T1B

Oklahoma, Arkansas, and then everybody else.

That Greg Childs guy at Arkansas is fucking fantastic

I'm surprised that DeJuan Miller wasn't mentioned for Oklahoma though. He was lighting it up before he got hurt last year.

ND is way too high. While Floyd could possibly be the most skilled WR in the country, the rest of the unit really hasn't done jack shit. Riddick has the potential to be a good player, but he's two years removed from RB. TJ Jones will be solid, but not spectacular. After that is a few freshman and some busts.

TE is in great shape. Eifert is a stud and Mike Ragone is a great #2 TE. Behind him are two promising players and a Golic.

Killian wrote:. . . While Floyd could possibly be the most skilled WR in the country . . .

Do what???

So you're saying that Floyd doesn't belong in the argument as one of the top WR's in the country?

Killian wrote:So you're saying that Floyd doesn't belong in the argument as one of the top WR's in the country?

I think it's Broyles, Blackmon, Jefferies, and everyone else . . . so yes.

Yeah, and most people would laugh at you for not considering him one of the top WR's in the country.

Killian wrote:Yeah, and most people would laugh at you for not considering him one of the top WR's in the country.

Define one of the top? By my definition the three people I showed are head and shoulders above the rest . . . But hey I guess that's why Floyd has a Blientkoff award under his arms and is about to break the NCAA receptions record this season . . . Oh, wait, he's doesn't and isn't about too.

SunCoastSooner wrote:

Killian wrote:Yeah, and most people would laugh at you for not considering him one of the top WR's in the country.

Define one of the top? By my definition the three people I showed are head and shoulders above the rest . . . But hey I guess that's why Floyd has a Blientkoff award under his arms and is about to break the NCAA receptions record this season . . . Oh, wait, he's doesn't and isn't about too.

"Isn't about too" is premature, especially considering no one expected Blackmon to win the Blientkoff last year. Define it however you want. NFL prospects or college production, Michael Floyd is one of the top recievers. His biggest problem has been staying healthy.

Jeffery:

46 rec, 763 yards, 16.6 avg and 6 TDs. Played in 12 of 13 games
88 rec, 1517 yards, 17.2 avg and 9 TDs. Played in 14 of 14 games

Blackmon:

20 rec, 260 yards, 13.0 avg and 2 TDs. Played in 12 of 13 games
111 rec, 1782 yards, 16.1 avg and 20 TDs. Played in 12 of 13 games

Broyles:

46 rec, 687 yards, 14.9 avg and 6 TDs. Played in 13 of 14 games
89 rec, 1120 yards, 12.6 avg and 15 TDs. Played in 12 of 13 games
131 rec, 1622 yards, 12.4 avg and 14 TDs. Played in 14 of 14 games

Floyd:

48 rec, 719 yards, 15.0 avg and 7 TDs. Played in 10 of 13 games
44 rec, 795 yards, 18.1 avg and 9 TDs. Played in 7 of 12 games
79 rec, 1025 yards, 13.0 avg and 12 TDs. Played in 12 of 13 games

If Floyd had not gotten hurt in his FR or Soph years, his numbers would have projected to the following:

62 rec, 935 yards and 9 TDs
75 rec, 1364 yards and 15 TDs

So, back to my original point when I said "Floyd could possibly be the most skilled WR in the country" as evident by him being considered a first round draft pick in the 2012 draft and to the second point of him being one of the top WR's in the country, his stats back that up as well.

And honestly, who really cares about the number of receptions? Was Freddie Barnes the best WR in 2009? He had 155 catches.

Killian wrote:

SunCoastSooner wrote:

Killian wrote:Yeah, and most people would laugh at you for not considering him one of the top WR's in the country.

Define one of the top? By my definition the three people I showed are head and shoulders above the rest . . . But hey I guess that's why Floyd has a Blientkoff award under his arms and is about to break the NCAA receptions record this season . . . Oh, wait, he's doesn't and isn't about too.

"Isn't about too" is premature, especially considering no one expected Blackmon to win the Blientkoff last year. Define it however you want. NFL prospects or college production, Michael Floyd is one of the top recievers. His biggest problem has been staying healthy.

