T1B

Zionism is a political movement organically associated with international imperialism and antagonistic to all action for liberation and to progressive movements in the world. It is racist and fanatic in its nature, aggressive, expansionist, and colonial in its aims, and fascist in its methods. Israel is the instrument of the Zionist movement, and geographical base for world imperialism placed strategically in the midst of the Arab homeland to combat the hopes of the Arab nation for liberation, unity, and progress. Israel is a constant source of threat vis-a-vis peace in the Middle East and the whole world. Since the liberation of Palestine will destroy the Zionist and imperialist presence and will contribute to the establishment of peace in the Middle East, the Palestinian people look for the support of all the progressive and peaceful forces and urge them all, irrespective of their affiliations and beliefs, to offer the Palestinian people all aid and support in their just struggle for the liberation of their homeland.
http://philip.greenspun.com/politics/israel/

mvscal wrote:

Yeah, I'm sure they'll be helpless before the "might" of Hamas.

How can anybody who is Jewish vote for a Democrat!

frodo_biguns wrote: How can anybody who is Jewish vote for a Democrat! :?

See You Next Wednesday wrote:

frodo_biguns wrote: How can anybody who is Jewish vote for a Democrat! :?

I dunno, because the Dems have traditionally been the party that has most strongly supported Israel?

The Israelis are simply fortunate that Muslims are even more loathsome and detestable than they are.

PSUFAN wrote:

The Israelis are simply fortunate that Muslims are even more loathsome and detestable than they are.

rackable

Dinsdale wrote:
And how is it that the Palestinians can't run out into the street and celebrate fast enough when some evil befalls America or Americans...

mvscal wrote:

BSmack wrote:

See You Next Wednesday wrote: I dunno, because the Dems have traditionally been the party that has most strongly supported Israel?

I shot Bobby Kennedy because he didn't support Isreal.

sin

Sirhan Sirhan

What the fuck are you talking about? He shot him:

A. Because he was crazy as a shithouse rat

B. Because Kennedy did support Israel during the Six Days War.

sarcasim

Martyred wrote:
How is it that Americans don't know how heavily they're being propagandized?

Hamas won. Get over it.

PSUFAN wrote:

sarcasim

will that harm my ghusl?

mvscal wrote:[obligatoryGannonreset]You bet![/obligatoryGannonreset]

See You Next Wednesday wrote:

frodo_biguns wrote: How can anybody who is Jewish vote for a Democrat! :?

I dunno, because the Dems have traditionally been the party that has most strongly supported Israel?

Records and highlights
The Is Air Force is considered the strongest air force in the Middle East, and one of the best and most sophisticated in the world. The Israeli air force is more powerful than those of all of the Arab armies put together. Many of Israel's most technologically advanced warplanes are of American origin, such as the F-16 Fighter Jet. The economic aid Israel receives from the USA is, therefore, a primary reason for the Israeli Airforce's superiority in the Middle East. However, the greatest strength of the IAF is the skill of its pilots. Israeli combat pilots are considered the best in the world, and hold a large number of shoot-down records. It is interesting to note that American pilots receive training from their Israeli counterparts as part of their training curriculum. Many of the IAF's electronics and weapons systems are developed and built in Israel by Israeli Military Industries and Israeli Aircraft Industries.

The following is a report that reveals some of the skills of the IAF pilots:

"Israeli air force pilots handily beat their German counterparts in "dogfights" in the first ever air force exercise between the two countries, an Israeli military official said Monday. The Israeli F-15 pilots, aided by special technology that Israel does not share or sell to other countries, beat the Germans by more than 100 "hits," said the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity. In the past, Israel has beaten American air force pilots by similar margins, the officials added. Israel purchases U.S. warplanes without battle technology, installing its own locally made systems into the aircraft. The exercise was conducted over the past two weeks in the skies of Sardinia in Italy." [1]
According to the IAF website:

687 enemy airplanes have been shot down in dogfights since Israel`s birth. Only 23 Israeli planes have been shot down by enemy planes since 1948 - a statistic which puts the dogfight victory ratio between Israel and its Arab neighbors at a whopping 30:1.

