T1B

Had two of the kids in suits stop by today. Since they seemed genuinely nice and my own two children were within earshot, I politely told them I was danged happy with my religion of choice and shooed them away.

Those nutjobs had their cult started about an hour from here, and each year a ton of 'em show up top watch the music & laser show that dramatizes the utter 100% bullshit made up by Joseph Smith in one of his alcoholic frenzies.

One of the things (aside from their whackass religious views) that shows them to be complete intellectual idjits is their acceptance of the Book of Mormon. Now, the Judeo-Christian Bible has some stuff in it that most of us recognize as scientifically inaccurate but that we don't worry about because we understand that folks 2,000-5,000 years ago didn't have the scientific "know-how" that we do.

The Book of Mor(m)on, OTOH, purports to describe events that occurred more recently and are therefore more easily checked for veracity.

I lifted a copy of the book from a Marriot we were staying at during a fraternity convention and made a point of reading it.

What a freaking load of bullshit from page 1 onward.

Never mind the fact that there's not a shred of anthropological or archeological evidence to support Smith's claims that Jesus appeared to Native Americans, or that Native Americans are a 'Lost Tribe of Israel," or that Native Americans of the time were smelting ore to make suits of armor and swords to fight their (completely made up) battle. Oh, and Smith had them riding horses...which weren't here.

We've found freaking MASTODON BONES here but nary a trace of this epic "Lord of the Rings" battle in which everyone died.

What is truly scary is how fast this frigging pseudo-Christian cult has spread.

Criminy, between Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, Scientology, and spiritualism, America has created and exported some pretty frigging stupid religious crap to the rest of the world.

Fuckin' RACK.

See that kid in a wheelchair? He's flawed because he's a SINNER.

--The Book of Mor(m)on

Born with brown or tan skin? That's because you're a SINNER.

--The Book of Mor(m)on

The kids that knocked on your door - they are making the effort because GOD asked them to - he requires it of them. Their efforts are eventually for naught, though, because if you weren't born into the Church, you already are destined for Damnation.

--The Book of Mor(m)on

Did Philip K. Dick ghostwrite The Book of Mor(m)on? It damnsure seems like it.

"Traditional Christians" being...what? Catholics? Quakers? Coptics? Hebridean Presbyterians?

PSUFAN wrote:"Traditional Christians" being...what? Catholics? Quakers? Coptics? Hebridean Presbyterians?

I think he just meant anyone who believes in something greater than himself.

What I don't get though is that Mormons pretty much subscribe to everything mv espouses other than there being a God. I would think that he of all people would kind of like 'em. I mean they both hate anyone that isn't an albino and neither of them think you are going to heaven, PSU. :idea:

mvscal wrote:I fail to see any meaningful difference between Mormons and traditional Christians.

Then you haven't looked hard enough.

At least the Judeo-Christian Bible has events and people in it that actually existed. Yeah, a lot of us buy into a literal Adam & Eve, but I'm not one of those. Jesus, Paul, Peter, etc. were all real. There really was a Roman Empire, centurians, etc.

The level to which 'traditional" Christians accept or get past the scientific and historical 'oopsies' is denominational.

The fairy tales that Mormons buy into are so incredibly recent timelinewise (ok, I made up a word) that it sheer credulity and cultlike adoration for them to say they that the "BoM" is in any way, shape, or form, accurate. I mean, there's shit in there that is absolutely scientifically WRONG - Jesus never appeared to Indians. there were no honeybees here 'til the Euros brought 'em, the Indians didn't have horses 'til the Spaniards brought 'em (the earlier horses died out long before Indians could get them), Indians did not make suits or armor or steel swords, etc.

The entire book shows how ONE guy made the shit up from his poor scientific knowledge and a bad version of the KJV.

Oh, and the early Mormons were cheats and counterfeiters. They used to get arrested for theft and passing their "funny money" in Geneseo.

Joseph Smith was a frigging con-man who pieced together bad schooling, Masonic ritual, and his delusions of grandeur and lust for chicks and power into the 19th century version of Scientology.

The only difference between Smith and Crowley was that Aleister admitted that he was a con-man...

mvscal wrote:You're all delusional nutters.

To each their own, I suppose...

mvscal wrote:So the Book of Mormon was the product of ONE guy who made a bunch of shit up vs the Bible which was the product of MANY guys making a bunch of shit up.

To a certain point, we agree.

However, a lot of the stuff that we'd both agree lump into "making shit up:" Garden of Eden, giants, the flood and the ark, etc. can be categorized as mythology lifted from other cultures. By the time you get to the New Testament, actual (historically provable) people and events show up. No one disputes that Pilate was real, or Herod, Peter, etc. You can dispute miracles, but even you have to admit that historians concede that the main players in the NT were real.

