T1B

0-22-1 in Mexico.

US have never won in Mexico.

That streak should end tomorrow.

US 2 Mexico 1.

Too much to hope for in Azteca... the piss bags will be flying and 120k screaming messicans will have an impact.

I'm hoping for Davies and Altidore up front so we can press their back four but I suspect Ching will get the call unfortunately.

They worked us over in the second half like we were a suburban back yard retaining wall job.

That was unfortunate in terms of a result but Mexico deserved it. They stepped up as the U.S. defense disappeared.

As much as I love soccer, we will always suck at it. This year was our "Miracle on Ice." We will NEVER compete on a global scale. Sad but most definitely true.

IndyFrisco wrote:As much as I love soccer, we will always suck at it. This year was our "Miracle on Ice." We will NEVER compete on a global scale. Sad but most definitely true.

So untrue. Say that to Vincent del Bosque or Luiz Felipe Scolari who have both stated that the United States' youth teams are amongst the most five talented in the world right now and if you "love" soccer then you should know who they are without having to bust out google. Coming into qualifying after the previous Gold Cup (not the most recent) the USA was expected to be in rebuild mode with a very youth oriented team yet over half way through the Hex we are sitting second in the table and short of a monumental meltdown in September and October virtually guaranteed a trip to South Africa.

It's supposed "soccer lovers" like you that are the downfall of the program from the root levels. The United States has gone from being a non-factor to a true contender with some of the big boys in one generation which is unheard of... just ask Portugal, Turkey, Paraguay, and Scotland about such a feat.

socal wrote:That was unfortunate in terms of a result but Mexico deserved it. They stepped up as the U.S. defense disappeared.

We played poorly with the outlet passing and holding form in the back 1/3 but just as much of this loss is attributable to the atrocious officiating in the game. The shot from 25 yards was gorgeous but it should have never occurred after Landon was mauled at midfield moving through two defenders which should have obviously have resulted in a free kick for the Nats. Even Andres Cantor noted during the game "El mismo juego, el mismo punto en el campo, los mismos trastos cínicos, sin la misma disciplina del árbitro." ("Same play, same spot on the field, same cynical tackle, without the same discipline from the referee.") after the foul outside the box. After the match in an interview he also stated "Éste era ciertamente uno de los fósforos lo más contrario posible oficiados que he observado nunca. El lado americano se justifica en preguntar el control de los funcionarios del fósforo." ("This was certainly one of the most inconsistently officiated matches that I have ever observed. The American side is justified in questioning the officials control of the match.") Gooch was given a yellow card for a hand ball where his arms are visibly being held in tight to his inside body and is pegged with the ball but in contrast an obvious hand ball inside the box, off a free kick, where the Mexican defender is obviously using his arms to enlarge his body goes uncalled. There are at least 8 other instances that could be cited during play that shows the horrible biased in the Panamanian officiating crew during the match... Hell on the Boca yellow card Bocanegra was the first player at the ball, had won the ball, and had released an upfield clearance when the Mexican player keeps running and intentionally trips over his leg before the model thespian routine where he rolls on the ground at least 6 times feigning injury (if you roll more than twice and nothing is broken, you're faking) and Boca is given a yellow card. Blanco obviously and intentionally stomps on an American defender's leg (can't remember if it was Boca or DeMerrit) while on the ground less than 3 meters from the head official and 10 meters from a side judge with both staring at it and not so much as a free kick is given! A Mexican player literally tried to strangle Feilhaber in a scrum started by Mexican players with the official standing less than 2 feet behind them coming to brake it up and that is the only yellow card Mexico receives the entire match? A Yellow card for attempting to strangle a player? Seriously??? I don't know what brand of Soccer/futebol/football is played south of the Rio Grande or in the Western Hemisphere in general but when I was a kid living in Scotland that was a straight Red Card and most likely a lengthy suspension!!!

SCS, you're right when you point out that the referee wasn't consistent on both sides. Be that as it may the U.S. has to play to that level, they have to persevere through that kind of bullshit and find a way to earn a point or three. That's part of the game. Unfortunately for Donovan when he protests it's usually at an inopportune moment of transition. I'd prefer he zip his lip and just play hardnosed and win the ball back rather that throw the arms to the sky and stop playing. When he's playing the U.S. is on. Witness Davies goal. But when he stops it puts too much pressure on the defense.