Jeffery:

46 rec, 763 yards, 16.6 avg and 6 TDs. Played in 12 of 13 games
88 rec, 1517 yards, 17.2 avg and 9 TDs. Played in 14 of 14 games

Blackmon:

20 rec, 260 yards, 13.0 avg and 2 TDs. Played in 12 of 13 games
111 rec, 1782 yards, 16.1 avg and 20 TDs. Played in 12 of 13 games

Broyles:

46 rec, 687 yards, 14.9 avg and 6 TDs. Played in 13 of 14 games
89 rec, 1120 yards, 12.6 avg and 15 TDs. Played in 12 of 13 games
131 rec, 1622 yards, 12.4 avg and 14 TDs. Played in 14 of 14 games

Floyd:

48 rec, 719 yards, 15.0 avg and 7 TDs. Played in 10 of 13 games
44 rec, 795 yards, 18.1 avg and 9 TDs. Played in 7 of 12 games
79 rec, 1025 yards, 13.0 avg and 12 TDs. Played in 12 of 13 games

If Floyd had not gotten hurt in his FR or Soph years, his numbers would have projected to the following:

62 rec, 935 yards and 9 TDs
75 rec, 1364 yards and 15 TDs

So, back to my original point when I said "Floyd could possibly be the most skilled WR in the country" as evident by him being considered a first round draft pick in the 2012 draft and to the second point of him being one of the top WR's in the country, his stats back that up as well.

And honestly, who really cares about the number of receptions? Was Freddie Barnes the best WR in 2009? He had 155 catches.

First of all . . . in what frame of mind does a person think that a guy who had fewer TDs, far fewer receptions, and far fewer yards is at the same skill level as the other two? Seriously?

I love the little projection thingy you did . . . Remind me how many of those ten games did Floyd start? Pssssstttt, the answer is 8. How many other receivers from that team have or will make it to the NFL that Notre Dame had splitting up looks and receptions? Two, Tate and a Tight end . . . it must have been rough, real fuckin' rough.

Broyles put up his freshman numbers (not needing projections) coming off the bench on a team where he was competing for looks against four other future NFL wide receivers and two more tight ends. Three of those guys were all drafted earlier in the draft than either Tate or Carlson were which were Floyd's only real competition for looks or progression.

This is what the nation thinks of Floyd being on the same field as Blackmon, Broyles, and Jefferies.
http://espn.go.com/sportsnation/rank?ve ... #topOfList

Notice what player has the fewest first place votes on that list, also notice how far back he is of the three previously mentioned receivers?

Floyd is the real deal. You don't need to crunch numbers, just watch him play. And if your espn link lists him as one of the 5 best receivers in the country, I'd say that qualifies as one of the nation's "top" WRs.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:Floyd is the real deal. You don't need to crunch numbers, just watch him play. And if your espn link lists him as one of the 5 best receivers in the country, I'd say that qualifies as one of the nation's "top" WRs.

That's not what his original statement was though. I think you'd be hard pressed to find one out of ten non-Notre Dame fans who would say they would rather have Floyd than Blackmon, Broyles, or Jefferies. In my book that wouldn't make him "arguably the most skilled receiver in the country." I don't think there is much of an argument about Blackmon, Broyles, and Jefferies being in a league of their own at this point.

Really? You don't think their are 10 fans that would say they would have Floyd than any of those three? I think there are plenty of people who would take a 6'3" 220lb WR over a 5'11", 180lb WR, no matter what the latter's production is.

Blackmon has had one year, Floyd has had three. And tell me, who do you think will get selected first, Floyd or Broyles? This is getting close to SEC-level myopia.

As far as the NFL is concerned, I think they will get picked in this order as I believe all 5 will go to the NFL next year:

Blackmon
Fuller
Jeffrey
Floyd
Broyles

As for BTPCFB rankings, I have a hard time ranking players that play in completely different systems. Okie Lite passes like 70% of the time. Of course Blackmon will get more receptions/yards in an offense like that. OU seems to be much more balanced and damn near 50/50 on the pass/run scale. A&M is more like 40/60. Jeffrey plays for Steve Spurrier. Enough said. I'm not that familiar with Floyd or ND's offense, but based on his size/stats, I put him ahead of Broyles for the NFL draft. Of course, the NFL draft has nothing to do with this year's BTPCFB season.

