T1B

Posted: **Tue Jun 17, 2008 4:33 pm**

and fun to laugh at too. I hope every one of his pitchers pulls a hammy running out a ground ball.

Hank Steinbrenner Blames N.L. Rules

By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Published: June 17, 2008
The Yankees’ loss of their ace, Chien-Ming Wang, for up to 10 weeks prompted the team co-chairman Hank Steinbrenner to chastise the National League for playing without a designated hitter.

“My only message is simple,” Steinbrenner said in Tampa, Fla. “The National League needs to join the 21st century. They need to grow up and join the 21st century.”

Steinbrenner said he was angry and added: “I’ve got my pitchers running the bases, and one of them gets hurt. He’s going to be out. I don’t like that, and it’s about time they address it. That was a rule from the 1800s.”

Making a rare appearance on the bases at an N.L. park in Houston on Sunday, Wang pulled up rounding third and hobbled home on a Derek Jeter single.

“This is always a concern of American League teams when their pitchers have to run the bases and they’re not used to doing it,” Steinbrenner said. “It’s not just us. It’s everybody. It probably should be a concern for National League owners, general managers and managers when their pitchers run the bases. Pitchers have enough to do without having to do that.”

Posted: **Tue Jun 17, 2008 5:26 pm**

That is pretty weak on his part. He probably doesn't say that unless Wang or any of his other pitchers pulls up lame. Easy to bitch when you have some bad luck. What is Josh Beckett or Roy Halladay got hurt...you think he'd complain then?

Personally, I would like to see the two leagues choose one way and stick with it...I can live with either one but just have to be the same in both leagues.

Posted: **Tue Jun 17, 2008 7:25 pm**

Shoalz I don't disagree on the league picking 1 rule.. the reason the DH was implemented was a joke to begin with and I like the traditional aspect of the game so I say get rid of it.

Posted: **Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:32 pm**

The dh rule isn't going anywhere. Ditching it will cost players jobs and the union will not hear of it. Whether you like it or not, it's here to stay. No sense arguing for of against, nothing's going to change.

Posted: **Wed Jun 18, 2008 4:09 pm**

Nothing like having an incompetent batter every 9 spots... takes a whole shitload of that bothersome "managing" out of the game.

"Wow, Skip, they're really rallying right now. What should we do?"

"It's the NL... I say we do nothing. They'll end their own rally."

Posted: **Wed Jun 18, 2008 6:17 pm**

The batter doesn't have to be incompetent.

Sincerely,

Don Drysdale
Fernando Valenzuela
etc.

Posted: **Wed Jun 18, 2008 6:31 pm**

So when exactly do these high school players that can hit 95mph+ on the gun as a pitcher and hit .340 as a hitter suddenly lose the ability to seing the bat like a normal human being?

Just because they get drafted as a pitcher doesn't mean they can't work on their hitting. Rick Ankiel never completely forgot how to hit otherwise he'd be out of baseball entirely.

Posted: **Wed Jun 18, 2008 6:56 pm**

Goober McTuber wrote:The batter doesn't have to be incompetent.

Sincerely,

Don Drysdale
Fernando Valenzuela
etc.

Got any names that have actually played in the last 100 years?

Posted: **Wed Jun 18, 2008 6:57 pm**

jiminphilly wrote:Rick Ankiel never completely forgot how to hit the juice, otherwise he'd be out of baseball entirely.

Posted: **Wed Jun 18, 2008 7:21 pm**

Dinsdale wrote:
Goober McTuber wrote:The batter doesn't have to be incompetent.

Sincerely,

Don Drysdale
Fernando Valenzuela
etc.

Got any names that have actually played in the last 100 years?

Valenzuela hit over .300 less than 20 years ago. Mike Hampton, Rick Rhoden, Carlos Zambrano. The problem is that the pitchers aren't required to work on their hitting. Most of them should be able to improve their hitting to a respectable level. They're baseball players, not golfers.

Posted: **Wed Jun 18, 2008 8:30 pm**

Dinsdale wrote:
jiminphilly wrote:Rick Ankiel never completely forgot how to hit the juice, otherwise he'd be out of baseball entirely.

So the juice made him look less like a retard at the plate? There is no excuse for some of these guys to swinging the bat like they're playing whiffle ball. (and for every batter hitting the juice, equal amounts of pitchers are too). The players need to practice their craft regardless of the juice.

Posted: **Wed Jun 18, 2008 8:54 pm**

Dinsdale wrote:
Goober McTuber wrote:The batter doesn't have to be incompetent.

