T1B

I gotta think Joeckel goes first. No knock against Fisher but Joeckel dominated at a very high level of competition. That's something you really don't want to overthink.

Sudden Sam wrote:Central Michigan connections abound with Chiefs personnel, though, so there might be a surprise with that 1st pick.

That's what I mean by overthinking it.

Either, or. When's the second round?

KC Scott wrote:Joekel - unless they find someone willing to trade with

why the fuck would KC trade away the opportunity to get someone like Joekel.....after Winston was released and with the talk of Albert possibly being traded, they need some offensive line help badly otherwise Smith is going to get killed.....

Felix wrote:

KC Scott wrote:Joekel - unless they find someone willing to trade with

why the fuck would KC trade away the opportunity to get someone like Joekel.....after Winston was released and with the talk of Albert possibly being traded, they need some offensive line help badly otherwise Smith is going to get killed.....

Why pass on Joekel? According to the Chiefs brain-trust (an oxymoron, I know), this draft is thick with linemen, and they supposedly kinda like that Donald Stephenson kid they drafted out of OU last year to fill the grid. Kid was kind of a project, but graded out well when he got to play. Probably all bullshit, but we'll see.

Besides, Cassel getting killed last year wasn't the issue. Inept play at Cassel's position was...

With no top-flight quarterback in this year's draft, fan consensus is pretty-much to trade down from the pick and pick up another 2 if they can. I say "another 2", because a 2 is supposedly the asking price for Brandon Albert to Miami. Still, it doesn't make sense to purposefully dig a hole, just so you'll have to turn around and fill it through the draft.

I don't know the situation with Albert, but if they can get a 2nd round pick for him, they should.

As for trading the #1, I don't think there would be many takers, so go with Joekel. As close to a "sure thing" as there is.

Everything I am seeing and hearing over the last 2 days says Fisher.

KC Scott wrote:Because they could move down and still get either Eric Fischer out of Cent Michigan or Lane Johnson from OU

Not very far down. Joeckel, Fisher and Johnson will all be gone by the 11th pick at the latest.

5th pick in the draft and Detroit takes a project player from Mother Africa. That is why you are, and will forever be, the Detroit Lions.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:5th pick in the draft and Detroit takes a project player from Mother Africa. That is why you are, and will forever be, the Detroit Lions.

Racist.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:5th pick in the draft and Detroit takes a project player from Mother Africa. That is why you are, and will forever be, the Detroit Lions.

Something of a project, sure, but oif you watched many BYU games (we get that channel here on cable), he's got potential up the yingyang. Not a horrible pick, but carries some risk.

Got home and watched about 30 minutes or so while eating dinner. My thoughts:

1) I've seen him for years, but who is is Mel Kipper? He crawls out of the woodwork once a year making all kinds of dumb shit comments then disappears for 11 1/2 months. I would think if he knew his shit he would be working for some NFL team or would be more of a regular during the season.

2) Gruden was nails, basically holding his tongue, turning his head, and smirking, when you knew he wanted to tell MK that he was a flipping tool.

3) The whole "Boston Strong" shit was overboard. Yea I get it, but one of the assholes is dead and the other is lucky to be alive in a hospital, facing capital murder charges. Head Doad in charge wants to make a big deal, he could have did something at the beginning instead of making everyone look like asses when the Patriots traded their pick, bwaaaaa.
Belichick

4) The draft in general is overblown - bla bla bla..... pick a guy, is that rookie really going to change your team and take your team you root for to the superbowl?

5) Buddy Nix is an Idiot.

Dinsdale wrote:

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:5th pick in the draft and Detroit takes a project player from Mother Africa. That is why you are, and will forever be, the Detroit Lions.

Something of a project, sure, but oif you watched many BYU games (we get that channel here on cable), he's got potential up the yingyang. Not a horrible pick, but carries some risk.

He may be the greatest pass rusher in NFL history. But that highlight reel ESPN showed was a joke. He was unblocked every single time. If I was a GM, I would want to take a look at the space eater that allowed Obingo Whatshisname to keep his jersey so clean.

Dinsdale wrote:

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:5th pick in the draft and Detroit takes a project player from Mother Africa. That is why you are, and will forever be, the Detroit Lions.

Something of a project, sure, but oif you watched many BYU games (we get that channel here on cable), he's got potential up the yingyang. Not a horrible pick, but carries some risk.

You don't go project with the 5th pick, period. 5th round, yes. And it goes against the very philosophy Mayhew and Schwartz have been hammering home since they've been in Detroit, which is to take the best player available. Milliner was the obvious choice there, an impact guy you can plug in right away.

I'll try to keep an open mind about it though. The Lions coached him in the Senior Bowl and obviously thought he could fit their scheme. We'll see, but three total years of football, and one "good" season in which he registered just 4.5 sacks in a non-AQ conference doesn't get me real excited.

KC Scott wrote:Manguy Gayo now a Charger - perfect

MVS your thoughts?

...the next Junior Seau

KC Scott wrote:Manguy Gayo now a Charger - perfect

MVS your thoughts?