IndyFrisco wrote:As far as the NFL is concerned, I think they will get picked in this order as I believe all 5 will go to the NFL next year:

Blackmon
Fuller
Jeffrey
Floyd
Broyles

As for BTPCFB rankings, I have a hard time ranking players that play in completely different systems. Okie Lite passes like 70% of the time. Of course Blackmon will get more receptions/yards in an offense like that. OU seems to be much more balanced and damn near 50/50 on the pass/run scale. A&M is more like 40/60. Jeffrey plays for Steve Spurrier. Enough said. I'm not that familiar with Floyd or ND's offense, but based on his size/stats, I put him ahead of Broyles for the NFL draft. Of course, the NFL draft has nothing to do with this year's BTPCFB season.

That's not true about Oklahoma State; I don't know what it was after or after the Bowl game but I know going into the Oklahoma game Oklahoma State was at 52/48% pass to rushing plays. According to ESPN they were the most balanced team in the Big 12 last season going into Oklahoma; Oklahoma was at a 54/46 pass to rush according to ESPN.

I would take Fuller over Floyd on the college level as well.

Killian wrote:Really? You don't think their are 10 fans that would say they would have Floyd than any of those three? I think there are plenty of people who would take a 6'3" 220lb WR over a 5'11", 180lb WR, no matter what the latter's production is.

Blackmon has had one year, Floyd has had three. And tell me, who do you think will get selected first, Floyd or Broyles? This is getting close to SEC-level myopia.

We're not discussing the NFL, we're discussing college. And yes I think you would be hard pressed to find one out of ten non-Notre Dame fans who would not want who might be the best slot receiver in the history of college football (and certainly without any argument the best since Wes Welker at Texas Tech) on their team than a kid who probably isn't even the best wide out this or last season in college ball. I'd certainly want a kid who consistently has racked up over 1,100 yards a season as a starter on teams who sport two or three other NFL bound kids at his position, averages 9+ receptions a game, and remains healthy over a kid who has barely broken the 1,000 yard mark once while having virtually no competition on his own team for looks, and can't stay healthy.

Jeffrey plays for Steve Spurrier. Enough said.

Do you watch South Carolina play? They run the ball a lot because they have arguably the best running back in the country.

SunCoastSooner wrote: We're not discussing the NFL, we're discussing college. And yes I think you would be hard pressed to find one out of ten non-Notre Dame fans who would not want who might be the best slot receiver in the history of college football (and certainly without any argument the best since Wes Welker at Texas Tech) on their team than a kid who probably isn't even the best wide out this or last season in college ball. I'd certainly want a kid who consistently has racked up over 1,100 yards a season as a starter on teams who sport two or three other NFL bound kids at his position, averages 9+ receptions a game, and remains healthy over a kid who has barely broken the 1,000 yard mark once while having virtually no competition on his own team for looks, and can't stay healthy.

No, we're discussing talent. The NFL is the best guage to deterimine the most talented receiver. You brought up college production and I said that based on talent or production, Floyd is in the argument as one of the top receivers playing in college.

You're comparing a slot guy against an outside receiver who is bigger and stronger, and who puts up numbers in his offense and you really don't think people might consider him over the slot guy? Jesus Christ man, have a little bit of objectivity. You know the guy you're comparing him to (Welker) wasn't drafted out of college, right? Welker produces, but doesn't have a ton of talent. He had more catches in 2007, so he was a better receiver than Moss? And in 2009, Freddie Barnes should have been the best receiver in the country because he had 155 catches?

And you know the whole argument of having other NFL bound targets on your team works against, Broyles, right? Seeing as how there is all of that NFL talent to go around, or because he's played in the slot, how many times has Broyles had to face double coverage? Floyd has been doubled since the second game of his college career, and he's still putting up those numbers. Broyles is also working in an offense that has the threat of a running game and a future top 10 pick at QB. Floyd has neither of those.