Contrast that to the Book of Mormon, which was wholly fabricated by Smith. Not a single person or event in it has been historically, scientifically, archeologically, genetically substantiated. The whole damned thing was completely made up -people, events- by that lushbag Smith.

The Mor(m)ons are distilled nutters.

PSUFAN wrote:The Mor(m)ons are distilled nutters.

That goes a long way towards explaining John Stockton's shorts.

I used to work in the town that was the birthplace of the Mormon religion. You'd see them all over one weekend in the summer (usually late July or early August) for the Hill Cumorah Pageant.

We used to have some Mormons that would come around our house. They came in handy once. My wife got an antique dresser from one of her friends, free if we took it away. Anyway, the damn thing must have weighed well over 100 pounds, we're lifting it up our porch steps without a lot of success, when along come 4 male Mormon missionaries, late teens or so. They offer to help us, and lift it up as easily as I'd lift a pillow, and carry it up to the second floor. All I had to do was tell them where to put it.

Later that day my wife sends me out to rake the yard (this is in October) when they come by and ask if they can help. By that time I'm feeling kind of guilty for already having taken advantage of their help, so I politely decline.

Btw, whenever the Mormons came over, my wife was always sure to offer them beer, wine, soda or coffee.

And let's not forget the famous "Magic Underwear!"

Good Mormon :)

I disagree with most of the theology of Mormons, but after spending a week in Provo last month...gotta give the folks credit they have at least the "cheery" thing down. We took a bunch of students to a huge (900 students from 50 schools) activity for landscape and horticulture workshops and competitions...and the BYU students were the hosts. Talk about clockwork! Every single thing started on time and when we needed a ride, a BYU student volunteer showed up in a van with a smile. Even our division head who is one of the most positive folks I have ever met said something like, "You ever get the feeling that the students all get a personality implant when they get here? They are all almost TOO nice."

Only bad thing about the whole deal was that all the students left the night time events early because there was not alcohol on campus events.

Diogenes wrote:At least they aren't as intolerant, bigoted and simpleminded as atheists.

Then again, who is?

The people who don't come knocking at my door to give me some "good news."

I don't NEED any fucking GOOD NEWS, from atheists nor anyone else.

Upon 40+ years on this Earth, I've yet to have an atheist come knocking at my door, yet I've had Baptists and Mormons around and others. How many atheists have you had knocking on your door, dio?

Diogenes wrote:They don't need to knock on the door, they have the Supreme Court misinterpreting the first amendment to make their faith the law of the land. You can't get away from their inability to allow any public expression of faith by anyone anywhere. The whole "wall of seperation" bullshit was created to keep said Mormons from practicing their faith in the 19th century, based on the 'fact' that only gooks and darkies believed in polygamy. White people were supposed to be above such things.

And just because you think you don't need the Good News....

Alcoholics don't need AA either. Until they do.

I helped you out with the Dio ... now,

You've GOT to be kidding me.

Let's get this straight. You're arguing that it's perfectly OK for nutjubs to come and knock and your and my doors, our neighbors's doors ... wake up our dogs ... not to mention the chickenshit yappy dogs of our neighbors, just so some nutjob can tell me the "GOOD NEWS?"

Don't get me wrong, I don't think it should be illegal, not at all, Dio. Hell, I welcome anyone and everyone at my door.

But aside from insulting my intelligence, with "The Good News" by some fucking moron in a suit, in a way, I kinda feel sorry for these idiots.

I was asking though, when was the last time you had an atheist, literally, come to your door, with the "Good News?"

Btw, personally, it is a complete insult to my intelligence when any of these assholes come to my door to try to tell a non church-going Catholic, who's been to Israel about the "Good News."

I basically tell them, "Hey! Ever heard of Fyodor Dostoyevsky?" Most of the time it's wide-eyed tardism, followed by the inevitable "Huh," or the insightful, "What?"

Then I tell them, "Yeah, it's an author, you know, one of those people who writes books. Your church may have burned a few, back in the 1950s."

Followed by a manatory, "HA HA HA. That's funny. But you haven't heard about how we've changed."

And my reply is, always: "And you haven't read "'The Grand Inquisitor', it's a chapter in "The brothers Karamazov," by Dostoyevsky, you know, the author I mentioned. Read it, and get back to me."

Tards at the door: "But ... "

Me: "READ IT and get back to me, so we can TALK ABOUT IT."

Them: "Ok."

Me: "Bye."


I've never had one of these "Good News" posers come back after the Dostoyevsky challenge. Ever. Too bad, too.

RadioFan wrote:

Diogenes wrote:They don't need to knock on the door, they have the Supreme Court misinterpreting the first amendment to make their faith the law of the land. You can't get away from their inability to allow any public expression of faith by anyone anywhere. The whole "wall of seperation" bullshit was created to keep said Mormons from practicing their faith in the 19th century, based on the 'fact' that only gooks and darkies believed in polygamy. White people were supposed to be above such things.

