Dark Clouds on the Big 12 horizon yet again?

[Cornhusker]

Well I've been wondering how the remaining Big 12er's are going to deal with the TLN. Concerns Texas A&M it seems.

http://tamu.scout.com/2/1086147.html

[Carson]

As long as Gene Stallings is alive, you will keep hearing this from AtM.

[Harvdog]

If A&M wants to go to the SEC, leave. They haven't done shit in the Big XII and will be worse in the SEC. I look at the schedule and it would be a tough road for them. Florida, Georgia, LSU, Alabama, Auburn, South Carolina, Ole Miss, Miss St....I have a hard time seeing the aggys winning many games. There fan base would shit. It would be comical to see aggy fan getting excited about their lone SEC victory over Vanderbilt.

[King Crimson]

in many ways, the Big XII had an interesting sub-text insofar as the former SWC conference schools trying to go from regional conference to national recog. there's a reason the Cotton Bowl was on at Hangover Time on NYD and isn't a BCS bowl. while the Big 8 was no media market power, it DID have OU and Nebraska....two of the top 5 or so programs of all-time. people will watch OU and NU.

with all respect to Indy, ATM never made that jump from regional (Texas) appeal to national market-winner. It could happen, but it hasn't yet. i thought it might when Mack "couldn't win the big game" and ATM hired Fran in the early 00's. but, Fran was mystery fuck-up and VY and a great D saved Mack's bacon and cemented UT as the "the Texas" team to love by winning the big prize in 05. I think you could argue Texas Tech and Leach made more national "news" than ATM in the Big XII from the SWC.

i was no fan of the Mike Sherman hire (who else wants the guy who won 8 games a year with Brett Favre in his prime playing Detriot twice?), but ATM should be pretty good this year. i loved Dereuter's D here in CO at the AFA.

[War Wagon]

..while the Big 8 was no media market power, it DID have OU and Nebraska....two of the top 5 or so programs of all-time. people will watch OU and NU.

Apparently, the Big 8 was enough of media market power to entice the Texas contingent.

Believe it or not, people watch MU and KU as well.

You're a boorish snob, go fuck yourself.

[M Club]

If A&M wants to go to the SEC, leave.

bwaa, can't wait three years from now when it's just you and iowa state left in your own shitty little conference: "if they want to join the wac, fuck 'em, we'll go it alone."

Believe it or not, people watch MU and KU as well.

i never heard of mizzou until i saw them getting ass humped by texas five times over and then once again.

[King Crimson]

..while the Big 8 was no media market power, it DID have OU and Nebraska....two of the top 5 or so programs of all-time. people will watch OU and NU.

Apparently, the Big 8 was enough of media market power to entice the Texas contingent.

Believe it or not, people watch MU and KU as well.

You're a boorish snob, go fuck yourself.

hey now. i've been a big supporter of the Border War as a rivalry throughout the duration on this board. maybe every once in a while troll you guys, but always a fellow traveler for the Big 8. anyway, my point was the historical big 8 of the 70's and 80's. outside a couple Warren Powers teams and Phil Bradley, my point is valid. national perception of the 8 was all through the lens of OU and NU.

[Harvdog]

If A&M wants to go to the SEC, leave.

bwaa, can't wait three years from now when it's just you and iowa state left in your own shitty little conference: "if they want to join the wac, fuck 'em, we'll go it alone."

I doubt it will happen but this is what is known as posturing. Both OU and A&M want a TV deal. OU is going to get theirs. You don't hear OU bitching about the Big XII. I have yet to hear any complaining from KU, MU, Baylor, TT, KSU, OSU, or ISU. The only school upset is A&M. The point was made by KC, who outside of Texas gives 2 shits about Texas A&M? A&M has always had an inferiority complex to Texas. They think they are better than us and have nothing to show for it. Kind of like a cousin or little brother that is jealous of the big brother that is better looking, bangs all the hot chicks, has a really nice car, 4.0 GPA, nicer house, better job and better prospects for the future. If A&M wants to leave, see ya. There are plenty of teams that could take their place.

[Go Coogs']

Texas will be independent by 2015.

