T1B

Mikey wrote:The electrolyzer has a conversion efficiency of around 50%. The fuel cell has a conversion efficiency of 50% max. So, going from solar electricity to fuel cell electricity you lose at least 75% of what the PV system produces. So, why not just use the PV panels directly.

OK, got me...

Why?



Sin,
Beenstupid4ever

H4ever wrote:I confused nitrogen and hydrogen somewhere in there...

Yes... one burns at an attainable temperature, and one of them is present in the atmosphere.


Every time you try to dig yourself out of the hole, you make it deeper with your next round of dumbfuckery.

I'm actually impressed that you can get a computer to boot up all by yourself (assuming you do).

Martyred wrote:

88 wrote: Chevron is the world's largest producer of geothermal energy:

http://www.chevron.com/deliveringenergy/geothermal/

Chevron wrote: ...steam...

:twisted:

Dinsdale wrote:I've got an idea -- why don't we pump water up hills with electric pumps, then build dams for hydroelectric on the hill?


Sin,
The Hydrogen Advocate4ever

Oddly enough, that is exactly what we do to store excess power already. Water/gravity make the best large capacity battery available.

smackaholic wrote: Oddly enough, that is exactly what we do to store excess power already. Water/gravity make the best large capacity battery available.

In certain places and certain situations, sure. I was working at a much more basic level to ridicule the tard, was all.

I've heard crazy proposals lately -- since our state decided to do the democrat thing (:SHOCKER:), and give huge subsidies to the well-connected wealthy folk who run wind-powered energy companies (there's a reason the world windsurfing championships have always been held in the Gorge), it's been a bit of a problem: the wind blows the hardest when the Columbia (hydroelectric capital of the US) is flowing the most. Last year, there was so much power coming from the BPA dams (which during high river flows, they can't really "shut off"), and no one to buy it (CA and AZ were doing just fine at the time, our two best power-swapping buddies), they ordered the wind farms shut down. WHOA, what a stink that caused with the tit-suckers... they sued (unsuccessfully, IIRC).

But people have brought up ideas to run pipelines from the Creek up Mt Hood (greenies won't like it, despite the minimal impact), and dumping mass water on the upper elevations of Hood, to increase snowpack/glaciation, through pumps that utilize the excess electricity. Still way frozen up there in early spring, and the runoff would come later in the summer, which would keep them big dams humming during the summer. As an added bonus, it would improve fish migration (which is a huge, huge management issue for the BPA, fish vs electricity in summer), and create better irrigation opportunities.

Seems pretty simple and relatively cheap to me (although the tech aspect of pumping water up that high, when there's no power grid at the higher elevations, due to impossibility, could be a logistical problem... Timberline brings fuel in on trucks and runs generators, since neither underground lines or overhead towers are an option there).


Seems like it's worth looking into.

Dinsdale wrote: But people have brought up ideas to run pipelines from the Creek up Mt Hood (greenies won't like it, despite the minimal impact), and dumping mass water on the upper elevations of Hood, to increase snowpack/glaciation, through pumps that utilize the excess electricity. Still way frozen up there in early spring, and the runoff would come later in the summer, which would keep them big dams humming during the summer. As an added bonus, it would improve fish migration (which is a huge, huge management issue for the BPA, fish vs electricity in summer), and create better irrigation opportunities.

Seems pretty simple and relatively cheap to me (although the tech aspect of pumping water up that high, when there's no power grid at the higher elevations, due to impossibility, could be a logistical problem... Timberline brings fuel in on trucks and runs generators, since neither underground lines or overhead towers are an option there).


Seems like it's worth looking into.

That's actually a very great idea. For example, anybody that has ever traveled down I-5 or Hwy-99 below Bakersfield has seen these enormous 4 pipes taking pumped water taken from the farmers over the mountains to SoCal. You don't hear any greenies bitch about that eyesore. BTW, CA is only a Blue state in SFO and LA along with a few seaside communities. Pelosi, Boxer, and Feinstein don't represent the rest of the State.

Atomic Punk wrote:BTW, CA is only a Blue state in SFO and LA along with a few seaside communities. Pelosi, Boxer, and Feinstein don't represent the rest of the State.

Oregon is a ridiculously blue state... in the Valley. The rest is extremely conservative. Unfortunately, the majority of the population lives in the Valley, so theryago.

