T1B

I can't believe some schools have nothing better to do than harp on high school athletic logos and threaten to take legal action. What's next, suing for fight song infringement? It's not like the color schemes or geographic locations are close enough for a high school to take away from sales of items with the questionable logo. Pretty pathetic if you ask me.



Is that Austin High and Westwood, or Arizona and Wisconsin?
New-look Maroons, Warriors run afoul of college logo trademark law

By Rick Cantu
AMERICAN-STATESMAN STAFF
Friday, September 19, 2008

The authorities who monitor trademarked college athletic logos have busted Austin High and Westwood.

The Maroons (2-1) and Warriors (2-1) have pretty mean football teams this year, but they were no match for Arizona and Wisconsin, a pair of highly visible universities that hold their identities close to their checkbooks.

In this case, the Westwood "W" and the Austin High "A" that have adorned their football helmets and other school apparel for years are too close for comfort for the college bigwigs.

Wisconsin wants its "W" back. Arizona wants to reclaim its signature "A."

What might seem much ado about nothing to some is serious business for the College Licensing Company, the Atlanta-based company that routinely notifies high schools around the country about trademark infringement. That includes Westwood and Austin High, and both schools have complied by changing their logos this season.

"It's not like we're cutting into (Wisconsin's) spirit item sales," Westwood band director Jack Green said.

Perhaps, but that's not the point, said James Aronowicz, the associate general counsel for the licensing company. His job is to determine whether logos are "distinctively similar" to colleges that already own trademark rights.

Westwood already has modified its logo on Web sites and murals, and the "motion W" already trademarked by Wisconsin will be repainted on the Warriors' basketball court.

"We had to immediately stop using the logo on all new shirts, bags or any item the booster club might be selling in a fundraiser," Westwood Principal Rebecca Donald said.

Westwood's helmet was different from Wisconsin's only because the Warriors' had a feather — denoting the Westwood mascot — attached to the W.

"That feature wasn't enough" to satisfy the licensing company, Green said.

Westwood's band also was affected by the licensing flap, because the marching band uniforms' jackets display Wisconsin's "motion W" across the chest.

It would cost the Round Rock school district $120,000 to switch uniforms — 400 uniforms, at $300 a pop — but Wisconsin has agreed to let the band continue using the uniforms for another five years.

Band uniforms usually are replaced every 10 years, Green said.

When Westwood — which last purchased new uniforms five years ago — gets new uniforms, it must do so with a different W.

Austin High was flagged because the block letter "A" — introduced six years ago by former football coach Steve Davis — matches the logo used by the Arizona Wildcats.

"When I came here, I could clearly see that we were using the University of Arizona logo," said Austin High Principal John Hudson, who lived in Arizona for 26 years before moving to Texas in 2006. "My middle son, a big Wildcat fan (and Arizona graduate), wanted to know why we had the U of A's logo."

Austin High, like Westwood, has changed the decals on its helmets this season.

"It's a pretty vanilla 'A' now," Maroons assistant coach Todd Brown said.

Trademark infringement is nothing new to Texas high schools.

The Woodlands also was forced to change its own "motion W" this season to appease Wisconsin.

One of the most notable cases was Schulenburg's use of the Superman "S" on its athletic uniforms. Schulenburg's "S" was bright orange, not red, but the school honored a request from DC Comics to change the logo.

Glenn Bacak, the Maroons' baseball coach, noted that many high schools could be charged with copycat logos.

"Our (baseball) caps look like Alabama's, (and) I have seen Gs like Georgia, and Rice's helmets look like the Philadelphia Eagles'," Bacak said. "Almost everyone could be called out for copying someone."

Georgetown football coach Phil Blue admits that his school's logo looks similar to Georgia's and the logo worn by the Green Bay Packers.

"We're just a little different than both," Blue said.

When Green, the Westwood band director, was informed that Georgetown and Green Bay have similar logos, he shook his head.

"Maybe the Green Bay Packers have more important things to worry about," he said.