[King Crimson]

let's not lose track of the fact that the thread was started by NU fan who thinks they badly were misused during their decade in the wilderness and that they were the only ones to not vote against prop 48 players. OU betrayed them, UT screwed them....and then Dr. Tom avenged the wrongs. heroic story for a team that hasn't been relevant for over a decade that lives in a cloister of Omaha/Lincoln media fellatio. we'll see how the Chicago/Big 10 media loves up the Huskers. and how huskerfan deals with it.

[War Wagon]

Should be interesting to see if Bubba Starling follows thru on his commitment to Nebraska or takes the bags of cash the Royals are ready to throw at him as the 5th draft pick. I say he takes the cash, but if he doesn't, he could rewrite some record books in Lincoln. The boy is a cornfed stud, basically a can't miss prospect no matter which road he takes. Huskerfan has to be salivating and crossing their fingers he picks football. That would certainly ease the sting of Gabbert stiffing them.

[Truman]

..while the Big 8 was no media market power, it DID have OU and Nebraska....two of the top 5 or so programs of all-time. people will watch OU and NU.

Apparently, the Big 8 was enough of media market power to entice the Texas contingent.

Believe it or not, people watch MU and KU as well.

Didn't used to. What KC said. Hell, I can remember when OU and Nebraska were the only games televised in this market - Mizzou, K-State, and the Beakers backyard.

I grew up on listening to Bill Wilkerson and Kevin Harlan call Tiger games on KCMO 'cuz network satellite trucks couldn't find Columbia's Providence Street exit off of I-70 with a presidential Secret Service escort.

As for enticing the Texas contingent: Shotgun marriage-of-convenience. And they moved the Conference office to Dallas. How'd that work out? Ask a 'horn or Aggie, and they're likely to tell you the Eight joined them - and not the other way around.

[Cornhusker]

let's not lose track of the fact that the thread was started by NU fan who thinks they badly were misused during their decade in the wilderness and that they were the only ones to not vote against prop 48 players. OU betrayed them, UT screwed them....and then Dr. Tom avenged the wrongs. heroic story for a team that hasn't been relevant for over a decade that lives in a cloister of Omaha/Lincoln media fellatio. we'll see how the Chicago/Big 10 media loves up the Huskers. and how huskerfan deals with it.

I was expecting this response at some point. If I had a troll I'd have played it from that angle just to keep it clean of an "NU fan posting". It seemed a relevant article that points to real possibilities from an A&M point of view, not an NU fan's. But what thread would be complete without the obligatory "NU is a cry baby so take your ball and go away comment?"
I see some in this thread believe the death of the Big 12 is immanent and they're not even NU fans..how dare they?

I need to ask you from a personal standpoint. When did I ever post NU was mistreated by the Big 12? Just because some feel that way, doesn't mean all do. I sincerely believe the vast majority of NU fans feel NU is much better served in the B1G from a financial and stability standpoint than the relationship offered in the Bevo conference. Thus the move is widely embraced. Most want the Big 12 to survive for the well being (tongue in cheek) of the remaining North teams if for nothing else. I believe in 3-5 years every school not named OU or UT will long to be in Nebraska's situation. "'sup Mizzou fan?" And rest assured, I do not subscribe to anything written in Omaha or Lincoln nor are my opinions based on any of their writers.

The neat thing about the B1G media its it's by-in-large the BTN. The brain child of the conference commissioner. If you take the time to tune in you'd notice a thing called parody. A dirty word in the Big 12.

[Cornhusker]

Should be interesting to see if Bubba Starling follows thru on his commitment to Nebraska or takes the bags of cash the Royals are ready to throw at him as the 5th draft pick. I say he takes the cash, but if he doesn't, he could rewrite some record books in Lincoln. The boy is a cornfed stud, basically a can't miss prospect no matter which road he takes. Huskerfan has to be salivating and crossing their fingers he picks football. That would certainly ease the sting of Gabbert stiffing them.

I'd say less than 5% of the people I've talked with believe he'll be anywhere near Lincoln come August 15.
The feds have a better chance to balance the budget than Starling being in NU's fall camp.

