T1B

You're not getting Kirk. Please go away. He won't even consider, I guarantee it. Stop the rumors already. Why must we go through with this crap every damn year? When are people going to learn Kirk isn't leaving? Next year will be his 12th year at Iowa. He's had offers from top programs and NFL gigs just about every year. Notre Dame is maybe the 15th best job he's been rumored to go to. Hate to say it, Irish fan, but he's got a better gig right now than if he were to leave for South Bend. He wouldn't make more if he were to go to ND. Not only that but he would have to deal with unrealistic expectations at ND and he wouldn't be going to a better program. Sure, the media will tell you ND is better than Iowa. But this ain't your daddy's Notre Dame anymore. Kirk is having more success than the last 3 Notre Dame coaches have had. The glory years are over for the Irish.

Try all you want, Notre Dame, but you have NO shot at landing him.

Mace wrote:Seriously, is this a rumor going around now? Hadn't heard it. The Irish don't need Ferentz, they need Norm Parker.....if he turns down USC.

Yeah, even that retard Sean Keeler tweeted "Ferentz to Notre Dame?". Next time I see him I will kick him in the junk.

Don't worry, Notre Dame fans aspire for a candidate higher than Ferentz. Getting one is a different argument.

And I'm sure the glory days for Texas, OU, LSU, USC etc., were over until they hired the right coach.

Don't worry, Notre Dame fans aspire for a candidate higher than Ferentz. Getting one is a different argument.

I would fire Ferentz in favor of Bill Belichik, but that's not gonna happen.

Bob Davie, Ty Willingham, Charlie Weis. These are your last 3 hires. None of them are even in Ferentz' league. This is my point about your fans, Killian. How many coaches are you guys going to fire before you realize that you guys running coaches out of town is the real problem and not the coaches you're hiring?

Why do you guys hate stability so much? You're not landing better coaches because great coaches don't want that job as much as you think.

Notre Dame won't get a coach as accomplished as Kirk. The ONLY reason for that? Your fans. Your fan base has ruined your program. You will deny this, and that's fine, but it's the truth.

The administration has ruined the program, not the fans. The fans are the only thing that can save it at this point. Hopefully Swarbrick and Jenkins have the sac that Malloy and White lacked.

ND could get Brian Kelly, who is as acomplished or more so than Ferentz.

Keeping Weis does nothing for stability. Recruiting will continue to slide and soon ND will be back to Willingham-esq talent levels. .583 doesn't cut it. Their last 3 hires have been disasters because the way they have gone about the searches and the candidates they had lined up. If Brian Kelly or Jon Gruden truely are the floor this time around, they will be well ahead of their last searches.

ND could get Brian Kelly, who is as acomplished or more so than Ferentz.

How is he as accomplished as Ferentz? He's a good coach, but I think his next move will be the NFL instead.

I would agree Kelly and Gruden are well ahead of their previous coaches, but I think it's unlikely to get either. If they Chuck Charlie, I think you'll see quite a few big names turn them down quickly and the question is will they panic and just hire the first decent coach they find or will the administration stay patient and keep plucking away at top names.

If I were ND I would have a list of at least a dozen big name coaches. I would start with Jim Harbaugh. Midwest guy, west coast ties, major college coaching experience, comes from a coaching family, etc.... I think it's quite obvious he isn't going to be staying at Stanford very long. Yeah, I know........the last Stanford coach you hired didn't work out so well for you. But this one is a better fit than Willingham. I can't think of a more perfect fit that Notre Dame could realistically get unless I'm wrong on Gruden.

I think Kelly would take the ND job if he'd already given the NFL a shot. He's turned down major colleges already, so it seems obvious he's waiting for an NFL gig. The problem with Gruden is you've got to expect some NFL teams to come after him and I just can't see him taking the ND job over an NFL job. But I would think Harbaugh is a realistic possibility.

If not Harbaugh, Gruden, or Kelly........who else better than Charlie could they land? Greg Schiano? Meh. I'd go with Harbaugh over him anyways. Jim Leavitt? Maybe. You have to wonder if he's gotten that program as far as he can take it. Tommy Tuberville? This might not be a bad hire. Mike Gundy? Can't imagine him staying at a 2nd rate program in the Big-12 South over a ND offer. Bret Bielema? There's your defensive coordinator with major college head coaching experience/success.