Still, overall, it wasn't a bad performance on the road in Azteca. I think they'll rebound and learn from it and become a better team for it.

Indy, like it or not, the U.S. is improving little by little. This team will compete internationally. I think they have something for South Africa 2010.

what all the talking heads on tv and radio are conveniently forgetting to mention is that this wasn't a must need result to get to SA. sure, it would have been nice to get even a point, but looking at the rest of the matches, especially the home matches (playing in columbus or foxboro in the snow = just as big of an advantage as stadia azteca) it really shouldn't be an issue to qualify.
winning this region does nothing, because it doesn't guarantee a seed in the group to keep us from the big powers in the world stage, so it doesn't really matter.

Mac22 wrote:what all the talking heads on tv and radio are conveniently forgetting to mention is that this wasn't a must need result to get to SA. sure, it would have been nice to get even a point, but looking at the rest of the matches, especially the home matches (playing in columbus or foxboro in the snow = just as big of an advantage as stadia azteca) it really shouldn't be an issue to qualify.
winning this region does nothing, because it doesn't guarantee a seed in the group to keep us from the big powers in the world stage, so it doesn't really matter.

Absolutely correct. We are tied for second in the Hex with a GD advantage over Honduras currently. We have the most favorable schedule left in the Hex with the most difficult games all passed on the road in Azteca and and San Jose. We should pull at least nine points in the next four games; only real road test is Honduras and they may be short their best two players as one is considering international retirement and the other is injured. Nine points mathematically guarantees a s spot in South Africa... even eight points with the current goals outlook gives us the advancement. Mexico still has a road match in Costa Rica and Honduras at home. Costa Rica is virtually assured advancement with our schedule the most favorable to finish in top three when matched against Mexico and Honduras who both have to face each other and Costa Rica still.

Can't really see the US as any sort of power till there's a broad, established league on a stable footing - and everything that comes with it. Decent acadamies bringing up young players and pouring money into development.

You "glass half full" guys are refreshing. And don't take a dig at me for not seeing the light at the end of the tunnel. The fact remains, Americans do not have their best athletes playing soccer. Other countries do. Our 3rd or 4th tier athletes will never compete.

You want to say I do not love the game or our national team because I am a realist? Fine. There's nothing in the books that says you have to be a homer to be a fan. I am ALWAYS a fan. I just don't have the glorious expectations some of you obviously have.

Oh, and SCS, I'll give you a chance to retract the comment how "soccer lovers" like me are the downfall. I refereee soccer for 7th and 8th grade middl school teams. I do love soccer. My 3 year old is in a soccer league. Don't fucking tell me I am killing soccer, ass. I am ALL ABOUT soccer.

I'd file this under Suncoastsooner nationalist, lynchmob weirdness - along with 'the premiership needs more american money'.

Fuck me, I'll take a Russian oligarch, a Saudi oilman or a Thai dictator over a yanquee wanquee with a credit card.

IndyFrisco wrote:You "glass half full" guys are refreshing. And don't take a dig at me for not seeing the light at the end of the tunnel. The fact remains, Americans do not have their best athletes playing soccer. Other countries do. Our 3rd or 4th tier athletes will never compete.

You want to say I do not love the game or our national team because I am a realist? Fine. There's nothing in the books that says you have to be a homer to be a fan. I am ALWAYS a fan. I just don't have the glorious expectations some of you obviously have.

i don't know about a light at the end of the tunnel. i'm pleased with the progress in the last decade or so. but i'm also realistic in that USA may not win a world cup while i'm alive, and i'm only 27. i have no problem with that. my expectations are what the team is at now, no more, no less. i will be more than happy to be 12th in the world with our 3rd and 4th tier athletes. yet i bleed soccer, yeah, i bleed other sports too, some even more than soccer (penn state for one, but soccer comes into play there also).

it's like rugby here in the US... i play for a division II team in Madison, and have played against a few of the big boys when we were division I last year (Roland Suniula is on the nat'l team). i watched a national team match against wales in chicago this summer, and we got smoked. but there are no expections of beating a new zealand or ireland. i'm perfectly happy with being in the top 20 in the world in a sport that we absolutely suck at. that still says a lot that we can beat teams who care even more about it than we do.

