Does any other nation but ours...

[Van]

...suffer with the "issue" of having to deal in a sickeningly P.C. manner with the demands of people who reside in their country...ILLEGALLY??

Again, fuck the whole immigrant issue. We've always been all about Ellis Island and welcoming all and sundry into our waiting arms.

All we ask is that you show up, make yourself known, go through the proper channels, state your allegiances and pay taxes.

Be accountable. Assimilate, or don't, but at least be accountable.

Our parents had to do it. Hell, with the help of the German Underground and the sacrifice of her father in the doing my mother escaped Nazi Germany and she and her mother ended up in Cleveland, Ohio, of all places. They went through the proper channels and they became legal citizens right away.

Illegal immigrants have ZERO rights in any other country on earth. They sure as hell don't picket en masse. They stay out of sight as best as possible.

Here? Here?? We actually see our politicians running in fear from them. We see our tax payer subsidized police forces setting up barricades in order for them to march safely through our tax payer subsidized streets. When the occasional giant forehead illegal falls and breaks his ankle on our tax payer's dime he then gets carted off in our tax payer subsidized ambulances where he'll receive treatment at our tax payer subsidized hospitals.

At no point in this process did they contribute a fucking dime towards the purchase of any of these services. How on earth are they entitled to any of them? If some clown walks into my store and wants to buy a coke from our coke machine he has to pay for it. If he wants a bike he has to pay for it. If he wants a loan he has to pay for it.

I want police forces and working street lights and emergency services and ER rooms fully staffed and ready to deal with my medical emergencies. I have to pay for them. I also have to pay for the military that ultimately safeguards all these things.

I also have to pay for those things, for you.

If ten million American citizens snuck into Mexico City would Vicente Fox allow them to overload Mexico's services without paying a dime into them? Would he allow a million of those same people to march down his streets all at once in protest, and would he allocate his police forces and other emergency services to ensure their safety?

Would Japan? Switzerland? Germany?

Russia?


China??

This is fucking insane. These people are here illegally, and still they have the temerity to not just sponge from our society and drive down our...

-Wages
-Property values
-School test scores
-Automobile aesthetics ( )
-Musical aesthetics ( )
-Emergency services response times
-Emergency services availability
-National and local self esteem

...while also driving up our...

-Unemployment rate
-Census figures
-Urban Blight
-Pollution
-Hospital bills
-Utility bills
-Auto insurance bills
-Grafitti

...and all the while they also sit there and demand that they be given the same rights as people who pay taxes, vote, die for our country and actually do more with their money than simply subsist and then send the rest home to another country??

And we tolerate this shit. Insane.

Reinvent the Ag business with the use of machines and force business owners into a new and proper paradigm whereby they have to pay competitive wages to legal citizens of this country and after only a short period of acclimation none of these fucking illegals will ever be missed...

Now, if the Illegals wish to do as we did in our earliest days then fine, bring it on. See if you can use your advanced civilization to displace us and take back America.

No? Not too shit hot tenable, that? Mexico, that land of which you're so proud that you literally risk life and limb in order to escape it? Those guys, are they going to reclaim the American Southwest and give it to you?

No? Not going to get any help there either? It's basically on you then?

Yep. It is. You're utterly impotent...and still we don't just tolerate your presence, we pay for it and suffer for it. We don't even stick you in refugee camps like the rest of the world does with their poor unwashed political immigrants who "escaped" their horrible homeland.

Nowhere else. Nowhere else but here. To put up with you is bad enough. Nobody else but us would even do that. You're...fucking...illegal. Bare minimum, you're lucky you're not in jail, or dead and rotting at the border. That'd be your plight if you tried this act anywhere in the Middle East or Asia.

To let it get so far that you now think you can demand equal rights??

Our society is fucking insane.

[Atomic Punk]

You are a tard racist!

- TVblOw

Unless the people in power in this country start getting whacked, then they'll continue to swim in money.

I fully propose executions of the big corrupt people's families on both sides of the aisle in the streets to make a point. It's going to happen at some point as people lose their jobs and can't make ends meet.

Start executing the fat cats in the oil industry after their families have been slaughtered in the streets and THAT's how to change things.

