T1B

How anybody could blow through that much $$ is just fucking beyond me.

Every NCAA athletic program should be required to have a mandatory course called something like "life skillz". Or something.

Mikey wrote:How anybody could blow through that much $$ is just fucking beyond me.

Every NCAA athletic program should be required to have a mandatory course called something like "life skillz". Or something.

They already do...oh, wait I see you working.

No shit?

You wouldn't know it, would you?

Sudden Sam wrote:He'd have been broke within a year after his playing career ended anyway.

Yeah, but he was hoping to break into the motion picture business.

I'm not quite sure how he'll make a Chapter 11 Plan work while he's incarcerated. There is that little detail.

I guess they didn't teach that in the "life skillz" class.

money management skillz got overlooked as well:

[quote]Michael Vick filed for bankruptcy protection while serving time for federal dogfighting charges, saying he owes between $10 million and $50 million to creditors.

'way to have a handle on your finances.

I read the thread title "Vick pulls the plug" and hoped he had hung himself with a shoestring from a shower head. Title your threads better and quit getting my hopes up, Willie.

Papa Willie wrote:The son of a bitch probably told him to file a Chapter 11

Chapter 11, Chapter 12 ... whatever it takes.

/sin/

Papa Willie wrote:

Rootbeer wrote:I read the thread title "Vick pulls the plug" and hoped he had hung himself with a shoestring from a shower head. Title your threads better and quit getting my hopes up, Willie.

:D

That would have been more desirable.

No kidding.

Michael Vick makes me hate my age. That prick is younger than I which means I'll spend most of my life having to listen to what a stupid prick he his. I hate Michael Jackson too but I'm at least comforted by the fact that he's old and abusing his body; some day he will die before I do. That makes me happy. I feel the same way about idiots like Jane Fonda and Nancy Pelosi. Vick needs to meet an early demise so I don't have to put up with his idiocy for the rest of my life.

I'm gonna go wayyyy out on a limb and guess that most of us on this board will outlive him.

Hell, even wolfman might outlive him! :D

Rootbeer wrote:Vick needs to meet an early demise so I don't have to put up with his idiocy for the rest of my life.

Look on the bright side, Rooty. Chances are his idiocy will result in his suffering, which should provide more solace to you than his experiencing a quick, painless, self-inflicted death at a young age. Buck up.

Vick was a pretty amazing athlete. I think it would have been interesting to see a CFB coach come up to the NFL and put together a true spread option attack with him as a centerpiece. Yes, there is probably too much speed and talent on defense for that to be done casually or easily...but it would be interesting to see a good attempt made.

I laugh at the idea that Vick was in classes on a campus at a major US university. What a fucked up situation.

At least he has his younger brother to carry on the family legacy.

PSUFAN wrote:Vick was a pretty amazing athlete. I think it would have been interesting to see a CFB coach come up to the NFL and put together a true spread option attack with him as a centerpiece. Yes, there is probably too much speed and talent on defense for that to be done casually or easily...but it would be interesting to see a good attempt made.

If Vick had run a true spread option offense in the NFL, he would have been on IR before week 8. The only thing that made Vick's runs possible was the threat, however limited, that he would throw the ball anywhere on the field. Running an option effectively eliminates half of the field as a potential passing area and leaves the QB exposed without any of the rules that protect a QB while in the pocket.

Oh yea, and the whole talent and speed issue. I mean is CFB fan getting tired of watching Reggie Bush getting chased down from behind by middle of the road NFL linebackers yet?

In short, there's a reason Steve Spurrier is now coaching in South Carolina. He thinks like you do.

I laugh at the idea that Vick was in classes on a campus at a major US university. What a fucked up situation.

Even funnier was his brother attending the same school.

Running an option

I'm not referring to a run option. I'm referring to a spread option, where there are 4 WRs on the field with a lone setback or a TE. Almost every team in the league uses this formation at various times. If you have a QB that can hit any of the receivers that are in patterns, then the LBs have to respect that...which opens running lanes for the QB - particularly a QB like Vick (used to be).

PSUFAN wrote:

Running an option

I'm not referring to a run option. I'm referring to a spread option, where there are 4 WRs on the field with a lone setback or a TE. Almost every team in the league uses this formation at various times. If you have a QB that can hit any of the receivers that are in patterns, then the LBs have to respect that...which opens running lanes for the QB - particularly a QB like Vick (used to be).