I don't think the rest of the country realizes that away from the coastal areas, just how banjo-plucking redneck California is. And away from the Willamette Valley, Oregon is even more necky.

As far as piping going up Mt Hood -- stupid greenies chain themselves to trees and shit to stop a gas pipeline (because I guess coal is better, or something) from going through the Mt Hood National Forest... a 12 foot wide swath would have a MONSTER environmental impact.

Don't get me wrong, I speak out loud and proud about serious environmental concerns in my great land, and have since long before the transplants tried to make that activity "cool" -- but I also don't sweat the inconsequential stuff, like cutting a 12 foot swath through millions of acres of forest... I kind of like money and heat, as well as the environment.

Dinsdale wrote:I've heard crazy proposals lately -- since our state decided to do the democrat thing (:SHOCKER:), and give huge subsidies to the well-connected wealthy folk who run wind-powered energy companies (there's a reason the world windsurfing championships have always been held in the Gorge), it's been a bit of a problem: the wind blows the hardest when the Columbia (hydroelectric capital of the US) is flowing the most. Last year, there was so much power coming from the BPA dams (which during high river flows, they can't really "shut off"), and no one to buy it (CA and AZ were doing just fine at the time, our two best power-swapping buddies), they ordered the wind farms shut down. WHOA, what a stink that caused with the tit-suckers... they sued (unsuccessfully, IIRC).

That's right, BPA won and didn't have to compensate the wind generators for their lost tax credits, which is about the only money the windies make, i.e., they suck up tax dollars.

But people have brought up ideas to run pipelines from the Creek up Mt Hood (greenies won't like it, despite the minimal impact), and dumping mass water on the upper elevations of Hood, to increase snowpack/glaciation, through pumps that utilize the excess electricity. Still way frozen up there in early spring, and the runoff would come later in the summer, which would keep them big dams humming during the summer. As an added bonus, it would improve fish migration (which is a huge, huge management issue for the BPA, fish vs electricity in summer), and create better irrigation opportunities.

Hood's runoff has zero effect on any of the Columbia's dams. Well, maybe Bonneville to some small extent. You'd have to pump that water up to BC, Canada to have it affect the Columbia's dams.

DrDetroit wrote:Hood's runoff has zero effect on any of the Columbia's dams. Well, maybe Bonneville to some small extent.

Trying to educate me on lower Columbia geography/topography?


Really?


It's also coupled with the very longstanding, albeit omitted from the initail post (in the rare instance of moderated brevity from me) plan to fill the caverns in the desert with the excess runoff in winter.

Add to that the "stacking" effect of filling the Bonneville Pool (yeah, I know you didn't know what it was called) on the impoundments upstream.

Try again, neophyte.

And think carefully before you want to start talking U&L issues with me -- I've forgotten more than you've learned.
You are everything that's wrong with my town -- know-it-all transplant idiots. I'm surprised you haven't started voting straight D yet. Would certainly fit the persona you're quickly adopting... don't integrate -- dictate. Us natives are surely a bunch of rubes who know nothing about our home, right?

You are the problem.

Not educating, informing to be polite. I thought I was posting an accurate observation about Hood's runoff and it's effect on the Columbia dams. Topography and geography? Nah.

I'd say trust me as I am now working for a certain, large power marketing administration out here, but you wouldn't believe me anyway. Nonetheless, I'm working alongside the guys who patented streamflow analysis software and next to guys who forecast runoff here in the PacNW. When I first got here and made a silly comment about Hood's late growing snowpack affecting the river, yeah, I was put in my place.

So, all I was pointing out was the Hood's runoff has very little effect on the Columbia dams, except perhaps for a small part at Bonneville.

If you want to disagree with that, go ahead. But whining about me teaching you U&L topography and geopgraphy, take it someplace else. The sniveling is remining me what I don't like about Portland.

Dinsdale wrote:

Atomic Punk wrote:BTW, CA is only a Blue state in SFO and LA along with a few seaside communities. Pelosi, Boxer, and Feinstein don't represent the rest of the State.

Oregon is a ridiculously blue state... in the Valley. The rest is extremely conservative. Unfortunately, the majority of the population lives in the Valley, so theryago.

I don't think the rest of the country realizes that away from the coastal areas, just how banjo-plucking redneck California is. And away from the Willamette Valley, Oregon is even more necky.

