T1B

Been reading it, about 1/3 of the way thru now. So far its pretty disheartening. The picture it paints is bleak, and the paths to achieving any success are so convoluted, relying on cooperation from so many different groups, factions, militias, individuals, political, religious, and military leaders (many of which are vehemently opposed to cooperation at some level, or have agendas of their own) That I don't see how it could possibly be managed.

with so many factors unknown, its an equation for disaster. We should set our own time table for events, and if they dont' stick to it or work things out among them, they will fail, not us. As long as we're in there holding down most of the responsibility for making things happen, we will continue to get the blame for most everything failing, even though the mitigating factors are typically a lack of cooperation or an inability/unwillingness to participate in a common goal.

more later. just starting section B.

I don't believe reading it will make me less enlightened, nor will it alter my feelings on how things should be done there. It's just information everyone else has

One of the biggest problems over there is iraq. they are playing a major part in the problems that exist, and are using this situation to further their own goals.

I can't say that I care for their approach of quoting anonymous people on the situation over there.

Think of it as a Gunslinger post. Giving it too much thought will make you measurably dumber.

mvscal wrote:... the attempt to link this to Israel shows the lot of them to be Arabist kneepadders.

There's nothing of the sort. Any mention of Israeli regional aggression is merely a tip of the hat to the Saudis.




Go back to sleep.

One thing I will say about the report, they made a fairly straight forward assessment of the situation over there, which is one reason why Maliki slammed the report. He'll never admit that he and his countrymen have utterly failed to take control and instead are letting the sects kill each other off for power.

The clerics aren't helping. 30 of them from saudi arabia just called for increased violence, for sunnis to fight shiites.

The clerics said jihad, "is one of the most important tenets of religion, and what has been taken by force can only be regained by force."

By contrast, The iraq study group was not at all realistic in their list of solutions.

How can anyone expect to fight a mindset like the above with diplomacy?

My guess is Bush will not alter his approach very much at all, except perhaps to set some loose deadlines for the iraqi government to meet, if it doesn't collapse first.

Maybe Bush's paln all along was to trigger an all-out middle east ceevil war.

Muzzie killin' muzzie.

Heltah Skeltah.


Smart man.

poptart wrote:Maybe Bush's paln all along was to trigger an all-out middle east ceevil war.

Muzzie killin' muzzie.

Heltah Skeltah.


Smart man.

How does that make you feel, as an alleged Christian?

My wish is for, (a), muzzies to come to Christ.

A slightly less ambitious wish would be for, (b), muzzies to understand that killing innocents is a bad bad BAD thing.


Realistically, (a) and (b) aren't catching on with these 'folks,' (that's Bush-speak) and in that case, (c - heltah skeltah) looks like the best available option.



I feel great.

Mister Bushice wrote:
The clerics aren't helping. 30 of them from saudi arabia just called for increased violence, for sunnis to fight shiites.

Bitchin!

Who wrote this suggested policy, anyway?


Uhm...two guys who have made mad cayshe working for...the Saudi royal family?

Yeah, let me run right out and impliment those policies.

Follow the money, as always.

As long as we let the Saudi terrorists write our foreign policy...well, you do the math.

poptart wrote:My wish is for, (a), muzzies to come to Christ.

A slightly less ambitious wish would be for, (b), muzzies to understand that killing innocents is a bad bad BAD thing.


Realistically, (a) and (b) aren't catching on with these 'folks,' (that's Bush-speak) and in that case, (c - heltah skeltah) looks like the best available option.

I feel great.

When killing and bloodshed is touted as a key part of a religion, and the people saying so fervently believe it, the cause is pretty much lost for any hope of a peaceful non violent solution except to defeat those who believe that, which leads to violent confrontation.

Circular logic, I know. Cuda and mvscal are writhing in ecstacy over it.

However If we had reliable alternative resources for oil I'd say we set some deadlines and get the hell out of there. IT is a no win situation for us nomatter what we do. Let them finish themselves off. A few years of civil war should just about eliminate the adult male population that thinks this way, and perhaps pave the way for those who don't.

Muslims around the world claim this is a religion of peace, but it seems clear now that its all a matter of interpretation of the koran.

They certainly make Christians and Jews look civilized by comparison*. One thing you just don't see are jews murdering jews, or Chirstians slaughtering other Christians, yet muslims seem to focus just as much hatred and violence on their fellow muslims as they do on anyone else.

In palestine the other day hamas sympathizers murdered 3 children of a government leader. These three vicious terrorists were between 3 and 9 years old. All for revenge, because they couldn't get at the father.


* Marty rant in 3,2,1.......