Fuck Bush, fuck Clinton, and fuck the dolts!

Much love,

Diogenesdex

[Dr_Phibes]

Hell, with the help of the German Underground and the sacrifice of her father in the doing my mother escaped Nazi Germany and she and her mother ended up in Cleveland, Ohio, of all places. They went through the proper channels and they became legal citizens right away.

I find that interesting. Your mother was quite lucky, but at the same time the vast majority of jews were turned away at port and sent back. I'm wondering what your attitude would be toward those who nipped off the ship and attempted to gain entry.

[The Seer]

The euros are scared to death to say anything about their
immigrant problem....Don't know how many of the muzzies are illegals, but can you imagine 14 million of those fucks here illegally?

[Van]

Hell, with the help of the German Underground and the sacrifice of her father in the doing my mother escaped Nazi Germany and she and her mother ended up in Cleveland, Ohio, of all places. They went through the proper channels and they became legal citizens right away.

I find that interesting. Your mother was quite lucky, but at the same time the vast majority of jews were turned away at port and sent back. I'm wondering what your attitude would be toward those who nipped off the ship and attempted to gain entry.

-There is no comparing the plight of Nazi Germany Era Jews to modern day Mexicans who simply want to jump the border to escape their shithole country and enjoy the benefits of our vastly superior one.

-My family wasn't Jewish. Quite the opposite, in fact: Blond Aryan Christians. I pretty much look like one of Hitler's Chamber Of Commerce posters. It was something like 1942 and they simply wanted out of Essen, Germany and it apparently wasn't particularly easy to get out at that time. My grandfather somehow died while getting his wife and my mom out through the German Underground. I don't know how he died. My mom doesn't speak of it much at all and apparently neither did her mom.

-I have no idea how they came to end up in Cleveland. All my mom says is that they had family there. I do know that what's important is that they immediately went through the proper channels and she became a citizen a.s.a.p. Her family didn't attempt to hide and sponge. They did what we're supposed to do to become American citizens.

That's all I ask of any immigrant. Be accountable. Don't sneak in, drink from our well, shit in our beds and somehow never become accountable.

[Atomic Punk]

Van, you just answered to a few trolls from Canada... or is it La Canada near Pasadena?



Good luck sucker.

[Van]

AP, as always I answer the post, not the poster.

Really, that's the way it's gotta be since there's not too many people here where I really know with whom I'm conversing.

Count 'em on two hands, maybe? No biggie. If the post is valid I'll respond to it, regardless.

[Mikey]

We've always been all about Ellis Island and welcoming all and sundry into our waiting arms.

All we ask is that you show up, make yourself known, go through the proper channels, state your allegiances and pay taxes.

Sorry, I didn't read your entire rant Van. But you're completely full of shit right out of the gate. If what you say here were true there would be no reason for these people to risk their lives trying to get in illegally, now would there?

Not saying I'm down with illegal immigration, but at least try and be honest. K?

[Atomic Punk]

Shit trolls have 6 year old "smack" and know how to get your goat... to literally fuck out of jealousy.

Same posting style from many shit trolls here that log in and out and I used to respond to him also.

I'm sure I'll be called a name soon by shit troll #1 - #40.

[Dr_Phibes]

Fuck this, I think I'll just stick to Spin Zone.

[War Wagon]

More bullshit, and this time coming from Van, of all people.

All we ask is that you show up, make yourself known, go through the proper channels, state your allegiances and pay taxes.

It isn't the same. You don't just "show up" and be allowed entry. That was so like 50-100 years ago. The waiting list is rather lengthy. It may take years. These people are hungry, and they are HERE NOW....and paying taxes, btw.

Our parents had to do it. Hell, with the help of the German Underground and the sacrifice of her father in the doing my mother escaped Nazi Germany and she and her mother ended up in Cleveland, Ohio, of all places. They went through the proper channels and they became legal citizens right away.

Right away, huh? Sweet deal. Did she spreckin ze English?

Nevermind, that probably didn't matter...then.

My grandparents on my mothers side also came over from Germany back in 1885 and settled in Kansas.

My dad came over from Scotland with his family in 1920 and settled in Jersey.