I'm not dancing in the streets or anything but ILB is a need position and 2nd round was the right place to take him. I don't have a problem with that pick. I think he will be a good fit for this defense.

I was mostly disappointed that they weren't more aggressive in the 1st round in order to target one of the top five O lineman. It seemed kinda like they got caught flatfooted by Jacksonville drafting an offensive tackle. Three offensive tackles in the first four picks?!? Has that ever happened before?

Keenan Allen was an absolute steal in the 3rd round, though. He might be one of the best value picks in the draft so far. Overall, not too bad.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:

Dinsdale wrote:

MgoBlue-LightSpecial wrote:5th pick in the draft and Detroit takes a project player from Mother Africa. That is why you are, and will forever be, the Detroit Lions.

Something of a project, sure, but oif you watched many BYU games (we get that channel here on cable), he's got potential up the yingyang. Not a horrible pick, but carries some risk.

You don't go project with the 5th pick, period. 5th round, yes.

Absolutely. The pick was a joke. That kid is nowhere near ready to go at the professional level. I'm sure he will be a great player one day...for some other team.

I was happy to see Le'Veon Bell go to a team like Pittsburgh. He should be a great fit there and will have a chance to play right away.

ChargerMike wrote:

KC Scott wrote:Manguy Gayo now a Charger - perfect

MVS your thoughts?

...the next Junior Seau

Linebacker, Samoan, homosexual, candidate for suicide.

Yeah. He definitely has the intangibles.

KC Scott wrote:ORLY?

I was just lashing out at all the hype making it sound like Monty Gayo was some kind of can't miss, perennial all pro prospect (unless they just misspelled perineal). I think he could be a serviceable player in the right situation and that is as an inside backer in a 3-4. Like I said, I'm not wild about the pick and I certainly never would have traded up to get him but I think he'll contribute.

It's been a pretty piss poor offseason for the Bolts. I'm guessing a lot of people who were shitting all over AJ Smith are going to be eating those words before too long. I'm not in the least bit impressed with what I've seen out of Telesco so far.

mvscal wrote:I think he could be a serviceable player in the right situation and that is as an inside backer in a 3-4.

as long as he can cover running backs and tight ends that run in the 5's, he'll be fine....

I'm sure he's capable of dropping into a shallow zone if he reads pass but he isn't going to be in man coverage very often (if ever) in that scheme.

mvscal wrote:I'm sure he's capable of dropping into a shallow zone if he reads pass but he isn't going to be in man coverage very often (if ever) in that scheme.

if he's on the inside he most certainly will have to cover te's and rb's coming out of the backfield, in edition to setting the edge against much faster rb's than he typically faced in college....so unless those combine times were anomalies, his speed should be of a MAJOR concern for the Blots...that and the fact at times he can't seem to get off of blocks.....

he may have leadership intangibles, but those won't help him make plays on the field....actually, the kid seems pretty likable and not somebody I'd root against, but I think he's going to get run over.....

Felix wrote:if he's on the inside he most certainly will have to cover te's and rb's coming out of the backfield, in edition to setting the edge against much faster rb's than he typically faced in college....

Not in a 3-4. I don't know what you're talking about.

Chiefs signed Tyler Bray, qb from Tenn as a UFA. Pretty good considering some "experts" had him going in the 1st round, while most had him 3rd-5th rounds.
HOWEVER, I do not recall having ever have read so many negative comments about a kid coming out of school, other than maybe Lawrence Phillips, or someone of that ilk.
"Million dollar arm, 5 cent head" , "Good arm, but not a very good head" , "Lack of intangibles and football IQ" , "Sociopath" , along with plenty of questions about his maturity,
and over all ability as a leader. Still bet he is better than Stanzi.

mvscal wrote:I don't know what you're talking about.

do you know how a 3-4 defense works?

the inside backers not only have to be fast, they have to be able to shed blocks and cover short route receivers.....sure, he did it well against college guys (except in the title game), but the NFL is a whole different animal....in the combines, he was running 4.8-4.9 40's, so unless he gains some serious speed in the next couple of months, he's going to be missing a lot of tackles and missing on a lot of coverage assignments.....

You're full of shit on just about every count. FTR, he ran 4.7 40 at his pro day. That is perfectly fine for an inside backer nor did he have any problems in coverage at Notre Dame and picked off quite a few passes. He has great football smarts and will be in the right place at the right time more often than not. Run stuffing is the primary responsibility for an ILB in the 3-4. Their coverage responsibilities are very limited.

It's pretty idiotic to judge him on the basis of one game. I know I was guilty of that, too. Show me one linebacker at any level of competition who will not struggle when his defensive line disintigrates in front of him. Alabama had three offensive linemen drafted two of them in the first round and one in the 4th. ND had all of one defensive lineman drafted and not until the 6th round.

Gayo will do just fine. I'm not worried about him at all. I'm more worried about the secondary and the offensive line.

mvscal wrote:You're full of shit on just about every count.

so in other words, you don't understand how a 3-4 defense works...

