the last time she tried to buy a vehicle from them. So much for "owner loyalty" meaning a damn thing.

BSmack wrote:

Dinsdale wrote:Oh... I see mvscal decided to delete his post in which he proved beyond any and all doubt that Clackamas County, Oregon indeed doesn't even rank among the top ten horses-per-capita counties in the State of Virginia.

Yea, but how many of them have you taken home?

Just one.

-Ucant

Oh.


Well since an arbitrary, subjective claim passes for PROOF in mvscal's world, here you go:

Sandy resident and gaming clinic facilitator Randy Pierce, who teaches at the equestrian center every Monday evening, said riders from Barlow, Sandy, Estacada, Corbett, Centennial and Oregon City high schools will all feel the loss if the Equestrian Center closes. “I don’t know of any place within 50 miles this big,” he said. “Clackamas County has the most horses per capita in the United States

So, by YOUR RULES... guess what?


BTW -- my numbers come from a professional farrier, who has travelled the country and competed (and won awards in) the World Farrier's Championships and whatnot. So we're stuck with YET ANOTHER "who to believe" with mvscal involved -- an internationally-recognized person from the equestrian industry, or mvscal?


Another big "HMMMM......"

mvscal wrote:My numbers come from the Dept. of Agriculture, so shove it up your ass, you cock sucking blowhard.

Yet that link is peculiarly absent... ponderous.


BTW-This will probably end up about the same as a debate of "most watched annual sporting event wordwide," which has been debated amongst me and mine... good luck finding any sort of real data aside from absolute bullshit claims.

Dinsdale wrote: ...aside from absolute bullshit claims.

Shouldn't that be "horseshit claims"?

War Wagon wrote: The bean counters want to know how efficient you are operating. Nevermind that the measuring itself takes away from productivity yet doesn't add one oz. of value to the customer.

Numerophobia is not a good thing

My oldest just started working at a DC in Harrisonville picking orders to help pay for school-
His base is $16 something per hour, but with an hourly incentive bonus based on production that can add up to 20% more

Obviosuly they used some "numbers" to calc how much the average joe can pull then incentivized to go above and beyond.

Pay for Performance.
Gee.... imagine that

BSmack wrote:when you start trying to "manage" process improvement, you're taking time and resources away from developing better products.

It's that whole ROI thing, in this case with the investment being one of time rather than $$. The objective, of course, is that the improvements resulting from the time and resources used to generate the ideas for improvement will pay for the time spent creating them once implemented. Some companies were probably in such shitty shape beforehand that it actually paid off, or at least accountants and managers can massage the numbers to make it appear that way.

I'm sure it's nothing ANOTHER reorganization won't fix.

Companies reorganize in an effort to keep bodies buried, and seldom, if ever, to improve processes.

Goober McTuber wrote:

Dinsdale wrote:I was just curious --


How many of you that feel you're qualified to comment on automotive workmanship, reliability, and fit-and-finish have ever repaired cars for a living?

TIA, and yes, you should feel stupid.

Didn’t you used to play defensive tackle for the Green Bay Packers?


No, my bad, that was Cletidus Hunt.

Cletidus Hunt, and Tedious Cunt.

I can understand the mix up.

rozy palms wrote:Nothing really more needs to be added than to say that you are one extremely ignorant idiot. No, seriously, you are.

No, I'm seriously NOT, but you have your opinion no matter how completely fucked up it is.

Malibus? Some finance companies STILL won't write a note on a used Malibu. Kias and Hyundais have gained better reputations now than a freaking Malibu.

Yet ANOTHER retarded post by rozy palms....the new Malibus have been highly decorated by everybody from Consumer Reports to Motor Trend.

I'm gonna love the day Tony raises the Championship Cup while standing next to his Toyota. Just to see you and Whitey melt and whine.

And I could give a FUCK less because I don't follow NASCAR like Wags does. Sorry to burst yer bubble there, Roze.

What is really funny to me is that I talk to people all over the country every day. The most backwards, trailer trash, redneck, hick, Jerry Springer show fill-in people that I talk to are easily the ones from Missouri. And it ain't even a nary bit close.

SUUUUUUURE.

Dinsdale wrote:I was just curious --


How many of you that feel you're qualified to comment on automotive workmanship, reliability, and fit-and-finish have ever repaired cars for a living?