So these are who I would go after in order of best fit if Gruden and Kelly say no.........

1.Harbaugh
2.Bielema
3.Leavitt
4.Shanahan
5.Schiano
6.Gundy
7.Tuberville

I think all 7 of those guys would be good hires and would at least consider the offer. So start with Harbaugh and work your way down until someone says "yes".

Tuberville...bwaaa.

They said Terry Bowden could get any coaching job he wanted...only took him ten years to find that plum North Alabama gig.

Name a head coach who left Auburn for a big-time job at another school. Leather helmet era doesn't count.

Kelly has built two programs and taken a third to unprecidented heights.

Harbaugh is more of a risk to the NFL than Kelly. Kelly runs a version of the spread.

ND is in a unique position because very few elite jobs will be open this year. If they can't get Kelly or Gruden, you don't make a move. ND will make a move.

And you don't start with that list. Those coaches either won't leave their current spot or are the wrong candidates.

And you don't start with that list. Those coaches either won't leave their current spot or are the wrong candidates.

So you're telling me that some of those guys wouldn't leave their current gig but you have a shot at Gruden or Kelly???

What about Bielema? Wisconsin only has so much upside. He's done a solid job there. He's a defensive guy. He's a pretty good recruiter too. I could see him taking that job. He's an Iowa guy, not a Wisconsin guy. Only reason he's Wisconsin's coach is because Ferentz never left and Alvarez just handed him the job. This seems to me that it would be a good hire.

Bielema? Give me a fucking break. He was handed a BCS team and great recruiting class by Alverez. He's done nothing on his own to distinguish himself.

And yes, ND has a shot at both Kelly and Gruden. Gruden is unemployed right now, ND had agreed in principle to a contract with him in 2001, he's stated numerous times in interviews and his autobiography that ND is a dream of his. Kelly is an Irish Catholic who began his coaching career less than 2 hours from Notre Dame.

Bielema? Give me a fucking break. He was handed a BCS team and great recruiting class by Alverez. He's done nothing on his own to distinguish himself.

What do you mean handed a great recruiting class by Alvarez? You realize Bielema was a big part of those recruits, right? Bielema has had some success as a coordinator for a couple BCS schools and now he's having some success as a head coach. He's got a pretty solid team this year (his own players) and they should be pretty good again next year.

I don't see why you don't think this is a good fit for him.

Who gives a crap who is Catholic and who isn't? This ain't church!

I hate agreeing with Jonsense about anything Killian but he does make a few valid points about the perception of Notre Dame from a national perspective outside the media and especially NBC. The expectations with limitations is major part of that problem as well.

TheJON wrote: 1.Harbaugh
2.Bielema
3.Leavitt
4.Shanahan
5.Schiano
6.Gundy
7.Tuberville

Rather than pick the entire post apart I'll just use your list in short form...

1. Harbaugh - doubtful... Michigan man through and through it would be sacrilege to both parties; even more so to Harb though I would think.

2. Bielema - I could see this happening a lot more than Harbaugh. There's no conflict in interest between the parties. He's proven with a good coaching pedigree. Having said that wasn't he basically the annointed hand picked successor to Alvarez? Why would he risk throwing all that away for an inherent trap job that has become Notre Dame.

3. Leavitt - No way, no how, no chance. Leavitt has grown his baby to a mature adolescent and budding contender in a state/region that is amongst the most talented recruiting wise a coach could ever ask for. Numerous big programs have already made runs at him and been scorned publicly for doing so (such as Bama). Leavitt is going to retire as a Golden Bull someday and be able to name his successor and live like a legend in the tropical Tampa Bay community.

4. Shanahan - I really don't know why but I could see this happening and in my mind of anyone on your list consider it to be the most reasonable and likely.

5. Schiano - He'd be interested; hell he'd be a fool not to be. Something tells me that he's still holding out on a hope and a prayer for the position in Happy Valley when Papa Bear is mummified on the sidelines.