[King Crimson]

let's not lose track of the fact that the thread was started by NU fan who thinks they badly were misused during their decade in the wilderness and that they were the only ones to not vote against prop 48 players. OU betrayed them, UT screwed them....and then Dr. Tom avenged the wrongs. heroic story for a team that hasn't been relevant for over a decade that lives in a cloister of Omaha/Lincoln media fellatio. we'll see how the Chicago/Big 10 media loves up the Huskers. and how huskerfan deals with it.

I was expecting this response at some point. .

you should have....because as an OU fan living in Boulder, working at CU....i'm already making fun of the NU self-righteous, post it on this board a million times perspective.

[King Crimson]

But what thread would be complete without the obligatory "NU is a cry baby so take your ball and go away comment?"

that's an answer only you can give us. as i recall, you posted that OU was a back-stabbing brother for "choosing Texas" as a rival.

[Cornhusker]

But what thread would be complete without the obligatory "NU is a cry baby so take your ball and go away comment?"

that's an answer only you can give us. as i recall, you posted that OU was a back-stabbing brother for "choosing Texas" as a rival.

I don't recall mentioning it in this thread. It's relevant how?

[MiketheangrydrunkenCUfan]

heroic story for a team that hasn't been relevant for over a decade

Hyperbole much? Nebraska was undefeated and the #1 team in the country on Thursday, Nov. 22, 2001 - a mere 9 years and 237 days ago...

[King Crimson]

heroic story for a team that hasn't been relevant for over a decade

Hyperbole much? Nebraska was undefeated and the #1 team in the country on Thursday, Nov. 22, 2001 - a mere 9 years and 237 days ago...

i sold my tickets to that game. made good money and some great memories for what seemed like kind of an asshat CU fan from netbuffs.com. he kind of tried to reneg on the agreed upon price....by claiming the tix were for his sons and then he didn't have the proper bills (i mean, fucking c'mon?). but, i did watch it on TV. i lived at 20th and Baseline, then. right across broadway from the old law building.

closer game than the score would indicate.....after the first 42 points for CU, there was some doubt. not a lot...but, some. nothing was ever in the bag with Vince Okruch.

[indyfrisco]

I'd be ok with a move to the SEC. I was hoping for that the last go round. My main reason for wanting a move to the SEC is so that A&M would get some games closer to where I live that I could drive to. I don't give a shit about the Big XII "conference" anyhow as it's only been around 14 years. t.u. getting backed by ESPN...that will never fly long term in College Station.

harv, I'm pretty sure I've never acted like A&M is any better than t.u. I also know I've never acted like we were some kind of national draw. I know what we are, and I'm ok with it. I would like to be more significant from a national standpoint, but Fran has made sure that ain't gonna happen anytime soon. Sherman seems to be moving the dial though. I do think the slightest bit of momentum should and would strike fear into t.u fan. And I'd say we've got that momentum going right now across the board in all sports.

[Harvdog]

harv, I'm pretty sure I've never acted like A&M is any better than t.u. I also know I've never acted like we were some kind of national draw. I know what we are, and I'm ok with it. I do think the slightest bit of momentum should and would strike fear into t.u fan. And I'd say we've got that momentum going right now across the board in all sports.

You must be a 2%'er. :D

I think it is good for the conference and good for the rivalry if A&M is good. Christ, with the recruits available in all sports, A&M should be a Top 25 program in all sports.

Most A&M fans that I know are completely different from you. Most think that the Big XII will die if they leave.....it won't. Most think that A&M is a National draw because they had big TV ratings back in the 1998 season for the opener against FSU. They also think that A&M is going to play for the MNC this year in Football. You won't. They also think that Texas will win 4 games this year. We will win at least 9.

There are many Texas fans that think we will win it all this year...we won't. There are those that think we should go the Notre Dame route.....stupid move.

It all just depends on the type of fan you talk to.

[Terry in Crapchester]

We'd be more than happy to accept Texas A&M and Oklahoma into the SEC family.