TIA, and yes, you should feel stupid.

I GUARANTEE that Densehole's post excludes me....I deal with all makes of cars on a daily basis and I'm more qualified to comment on automotive workmanship, reliability, and fit-and-finish that anybody posting on this board.

RevLimiter wrote:

Dinsdale wrote:I was just curious --


How many of you that feel you're qualified to comment on automotive workmanship, reliability, and fit-and-finish have ever repaired cars for a living?

TIA, and yes, you should feel stupid.

I GUARANTEE that Densehole's post excludes me....I deal with all makes of cars on a daily basis and I'm more qualified to comment on automotive workmanship, reliability, and fit-and-finish that anybody posting on this board.

I don't believe cutting and pasting comments from car and driver magazine really qualifies you, sport.

RevLimiter wrote: I deal with all makes of cars on a daily basis and I'm more qualified to comment on automotive workmanship, reliability, and fit-and-finish that anybody posting on this board.

C&P Paul before putting on that extra 200 lb....

I'm going to edmunds.com to see what they say about all this.

Smacka, here's the thing. You might need to spend a little more now to not have to spend a lot more later. Go with the Jap car. There was a time that our car broke down and dad, brother or boyfriend got it fixed on Sunday afternoon. Why isn't that the case now?

I do believe American auto companies are stepping up their quality, they have to to compete. But I'd wait a few more years before depending on them.

RevLimiter wrote: I GUARANTEE that Densehole's post excludes me....I deal with all makes of cars on a daily basis and I'm more qualified to comment on automotive workmanship, reliability, and fit-and-finish that anybody posting on this board.

I think he was addressing you here:

...and yes, you should feel stupid.

The Whistle Is Screaming wrote:I'm going to edmunds.com to see what they say about all this.

You can go to cars.com. Imports dominate the American makes.

http://www.cars.com/go/advice/Story.jsp ... est_resale" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

trev wrote:
I do believe American auto companies are stepping up their quality, they have to to compete. But I'd wait a few more years before depending on them.

Do you know why Ford stopped making the Escort? It lasted too long.

That's about all you need to know about American auto manufacturers.

Monica gets -50 for missing a reset

KFC Paula, putting Dominoes leaflets under cars' windshield wipers at the grocery store parking lot may qualify as "dealing with all makes of cars on a daily basis" but it really doesn't make you any kind of authority

OCmike wrote: Do you know why Ford stopped making the Escort? It lasted too long.

Right.

You mean before or after the blown head gaskets were replaced?

Escorts were notorious for that.

B,
The edmunds.com remark was a joke. Hell, I don't even remember the story behind it, but someone here can fill us in.

I did go to the site and found this ...

http://www.edmunds.com/apps/vdpcontaine ... geNumber=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Road Test: Comparison Test

Comparison Test: 1984 Ferrari 308 GTSi vs. 2007 Kia Sedona EX
Who's got it better, Magnum or Mom?

... it's worth the read.

Sudden Sam wrote:Dinsdale's "point" is beyond stupid. Absolutely moronic.

No. YOUR point is beyond stupid... sup Paul.


Sorry, bud. I used to repair automobiles for a living. And I can tell you, beyond any and all doubt, is that what Joe Consumer percieves as quality and reliability, as opposed to what actually happens to vehicles once they get a bunch of miles, are so far apart, it's hilarious to those in that profession.

Lots of people think Chrysler products are the bee's knees. With my admittedly unscientific observations, Chrysler owners were BY FAR the leats satisfied customers with the automaker... not even close.

The other make that stood head-and-shoulders above the rest in terms of dissatisfied owners was BMTroubleYou.

Again, not even a close debate.

Yet here's dipshits like Consumer Reports (a rag which is a liability to consumers, rather than an asset) that will tell you the moon and stars revolve around BMW. And if Consumer Reports says it's true, then their fellow dipshits believe them.


Audi owners are generally a very unhappy lot, but it's such a small market share, they hardly merit a mention. They usually reach wit's end when the power windows fail for the 14th time. Euro manufacturers have this strange arrogance, and when the same part/system of their vehicle fails way ahead of its time for the 14th model year in a row, they explain how its the consumers' fault, rather than trying to improve a faulty design (running a ground wire to every electrical component rather than bolting it to metal was a bad idea 50 years ago, and guess what? It isn't any better an idea today... way to improve that product, Euro douches).