I've acknowledged that Floyd's biggest problem is staying healthy. Had he done that, you would have even less of a leg to stand on. Jeffery is a stud, Blackmon has skill, but will be hurt by the departure of Holgerson and Broyles will continue to put up his numbers. My guess is Floyd will as well.

Jesus Christ man, have a little bit of objectivity.

He can't.

This...

...is just SICK!

Can't find the actual video of that 3rd down catch anywhere.

Killian wrote:

SunCoastSooner wrote: We're not discussing the NFL, we're discussing college. And yes I think you would be hard pressed to find one out of ten non-Notre Dame fans who would not want who might be the best slot receiver in the history of college football (and certainly without any argument the best since Wes Welker at Texas Tech) on their team than a kid who probably isn't even the best wide out this or last season in college ball. I'd certainly want a kid who consistently has racked up over 1,100 yards a season as a starter on teams who sport two or three other NFL bound kids at his position, averages 9+ receptions a game, and remains healthy over a kid who has barely broken the 1,000 yard mark once while having virtually no competition on his own team for looks, and can't stay healthy.

No, we're discussing talent. The NFL is the best guage to deterimine the most talented receiver. You brought up college production and I said that based on talent or production, Floyd is in the argument as one of the top receivers playing in college.

You're comparing a slot guy against an outside receiver who is bigger and stronger, and who puts up numbers in his offense and you really don't think people might consider him over the slot guy? Jesus Christ man, have a little bit of objectivity. You know the guy you're comparing him to (Welker) wasn't drafted out of college, right? Welker produces, but doesn't have a ton of talent. He had more catches in 2007, so he was a better receiver than Moss? And in 2009, Freddie Barnes should have been the best receiver in the country because he had 155 catches?

And you know the whole argument of having other NFL bound targets on your team works against, Broyles, right? Seeing as how there is all of that NFL talent to go around, or because he's played in the slot, how many times has Broyles had to face double coverage? Floyd has been doubled since the second game of his college career, and he's still putting up those numbers. Broyles is also working in an offense that has the threat of a running game and a future top 10 pick at QB. Floyd has neither of those.

I've acknowledged that Floyd's biggest problem is staying healthy. Had he done that, you would have even less of a leg to stand on. Jeffery is a stud, Blackmon has skill, but will be hurt by the departure of Holgerson and Broyles will continue to put up his numbers. My guess is Floyd will as well.

Weird here I was thinking we were on a college football board . . .

Broyles is much better in space than Floyd; Broyles is probably the best receiver in space in all of college ball and why he puts up numbers.

Oh and as far as double coverage: Broyles faced it most of the season; certainly against Florida State (Greg Reid and their nickleback were on him most of the game), Air Force, Cincinnati, Texas, Oklahoma State, and Nebraska all double covered Broyles.

Having between four and six other targets a game to choose from is a plus in looks? I played QB in high school and I don't recall that ever being good for a guy who wants to be the go to target, EVER.

And the Jefferies plays for Spurrier argument is complete Bullshit. Spurrier probably had the most balanced game plan of his career week in and week out last season. Junior does more running of the offense than Daddy Spurrier in any case and he is much more dedicated to the run than his father. Tell me you knew?

TheJON wrote:

Jesus Christ man, have a little bit of objectivity.

He can't.

Please, lets not act like I am just talking about Broyles. There are at least four guys in college football I would want on in my receiver corp LONG before Floyd; Blackmon, Broyles, Jefferies, and Fuller. Three of them I consider on a different field than the rest, most of the country and most analysts agree on that. Two of the four I would take off the top of my head play for teams I despise. It's not a biased call by any means. As my link showed earlier, most people would likely agree with me.

I can buy the "there are other receivers better than Floyd". But to say ANYONE in the country is "on another level" is just plain ridiculous. That's implying Floyd is chopped liver compared to them.

TheJON wrote:I can buy the "there are other receivers better than Floyd". But to say ANYONE in the country is "on another level" is just plain ridiculous. That's implying Floyd is chopped liver compared to them.