Mac22 wrote:

IndyFrisco wrote:You "glass half full" guys are refreshing. And don't take a dig at me for not seeing the light at the end of the tunnel. The fact remains, Americans do not have their best athletes playing soccer. Other countries do. Our 3rd or 4th tier athletes will never compete.

You want to say I do not love the game or our national team because I am a realist? Fine. There's nothing in the books that says you have to be a homer to be a fan. I am ALWAYS a fan. I just don't have the glorious expectations some of you obviously have.

i don't know about a light at the end of the tunnel. i'm pleased with the progress in the last decade or so. but i'm also realistic in that USA may not win a world cup while i'm alive, and i'm only 27. i have no problem with that. my expectations are what the team is at now, no more, no less. i will be more than happy to be 12th in the world with our 3rd and 4th tier athletes. yet i bleed soccer, yeah, i bleed other sports too, some even more than soccer (penn state for one, but soccer comes into play there also).

it's like rugby here in the US... i play for a division II team in Madison, and have played against a few of the big boys when we were division I last year (Roland Suniula is on the nat'l team). i watched a national team match against wales in chicago this summer, and we got smoked. but there are no expections of beating a new zealand or ireland. i'm perfectly happy with being in the top 20 in the world in a sport that we absolutely suck at. that still says a lot that we can beat teams who care even more about it than we do.

Fuckin' WURD!!!!!

IndyFrisco wrote:Oh, and SCS, I'll give you a chance to retract the comment how "soccer lovers" like me are the downfall. I refereee soccer for 7th and 8th grade middl school teams. I do love soccer. My 3 year old is in a soccer league. Don't fucking tell me I am killing soccer, ass. I am ALL ABOUT soccer.

Do you want a cookie for officiating a bunch of Junior High kids while dismantling their potential on this board from me? Go look somewhere else! I have umpired little league ball, officiated pee wee football, coached both, and coached swimming and soccer. I have no love or respect for your out look. We are a nation of 304+ million people and you can tell me we can't be at the same level as Turkey, Portugal, Cameroon, and Uruguay with the third best players in the class? Get a grip... We may not EVER win a world cup but we sure as hell can be a challenger!!! We're the third most populated country in the world, the wealthiest country on earth, even in a recession, and have the ability and resources to make it happen. Our issue is at the root with people who 1) have no hope or vision (that would be you as exhibit A) and 2) with youth coach idiots who are more interested in their W-L-D than developing skill, technique, and knowledge of the game!

Dr_Phibes wrote:Can't really see the US as any sort of power till there's a broad, established league on a stable footing - and everything that comes with it. Decent acadamies bringing up young players and pouring money into development.

We're trying... people like Indy don't believe it is possible. It's an up hill battle with these people.

I thought we played as well as you can in a smoggy city at 8,000 feet with the elements and the referees against you.

First off, Azteca is a shithole. Mexico has the biggest advantage playing there. Funny how when they leave, they lose games. Notice the 10 year losing streak to the US in the US and other parts of the world (WC 2002, Korea). And don't give me this Gold Cup crap, they played 6 guys from that team on Wednesday. We played 1 (Ching) and brought in 1 (Holden).

I have never witnessed such a biased game. The referee should be banned from qualifying games. There were so many bad calls against the US. Boca's yellow was a terrible call. He got the ball and Dos Santos tripped and rolled like he was on fire. Yellow. 2 minutes later, Dos Santos comes in on a tackle with studs up and nothing is called. This was right in front of the official. The commentators were saying that it was a terrible call and should be a yellow at the least! It was a dangerous play and was from behind and most refs would have called a red.

The fans are a joke. I read blogs from yahoo, ESPN, and CNNSI where the reporters saw things like guys pissing or puking in beer cups and throwing it on the field at the players. I cannot imagine that happening in the US.

We are in good shape. I expect 3 points against El Salvador, T&T and Costa Rica at home. I would like to see a draw at Honduras. That gives us 20. I expect Mexico to lose at CR. If they win the rest they have 19. CR should win 2-3. 3 gives them 21. Honduras should win 2-3 and lose or tie 1. That would give them 19-20. Either way, we make it to to SA.

oh yeah.....FUCK EL TRI!