I don't know if they were granted instant citizenship right away, like your ancestors, but they were allowed in....all legal and proper like.

It's not like that anymore, Van.

You really seem to be struggling with that little concept.

At no point in this process did they contribute a fucking dime towards the purchase of any of these services. How on earth are they entitled to any of them?

Holy shit, Van. It's like you're intentionally lobbing slow pitch softballs right thru the zone.

They have phony SS cards and pay income taxes. They pay sales taxes when they go to the store. They pay personal property tax when they license their vehicle. If they own a house, they pay real estate taxes.

I'm not even going to bother with the rest of your outlandish hysterical rantings. Suffice to say that you and mvscal ought to have a tea-party and compare sympathetic notes.

[Van]

We've always been all about Ellis Island and welcoming all and sundry into our waiting arms.

All we ask is that you show up, make yourself known, go through the proper channels, state your allegiances and pay taxes.

Sorry, I didn't read your entire rant Van. But you're completely full of shit right out of the gate. If what you say here were true there would be no reason for these people to risk their lives trying to get in illegally, now would there?

Not saying I'm down with illegal immigration, but at least try and be honest. K?

Right on the heels of what I just said to AP, here's the rare opposite scenario...

In this case, yeah, I am wondering whether you're the "Mikey" I used to "know", 'cause the one using your nic lately has somehow turned into a really cunty little bitch. Weird. If it's "you", the guy I used to see long ago in Chat, the guy who lived above Camp Pendleton, hmmm. You definitely never used to be like this.

Dunno what prompted this change in you but whatever...

Anyway...

If what you say here were true there would be no reason for these people to risk their lives trying to get in illegally, now would there?

Did you really just type that??? Was that supposed to be some sort of use of logic or something?

Mikey, the people attempting to get in illegally aren't exactly the Best Of Mexico's Best. They're not spending their time going to consulates and embassies and filling out forms and providing necessary documentation...on either end, Mexican or American.

These aren't reputable store owners and such filing emigration papers in their homeland and then presenting those completed documents to our Immigration Department, whereupon they'll sit back and wait for the formal process to take place in due time.

Those guys, no, they don't need to try to get in illegally, do they?

Of course they don't. Of course that's typically not the M.O. of the average Illegal.

Also, within some limits, hey, we as a nation do have to be able to somewhat put a cap on the number of immigrants we accept. In most any other country I can't just take my American citizenship and decide to up and move there and become a citizen. I have to show them how I'll be making a living and for the most part I'll need to show that I'm not merely supplanting one of their own workers. I need to bring something useful to the table.

It's FAR more difficult to gain citizenship in a place like, say, New Zealand, than it is to gain it here.

Indigent Mexicans sneaking into our country? You wonder why they do it illegally, if doing it legally is so easy?

Please. They're fucking indigents. Nothing simple and above board is easy for them. The path of least resistance is to just go for it and wing it, knowing they have nothing to lose.

[Moving Sale]

Van,
When illegal immigration is malum in se or you can start a thread where their illegal status is not your heading, get back to me.

You can take your 'not a dime' argument and stick it in your ass.

Gawd you are a tard.

[Moving Sale]

AP, as always I answer the post, not the poster.

I Laughed!

[Van]

More bullshit, and this time coming from Van, of all people.

All we ask is that you show up, make yourself known, go through the proper channels, state your allegiances and pay taxes.

It isn't the same.

Nor should it be. Like I said, "Go through the proper channels."

We aren't obligated to take in every last one of the world's strays, much less the ones who don't have the wherewithal to go through the proper channels.

You don't just "show up" and be allowed entry.

Nope, you don't.

It'd be nice if first you squared things away with your own country's authorities. Maybe let 'em know you're leaving, ya' know? See, that way, if you act the fool in our country we can send you back and they have some clue as to who you are.

It's that itchy "accountability" thing again.

To gain legal entry here ought to require due diligence on our government's part. Nothing wrong with that.

That was so like 50-100 years ago.

California wasn't overrun by illegal immigration 50-100 years ago. Times change, polices must follow accordingly.

Accountability and going through proper channels and earning your way into our largesse has to be the case here now, same as it's ALWAYS been everywhere else.