I see what you're saying, but I still think it would have ended badly.

If the QB can hit the receivers, there's no need to run. If he can't (like Vick) then there's no way the running lanes will be open anyway.

R-Jack wrote:Actually I think Vick has been going to the spread option quite a bit in prison.

It just wasn't an option at first.

I guess "Vick pulls the plug" had a different meaning altogether.

The Vick experiment did work the first few years. NFL defense didn't really figure him out. They knew he had an absolute cannon for an arm, but they finally were figuring him out in the last 2 years. Solution - MAKE him beat you with the pass.

What did he really do in college either? FSU did the same in that Sugar Bowl game. Yeah, they scored points but FSU was without their MLB and SS.

Papa Willie wrote:

Terry in Crapchester wrote:I'm not quite sure how he'll make a Chapter 11 Plan work while he's incarcerated. There is that little detail.

I do. He had/has probably that same sack of shit lawyer that did so good for him during the Doggie Trial. The son of a bitch probably told him to file a Chapter 11, knowing he wouldn't be able to take care of shit (when somebody's broke and in jail - they don't earn much income) - and then he'll file a 7.

Good ole' lawyers. He'll double-dip on that one.

Where I live and practice, debtors' attorneys are required to sign a statement under penalty of perjury, attached to the debtor's Schedules, that they have explained to the debtor the various provisions of the Bankruptcy Code, as well as the obligations and right (or lack thereof, in some cases) to proceed under each. I thought that was a national requirement, but I could be wrong on that point.

In any event, Vick's options in Bankruptcy are somewhat limited. Chapter 13 is out -- his debts clearly exceed the statutory limits. Chapter 12 is out for the same reason, not to mention that he's not a family farmer or fisherman.

That leaves Chapter 7 and Chapter 11 as his only two options in Bankruptcy. Any individual can file Chapter 11, but the requirements are pretty onerous, and in 99 out of 100 cases involving individual debtors, there's nothing to be gained through a Chapter 11 that can't be gained through either a 7 or a 13.

Vick's case might be the exception. The key factor in that depends on whether he has a realistic chance of being released early enough to continue his NFL career following his release. If there's a possibility of that, perhaps his creditos would have objected to a Chapter 7 filing. And since a Chapter 13 Plan can be extended out as long as five years, I see no reason why Vick couldn't formulate a Chapter 11 Plan that would do the same thing, with only minimal payments or maybe even none while he's incarcerated.

Papa Willie wrote:How would they have filed a Chapter 11 under this? Michael Vick dba Michael Vick?

Chapter 11 is more common for businesses and principals of small businesses, but there is no law prohibiting individuals from filing under Chapter 11. No requirement of a corporation, dba, etc.

Not sure what state he filed in, but here in GA, one of the oldest tricks in the books is a lawyer getting somebody to file a 13 (knowing the subject will never be able to or try to pay), and then converting to a 7.

Actually - it's pretty fucking stupid that he didn't just go ahead and file a 7. I'm sure there's some law saying (as much as he owed) that he had to try an 11, but I'd bet money it gets converted to a 7.

He'll never make enough money again in his life to come close to paying off as much as he owes.

Starting with the obvious, Vick's case is extremely unique. Obviously, most bankruptcy debtors don't show nearly the potential for increase in income that Vick does.

You might not be aware of this, but there was a significant change in bankruptcy law in 2005. Appropos to this case, the substantial abuse provisions surrounding Chapter 7 have been changed significantly.

In Chapter 7, under the old laws, a debtor could not be forced out of Chapter 7 unless it was shown that the Chapter 7 filing was a substantial abuse of the bankruptcy system. Only the U.S. Trustee could file a substantial abuse motion, and in such a motion there was a presumption in favor of the debtor.

Under the new laws, the standard is no longer substantial abuse, but simple abuse. And any party in interest, i.e., any creditor, may now file such a motion. Also, the presumption under such a motion is now against the debtor.

It's all speculative in Vick's case, of course, but if there's any possibility of him returning to the NFL within the next five years or so, my guess is that a Chapter 7 case would have been tossed. That's probably why he filed Chapter 11.