I don't think that'll happen unless the Meatgrinder goes to 16. If you stopped after those two, that would mean divisional realignment in either of the following formats:

1. Auburn goes to the East without Bama; or
2. Auburn and Bama go to the East, and Vandy goes to the West.

I would have to think option 2 is the more likely, but Vandy certainly wouldn't like that, and as the only private school in the conference, they probably have more pull than their performance on the field would indicate.

The most likely scenario is to add one team in the East and one in the West, as the linked blog suggests. I have to think that there are other schools in the east that bring more to the table than Clemson, though.

[indyfrisco]

The most likely scenario is to add one team in the East and one in the West, as the linked blog suggests. I have to think that there are other schools in the east that bring more to the table than Clemson, though.

Add Miami/FSU to the east and A&M/OU to the west. Play everyone in your division, 2 games against a team from the other division that rotates, 3 OOC games and a CCG game.

[SunCoastSooner]

We'd be more than happy to accept Texas A&M and Oklahoma into the SEC family.

I don't think that'll happen unless the Meatgrinder goes to 16. If you stopped after those two, that would mean divisional realignment in either of the following formats:

1. Auburn goes to the East without Bama; or
2. Auburn and Bama go to the East, and Vandy goes to the West.

I would have to think option 2 is the more likely, but Vandy certainly wouldn't like that, and as the only private school in the conference, they probably have more pull than their performance on the field would indicate.

The most likely scenario is to add one team in the East and one in the West, as the linked blog suggests. I have to think that there are other schools in the east that bring more to the table than Clemson, though.

Terry, you're wrong.

In June of 2010 Michael Slive and the SEC invited Oklahoma and Texas A&M to the SEC. David Boren mentioned this in an interview at the end of June while the conference realignment fiasco was in full swing. Craig Pinkerton, a spokesman for the SEC, confirmed the invitation had been made to Oklahoma and Texas A&M but did not include Texas later in July. Michael Slive on a nightly sports radio program during the SEC Athletic Directors meetings (here in my home town of Destin annually) said they were not at the time interested in expanding to a full 16 but were very interested in an Oklahoma and Texas A&M move to the conference and were not exploring any other institutions beyond the two at that time.

[SunCoastSooner]

OU and T A&M are perfect fits for the conference. I would hope the SEC would never extend an invitation to Miami. Could go after FSU amd bring Georgia Tech back into the fold. The Ramblin' Wreck would fit right in now that they're on probation. :D

Why not Miami? They are a small and prestigious private school. Easily the top major academic institution in the State of Florida. Strong football tradition (stronger than FSwhos at the least), great baseball program, dedicated to improving basketball which Florida State isn't dedicated toward. In my eyes Miami brings more to the table than the Crimanoles do.

[Screw_Michigan]

dedicated to improving basketball which Florida State isn't dedicated toward.

:?

So what, Miami hired Larranaga. FSU made the tournament last season.

[SunCoastSooner]

dedicated to improving basketball which Florida State isn't dedicated toward.

:?

So what, Miami hired Larranaga. FSU made the tournament last season.

Have you seen Floriduh State's facilities for Basketball? There are prep schools and high schools who have invested as much or more into basketball facilities as the Criminoles.

[Terry in Crapchester]

We'd be more than happy to accept Texas A&M and Oklahoma into the SEC family.

I don't think that'll happen unless the Meatgrinder goes to 16. If you stopped after those two, that would mean divisional realignment in either of the following formats:

1. Auburn goes to the East without Bama; or
2. Auburn and Bama go to the East, and Vandy goes to the West.

I would have to think option 2 is the more likely, but Vandy certainly wouldn't like that, and as the only private school in the conference, they probably have more pull than their performance on the field would indicate.

The most likely scenario is to add one team in the East and one in the West, as the linked blog suggests. I have to think that there are other schools in the east that bring more to the table than Clemson, though.

Terry, you're wrong.

In June of 2010 Michael Slive and the SEC invited Oklahoma and Texas A&M to the SEC. David Boren mentioned this in an interview at the end of June while the conference realignment fiasco was in full swing. Craig Pinkerton, a spokesman for the SEC, confirmed the invitation had been made to Oklahoma and Texas A&M but did not include Texas later in July. Michael Slive on a nightly sports radio program during the SEC Athletic Directors meetings (here in my home town of Destin annually) said they were not at the time interested in expanding to a full 16 but were very interested in an Oklahoma and Texas A&M move to the conference and were not exploring any other institutions beyond the two at that time.