Didnt Grambling change their logo because they couldnt afford to continue to pay the Packers for the use of the oval G

something simular happened in Oklahoma a couple years ago..Tulsa Union , (pictured) came under fire from Miami for using the U on their helmets...not for sure if they're having to change or not...it may still be in court..not for sure

RACK the Badgers for sticking it to the thieving bastards at Hicksville High School in Texas.

Moby Dick wrote:something simular happened in Oklahoma a couple years ago..Tulsa Union , (pictured) came under fire from Miami for using the U on their helmets...not for sure if they're having to change or not...it may still be in court..not for sure

Miami also did the same thing to Umatilla high school here in FL.

Moby Dick wrote:something simular happened in Oklahoma a couple years ago..Tulsa Union , (pictured) came under fire from Miami for using the U on their helmets...not for sure if they're having to change or not...it may still be in court..not for sure

Union agreed to pay Miami $1,000 per year.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/article. ... Teams43491

No shit, Campinfool.

I can't remember the last time we've seen such bitchlike behavior...


Wait, yes I can... it came from Big12 Country. The letters "A" and "M" ring any bells?

There is a huge difference between an NFL team using it and a HS team.

Props to the college's that allow the HS teams to use the basic logos for a couple hundred bucks a season.

Dinsdale wrote:No shit, Campinfool.

I can't remember the last time we've seen such bitchlike behavior...


Wait, yes I can... it came from Big12 Country. The letters "A" and "M" ring any bells?

i don't think that's a great analogy either. seems the complaints are coming from Arizona and Wisconsin about Big Xii country....as in high schools. not FROM Big XII country per se alone.

i also agree a pro team trying to capitalize on a rare championship type (being a usual bottom feeder) run using something trademarked by a college team (which is sort of "brand" particular to Texas A&M, better or worse) is not the same as a high school team sporting a U of A "A" on their lids.

As other have said, it is not just a Pac10 or Big10 thing. Most schools/businesses protect trademarks.

Any lower division school or high school that has a "Native" American team name usually has the seminole helmet. I dont know if FSU has ever sued anyone though

Mr T wrote: Any lower division school or high school that has a "Native" American team name usually has the seminole helmet.

that not true.

maybe in Florida, but not in the US as a whole. That's certainly not true in Oklahoma nor was it true before the PC changing of names from many schools nationwide. some of which i think was a legit. "Savages" doesn't ring quite right. some, probably overdone. Seminoles are one regional tribe. High school teams in the Cherokee Strip or Osage Hills in Oklahoma or Arapahoe in the Colorado plains....are not calling themselves the Seminoles or wearing the helmet.

some teams will saddle up to the success that FSU had in the 80's and 90's...but that's not a comprehensive account of teams with "Indian" names.

King Crimson wrote:

Mr T wrote: Any lower division school or high school that has a "Native" American team name usually has the seminole helmet.

that not true.

maybe in Florida, but not in the US as a whole. That's certainly not true in Oklahoma nor was it true before the PC changing of names from many schools nationwide. some of which i think was a legit. "Savages" doesn't ring quite right. some, probably overdone. Seminoles are one regional tribe. High school teams in the Cherokee Strip or Osage Hills in Oklahoma or Arapahoe in the Colorado plains....are not calling themselves the Seminoles or wearing the helmet.

some teams will saddle up to the success that FSU had in the 80's and 90's...but that's not a comprehensive account of teams with "Indian" names.

I didnt say they use the seminole name. I said they wear the seminole helmet.

Its true in the south. I dont know else where. Before the NCAA cracked down on "Native" American team names, you could usually see a team with the name Indians or Braves with a seminole logo on the helmet but different colors. I am not saying they all had them, but a lot of them did.

Ps. Fuck Oklahoma. The Florida State Seminoles represent the Seminoles that stayed in Florida not the ones in Oklahoma. The Florida Seminoles had to convince the Oklahoma seminoles to allow FSU to keep the name and logos. They were the only ones with a problem outside the NCAA and faggy ass white people with nothing better to do.