And did someone really just try and cite Motor Trend?

Allow me to BWAHAHAHAHA!!!!!


You DO realize that Motor Trend has a poerfect record for over 30 years now that their Car of the Year Award goes to the company that purchased the most advertising space the year prior... right? You DID know that, right?


You might notice that I've avoided "best manufacturer" talk. Wasn't the point. The point was, that Joe Consumer knows approximately jack-shit when it comes to long-term vehicle reliability -- every owner treats their ride differently, and until you spend you day under the hood repairing poorly-designed shit, or repair the same inadequacy in the same vehicles over and over again, your opinion doesn't mean shit. There's fucking millions and millions of cars on the road, and YOUR particular experience with one or two is so far below being "insignificant," I'm not sure there's a good word for its insignificance.


Sorry to burst your opinion that you regard so highly, but them's the FACTS. The only people that run up huge miles over the long-term and bring the faults to the forefront are low-income folks and gearheads. That is REALITY. Your 1-in-100,000,000 opinion and never-worked-on-cars-professionally-a-day-in-your-life observations truly are meaningless in the Big Picture.


You've owned 15 vehicles... I've repaired literally thousands and thousands and thousands... another big "HMMMMMM....."

War Wagon wrote:

OCmike wrote: Do you know why Ford stopped making the Escort? It lasted too long.

Right.

You mean before or after the blown head gaskets were replaced?

Escorts were notorious for that.

I drove an Escort for years. The thing was all but bullet proof. I finally traded it in after 175k miles and 9 years on the road, and never had a head gasket or any other major issue of any kind. The one and only problem I had with that car aside from normal wear and tear was the hood latch that shit the bed after 100,000 miles or so.

Dinsdale,

I base my opinion on having worked in a multi-line dealership for five years, and from conversations with a number of different guys who have “repaired literally thousands and thousands and thousands” of vehicles. It’s not that difficult to acquire knowledge on any subject without working years in that particular field.

mvscal wrote:Don't you know that Dinsdale's buddy is a professional farrier

Don't see him much since the Evil Evil bitch bore his spawn, but he was my several times a week fishing buddy for years. Not just a "professional farrier"... he's an internationally recognized master of the craft, like his father before him. Funny how taking some individual honors in the world championships gets you a whole bunch more money per barn-visit. Didn't take top honors, but won a couple of the individual events, and was disqualified from one of the big ones for leaving off a center-punch, which he wasn't in the habit of using, since he believes a center-punched shoe is less cosmetically appealling than a non-punched shoe -- but he should have read the requirements better before that event... dumb mistake.

err mechanic

Worked as a greasemonkey for the better part of a decade, and still know plenty of pro gearheads.

or was it a oenologist

One of my oldest, closest friends. Has a college degree in the shit (University of Cal Davis, the creme-de-la-creme of western-hemispere enology schools). Matter of fact, I seem to remember a wine snob from this very board touting wines he made.

Dude currently made a big jump, and told his dickhead employer (a former college buddy of one Bill Clinton, with party pics to back it up) to fuck off, and is now focused on putting the small ("small" doesn't do it justice at this point) winery he now owns onto the wine-world's radar. The first batch of cab has been released, and it's a big fat ol' Bordeaux. Second year's crush included syrah (NOT "shiraz," you freaking commies), which is looking pretty tasty at this point, too.

or transporter of hazardous materials

I was a loader of hazardous materials for quite a while, and was part of a trained emergency response team should one of those shipments ever find the pavement (it didn't).

no wait, I think it was a master brewer.

Just a hobby. More into drinking it than making it... although, having one of my bestest buddies working in a winery with a full lab at his disposal, sure made brewing a snap. "Child's play compared to winemaking," he'd always tell us.

It's hard to keep up with all these world renowed specialists.

Don't forget experience in water treatment plants and government contracting. I'm sure there's plenty of other things I'm forgetting, too.


Bottom line -- I get out a lot, and you obviously don't. People like me when I do get out, and want to be around me... obviously doesn't apply to you. To each their own.