The waiting list is rather lengthy. It may take years.

Their nation's problem, not ours. I don't see Mexico cutting us any child support checks.

These people are hungry, and they are HERE NOW....

They come from an oil rich nation awash in drug money, replete with an enormous land mass and all sorts of natural resources. Certainly, much more than Japan enjoys. There's no reason they still need to be hungry. There's no reason they need to become our problem, in total.

and paying taxes, btw.

Nobody getting paid under the table is paying taxes. FAR too many illegals avail themselves of tax payer provided services without ever having paid their fair share (or any share) in taxes.

Our parents had to do it. Hell, with the help of the German Underground and the sacrifice of her father in the doing my mother escaped Nazi Germany and she and her mother ended up in Cleveland, Ohio, of all places. They went through the proper channels and they became legal citizens right away.

Right away, huh? Sweet deal. Did she spreckin ze English?

No idea. Pretty sure mom didn't though, since she was only something like three years old.

Nevermind, that probably didn't matter...then.

My grandparents on my mothers side also came over from Germany back in 1885 and settled in Kansas.

My dad came over from Scotland with his family in 1920 and settled in Jersey.

I don't know if they were granted instant citizenship right away, like your ancestors, but they were allowed in....all legal and proper like.

It's not like that anymore, Van.

You really seem to be struggling with that little concept.

You seem to be struggling with the little concept that it's not like that anywhere else either, and nobody else allows what we allow here. Nowhere is it written in stone (not even on the Statue Of Liberty) that we're to take every illegal indigent from all over the world, just because they found a way to sneak themselves into our country.

Pretty sure your grandparents didn't gain entry into our country by allowing themselves to be stuffed into an air conditioning vent of a Buick Impala by some flesh peddling coyote.

Times have changed, and so must our immigration policies.

At no point in this process did they contribute a fucking dime towards the purchase of any of these services. How on earth are they entitled to any of them?

Holy shit, Van. It's like you're intentionally lobbing slow pitch softballs right thru the zone.

They have phony SS cards and pay income taxes.

Some do. Many (most?) don't.

They pay sales taxes when they go to the store.

Using money they gained illegally; money for which, by and large, they didn't pay their fair share of proper taxes.

They pay personal property tax when they license their vehicle.

You very obviously haven't spent much time in California. Many, many of those tards don't drive registered vehicles at all and even fewer drive properly insured registered vehicles.

You've got to be kidding me with that one.

If they own a house, they pay real estate taxes.

Bwaaahahahaaaaa!!

I guess "squatting" equates to home ownership there in Mizzou???

They don't have ANY LEGAL I.D.!! They don't have a W2! They're often as not paid under the table, ILLEGALLY!! They sure as hell don't have GOOD CREDIT, much less the ability to obtain and make good on a home loan!!

Jeez, dude! LOL!!

I'm not even going to bother with the rest of your outlandish hysterical rantings. Suffice to say that you and mvscal ought to have a tea-party and compare sympathetic notes.

Idealistic Midwest Sheltered College Boy Who Hasn't Seen Any Real Life Yet Much?

Again, point me to any other country which so benevolently deals with anywhere near such an enormous influx of indigent illegal immigrants in their midst?

[Van]

And there's TVO, chiming in as vacuously and predictably as the early morning shits following his usual late night repast of date raping and Tommie's Burgers...

[Moving Sale]

Nice dodge Van.

[Atomic Punk]

Come on man... First time I hear of a white guy bitching about not being able to work in the lettuce fields will be the first.

Plus, Latinas are the only way to go in my published book of getting it young, cheap, and fun.

[Van]

That was downright evil, ZZ.

:-)

[Moving Sale]

Nice dodge Van.

X2

[tough love]

Seems to me that American greed brought this dealio upon itself.

When a large number of illegalexicans stay away from their 'illegal work' and the end result causes a noticeable blip in the work places where they partake in, what can the rest of world do but scoff at the irony of America.

And to think that those who caused such a fuss by not showing up, only added up to approx 10% of your said illegalexican work force.

Nuestro Himno.

[Spinach Genie]

Rack the post, Van. Warwagon is a fucking moron and TVO is pretty much a good chunk of the reason this doesn't get approached with more seriousness.