6. Gundy - Gundy doesn't consider his gig a second rate, lower tier Big 12, job as you describe it. The man is a Poke through and through; this was his dream job and it took him slaving away under two predecessors and selling his body for T Boone to get it. The only way you'll ever see Gundy leave Stoolwater is when T. Boone sends his private army into the coaches offices to cut the chains and pry his bloody hands from the HC desk.

7. Tuberville - I just don't see it. TeleTubby is a southern boy through and through and I just don't see him taking a gig up north ala Zook.

Carson wrote:Tuberville...bwaaa.

They said Terry Bowden could get any coaching job he wanted...only took him ten years to find that plum North Alabama gig.

Name a head coach who left Auburn for a big-time job at another school. Leather helmet era doesn't count.

Terry Bowden tried everything short of offering Joe Castiglione a blow job for the Oklahoma gig back in '99 before it was offered to Stoops.

My guess, worth just about nil, is that Gruden will be the next ND coach.

1. Harbaugh - doubtful... Michigan man through and through it would be sacrilege to both parties; even more so to Harb though I would think.

2. Bielema - I could see this happening a lot more than Harbaugh. There's no conflict in interest between the parties. He's proven with a good coaching pedigree. Having said that wasn't he basically the annointed hand picked successor to Alvarez? Why would he risk throwing all that away for an inherent trap job that has become Notre Dame.

I dunno, Harbaugh doesn't seem to fond of Michigan anymore. Even so, it's not uncommon for someone to go coach at his alma-maters rival or some other BCS school.

Bielema is doing it right now. Played at Iowa, die-hard Hawkeye fan, has a Tigerhawk tattoo on his ankle. Dan McCarney played and coached at Iowa. When he was a coach during the 1980's, Hayden Fry would use him to fire up the troops to pound Iowa State because he hated ISU so much. Then, as you know, he ended up a long-time coach in Ames.

I don't think landing Harbaugh is that unrealistic. They can talk about his new contract at Stanford all they want, but if a school like Notre Dame comes calling I bet he'll be gone as fast as he can. No matter how good you are, you're going to have losing seasons more often than winning ones at Stanford. Ty went to the Rose Bowl and as soon as ND called, he was out faster than you can say "Buddy Teevens".

SunCoastSooner wrote: Terry Bowden tried everything short of offering Joe Castiglione a blow job for the Oklahoma gig back in '99 before it was offered to Stoops.

a gruesome, gruesome thought. The Tater Tot on the OU sidelines, yikes.

Just a hunch, but I doubt ND will be calling Stanford again anytime soon for a head coach.

As for Kelly, fine, forget the Irish Catholic angle. He turned down the Tennessee and Washingto jobs last year right around the time the ND job was rumored to be opening up. Some well informed speculation was that Kelly did this because he was waiting to see what happenned to Weis, and that he was contactedin some capacity last year.

KC, I'm not saying that ND can get any coach they want, but they can still draw from an elite pool if they do it right.

the only reason i don't want harbaugh is because i'm still holding out hope dickrod can pull this thing together. otherwise, if a "michigan man" is going to come back and resurrect the program then i'd much prefer it be him rather than les miles, that hack.

harbaugh's extremely fond of michigan, still. his fall on the sword was directed at the admin, not the institution. he thinks they've relaxed standards too much, and doing what he's doing at stanford is his way of saying a school can focus on on both football and academics without sacrificing either. that may be just the wine speaking, even though i'm at work.

i don't see why anyone thinks kelly would turn down notre dame. he's a climber, and that whole "it's easier to win at cincy" shit is a joke compared to actually running a program like notre dame. if picking the easiest route to the bcs were the issue then people would be lining up to coach and and all acc teams. the catholic angle is at play here. not for any practical reasons, but definitely one extra bullet point to help both sides explain why the relationship is so perfect.

Killian wrote: KC, I'm not saying that ND can get any coach they want, but they can still draw from an elite pool if they do it right.

i agree. i think they get their choice of Kelly or Gruden. i think ND has too many resources to stay down forever; unlike some others who've recently also made loud and frequent prophecy about the end of Bama football as an elite program. However, I think maybe you've responded to me in error. my only post so far is about Tater Tot Bowden contaminating the west sidelines of Owen Field.