A few points:

1. I think the circumstances were slightly different back then. The Pac also had offers out to both Oklahoma and aTm (in addition to Texas, Taco Tech and Okie State) and the SEC probably figured it had to act quickly or lose the opportunity.

2. Conference commissioners aren't always exactly transparent with the general public (to put it mildly). Adding Oklahoma and aTm would not have prohibited the SEC from adding other schools, which it certainly could have done on a more leisurely basis, given Point 1 above.

3. If the SEC added Oklahoma and aTm and then stopped, both of those schools would be playing in the West (sin, you know who). The SEC would have had to shift one school (net) to the East to offset that. Bama would not be happy about Auburn going to the East by itself. Similarly, Vandy would not be happy about going to the West so that Auburn and Bama both could go to the East.

Eastern expansion in the SEC could be problematic, though. I've heard that Florida, Georgia, Kentucky and South Carolina all want to be the only school from their respective states in the SEC, and for that reason, all have agreed to vote against membership for any school from any of those states that is offered membership. Of course, when push comes to shove that agreement might not stick, and that could explain SEC interest in Clemson (figuring South Carolina as being in the weakest position among those schools). I'd also heard that the SEC would consider North Carolina (would seem a bit odd in the SEC to me, anyway; I think the majority of people who are college sports fans would name North Carolina if asked to name a single school in the ACC), as well as possibly Virginia Tech and West Virginia (the latter is unlikely, I think, given their relative geographic isolation from the rest of the conference and the SEC's aversion to air travel).

[King Crimson]

the sticking point with OU to the SEC was OU remains (currently) committed to staying in the same conference as OSU. that's partially a party line....but some truth to it as well. OU to the Pac was wildly unpopular both with fans and the administration. SEC had some traction. people cite the RRS, but that's only got 16 of over 100 years with UT and OU in the same conference. that could be worked out, as it was in the Big 8/SWC days.

now, i think OSU may not bring the holy media markets as some other expansion, but i think there are enough holes in the straight up, all about media markets argument (as there were with posturing about academics....SLC is a big media boom without BYU? OU is on in Denver more than CU and CSU combined....)....but think is a better fit than many SEC peeps would acknowledge. they are traditionally good (not as good as THEY think) in hoops, lots of money and as long Gundy is winning 8-10 games a year....they have a nice men's revenue package. also, really good at the spring sports that are popular in the SEC....baseball, golf, pig-molestation, etc. kidding.

btw, who thinks Vandy is going to have any pull about where they may or may not go? there's been talk way before even when i was at Vandy of a kind of southern, private school conference....Vandy, Tulane, Davidson (hoops), Ga Tech (realistic, dunno, but part of the discussion as i heard it)...and a lot of the old SWC privates like SMU and Rice could make a nice fit. Baylor could easily be a casualty of UT going indy or whatever might happen (recall they were NOT invited to the big Pac). Tulsa, maybe, these days. ACC potential leftovers like Wake. wouldn't be a powerhouse, but would make a lot of people on campus (who actually do have some pull) a lot happier particularly if the "level playing field" idea becomes kaput in these brave new Libertarian times.

i think it will be interesting to see if the ACC can hold itself together as a hoops conference with all the football money pressure dictating the "force" of change.

[txangler74]

there's been talk way before even when i was at Vandy of a kind of southern, private school conference....Vandy, Tulane, Davidson (hoops), Ga Tech (realistic, dunno, but part of the discussion as i heard it)...and a lot of the old SWC privates like SMU and Rice could make a nice fit. Baylor could easily be a casualty of UT going indy or whatever might happen (recall they were NOT invited to the big Pac). Tulsa, maybe, these days.