As far as piping going up Mt Hood -- stupid greenies chain themselves to trees and shit to stop a gas pipeline (because I guess coal is better, or something) from going through the Mt Hood National Forest... a 12 foot wide swath would have a MONSTER environmental impact.

Don't get me wrong, I speak out loud and proud about serious environmental concerns in my great land, and have since long before the transplants tried to make that activity "cool" -- but I also don't sweat the inconsequential stuff, like cutting a 12 foot swath through millions of acres of forest... I kind of like money and heat, as well as the environment.

I don't understand Oregon politics and why it's such a Blue State. The rednecks up there hate Californian transplants. It is well known in my redneck area that they hate Californians so why is it so Blue up there. I love Oregon and it's a great place.

I can imagine those like TVO, Mikey, m2, etc. fitting the criteria to be loathed and stereo typed, but what about us real Californians that make up most of the State that get blown off by our politicians?

Since I grew up in a farming community, they are letting mass crops die because of water rights. The only good that comes from it is that many illegals from south of the border are going back south. I've heard this from local farmers and it was even a special episode show on Hannity where he was here showing just that.

DrDetroit wrote:The sniveling is remining me what I don't like about Portland.

We wouldn't bitch if you transplants weren't such arrogant douchebags.

The Midwesterners being by far the worst... hands down.

At least we can kind of relate to the Calis. Least Coasters are shut-in idiots with no clue how to live outside of a building, but at least they don't douche it up as hard as the Flyovers.


AP -- we don't, nor have we ever, including the Great Migration of the late 80's/early 90's, have a problem with the redneck Calis. Even most of the non-radical NoCals. Because they didn't show up and start telling us how to live. It's been hard, starting with my early adulthood, watching this place become a refugee camp for disgruntled dickheads who want to build their utopia... at my expense. Used to be such an awesome place, with awesome people. WShile I'll still take it over anywhere else, I just wish the "keep Portland weird" crowd (like they have any fucking clue) would go back where they came from, and let us do our "progressive redneck" thing like the Old Days.

Well, I would love to catch fish there one day but not go hiking on a damn mountain with freezing temps and high winds. Darwin catches those idiots better than most fishermen could catch salmon.

Oregon being a Blue state like Cali is a farce. The people and especially farmers here are pissed off and Romney wins in spite of this idiot in charge. Is the Electoral college like the BCS?

Wolfman wrote:The 1950's saw many really bad storms. Among them was Hurricane Hazel in 1954. I was 15 at the time . . .

Is that in decades or centuries?

I have to say the Columbia and Bonneville is pretty awesome when they have all the tainter gates open.



This was in early July of this year.

atomicdad wrote:I have to say the Columbia and Bonneville is pretty awesome when they have all the tainter gates open.

Gets really "awesome" when you're in a small boat on the hook (that's "anchored") sitting below it when the tide changes.

Can get a wee bit crazy. Better have a bunch of rope out.

Atomic Punk wrote:
I can imagine those like TVO, Mikey, m2, etc. fitting the criteria to be loathed and stereo typed, but what about us real Californians that make up most of the State that get blown off by our politicians?

Real Californians like you?



You're so right. Nothing to loathed and stereotyped about narcissistic pantie wearing faggots who type with two fingers while blundering around on the keyboard trying to make complete sentences.

Us real Californians wouldn't do that. You see we're known for our tolerance and inclusiveness here.

What type of stereo do you have, BTW?

Mikey wrote: Us real Californians wouldn't do that. You see we're known for our tolerance and inclusiveness here.

Thanks to liberal douchebags like yourself, we are also known for high taxes, fiscally irresponsible government, and a very unfriendly business environment.

thanks a lot fuckface.

Mikey wrote:

Atomic Punk wrote:
I can imagine those like TVO, Mikey, m2, etc. fitting the criteria to be loathed and stereo typed, but what about us real Californians that make up most of the State that get blown off by our politicians?

Real Californians like you?



You're so right. Nothing to loathed and stereotyped about narcissistic pantie wearing faggots who type with two fingers while blundering around on the keyboard trying to make complete sentences.

Us real Californians wouldn't do that. You see we're known for our tolerance and inclusiveness here.

You calling me a faggot then saying "us Californians" are tolerant? Morbidly obese and bald Mikey is on a roll. I can say that since we've had a beer together here with others here in Fresneck and it seemed to be a cool time.

Dang, I hope I didn't make another spelling or grammar error.