Lawyers, politics and greed.

[PSUFAN]

Scanning these rants leaves me with one salient observation, Van...why don't you recognize the role that employers play in this? You can't blame immigrants for wanting to improve their lot if possible. Nefarious employers make it possible. Let's see a rant bemoaning these employers for enabling and benefiting from illegal labor.

[Neely8]

Run for President Van. Ill vote for you on this platform alone. You said exactly everything I have been thinking. RACK THIS THREAD!!!

[Cicero]

We aren't obligated to take in every last one of the world's strays, much less the ones who don't have the wherewithal to go through the proper channels.

RACK. Shouldnt there be a limit on the number we let in? The whites are becoming the minority in this country if you lump all the other minority groups together. If people want this country to turn to shit, then keep letting them in. I have no problem letting in those who come here to work and who want to become citizens, but I just dont see it happening.

I dont feel they should be able to stage large scale protests. They have no rightsin this country and have no right to demand that US citizens give them certain things. We have catered to long to the minority in this country. This pussy ass, liberal PC bullshit is going to be the end of us a super power and the voice of that bullshit will only get stronger as long as more anti-white, anti-establishment dregs are allowed to enter and procreate inside our country.

[PSUFAN]

Which one do we have more control over today, half-wits? Conditions in other countries, or employment conditions in this country?

You want to fix this, or do you want to demagogue and traipse around the issue? Put the Fear of God into those who benefit from illegal labor, and you fix the problem. Anything less is a bunch of hot air.

[Van]

Scanning these rants leaves me with one salient observation, Van...why don't you recognize the role that employers play in this? You can't blame immigrants for wanting to improve their lot if possible. Nefarious employers make it possible. Let's see a rant bemoaning these employers for enabling and benefiting from illegal labor.

In general, no disagreement there.

Like I said, there's going to have to be an acclimation period whereby the Ag business in particular has to adjust to doing business a whole new way. Near slave labor wages shouldn't be allowed. They're going to have to modernize and begin implementing the use of machines. We as a society will likely also have to get used to paying a bit more for produce.

So be it.

[Neely8]

Which one do we have more control over today, half-wits? Conditions in other countries, or employment conditions in this country?

You want to fix this, or do you want to demagogue and traipse around the issue? Put the Fear of God into those who benefit from illegal labor, and you fix the problem. Anything less is a bunch of hot air.

I and alot of people agree PSU. There are many people to blame. We can also throw alot of blame at Vincente Fox. He is opposed to the fence on the border. Gee I wonder why? Maybe because then he might have to deal with some of his countries problems rather then shipping them off to the US. I think the protests yesterday sparked this thread and therefore that is why it is aimed at the immigrants. I can't speak for Van. I however agree that you have to start by taking away their opportunities to work......

[BSmack]

Scanning these rants leaves me with one salient observation, Van...why don't you recognize the role that employers play in this? You can't blame immigrants for wanting to improve their lot if possible. Nefarious employers make it possible. Let's see a rant bemoaning these employers for enabling and benefiting from illegal labor.

In general, no disagreement there.

Like I said, there's going to have to be an acclimation period whereby the Ag business in particular has to adjust to doing business a whole new way. Near slave labor wages shouldn't be allowed. They're going to have to modernize and begin implementing the use of machines. We as a society will likely also have to get used to paying a bit more for produce.

So be it.

Or maybe people can start growing their own? You know, like victory gardens back in WWII. And perhaps the family farm might be competitive if they don't have to compete against slave wages? You know, a more decentralized food production system would also reduce shipping distance. Which would mean less fuel being used.

Just a few thoughts.

[socal]

Roseville thinktank spews
Forth rant as sales commission
Fills Tesoro 's bank
.
.
.

[Cicero]

Which one do we have more control over today, half-wits? Conditions in other countries, or employment conditions in this country?

You want to fix this, or do you want to demagogue and traipse around the issue? Put the Fear of God into those who benefit from illegal labor, and you fix the problem. Anything less is a bunch of hot air.

I am all for that. I honestly dont want any of them to come into this country. Build a freaking huge wall and have snipers at the top. If we raised wages, whites would do the job.