Grant Wahl is reporting that Landon Donovan played the match in Mexico after having contracted H1N1 virus (swine flu). Other media outlets are reporting that two other unspecified players may have also contracted the virus; speculation is that Jozy Altidore may be one of those players and why he did not start against Mexico.

http://www.fannation.com/si_blogs/grant ... -flu-virus

SunCoastSooner wrote:Grant Wahl is reporting that Landon Donovan played the match in Mexico after having contracted H1N1 virus (swine flu). Other media outlets are reporting that two other unspecified players may have also contracted the virus; speculation is that Jozy Altidore may be one of those players and why he did not start against Mexico.

http://www.fannation.com/si_blogs/grant ... -flu-virus

Cherundolo has been quarantined by his club in Germany after testing positive for the virus as well.

Indy is talking total sense - who cares about population size, money or anything else? There's no decent competition for potential players, they'll never be able to compete on an international level.

Suncoast is full of crap as usual - a managerial programme is easy to assemble, that's the simple part, there simply isn't a pool of players to draw from. It's a difficult postion to be in, sort of reverse of everyone else's.
The odd upset, or three game run in the internationals is the best you can hope for - you'll never win a tournament like that.

If I were king of the universe, I'd start nationalising Mexican players, there's a mountain of talent down there - give them passports and put them through a disciplined system. The French did it with North Africans and have cups coming out their ears.

socal wrote:Indy, like it or not, the U.S. is improving little by little. This team will compete internationally. I think they have something for South Africa 2010.

I like the fact we've shown some signs of improvement. I have no delusions of grandeur that the US Team will compete year in and year out at a high level. Like Mac said, I'm happy enough if we make a run in any tourney. You can catch lightning in a bottle for a short period of time. That's all I ask for.

Other countries are using their absolute best athletes for their national team. We are not, and we never will. Sorry if it gets some panties in a wad for being a realist.

Oh, and to Screwball, when I say anyone has the aptitude to make something of themselves if they want to you tell me it's not true. Yet when I say that physical ability for our soccer players, something that can't be "learned" like education, isn't on par with real contenders you say I need to check myself.

So, you just biting ankles or just that stupid?

Dr_Phibes wrote:Indy is talking total sense - who cares about population size, money or anything else? There's no decent competition for potential players, they'll never be able to compete on an international level.

Suncoast is full of crap as usual - a managerial programme is easy to assemble, that's the simple part, there simply isn't a pool of players to draw from. It's a difficult postion to be in, sort of reverse of everyone else's.
The odd upset, or three game run in the internationals is the best you can hope for - you'll never win a tournament like that.

If I were king of the universe, I'd start nationalising Mexican players, there's a mountain of talent down there - give them passports and put them through a disciplined system. The French did it with North Africans and have cups coming out their ears.

You're officially a fucking moron and don't have fucking clue what you're talking about. The Mexican U21s have 8 United States citizens who live full time in America when not playing soccer. U17... 15 players, same scenario. Even Mexicans who follow their national team have recognized this issue. With the new FIFA rule Mexico is in full panic mode and all you have to do is read their own organization's own President's comments to recognize such.

IndyFrisco wrote:Oh, and to Screwball, when I say anyone has the aptitude to make something of themselves if they want to you tell me it's not true. Yet when I say that physical ability for our soccer players, something that can't be "learned" like education, isn't on par with real contenders you say I need to check myself.

So, you just biting ankles or just that stupid?

Get a grip and go referee you're precious Junior high match up in BFE Indiana... I'll take take Bosque and Scolari's documented opinions over Phibs and Indy's any day of the week and multiple times on Sunday when it comes to this issue. But I'm sure that Indy's refereeing of BFE Indiana sides outweighs two of the most successful international managers in the world.

I'll take take Bosque and Scolari's documented opinions over Phibs and Indy's any day of the week and multiple times on Sunday when it comes to this issue.

So you went to the FIFA website, looked up the rules on dodgy passpots and found a quote from Scolari saying, 'Hey kids, FIFA is cracking down on stuff - I agree, It's bad for football.

PS

Stay in school.




I admire your enthusiasm.