FTR, he ran 4.7 40 at his pro day.

fuck yeah, that's a lot faster than 4.8....

That is perfectly fine for an inside backer nor did he have any problems in coverage at Notre Dame and picked off quite a few passes. Run stuffing is the primary responsibility for an ILB in the 3-4. Their coverage responsibilities are very limited.

wait now, I'm confused.....he picked off quite a few passes, but you say he doesn't need pass coverage skills in the NFL is that right? you do know that notre dame ran a 3-4 defense right? and that he won't be playing against Pitt and BYU right?

It's pretty idiotic to judge him on the basis of one game. I know I was guilty of that, too. Show me one linebacker at any level of competition who will not struggle when his defensive line disintigrates in front of him. Alabama had three offensive linemen drafted two of them in the first round and one in the 4th. ND had all of one defensive lineman drafted and not until the 6th round.

look it wasn't the fact that he wasn't getting any support from his down line guys....he couldn't get off blocks and when he did, he couldn't tackle....he looked incredibly slow against an Alabama team that offensively wasn't particularly fast....was Alabama a good team, yeah...did they have quality players, absolutely.....but what the fuck do you think he's going to face in the NFL....bigger, faster, stronger guys

Gayo will do just fine. I'm not worried about him at all. I'm more worried about the secondary and the offensive line.

I like the fact you're now sticking up for the guy like a mother alligator defending her nest.....

like I said earlier, it's hard to root against the guy and I actually hope I'm wrong and he does have a decent career....

I just don't think he will....

Felix wrote:look it wasn't the fact that he wasn't getting any support from his down line guys....

So that is a fact then, correct? You agree that ND's defense line disintigrated against Alabama? What is their job again? Please refresh me on that point.

mvscal wrote:
So that is a fact then, correct? You agree that ND's defense line disintigrated against Alabama?

sure, they wilted under the superior athletic ability of the Alabama offensive line, but again there were numerous instances where Teo couldn't get off a block by a lineman, a blocking back, or a TE......now we're talking about big but relatively slow guys here....at linebacker, Teo should have been significantly quicker than any of bama's offensive line guys, and he simply didn't look like he was....now I'll grant you the fact that he spent a lot of time on the field and was probably sucking O's by the middle of the second period, but he looked really slow all night long.....

it's not going to get any easier in the NFL....

ND made the decision to put their 350 lb NT right over Barrett Jones, who had a foot injury, in hopes that he could beat Jones one-on-one and get into the backfield. This allowed Warmack a free run at Te’o or whatever linebacker was standing in his way because he didn’t have to help on the outside with Stephon Tuitt because DJ Fluker was handling him just fine, due in part to Fluker being a first round pick and Tuitt having a sports hernia that limited his mobility. Both of those defensive linemen for Notre Dame will be first or second round picks. ND only lost their other DE, Kapron Lewis-Moore, who was picked in the 6th round after blowing out his knee against Alabama.

Te’o played an awful game. But he did improve greatly in his pass coverage in his junior and senior year. Against USC, on at least one occasion near the goal line, he was responsible for Marquise Lee.

Te’o has enough speed to be successful, and his 40 time should not hurt him. Brandon Spikes and Vontaze Burfict both ran 5.0 40 yard dashes and they are two of the better young ILB’s in the league.

Te’o has to overcome his size (listed at 6’3”, 255 and measured at 6’1”, 244) and get better at fighting off blocks. When he had a space eater in front of him playing at a high level as Louis Nix did this past season, Te’o was very effective.

I don't think his size is a problem. He is the same size (almost exactly) as Donald Butler. The ability to shed blocks is technique and that is something that can be coached. Another odd thing I noticed about that game was the Domers diving at runners' feet trying to make shoestring tackles. It happened far too often for me to conclude anything other than that is what they were coached to do. Bama just ran right through that shit.

Gotta give Warmck credit as well. I don't think there are going to be too many NFL linebackers shedding his blocks if he gets a clean release. He's a beast and a well deserved top ten pick. Here's a condensation of most if not all of Alabama's offensive plays. The controled the LOS at will. Jones neutralized the NT and you had guards, tackles and even tight ends running around loose and blowing people up. ND couldn't set the edge. They couldn't plug the middle. They couldn't rush the passer. Total domination. Te'o's ('sup Rumps) worst sins were taking some bad angles and missing a few tackles. Otherwise, there really wasn't a whole helluva lot any one player could do to stop that rout. Check out the 3rd and 1 play at the 1:54. Warmack gets a clean run at Te'o with predictable results. He just engulfs him and blows him out of the way. Chance will be doing the same thing on Sundays to better players than Te'o.

I am sure he'll make a great pro .

mvscal wrote: Keenan Allen was an absolute steal in the 3rd round, though. He might be one of the best value picks in the draft so far. Overall, not too bad.

maybe. but someone might want tell this fuckin idiot who drafted him.

It's that Kal education at work. It's pretty much a given that when you draft a Kal player, you are drafting a stupid niqqer.