And just because you think you don't need the Good News....

Alcoholics don't need AA either. Until they do.

I helped you out with the Dio ... now,

You've GOT to be kidding me.

Let's get this straight. You're arguing that it's perfectly OK for nutjubs to come and knock and your and my doors, our neighbors's doors ... wake up our dogs ... not to mention the chickenshit yappy dogs of our neighbors, just so some nutjob can tell me the "GOOD NEWS?"

Don't get me wrong, I don't think it should be illegal, not at all, Dio. Hell, I welcome anyone and everyone at my door.

But aside from insulting my intelligence, with "The Good News" by some fucking moron in a suit, in a way, I kinda feel sorry for these idiots.

I was asking though, when was the last time you had an atheist, literally, come to your door, with the "Good News?"

I think you missed my earlier point...

They're better than your typical atheist. I wouldn't be to worried about them starting any French Revolution/Khmer Rouge type "kill everyone who we think might disagree with us" reigns of terror or opening any gulags if they ever gained power. They'd just bore us all to tears. And if they want to have seven wives, so fucking what? Seven times the headaches for them.

If you don't want your door knocked on, put up a sign. If they knock anyway, sic the dogs on them.

They are an annoyance at worst. When atheists get power, they are a menace. Whether they knock on doors or just break them down. You should read Camus' The Rebal.

Diogenes wrote:I think you missed my earlier point...

They're better than your typical atheist. I wouldn't be to worried about them starting any French Revolution/Khmer Rouge type "kill everyone who we think might disagree with us" reigns of terror or opening any gulags if they ever gained power. They'd just bore us all to tears. And if they want to have seven wives, so fucking what? Seven times the headaches for them.

True, only aeithists don't come knocking at my door.

Diogenes wrote:If you don't want your door knocked on, put up a sign. If they knock anyway, sic the dogs on them.

I do. :twisted:

And I take my labs in the Bronco with me, all the time now. They've probably saved me, at least twice, from freaks determined to fuck with me until they suddendly realized I had dogs in the vehicle. It's amazing how people with fuck with you when you're alone ... but when you have dogs in a vehicle, it's pretty freakin cool, especially when they're labs, who will put their lives on the line for you. People will mess with strangers, but they won't mess with dogs, especially dogs that are bent on protecting their master.

Diogenes wrote:They are an annoyance at worst.

Yeah, I know. I don't really mind, outside of idiots insulting my intelligence with thier knock-on-door tardism, and not knowing who they are dealing with. :twisted:

Diogenes wrote:When atheists get power, they are a menace. Whether they knock on doors or just break them down. You should read Camus' The Rebal.

Absolutely. And I will.

Most of the Mormons I've actually known have been great people. I can never understand why they can be beholden to such claptrap as the Book of Mor(m)on. The only conclusion that makes sense to me is that they haven't read the damn thing.

Mike the Lab Rat wrote:Criminy, between Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, Scientology, and spiritualism, America has created and exported some pretty frigging stupid religious crap to the rest of the world.

Agreed. But, although probably the most numerous, the Mormons (or even the Jehovah's Witnesses, for that matter) are far from the worst of the lot. The worst of the worst, at least among those who still exist (that criterion eliminates the Branch Davidians and Jim Jones' Guyana cult), imho:

1. Scientologists: Greedy, amoral bastards who will wrench the last dime out of their "believers'", ERRR, vitims' hands.

2. Moonies: Kidnap young people, forcibly separate them from their family and friends, tell them that these people want to kill them, then marry them to strangers.

PSUFAN wrote:Most of the Mormons I've actually known have been great people. I can never understand why they can be beholden to such claptrap as the Book of Mor(m)on. The only conclusion that makes sense to me is that they haven't read the damn thing.

I'll agree with this. We've had some Mormons come and visit us, after I was dumb enough to sign up for some genealogy information at the State Fair. I'm sure these people all believe I'm going straight to hell, but they were certainly nice to me. Couldn't understand why people who otherwise seemed reasonably intelligent could believe the Book of Mormon, though.

Scientology

I'm all for burning these crack pots at the stake. Starting with Tom Cruise and every other.... fuck that, I'm for burning all of Hollywood at the stake. It's fire and brimstone time. I'm making my list and starting with Scientology and then I'm moving on to those "Kaballah" fuckheads. The next dillweed I see with a bottle of "Kaballah water" is getting their jaw broke. 7th day Adventists and Jehovahs, make your peace.

JCT wrote:

Scientology

I'm all for burning these crack pots at the stake. Starting with Tom Cruise.

C'mon, you know you've been following the TomKat baby story.