Mr T wrote:

King Crimson wrote:

Mr T wrote: Any lower division school or high school that has a "Native" American team name usually has the seminole helmet.

that not true.

maybe in Florida, but not in the US as a whole. That's certainly not true in Oklahoma nor was it true before the PC changing of names from many schools nationwide. some of which i think was a legit. "Savages" doesn't ring quite right. some, probably overdone. Seminoles are one regional tribe. High school teams in the Cherokee Strip or Osage Hills in Oklahoma or Arapahoe in the Colorado plains....are not calling themselves the Seminoles or wearing the helmet.

some teams will saddle up to the success that FSU had in the 80's and 90's...but that's not a comprehensive account of teams with "Indian" names.

I didnt say they use the seminole name. I said they wear the seminole helmet.

Its true in the south. I dont know else where. Before the NCAA cracked down on "Native" American team names, you could usually see a team with the name Indians or Braves with a seminole logo on the helmet but different colors. I am not saying they all had them, but a lot of them did.

i realize what you mean about the spear helmet. it's a great logo. i like the garnet and gold. it's a good look.

i could see the point where the Seminoles helmet was still in use (at FSU with the Seminole Tribe approval) and thereby "acceptable", but personal experience in the OK/Texas/NM/Colorado areas you don't see that so much. Much more popular was a kind of Washington Redskins type logo. we wore one at my junior high in Norman. sort of like Penn State's unis with a blue/white outlined Skins logo.

you guys adopted that logo in 76 and the NFL Skins wore it in the late 60's. lucky they aren't charging you....heh.

http://www.nationalchamps.net/Helmet_Project/

Yes we did take the idea of our logo from the skins but it isnt the same logo. Were they using it the same time we adopted our logo?

Ps. Check your link. FSU was putting spears on its helmets three years before the skins were.

Still not as sorry ass as what we've seen from the Pac-10 and Big-10 on the field this season.

I could almost understand jumping on a high school logo that actually resembled a one of a kind, highly distinguishable logo such as a longhorn or even the UM wolverine style helmet. But man how chickenshit is it to copyright a block letter "A" or a "W"?. So stupid. I do remember the ATM/ Seahawk dispute and even Texas suing an Aggie entrepenuer for their saw 'em off logo and I think so are pretty bullish as well, but public high schools already face enough issues without someone trying to claim they are infringing on some profits.

Mr T wrote:Yes we did take the idea of our logo from the skins but it isnt the same logo. Were they using it the same time we adopted our logo?

Ps. Check your link. FSU was putting spears on its helmets three years before the skins were.

yer kidding, right? in 1962 you had an elongated Windows XP cursor on your helmet and it was far away better than any of the other goofball stuff you had until the mid 70's. Please. some of those look like 3rd place in the elementary school contest. the state of Florida with "state" on it. the full feathered chief thing? c'mon.

you guys lifted the look straight from the Skins. there is nothing about the natural genesis of FSU helmet logo development there to suggest otherwise. sorry. 1962 is the only year with anything resembling a "spear" and i'd call it more of an arrow, to be honest.....then, the spear appears full formed in 1976. Same as the Skins. It's OK, it's a good look....just admit it.

I dont think Arizonas A is just a block A.

some private school in Woodland Hills Utah recently changed its name to USC and their mascot to the Trojans, the guy who bought the school said he is a descendent of some king of troy so USC shouldnt go after them for copyright infringement. That explained the Trojans but to change a name of a school from woodland hills to utah southern community high school and stealing most the schools logos are not.
The school changed their Trojan logo to look like this

but the interlocking S and C are still all USC's

campinfool wrote:But man how chickenshit is it to copyright a block letter "A" or a "W"?

They’re welcome to use a block “W”. Just not our trademarked Motion W. We also just settled a lawsuit against Washburn University in Topeka for thieving the W.

Personally, I see nothing wrong with a university wanting to keep its logo trademarked.

If you don't like it, then create your own damned logo/uniform.

King Crimson wrote:yer kidding, right? in 1962 you had an elongated Windows XP cursor on your helmet and it was far away better than any of the other goofball stuff you had until the mid 70's.