Sincerely,

Don Drysdale
Fernando Valenzuela
etc.

Got any names that have actually played in the last 100 years?

Ever heard of Greg Maddux, Tom Glavine, or John Smoltz? What about Mike Hampton? Dontrelle Willis? Heck, on the Giants, Cain and Lincecum both can swing a stick pretty well. Back in the day, Orel was a pretty good hitter. Need any more?

Posted: **Wed Jun 18, 2008 9:22 pm**

battery chucka' one wrote:Ever heard of Greg Maddux

I think so.

You're talking about the Greg Maddux that plays for the Padres and bats...

.043

Right?

Tom Glavine

Is this the same Tom Glavine that plays for the Bravos and bats .105?

John Smoltz?

You mean the John Smoltz that also plays for the Braves, but had yet to actually record a hit this season before hitting the DL?

THAT John Smoltz?

The one with the .161 career average?

What about Mike Hampton?

Heyyyy, you finally found a pitcher with a career average above the Mendoza Line with which to try and make your point.

Props on that, I guess.

Dontrelle Willis?

Yes, nothing strikes fear in the heart of a pitcher like a .234 career average hitter.

Heck, on the Giants, Cain and Lincecum both can swing a stick pretty well.

Ah, I see the problem here -- semantics. You consider BAs of .120 and .114, respectively, to be "swinging a stick pretty well."

Most people that aren't named BCO would not.

Posted: **Wed Jun 18, 2008 9:42 pm**

The key, son, is that those pitchers aren't 'automatic outs'. Each is a tough out in the lineup. The aforementioned Rick Ankiel is currently a 25-30 HR guy. All the Braves pitchers were tough outs. But then, son, I don't think you watch much baseball. Never mind.

Posted: **Wed Jun 18, 2008 9:47 pm**

There's that pesky semantics again.

YOU think hitters with career averages under .200 are "tough outs."

REALITY dictates that they are not.

BTW-I'll help you out even more...

When you clown yourself EVERY FREAKING TIME YOU POST, you need to find a new catch-phrase to try and divert attention away from the plungering you're invariably putting on yourself... try mixing it up some, and try and not go to "son" as your default response whenever someone points out your flagrant stupidity...

Like citing career .170 hitters as "tough outs," for example.

Posted: **Wed Jun 18, 2008 11:20 pm**

A bit of a reach given he's got only 106 AB in his two year career but Micah Owings with Arizona has a .302 career average with 5 home runs and 18 RBI...an .889 OPS to boot. Not too shabby for a pitcher...

In general though, a pitcher's role in the lineup is to lay down bunts for guys on first or second with less than two outs or if no one is on base to just not hurt themselves at the plate. If you can get a pitcher that can reach base once a game, that's about as much as you can hope for. Considering most starting pitchers won't get more than 3 or 4 plate appearances a game if they're pitching well and has a large enough lead to justify keeping him in. If you have a pitcher with a .200-.250 average, take it and run.

Posted: **Thu Jun 19, 2008 2:40 am**

Dins goes absolute Yard.

And this comes from an Astro fan.

You guys pop out 5 or 6 extreme exceptions as hopes to bolster you argument?

Owings and Hampton should not have ever been pitchers. Period. Hampton might have been a HOF 2b or CF had he taken the right career path. But out of how many pitchers?

Rack Dins. Pitchers hitting is an embarrassment AS A VERY GENERAL RULE.

Posted: **Thu Jun 19, 2008 1:40 pm**

rozy wrote: Pitchers hitting is an embarrassment AS A VERY GENERAL RULE.

So answer my question-

So when exactly do these high school and college players that can hit 95mph+ on the gun as a pitcher and hit .340 as a hitter suddenly lose the ability to swing the bat like a normal human being?

Just because they get drafted as a pitcher doesn't mean they can't work on their hitting....

I could care less about the avg. of a pitcher if he at least moves the runner from 1st to 2nd on a bunt or works the count to up the pitch- count of the opposing pitcher and even draw a walk. Heaven forbid they hit the ball to the right side of the field to move a runner to third or get the ball in the air for a sac fly. The top and middle of the lineup is there to produce the runs and hits, all a pitcher needs to do is the basic fundamentals to help his game along. The fact that most pitchers can't or won't is telling of just how much the fundamentals of the game have been lost.

Posted: **Thu Jun 19, 2008 3:17 pm**

rozy wrote:Dins goes absolute Yard.

On BCO. Rah-rah, sis-boom-bah.