JCT wrote:

Scientology

I'm all for burning these crack pots at the stake. Starting with Tom Cruise . . .

Tom Cruise, freaky though he is, is actually relatively benign by the Scientologists' standard. Certainly, he's harmless to anyone grounded in reality. You can't say the same about the "Church" of Scientology.

Unfortunately for Cruise, however, I suspect he has no idea that he's being used as a front, not to mention how evil and conniving the group for which he is fronting really is.

anybody catch the south park episode about the mormons? hilarious.

Mormons makes good funnay.

For whatever reason, I'd say Mormons make up the largest percentage of my own personal "best people I ever met" category.

They can believe whatever they want if it makes treat others better than most.

Gotta agree on the niceness thing. We had a partner in a design firm that I worked for years ago that was a devout Mormon, and we called him "Mr. Valium". He could call you in and tell you that you had to work overtime for 3 weeks because we had deadlines and you would walk out and and just be so thankful he had the time to talk with you about it so nicely.

We also have a family joke about Mormon missionaries. When our kid was young enough to confuse words that sound the same, one day we drove by some guys in the black slacks and white shirts on bicycles and he asked me, the way an innocent little kid does..."Mom, are those the mercenaries you told me about?"

I laughed my ass off, and we still joke about it to this day. Two days ago my much older and wiser kid was in the car with me and we drove by a couple of guys on bikes in the black and white. He looked and me and nodded and said...mercenaries.

i grew up in northern utah in the 80's and there are a few indisputeable facts about mormons that need to be aired........

1---green jello is health food

2---anti-depressants for women are good

3----mormon chicks rock and give great head

4----dudes go on missions out of pressure, no other reason

5----bearing testimony is done out of pressure

6----mormons have the best welfare system on the planet

Most of the devout/practicing mormons I've ever met have been some truly vile people.

I've also met a lot of cool ones -- every single one of which left the church.


I don't have a link handy, but if you search the web or the library, there's volumes of scientific evidence that the whole thing is a made up scam.

Like most organized religion, they lie to you to take your money.

Terry in Crapchester wrote: 2. Moonies: Kidnap young people, forcibly separate them from their family and friends, tell them that these people want to kill them, then marry them to strangers.

And every time you eat sushi, you're supporting them...that's how they get their money, by monopolizing the sushi-distribution in this country.


Bet you never knew that, eh?

Dinsdale wrote:

Terry in Crapchester wrote: 2. Moonies: Kidnap young people, forcibly separate them from their family and friends, tell them that these people want to kill them, then marry them to strangers.

And every time you eat sushi, you're supporting them...that's how they get their money, by monopolizing the sushi-distribution in this country.


Bet you never knew that, eh?

You posted it about a month or two ago, I didn't know before then.

Doesn't apply to me in any event, though, as I've never eaten sushi. The thought of putting raw fish in my mouth is pretty close to the most repulsive thing I can think of.

Question:

If I'm deciding on a particular belief, why should I pick a religion which:
1. springs up in the 19th century
2. basically says "Everyone had it wrong until Jesus/God/some angel came and spoke to ME"?

If this is the case, does this not alienate every single person on earth before him, thus sending them all straight to hell?

Fuck the wives/holy underwear/'special' translation of the Bible...No one had it right before Jesus came to earth and spoke to this douchebag?

Joseph Smith was a gold digger. Everything he bragged about seeing was only seen by..you guessed it..Joseph Smith. He found the golden tablets that nobody else ever saw...digging for treasure. The magical spectacles which allowed him to view and decipher these tablets were only seen by..guess who??...Yep Good ole Joseph Smith. Smith also predicted the coming of the Lord would be in 1891..wrong.. He also predicted the U.S. Government would be overthrown before the coming of the Lord for the wrongs the government committed against the Mormons in Missouri... How'd that work out for him? He was jailed and killed. This guy had all his people give him their worldly posessions in the name of the Lord mainly to make up for the fact that he was a terrible gold digger. The guy was a blasphemer and an all around disgusting, greedy sack o' shit..

Anyone who compares the Mormom religion to Christianity is an utter buffoon. The Mormons hide under the Christian veil only in an attempt to give themselves some sort of legitimacy. The teachings and miracles performed by Jesus Christ were witnessed by thousands..nay...10's of thousands

I don't care what your religion is...the Mormons are a cult...Scientologists are a cult. Are some of them nice people??...I bet they are... That doesn't mean they aren't full of shite.

PSUFAN wrote:The only conclusion that makes sense to me is that they haven't read the damn thing.

Like most Christians haven't really read the bible.

How many young american church attending roman catholics follow all the rules of the faith as laid out by the vatican?

Are Christians supposed to have faith in the risen Christ, or have faith in the vatican .... ?

The vatican is the epitome of religion, and it blows.