I havent seen that cursor before. Did FSU steal the cursor image too?

https://www.gridironmemories.com/shop/c ... p?catid=97

King Crimson wrote:you guys lifted the look straight from the Skins. there is nothing about the natural genesis of FSU helmet logo development there to suggest otherwise. sorry. 1962 is the only year with anything resembling a "spear" and i'd call it more of an arrow, to be honest.....then, the spear appears full formed in 1976. Same as the Skins. It's OK, it's a good look....just admit it.

From my previous post....

Mr T wrote:Yes we did take the idea of our logo from the skins but it isnt the same logo.

i also said it looked more like an arrow than a spear. and that the "spear" look was not part of the FSU helmet until 1976. you told me to go look at my own link (helmet project)....i have no idea what that was supposed to mean.

because the "spear" look was never on an FSU helmet before it was on a skins helmet.

just admit you are wrong.

Mr T wrote: Ps. Check your link. FSU was putting spears on its helmets three years before the skins were.

i don't really see it. nor do i think anything on the helmet project support this claim.

Those single arrow helmets are AWESOME.

The arrow is kind of cool... why'd they go to a spear?

King Crimson wrote:just admit you are wrong.

From my previous post....

Mr T wrote:Yes we did take the idea of our logo from the skins but it isnt the same logo.

Nice sarcasm PSUFan.

you also said you had spears on the helmet before the Skins and that is factually untrue, which i've demonstrated.

and this "Fuck Oklahoma" thing you've got above i'm gonna let go. like a lot of Oklahomans i'm part Cherokee and part Choctaw and I sure as hell don't need you telling me how to think about Indian heritage when you are full of shit about your own football helmet...which (helmet/logo licensing, although entirely inaccurate) apparently in your mind is a synechdoche for being an expert on US-Indian affairs.

The HS I went to my freshman year had the same logo as Kansas and they made us change or they'd sue the fuck out of the school. They changed it.......barely. This same school now uses the Miami "U" on their helmets with the same uni's (exactly) as Ole Miss. I wonder if The U knows. Sounds like they're not too thrilled to see other teams use that logo. Fuck them.

Wisconsin threatened to sue a school in central Iowa for stealing the "W" logo. Aparently, they invented the alphabet. Someone needs to tell those fat fucks up in Madison that the god damn "W" is not a logo, it's fucking letter!

TheJON wrote:Wisconsin threatened to sue a school in central Iowa for stealing the "W" logo. Aparently, they invented the alphabet. Someone needs to tell those fat fucks up in Madison that the god damn "W" is not a logo, it's fucking letter!

You really are a fucking retard. A block W is just a letter. The Motion W is a trademarked item that the University of Wisconsin spent money to develop. Aparently (sic), we invented the alphabet. And there is a significant market for that alphabet and its usage in Bumfuck, Iowa. Moron.

King Crimson wrote:you also said you had spears on the helmet before the Skins and that is factually untrue, which i've demonstrated.

We had something similar to what they had on both occasions before and after they had their helmet logo and decided to go another way. You feel that FSU would have never ended up with a spear or anything similar even though we did have something before the skins. Maybe we wouldnt have had the spear, maybe it wouldve looked different, maybe it wouldve been a tomahawk or just the seminole logo....I dont know but as I said before.....

Mr T wrote:Yes we did take the idea of our logo from the skins but it isnt the same logo.

King Crimson wrote:like a lot of Oklahomans i'm part Cherokee and part Choctaw

Is your baby a Chippewa?

King Crimson wrote:I sure as hell don't need you telling me how to think about Indian heritage when you are full of shit about your own football helmet...which (helmet/logo licensing, although entirely inaccurate) apparently in your mind is a synechdoche for being an expert on US-Indian affairs.

I told you fuck Oklahoma because you thought I was referring to the Oklahoma Seminoles. I guess an Indian expert like yourself forgot that some Seminoles told the white man to go fuck himself and didn't go west.

Whatever happens from here on out is inconsequential -- KC used the word "synechdoche" in a post...


BODE be unto him.