RevLimiter wrote: I deal with all makes of cars on a daily basis and I'm more qualified to comment on automotive workmanship, reliability, and fit-and-finish that anybody posting on this board

Working at Jiffy Lube does not make you an expert on anything except finding a filter and turning counter-cockwise

Goober McTuber wrote:I base my opinion on having worked in a multi-line dealership for five years, and from conversations with a number of different guys who have “repaired literally thousands and thousands and thousands” of vehicles.

There'ya'go.


You've based your opinions on cars that are at the dealership for warranty repairs and routine service on vehicles that are generally still under factory warranty.


So... this is relevant... how?

Dinsdale wrote:Lots of people think Chrysler products are the bee's knees. With my admittedly unscientific observations, Chrysler owners were BY FAR the leats satisfied customers with the automaker... not even close.

My observation, also unscientific, is that most Chrysler products- certainly all of them built since about 1971 or 72- turn into shitboxes about 20 minutes after being bought and then continue that existence for many years. Service is a waste of time & money because nothing changes

The other make that stood head-and-shoulders above the rest in terms of dissatisfied owners was BMTroubleYou.

As a former BMW owner, I concede the point. Although it's less the quality of the car, than the quality of the service. Having to get the brake fluid flushed & replaced on a yearly basis is one thingie, but it shouldn't be too much to expect that the mechanics could both do the job right, AND not fuck something else up on the car at the same time.

You DO realize that Motor Trend has a poerfect record for over 30 years now that their Car of the Year Award goes to the company that purchased the most advertising space the year prior... right? You DID know that, right?

I thought everybody knew that. But then again, this is T1B we're talking about, so I'll concede yet another point to you.

mvscal wrote:

Dinsdale wrote:Bottom line -- I get out a lot,

16,469 posts says what?

Sin,

16,149 posts

:paul:

One more post by cliffy in this thread and we're all gonna need to don hip boots just to read it.

KC Scott wrote:

mvscal wrote:

Dinsdale wrote:Bottom line -- I get out a lot,

16,469 posts says what?

Sin,

16,149 posts

:paul:

Sin,

3582 Posts

(Just in case I missed the memo where post total smack became cool.)

BSmack wrote: I drove an Escort for years.

You have my sincere condolences. :wink:

Dinsdale wrote:

Goober McTuber wrote:I base my opinion on having worked in a multi-line dealership for five years, and from conversations with a number of different guys who have “repaired literally thousands and thousands and thousands” of vehicles.

There'ya'go.


You've based your opinions on cars that are at the dealership for warranty repairs and routine service on vehicles that are generally still under factory warranty.


So... this is relevant... how?

The majority of their work was non-warranty. More of their work was on older vehicles as the newer ones seldom came in for anything other than oil changes and whatnot. Well, except for one line they handled, the aforementioned BMW. Very expensive fuckers to fix. $600 tune-ups back in the 80’s.

I also learned to appraise used cars from one of the more knowledgeable (and obnoxious) sales managers in this area. He had an encyclopedic knowledge of what common defects every car was known for.

And in case you didn’t understand, I still talk to a number of people who fix cars for a living in private shops, not dealerships.

The Whistle Is Screaming wrote:
Sin,

3582 Posts

(Just in case I missed the memo where post total smack became cool.)

You did -

MVS bagging Dins about Post totals would Like Paul Bagging Bsmack on pants sizes

Fucking RACK a thread full of you old dumbfucks pointlessly arguing.......again.


Riveting shit here. Really.




Update the will and slam the toetag on this fucking place.

War Wagon wrote:

BSmack wrote:I drove an Escort for years.

You have my sincere condolences. :wink:

Why? That thing was the most durable and reliable vehicle I have ever owned. I'm driving a Blazer now and will consider myself lucky if it makes it to 125k, much less the 175k I got out of that Escort under far worse conditions.

KC Scott wrote:

The Whistle Is Screaming wrote:
Sin,

3582 Posts

(Just in case I missed the memo where post total smack became cool.)

You did -

MVS bagging Dins about Post totals would Like Paul Bagging Bsmack on pants sizes

I caught mv's "blast" on Dins, I contemplated a similar post to yours. Since you beat me to it, I figured I'd carry the foolish joke a little further.

mvscal wrote:

KC Scott wrote:MVS bagging Dins about Post totals would Like Paul Bagging Bsmack on pants sizes

He said he gets out a lot. I offered conclusive evidence to the contrary.

Problem with that?

You don't get out much do you?