[BSmack]

Which one do we have more control over today, half-wits? Conditions in other countries, or employment conditions in this country?

You want to fix this, or do you want to demagogue and traipse around the issue? Put the Fear of God into those who benefit from illegal labor, and you fix the problem. Anything less is a bunch of hot air.

I am all for that. I honestly dont want any of them to come into this country. Build a freaking huge wall and have snipers at the top. If we raised wages, whites would do the job.

How the fuck does that "put the fear of God" into employers?

[Cicero]

Fine. Make them pay large fines for employing illegals or for not paying them at least the legal minimum wage.

Or, just prevent them from coming in all together and deport all illegals who dont file correct paperwork w/ in a year.

[BSmack]

Fine. Make them pay large fines for employing illegals or for not paying them at least the legal minimum wage.

Or, just prevent them from coming in all together and deport all illegals who dont file correct paperwork w/ in a year.

Yea, a "large fine" is realy going to make Wal Mart think twice. Start talking 10 year prison sentences and I'll be impressed.

[Terry in Crapchester]

My grandparents on my mothers side also came over from Germany back in 1885 and settled in Kansas.

We could be related.

My father's father's family came over from what was Bavaria (now part of Germany), and a number of them settled in Kansas. I do think it was a little earlier than 1885, however, in that my grandfather was born in 1901, and his father, although not his grandfather, was born in the U.S.

[Degenerate]

Like I said, there's going to have to be an acclimation period whereby the Ag business in particular has to adjust to doing business a whole new way. Near slave labor wages shouldn't be allowed. They're going to have to modernize and begin implementing the use of machines. We as a society will likely also have to get used to paying a bit more for produce.

Boy, thanks, Van. I really hope Fortune 500 companies like ADM, Tyson, Monsanto, Dole, Chiquita, Gold Kist, Cargill, etc. learn to get with the program and "modernize." You think any of them have invested in some machinery yet? I've heard about this killer startup in Illinois called Caterpillar...supposed to be on the cutting edge of this agriculture thing. My broker says it's a can't-miss!

[Sirfindafold]

These people are hungry, and they are HERE NOW....and paying taxes, btw.

30% of our prison population is made up of illegal immigrants. I'm pretty sure those people aren't hungry and I'm positive that they don't pay taxes.


PSU - You are starting to see a slight crackdown on the employers in our industry - Employees with false SS numbers are slowly being terminated, but not incarcerated.

[PSUFAN]

Guess what? Nothing is going to change until people get serious about both aspects - illegal employers, and illegal employees. As you can see quite clearly in this thread, you can make halfwits like Sissyroo nod at illegal employers, but it's apparently too much to refrain from spinning into useless invective about illegal employees.

Why is this important? Because, at the end of this current foot-stamping session, there won't be any real immigration reform, or any change in the status quo unless the core issues are addressed. Assholes like Sean Hannity and his left-wing equivalents are playing folks like hill country fiddles - stacking huge piles of political hay. Not a word from them about illegal employers..and BOOM, of they'll go to the next issue.

The analogy of cocaine is very useful here. It does absolutely nothing to aid the War on Drugs to uproot a few coca plants in Columbia, while the demand stateside surges.

Shoot a few thousand illegal immigrants as they cross over, fine...that does nothing to address the demand for their labor. It is our fellow citizens that employ illegals, and it's time that they are forced to obey our laws.

[PSUFAN]

PSU - You are starting to see a slight crackdown on the employers in our industry

not nearly fucking good enough.

[PSUFAN]

Like I said, there's going to have to be an acclimation period whereby the Ag business in particular has to adjust to doing business a whole new way. Near slave labor wages shouldn't be allowed. They're going to have to modernize and begin implementing the use of machines. We as a society will likely also have to get used to paying a bit more for produce.

STOP PREVARICATING. Next, you'll suggest an acclimation period for the immigrants themselves...they need to get used to eating dirt in Sonora and Sinaloa and El Salvador.

Oh, woe is industry...they need time to adjust to our existing labor law. We can't demand that they play by the rules, because they're so accustomed to cheap labor.

Get a fucking clue.