I would love to see something like that for SMU, really anything that brings together more regional interest. No one in CUSA West gives a crap about the East teams and vice versa. Not sure how Vandy or GTech would draw playing in Dallas or Houston. But having Baylor and TCU back in with the current CUSA west teams that would be a greatness. Very little TV money in the conference like that. As much as I hate to say it we are all a bunch of stepchildren when it comes to being in a major conference, we need them more then they need us. Vandy and Baylor will do everything possible to stay where they are at.

[King Crimson]

there's been talk way before even when i was at Vandy of a kind of southern, private school conference....Vandy, Tulane, Davidson (hoops), Ga Tech (realistic, dunno, but part of the discussion as i heard it)...and a lot of the old SWC privates like SMU and Rice could make a nice fit. Baylor could easily be a casualty of UT going indy or whatever might happen (recall they were NOT invited to the big Pac). Tulsa, maybe, these days.

I would love to see something like that for SMU, really anything that brings together more regional interest. No one in CUSA West gives a crap about the East teams and vice versa. Not sure how Vandy or GTech would draw playing in Dallas or Houston. But having Baylor and TCU back in with the current CUSA west teams that would be a greatness. Very little TV money in the conference like that. As much as I hate to say it we are all a bunch of stepchildren when it comes to being in a major conference, we need them more then they need us. Vandy and Baylor will do everything possible to stay where they are at.

TCU ain't gonna happen. they are bigtime for now. well, the tradeoff would be a wanking, prestige idea in lieu of revenue that lets private schools fall on their swords, make the faculty happy by de-emphasizing big-time sports which gives you that "integrity" veneer that is popular today. admins can pat themselves on the back for "doing the right thing" while the rest of D-1 continues down it's win-at-all costs road. make a lot of speeches about the scholar-athlete. However, the endless parade of douchebags named Hillis Blah Blah Blah Minsterfield IV at the conference golf tournament would be epic.

i knew several people from DFW at Vandy. so, maybe?

[txangler74]

That's the balancing act SMU is going through at the moment. Academia is still throwing fits over June Jones' and other coach's salaries but donations to the school and new student applications are at a all time high since the Hawaii bowl victory two years ago. The recent Forbes university rankings have thrown some water on the fire. With SMU ranked #2 in the state, academia has been shown that you can balance top notch education and have a competitive football team. Then again it didn't put out all the flames being that TCU is who we compare ourselves to. They ranked last out of all private schools in state and out of the top 10 of all Universities in Texas.

[MuchoBulls]

Add Miami/FSU to the east

I think you'd see a pairing of FSU/GT before Miami.

[Bizzarofelice]

I grew up on listening to Bill Wilkerson and Kevin Harlan call Tiger games on KCMO 'cuz network satellite trucks couldn't find Columbia's Providence Street exit off of I-70 with a presidential Secret Service escort.

HAHAHAAH wait... fuck.


my freshman year the national spotlight shined on Mizzou and a game against the Buffs was televised. it was a cold and wet october night and the omniturf was terrible. 6-0 loss in the rain. my dorm was close enough to hear the crowd's groans.

[Bizzarofelice]

most conferences have a Vandy. easier to get around sunshine laws when there is a private entity included.


see Baylor and Northwestern

[War Wagon]

I'd say less than 5% of the people I've talked with believe he'll be anywhere near Lincoln come August 15.
The feds have a better chance to balance the budget than Starling being in NU's fall camp.

You wuz right! :D

Sorry, Cornfan.... not really.

I can't tell you how pissed off I would be if this had turned out otherwise.

[Cornhusker]

I'd say less than 5% of the people I've talked with believe he'll be anywhere near Lincoln come August 15.
The feds have a better chance to balance the budget than Starling being in NU's fall camp.

You wuz right! :D

Sorry, Cornfan.... not really.

I can't tell you how pissed off I would be if this had turned out otherwise.

Can't blame the kid, he put himself in position for the payday so he should collect. Congrats to him.
Thing is he'll be playing in Bugaha probably for a couple years. He's going to play CF from what I understand. Not projected to pitch in the MLB.
So he'll bounce around on a bus for 2-3 years learning to hit big league pitching where he could have had Erin Andrews shoving a microphone in his grill on game day, playing the big man on campus role; which of course requires the coed groupies occupying his free time.

Oh.. the price we pay for money.