Never said he is chopped liver, but I don't agree that he is at the same skill level as the three I mentioned.

I think he is more comparable to Fuller but I would still take Fuller before Floyd.

LONG before Floyd? How many games have you watched him play? And yes, the better the targets on the other side, the less opportunity a coach has to scheme against one specific player.

I never said that Broyles wasn't better in space than Floyd. He should be, that's his job. He's 5'11" and 180lbs, he's not going to out muscle DB's for the ball. So fine, Broyles is better in space. Floyd is better with the ball in the air, on jump balls and blocking.

Funny, we are on a college football board. And I said that Floyd may be the most talented WR in the country. Didn't say he was the best, didn't say he produced the most, said he may have the most talent. Not the fastest, not the best in space, the most overall talent.

I'll make you a bet. If you send out an email to 5 non-OU buddies, I bet most of them will have Broyles and Blackmon in the top two, with Floyd or Fuller as their third. Maybe some will have Jeffery, but I bet you'll have to remind some of them. And if I do it to 5 non-ND buddies, I bet they'll have Floyd at least in the top 2, probably along with Jeffery, and then either Broyles and Blackmon. Fuller won't even enter into the conversation. It's all based on region and where you are.

And I'll dismiss an opinion poll as soon as I see ESPN attached to it. I don't trust any opinion piece after what happened with Leach.

SunCoastSooner wrote:We're not discussing the NFL, we're discussing college.

If the original contention was "most skilled" WR, why wouldn't a discussion of NFL potential be applicable?

Killian wrote:LONG before Floyd? How many games have you watched him play? And yes, the better the targets on the other side, the less opportunity a coach has to scheme against one specific player.

I never said that Broyles wasn't better in space than Floyd. He should be, that's his job. He's 5'11" and 180lbs, he's not going to out muscle DB's for the ball. So fine, Broyles is better in space. Floyd is better with the ball in the air, on jump balls and blocking.

Funny, we are on a college football board. And I said that Floyd may be the most talented WR in the country. Didn't say he was the best, didn't say he produced the most, said he may have the most talent. Not the fastest, not the best in space, the most overall talent.

I'll make you a bet. If you send out an email to 5 non-OU buddies, I bet most of them will have Broyles and Blackmon in the top two, with Floyd or Fuller as their third. Maybe some will have Jeffery, but I bet you'll have to remind some of them. And if I do it to 5 non-ND buddies, I bet they'll have Floyd at least in the top 2, probably along with Jeffery, and then either Broyles and Blackmon. Fuller won't even enter into the conversation. It's all based on region and where you are.

And I'll dismiss an opinion poll as soon as I see ESPN attached to it. I don't trust any opinion piece after what happened with Leach.

I saw all or most of all but two of Notre Dame's games last season; didn't see any of the Army game and only bits and pieces of the Bowl game against Miami. Other than that I got a pretty healthy dose of Notre Dame at the Sports bar because the Notre Dame group is placed in a section that is basically direct viewing from the table that we have reserved at our sports bar. Kind of a small group but they spend and tip well and the bar manager is a Notre Dame fan so they probably have the smallest group that gets preferential treatment in the place.

How many times have you watched Broyles? Broyles has made some amazing leaping catches and is probably the best blocker I have ever seen in the slot.

TheJON wrote:I can buy the "there are other receivers better than Floyd". But to say ANYONE in the country is "on another level" is just plain ridiculous. That's implying Floyd is chopped liver compared to them.

Whoa, a rackable take from...JON. That sums it up nicely.

Killian wrote: The NFL is the best guage to deterimine the most talented receiver.

No.



And Michael Egnew is the best TE in the nation, and was last year, as well, but they gave the Mackey to some kid wholived in a fridge box so the story made people get warm fuzzies.

Bizzarofelice wrote:

Killian wrote: The NFL is the best guage to deterimine the most talented receiver.

No.

Yes.

Killian wrote:

Bizzarofelice wrote:

Killian wrote: The NFL is the best guage to deterimine the most talented receiver.

No.

Yes.

Maybe.