Sirfindafold wrote:

Mikey wrote: Us real Californians wouldn't do that. You see we're known for our tolerance and inclusiveness here.

Thanks to liberal douchebags like yourself, we are also known for high taxes, fiscally irresponsible government, and a very unfriendly business environment.

thanks a lot fuckface.

If I had any idea you were a Californian I certainly would have asked my mom to bear me somewhere else.

Atomic Punk wrote:
Dang, I hope I didn't make another spelling or grammar error.

If you did you can be sure I'll find it.

You calling me a faggot then saying "us Californians" are tolerant?

I didn't call you a faggot. I just said that us real Californians wouldn't hold it against you if you were.

Mikey wrote:

Atomic Punk wrote:
Dang, I hope I didn't make another spelling or grammar error.

If you did you can be sure I'll find it.

You calling me a faggot then saying "us Californians" are tolerant?

I didn't call you a faggot. I just said that us real Californians wouldn't hold it against you if you were.

No, you called me a faggot then claimed "us Californians" (meaning you are the authority/representitive) are tolerant.

Me calling you bald and morbidly obese is more on point if I were to get into personal name calling. You know I would never go there.

Atomic Punk wrote:
No, you called me a faggot then claimed "us Californians" (meaning you are the authority/representitive) are tolerant.

Me calling you bald and morbidly obese is more on point if I were to get into personal name calling. You know I would never go there.

Of course you wouldn't.

In any case, I'd rather be fat and bald than widely known as a serial deviant and potential hermaphrodite.

Mikey wrote:

Atomic Punk wrote:
No, you called me a faggot then claimed "us Californians" (meaning you are the authority/representitive) are tolerant.

Me calling you bald and morbidly obese is more on point if I were to get into personal name calling. You know I would never go there.

Of course you wouldn't.

In any case, I'd rather be fat and bald than widely known as a serial deviant and potential hermaphrodite.

I am much happier being none of the above. Carrion.

I'm not nearly that fat. The bald part is pretty close, though.

Mikey is very tolerant. He votes for this:

Pelosi holds secret fundraiser with Islamists, Hamas-linked groups

http://dailycaller.com/2012/11/02/pelos ... ed-groups/

trev wrote:Mikey is very tolerant. He votes for this:

Pelosi holds secret fundraiser with Islamists, Hamas-linked groups

Mikey has been lying to us, and actually lives in San Francisco?


Nice troll job, Mikey. The pics of some dude's house in Fallbrook (or wherever the fuck it is) that you randomly googled, and even stole his solar pics... great work there.

I bought it, all the way.

Dinsdale wrote:

trev wrote:Mikey is very tolerant. He votes for this:

Pelosi holds secret fundraiser with Islamists, Hamas-linked groups

Mikey has been lying to us, and actually lives in San Francisco?


Nice troll job, Mikey. The pics of some dude's house in Fallbrook (or wherever the fuck it is) that you randomly googled, and even stole his solar pics... great work there.

I bought it, all the way.

Sucker.

We actually had a Lebanese guy as our Congressman, until he got re-districted out of our neighborhood.

I never voted for him though.

Mikey wrote:

Atomic Punk wrote:
No, you called me a faggot then claimed "us Californians" (meaning you are the authority/representitive) are tolerant.

Me calling you bald and morbidly obese is more on point if I were to get into personal name calling. You know I would never go there.

Of course you wouldn't.

In any case, I'd rather be fat and bald than widely known as a serial deviant and potential hermaphrodite.

Oh, there you go. You are supposed to be a representative of "us Californians" and known for being tolerant. Look at your childish name calling and slanderous statement. It's mean and hurtful. This is an outrage!

I'm offended quite frankly.

88 wrote: Based upon what I witnessed in Cleveland's House of Blues last night, a fat and bald dude can totally dominate:

RACK "The D" and all reference to "KG".

3. No one was using oil 150 years ago for anything significant, and there is no reason to expect that 150 years from now, we would continue to use it (assuming scientific advances continue at the same pace). Since we have hundreds of years of it, why not use it now?

This is why I'm not going down the rabbit hole with you or Dims. We all know that only Luddites and people making $ from FF still pimp them. Their days are numbered. Their real cost is way higher than a few bicks a gallon and a lot of that cost past on to nonusers And low volume users. They are dirty and toxic. Science is not on their side and it is time to start saving what is left for something besides burning.

Moron.

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