Dr_Phibes wrote:

I'll take take Bosque and Scolari's documented opinions over Phibs and Indy's any day of the week and multiple times on Sunday when it comes to this issue.

So you went to the FIFA website, looked up the rules on dodgy passpots and found a quote from Scolari saying, 'Hey kids, FIFA is cracking down on stuff - I agree, It's bad for football.

PS

Stay in school.




I admire your enthusiasm.

FIFA is cracking down? You're a fucking IDIOT... they made it easier to become member of the senior national team... trolls are morons.


P.S. If you're not a troll you're just a moron.

No, not trolling - just taking a wild guess as to what on earth you're talking about.

I have presented an ironclad, bullet-proof plan for US world football dominance. According to you, I am wrong.
Scolari said something? the Mexicans are aware of something? and FIFA has done something? that prove me wrong, but you haven't said what.

You are being very cryptic and mysterious, Suncoast - but then, you've got your ear to the ground, right?

Dr_Phibes wrote:No, not trolling - just taking a wild guess as to what on earth you're talking about.

I have presented an ironclad, bullet-proof plan for US world football dominance. According to you, I am wrong.
Scolari said something? the Mexicans are aware of something? and FIFA has done something? that prove me wrong, but you haven't said what.

You are being very cryptic and mysterious, Suncoast - but then, you've got your ear to the ground, right?

If you have never been capped by a nation's senior national team in a FIFA event you can switch your country if you have a valid link to that country.

I never said it was easy. Just that anyone can do it. It is damn hard to do, but it can be done. Shit or get off the pot; I don't fucking care. I'm just saying if you are a failure, I'm not willing to pay for it.

SunCoastSooner wrote:
If you have never been capped by a nation's senior national team in a FIFA event you can switch your country if you have a valid link to that country.

Thanks for bearing with me, I can be a bit slow sometimes.

I'll guess again as to your point.. you don't like the rule because of American brain drain? There's nothing you can do about it - it's fair and it works both ways. Decent midfielders like Muzzy Izzet and Robbie Savage couldn't crack the England line-up and went on to strengthen smaller sides.

Rather than cry and print up 'Judas' T-shirts like any two year old, wouldn't it be more practical to use the rule to your own advantage? Throw around a little 'American' money and draw foreign players into the US squad?

Dr_Phibes wrote:

SunCoastSooner wrote:
If you have never been capped by a nation's senior national team in a FIFA event you can switch your country if you have a valid link to that country.

Thanks for bearing with me, I can be a bit slow sometimes.

I'll guess again as to your point.. you don't like the rule because of American brain drain? There's nothing you can do about it - it's fair and it works both ways. Decent midfielders like Muzzy Izzet and Robbie Savage couldn't crack the England line-up and went on to strengthen smaller sides.

Rather than cry and print up 'Judas' T-shirts like any two year old, wouldn't it be more practical to use the rule to your own advantage? Throw around a little 'American' money and draw foreign players into the US squad?

We have been... Jermaine Jones, Castillo, Stuart Holden.

Well that's one Mexican, but you're not nearly trying hard enough. My brilliant plan requires total commitment.

Try the ex-wife's bedroom, there's probably two fit out of the dozen. A quickie marriage, citizenship then run a few laps and hey-ho, it's off to Azteca we go.

Trust me, I'm a fountain of knowledge on this stuff.

Dr_Phibes wrote:Well that's one Mexican, but you're not nearly trying hard enough. My brilliant plan requires total commitment.

Try the ex-wife's bedroom, there's probably two fit out of the dozen. A quickie marriage, citizenship then run a few laps and hey-ho, it's off to Azteca we go.

Trust me, I'm a fountain of knowledge on this stuff.

Are you suggesting the American squad tap one of the Mexicans currently...nah...forget it...

Dr_Phibes wrote:Well that's one Mexican, but you're not nearly trying hard enough. My brilliant plan requires total commitment.

Try the ex-wife's bedroom, there's probably two fit out of the dozen. A quickie marriage, citizenship then run a few laps and hey-ho, it's off to Azteca we go.

Trust me, I'm a fountain of knowledge on this stuff.

Good plan Mtool.... you forgot the pictures of San Fransisco which you don't live in as well though.