My fault, I meant Suncoast.

Killian wrote:And I'm sure the glory days for Texas, OU, LSU, USC etc., were over until they hired the right coach.

That's just it. ND is held to a different standard, at least in the minds of the haters.

Yes, ND has gone 21 years without a national championship. And yes, that's too long by ND standards. But if you look at college football history, there are plenty of elite programs which have/had either current or recently ended streaks of comparable or, in some cases, significantly longer duration:

Michigan: 49 years between consecutive national championships (1948-1997)
LSU: 45 years between consecutive national championships (1958-2003)
Texas: 35 years between consecutive national championships (1970-2005)
Ohio State: 34 years between consecutive national championships (1968-2002)
USC: 25 years between consecutive national championships (1978-2003)
Penn State: 23 years since last national championship (1986)
Nebraska: 23 years between consecutive national championships (1971-1994)
Notre Dame: 21 years since last national championship (1988)
Alabama: 16 years since last national championship (1992, note that I haven't yet included this season since they still have a shot)
Oklahoma: 15 years between consecutive national championships (1985-2000)

But I'm certain that none of those other programs ever stopped being elite on the basis of those streaks. Only ND did.

TheJON wrote:Who gives a crap who is Catholic and who isn't? This ain't church!

I'll go on record as saying that I personally don't care whether ND's next head coach is Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, atheist, Zen Buddhist, or Zoroastrian, so long as the program is winning and doing it the right way. One of ND's most successful head coaches ever -- Ara Parseghian -- was Protestant (although the hire was initially somewhat controversial for that reason). Knute didn't convert to Catholicism until after he arrived at ND.

That being said, ND owes a major part of its fanbase to being a sort of unofficial National Catholic U. For that reason, a Catholic coach is a little more likely to gravitate to the job. All else being held equal, it might mean the difference between ND getting a particular coach and not getting him, under certain circumstances.

As for your list, the only guy I'd even consider there is Shanahan, although he might be the biggest reach of all. I definitely wouldn't mind if ND's next head coach hired Tuberville as his DC to replace Brown and/or Tenuta, though.

Killian wrote:Gruden is unemployed right now,

He isn't coaching right now, but unless you know something I don't, he's not unemployed either. Last I heard, he was still an analyst on MNF. And that job may be more to his liking than the one he held in 2001.

My gut tells me that Kelly is probably the next hire, although I could be wrong about that. I thought Vermeil was coming to ND to replace Faust in '85.

Killian wrote:My fault, I meant Suncoast.

I didn't say I whole heartedly agreed with Jonsense; just that he made some valid points for once. I think if you look at my posting concerning his list you'd realize that I think you both make a decent case and the truth lie somewhere in the middle of what you both perceive. I do believe that Notre Dame and it's fans/alumni are its own worst enemy most of the time though.

TheJON wrote:I would fire Ferentz in favor of Bill Belichik, but that's not gonna happen.

How do you feel about that now?

mvscal wrote:

Killian wrote:Gruden is unemployed right now,

Not anymore. He just signed a deal to stay at ESPN.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4659441

I'd have to guess that all but wipes out any chance ND has of getting Gruden. Perhaps he was using ND, and anticipated NFL openings, as a wedge to get more money from ESPN.

Madden was about the same age as Gruden is now when he up and retired from coaching and wound up in the broadcast booth. Madden, of course, never looked back. Could be the same thing for Gruden.

It's a fucking contract. It's so ESPN can lock him up long term if he decides to stick with the broadcasting route. It essentially gave ESPN exclusive rights to Gruden as a media personality. It has nothing to do with his coaching future.

Killian wrote:It's a fucking contract. It's so ESPN can lock him up long term if he decides to stick with the broadcasting route. It essentially gave ESPN exclusive rights to Gruden as a media personality. It has nothing to do with his coaching future.

Not saying that contracts can't be broken, they certainly can. But I see some similarities between this and the extension Weis signed back in '05. Recall that there were rumors circulating back then that Weis was soon headed back to the NFL.