The fact that you can cite a number of good hitting pitchers from 20, 30 and 40 years ago simply bolsters the argument that if pitcher spends a little time in the batting cage, they might be semi-respectable at the plate. A .200 to .240 batting average would be a reasonable expectation. It keeps Ricky Weeks in the lineup.

Posted: **Thu Jun 19, 2008 4:02 pm**

jiminphilly wrote:So when exactly do these high school and college players that can hit 95mph+ on the gun as a pitcher and hit .340 as a hitter suddenly lose the ability to swing the bat like a normal human being?

I am going to let you in on a little secret. Most of the college and high school players "who hit .340" were doing so against dudes who mostly threw straight balls, especially in high school. How many pitchers in college and h/s have mastered the slider, curve, cut fastball, split-fingered, etc, etc, etc... not to mention pitch location. Furthermore, batting (and pitching for that matter) involves a lot of prep work. Time spent in the cage, watching film, analyzing pitching charts, etc, etc.... you think these guys just walk up there and start hacking? It's a full-time job. Are you really incredulous these pitchers "lost it"... or maybe, just maybe... most never "had it" to begin with.

Posted: **Thu Jun 19, 2008 4:51 pm**

Yeah, the super-jock high school pitcher hits .340...

The league batting champ hits .650.

Posted: **Thu Jun 19, 2008 8:20 pm**

ucantdoitdoggieSTyle2 wrote:
jiminphilly wrote:So when exactly do these high school and college players that can hit 95mph+ on the gun as a pitcher and hit .340 as a hitter suddenly lose the ability to swing the bat like a normal human being?

I am going to let you in on a little secret. Most of the college and high school players "who hit .340" were doing so against dudes who mostly threw straight balls, especially in high school. How many pitchers in college and h/s have mastered the slider, curve, cut fastball, split-fingered, etc, etc, etc... not to mention pitch location. Furthermore, batting (and pitching for that matter) involves a lot of prep work. Time spent in the cage, watching film, analyzing pitching charts, etc, etc.... you think these guys just walk up there and start hacking? It's a full-time job. Are you really incredulous these pitchers "lost it"... or maybe, just maybe... most never "had it" to begin with.

As I said, I'm not looking for a pitcher to bat 9th and maintain an average above the mendoza line. I never said pitching (or hitting) is something they just take a hack at and hope for the best. But pitchers (ON AVERAGE) approach hitting with the same contempt as getting drug tested. If they had their way they wouldn't do either. Most pitchers will see something to hit. No one wants to walk a pitcher and turn the lineup over. If you can hit a 95mph fastball in high school (and most of them could) then they can do it in the majors.

Posted: **Thu Jun 19, 2008 11:02 pm**

jiminphilly wrote:If you can hit a 95mph fastball in high school (and most of them could) then they can do it in the majors.

LINK?

Are you fucking high?

I doubt most MLB pitchers ever saw a 95 MPH fastball in high school, much less could routinely hit one, as you're suggesting. I'd put the average high school fastball in the high 70s/low 80s... even then, how much movement do you think are on these "heaters"?

95 MPH fastball... in high school? Good Lord.

Posted: **Fri Jun 20, 2008 2:35 am**

lost in all this wah, the pitchers have to bat is the fact wang was hurt running the bases. pitchers are already coddled after throwing 80 pitches; now they can't run? perhaps next time he'll join in on pregame stretching. quite honestly, pitchers have a one-day work week and a four-day weekend. i'm sure a couple of them are fast enough to be used as pinch-runners if the need ever arose. there are ways to contribute other than a 5.00+ era.

pitchers obviously got to the show on their ability to pitch, not hit, but there are enough hours in the day to hit a batting cage and become mildly serviceable. i'm not suggesting .300, but at least good enough to make the other guy do something other than blow three fastballs by you. these guys have access to good hitting coaches, and i'm pretty sure that they weren't exclusively pitchers all through little league, so there's definitely a skill set to build upon there.

Posted: **Fri Jun 20, 2008 1:33 pm**

I agree with M Club. Dude was unable to run 90 feet. First graders can run 90 feet without pulling up lame. This isn't that tough to do. Perhaps the Yankees should look into investing in a conditioning coach.

Posted: **Thu Oct 30, 2008 10:30 pm**

Joe Blanton and Brett Myers thinks you're all assholes.... :D

Posted: **Fri Nov 21, 2008 2:54 am**

Poor Hank, little brother gets control of the family business.

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd ... p&c_id=mlb

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