The IAF is holding world records at the amounts of enemy's warplanes shoot-downs, air combats, special operations, and air to ground operations at the jet era.

Some of the records and highlight moments are as follows:

June 5, 1967 - the Six Day War: The destruction of the entire Egyptian air-force within 3 hours. By the end of the day the Syrian and Jordanian air forces were wiped out as well. The IAF shoot-down total at the end of the war was a claimed record of 451 enemy aircraft downed versus of its own 10 downed. See: Operation Red Sheet.

March, 1969 until August, 1970- the War of Attrition: 111 enemy warplanes were shot-down in dogfights by IAF pilots while only 4 IAF warplanes were shot down in dogfights by enemy pilots.

Also, during the Cold War the Soviet Union held close relationships with the Arab nations - On July 30, 1970 the tension peaked: A large scale air brawl between IAF planes and MiGs flown by Soviet pilots occurred- 5 MiGs flown by Soviet pilots were shot down, while the IAF suffered no losses.

October 9, 1973- the Yom Kippur War: The destruction of the Syrian General Staff in Damascus: On October 9th 1973, two F-4 Phantom quartets attacked and destroyed the Syrian General Staff Headquarters in the heart of Damascus. The Syrian Air Force Headquarters were damaged as well.

Also, during the Yom Kippur War, the IAF shot-downed 277 enemy warplanes- accounting for over a third of the IAF`s total kills since 1948.
Obtaining the first shoot-downs for the American fighter jets, the F-15 and the F-16. [2]
June 7, 1981 - Operation Babylon: The destruction of the Iraqi Osiraq nuclear reactor. Eight IAF F-16 fighters flew to Iraq and bombed the nuclear facilties of Osiraq. Among the pilots that took part in the attack was the late Ilan Ramon, Israel's first astronaut.
June 8, 1982 - Operation Peace for Galilee: The destruction of the entire Soviet-Syrian air-defence system in Lebanon within few hours without a single warplane lost; Syria with the U.S.S.R built up an overlapping network of surface-to-air missiles, and the density of SAM site locations was unmatched anywhere in the world including the U.S.S.R. itself. Also the IAF achieved in dogfights a total of 80 Syrian planes shoot-downs, without a single Israeli plane being shot down.

October 1, 1985 - Operation Wooden Leg: The bombing of PLO Headquarters in Tunis, Tunisia, the longest combat mission ever undertaken by the IAF: 2300 kilometers, involving in flight refueling by an IAF Boeing 707..
Israeli F-15 after losing wing.The only documented successful emergency landing of an F-15 with one wing, the other torn off after an airborne collision with an A-4 Skyhawk. The Skyhawk exploded and its pilot ejected. McDonnell-Douglas, the F-15 Manufacturer, refused to believe it was possible until photos of the incident were shown. The F-15 was restored to flight status.
"Ace" pilots: 39 IAF pilots shot down at least 5 jet planes, 10 out of them shot down at least 8 jet planes.

"Ace of Aces": Major General Giora Epstein shot down 17 (seventeen) jet planes, holding the world record of jets shot down.
126 enemy planes were shot down in dogfights in the years between the wars - most of them in the 70`s. The IAF lost only 2 planes in dogfights between the wars, in 1959 and in 1964.

Bizzarofelice wrote:What Dinsdale said. We've got our puppet in Iraq. Let Israel fend for itself, or get money from other Jewloving countries.

Bizzarofelice wrote:We've got our puppet in Iraq.

Martyred wrote:You'll stop giving aid to Israel when Israel says so.
Not a minute sooner.

mvscal wrote:This idea is clearly the product of an idiot. It's up to the IDF to ensure the safety of Israel not some UN clusterfuck. We just stop sending them money. They don't depend on it and they don't need it.

fraudo_biguns wrote:Not in the past 20 years they haven't! Remember it was our military equipment we sold to Israel under Nixon, Ford an Reagan & Bush 41 that beat the snot out of the Arabs. While Carter worked on treaties and cutting their arms supply from the United States.

RadioFan wrote:

fraudo_biguns wrote:Not in the past 20 years they haven't! Remember it was our military equipment we sold to Israel under Nixon, Ford an Reagan & Bush 41 that beat the snot out of the Arabs. While Carter worked on treaties and cutting their arms supply from the United States.