At a minimum, the timing is certainly peculiar. Now, if he does come to ND, the buyout of his ESPN contract almost certainly will cost ND much more than it would have before he re-upped.

If he and his agent didn't write an out clause in his contract that would enable Gruden to get back into coaching I would be very shocked, given Gruden's stance on coaching in the future.

You're out of your element in this forum. Go back to Cul de Smack or the political forum where your hair pulling generates some sort of reaction.

Sudden Sam wrote:I'm sure Gruden had that out written in the new contract.

But...

...where is all this Gruden talk coming from? Strictly from ND fan boards?

His father was a RB coach under Dan Devine and Gruden himself was approached about the job in 2001 before the O'Leary debacle and subsequent Willingham hire. He had agreed in principle to take the job. From there the details get murky as to why it didn't happen. Some say it was Al Davis, others say that it was the fault of then ND president Monk Malloy. Also, Gruden has spoken about his affinity for Notre Dame in interviews, his autobiography and privately to people who know him and are connected to ND.

His name has been linked to that job for going on 8 years.

Tell me, how many contracts have kept other ESPN analysts from taking coaching jobs? It didn't seem to hinder Lou Pinella, Bobby Valentine, Barry Melrose, or Bill Parcells from taking coaching jobs. Anyone that ND approaches about this job will be under contract and there will be some sort of buyout involved. So again, Jon Gruden signing an extension to broadcast MNF and pick up other broadcasting jobs at ESPN has absolutely fucking zero to do with his coaching future. If the right job comes a long, be it Notre Dame, Dallas, etc., Gruden will opt out of his contract and become a head coach again. He's stated he wants to coach again. So explain to me how this contract, that locks him up at ESPN and guarantees him a job for 2010 and beyond, has anything to do with his coaching prospects?

You're out of your element, Donnie.

mvscal wrote:

Killian wrote:So again, Jon Gruden signing an extension to broadcast MNF and pick up other broadcasting jobs at ESPN has absolutely fucking zero to do with his coaching future.

Guess again, fucktard. Being an idiot, you pay more attention to what he has said in the past than what he's doing right now.

Obviously he would make more money coaching than broadcasting, right? So it isn't about the money. Obviously the leverage his agent would bring to the table is that there would be a number of pro and college teams vying for his services, right? It's quite clear from his actions that he's not interested in coaching in the near future because if he was...he'd be doing it.

I'm not sure why it's so difficult to grasp the simple fact that he has taken another job does have something to do with his coaching future.

Do you want to address my first point, where I blew your stupid fucking argument out of the water? No, I didn't think so.

Let me explain it to you, in simpler terms. Jon Gruden signed a one (1) year contract with ESPN to do MNF games. When coaching positions are open, there is an interview process with multiple candidates. At this point, zero (0) openings exist. Now, if any were to open up (ie Notre Dame or the Dallas Cowboys) Gruden's agent, Bob Lamonte, would likely have been contacted. Seeing as how no interviews have taken place, Gruden still has no idea where he sits in the pecking order of those two potential openings. Or perhaps those two told him that he is on the list, but not at the front of it at this time. Gruden would like to be employed next year, so he signs a contract extension with ESPN because he has no idea if any jobs are going to be open, of if the jobs he wants are going to be open.

So, again, him signing this contract extension has fucking zero to do with him potentially coaching next year.

Keep moving and go bitch about something Obama did or didn't do. You have no idea what you're fucking talking about.

No where did I say that Gruden needed the money or didn't like his MNF gig. The whole conversation centered around his extension and if it would keep him from coaching. He may not coach next year, but it has nothing to do with that contract.

And please, I've seen coaching candidates come and go and the ND administration fuck up coaching searches that were akin to a breakway layup, only to see them dribble the ball off their foot. Gruden could come on MNF tonight in a fucking leprechaun suit sporting an Irish accent saying "Oh dere's nuttin I want more den to coach da Fightin' Irish!" And bust into an Irish jig while drinking whiskey and beating his wife and the ND administration would find a way to fuck it up.

Sorry to interrupt, I just noticed this for the first time.

Killian wrote:I would rather watch a porno staring Charlie Weis, than see him coach another game for ND.