U.S. policy toward Israel and its neighbors has changed little since the '67 war, no matter who has been in the White House.

But then again, you remain a gibbering dumbfuck, so really no surprise to see you trying to spin some sort of partisan drivel into policy that hasn't changed much in nearly four decades.

RadioFag wrote:

froudo_biguns History Major Extraordinaire wrote:Not in the past 20 years they haven't! Remember it was our military equipment we sold to Israel under Nixon, Ford an Reagan & Bush 41 that beat the snot out of the Arabs. While Carter worked on treaties and cutting their arms supply from the United States.

U.S. policy toward Israel and its neighbors has changed little since the '67 war, no matter who has been in the White House.

But then again, you remain a gibbering dumbfuck, so really no surprise to see you trying to spin some sort of partisan drivel into policy that hasn't changed much in nearly four decades.

Terry's in Crap Chester wrote:

RadioFag wrote:

fraudo_biguns wrote:Not in the past 20 years they haven't! Remember it was our military equipment we sold to Israel under Nixon, Ford an Reagan & Bush 41 that beat the snot out of the Arabs. While Carter worked on treaties and cutting their arms supply from the United States.

U.S. policy toward Israel and its neighbors has changed little since the '67 war, no matter who has been in the White House.

But then again, you remain a gibbering dumbfuck, so really no surprise to see you trying to spin some sort of partisan drivel into policy that hasn't changed much in nearly four decades.

Rack.

fraudo_biguns wrote:Why do you continue to show your ineptitude in topics that relate to history! I bet your brain feels as good as new, seeing that you've never used it. If you knew what you're talking about, you'd be dangerous. I suggest you need Mark Twain's advice; "It is better to be silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt."

Sin....USS LIBERTY

You... taking me on in HISTORY!!!!!!!!!! BWWWWWWWHAHAHAHAAAAA!!!!!
Get Real!!!

Sincerely,
Frodo
History Major Extraordinaire

Martyred wrote:Oh yeah, I forgot. Somehow all of Israel's enemies and threat sources are miraculously and magically also America's...

Diogenes wrote:Incorrect, after the dems repudiation of Soviet containment, Carter's policies towards Israel was a prime reason the so-called 'neo-cons' (my fellow liberals actually) defected ti the GOP en masse in the late seventies/early eighties.

RadioFan wrote:

Diogenes wrote:Incorrect, after the dems repudiation of Soviet containment, Carter's policies towards Israel was a prime reason the so-called 'neo-cons' (my fellow liberals actually) defected ti the GOP en masse in the late seventies/early eighties.

And history is still the judge of that policy. In no way has it been decided. Last time I checked, one can still venture freely to the Western Wall, and place a piece of paper with a prayer on it, then walk 20 minutes and see the Rock of the Dome and be amazed.

Internal U.S. political bullshit and and Hamas be damned, United States Policy -- with carrots and sticks, has worked so far.

Diogenes wrote:...the so-called 'neo-cons' (my fellow liberals actually)

Diogenes wrote:Incorrect, after the dems repudiation of Soviet containment, Carter's policies towards Israel was a prime reason the so-called 'neo-cons' (my fellow liberals actually) defected ti the GOP en masse in the late seventies/early eighties.[/b]

Martyred wrote:

Diogenes wrote:...the so-called 'neo-cons' (my fellow liberals actually)

Yeah...liberals...


Sincerely,

Dr_Phibes wrote:

Diogenes wrote:Incorrect, after the dems repudiation of Soviet containment, Carter's policies towards Israel was a prime reason the so-called 'neo-cons' (my fellow liberals actually) defected ti the GOP en masse in the late seventies/early eighties.

Cheers, Dio. So in other words they're Zionists.

Dr_Phibes wrote:Yes, but that's an anachronism. A strange thing to base a modern foreign policy upon, yes? Small wonder everything's gone pear shaped, this isn't 1979.

Dr_Phibes wrote:Yes, but that's an anachronism. A strange thing to base a modern foreign policy upon, yes?