If global warming is as bad as some on the left say...

[Left Seater]

then why aren't they supporting projects that they themselves go on and on about at length?

Cape Wind is a project that would supply about 70% of the electrical needs of Cape Cod, but it is being opposed by liberals who are pushing for just such projects. Nice job Teddy, just another of your do what I say not what I do stances.

Teddy fights against wind energy for his state

Cape Wind Project

Furthermore Mass has a law on the books that says that a certain percentage of their electricity must come from renewable sources by 2009. This would certainly help you get there, but I guess the easier way is to just change that law, huh?

Hey Teddy and others that say global warming is such a dire issue, support these alternative methods and you will bring yourself a little more cred. Until then, shut the hell up!

[DrDetroit]

"What we have here are a bunch of well-heeled NIMBY opponents who extol the greatness of renewable energy at their cocktail parties,"

RACK!!!

Sure, those wind fields are great...until you have to look at them or until they start whacking your belovec birds. :roll:

[At Large]

I cringe everytime I turn on the TV and see Ted Kennedy going on and on about the latest outrage of the day. He's one of the main reasons people hate the Democrats. He just needs to shut the hell up and retire. The man is a living and breathing contradiction of life who thinks that just because he's a Kennedy, that people will listen to him. How he keeps getting reelected, I'll never know. He's a poster child for the benefits of term limits. If Howard Dean was serious about the Democrats getting more respect, he'd institute a stupid jar that you'd have to pay a grand into everytime you said something stupid. Teddy would be out of a million in no time flat...

[BSmack]

Rich people of all political persuasions are flipping out about wind power and cell towers once they discovered said structures would be constructed in their backyards. Here in NY, Tom Golisano (not exactly a bleeding heart) is playing the Teddy Kennedy role. On this issue they can all eat a dick.

[Mister Bushice]

Astronauts spot environmental damage from space:

Shuttle commander sees wide environmental damage

By Jeff Franks Thu Aug 4, 9:48 AM ET

HOUSTON (Reuters) - Commander Eileen Collins said astronauts on shuttle Discovery had seen widespread environmental destruction on Earth and warned on Thursday that greater care was needed to protect natural resources.

"Sometimes you can see how there is erosion, and you can see how there is deforestation. It's very widespread in some parts of the world," Collins said in a conversation from space with Japanese officials in Tokyo, including Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi.

"We would like to see, from the astronauts' point of view, people take good care of the Earth and replace the resources that have been used," said Collins, who was standing with Japanese astronaut Soichi Noguchi in front of a Japanese flag and holding a colorful fan.

Collins, making her fourth shuttle flight, said the view from space made clear that Earth's atmosphere must be protected, too.

"The atmosphere almost looks like an eggshell on an egg, it's so very thin," she said. "We know that we don't have much air, we need to protect what we have."

[DrDetroit]

This person's opinion matters how?

[Mister Bushice]

more than yours. Plus, there's that pesky visible component of the evidence of destruction.

[BSmack]

Not like she has an agenda or anything. Just an "unbiased" scientific observer, huh?

Like you?

[DrDetroit]

more than yours. Plus, there's that pesky visible component of the evidence of destruction.

Her scientific research has concluded what, exactly? That she can see deforestation and erosion?

So what? It's not like that's not readily observable from the ground.

Sorry, but she can take her opinions to space, at least she won't be wasting our air.

[Felix]

So now they're attacking a national hero because she pointed out some observations and offered her opinion.

Jesus fucking christ, how low can you fucking mooks sink........

[DrDetroit]

Attacking?

No, merely discounting her opinion as ignorant and uninformed.

She used her status as an astronaut to spew her uninformed environmental crap.

That's "attacking" her?

No...attacking someone is going after their adopted kids like TIME and the NY Times.

[Felix]

Attacking?

No, merely discounting her opinion as ignorant and uninformed.

Now why would you say that? What evidence do you have that supports your allegation that her opinion is uninformed?

She used her status as an astronaut to spew her uninformed environmental crap.

Give me the exact passage that you disagree with........

No...attacking someone is going after their adopted kids like TIME and the NY Times.

Show me the story where either of those newspapers have attacked his adopted children.....

[BSmack]

Attacking?

No, merely discounting her opinion as ignorant and uninformed.

Let's check her qualifications.

Colonel Eileen Marie Collins (b. 19 November 1956 in Elmira, New York) is an American astronaut and a retired U.S. Air Force test pilot. She is the first female pilot and first female commander of a Space Shuttle.

As a child, Collins expressed an interest both in spaceflight and in being a pilot. She graduated from Syracuse University in 1978 and then earned a master of science degree in operations research from Stanford University in 1986 and a master of arts degree in space systems management from Webster University in 1989. She married pilot Pat Youngs in 1988; the couple have two children, Bridget and Luke. Collins' parents are James Collins, a surveyor and postal worker, and Rose Marie. She has three siblings.

Collins completed her USAF undergraduate pilot training in 1979, after which she was a T-38 instructor pilot until 1982. From 1983 to 1985, Collins was an instructor pilot and aircraft commander on the C-141 Starlifter. From 1986 to 1989, she was an assistant professor of mathematics and a T-41 instructor pilot at the U.S. Air Force Academy. She was selected for NASA's astronaut program while attending the prestigious Air Force Test Pilot School at Edwards Air Force Base, from which she graduated in 1990. She has logged more than 6,000 hours in 30 different types of aircraft.

Collins also participated in the U.S. invasion of Grenada, evacuating medical students and their families off the island as part of Operation Urgent Fury in 1983.

Collins first flew the shuttle as pilot in 1995 aboard STS-63, which involved a rendezvous between Discovery and the Russian space station Mir. In recognition of her achievement as the first female shuttle pilot, she received the Harmon Trophy. She also was the pilot for STS-84 in 1997.

Collins next commanded STS-93, launched in July 1999, which deployed the Chandra X-Ray Observatory. This was shuttle Columbia's next-to-last completed mission, the final one being STS-109, which flew in March 2002.

Collins is currently commanding STS-114, the first shuttle flight since the Space Shuttle Columbia disaster. The flight was launched on 26 July 2005, and is expected to return on 8 August 2005. During STS-114, Collins became the first astronaut to fly the space shuttle through a complete loop. This was necessary so astronauts aboard the International Space Station could take photographs of the shuttle's belly, to ensure there was no threat from debris-related damage to the shuttle upon re-entry.

The main entrance boulevard to Syracuse Hancock International Airport is named in her honor.

How many Masters Degrees do YOU have?

[Mister Bushice]

You may as well give up trying, Felix. Detroit is convinced he's the only one here who is right no matter what the evidence against him is, and he will never stop his endless response/question/insult posts as long as you reply to them.

Better to just post your own opinion and wait for someone lucid and less abrasively annoying to reply to it.

[Felix]

Better to just post your own opinion and wait for someone lucid and less abrasively annoying to reply to it.

I think my biggest problem is that there is nothing in the story that I would expect to elicit such a tardish reaction......but then again, were talking about Detwat so I guess that's my bad....

[DrDetroit]

BSmack:

How many Masters Degrees do YOU have?

Hmmm, she has two masters' degrees, yet neither one in climatology, geology, environmental science, etc.

What "qualifications" were you referring to, dolt?

Bushice:

You may as well give up trying, Felix. Detroit is convinced he's the only one here who is right no matter what the evidence against him is, and he will never stop his endless response/question/insult posts as long as you reply to them.

1) I'm not arguing that I am right about anything in this thread. I merely noted that we have someone abusing her status as an astronaut to spew ignorant takes re: the environment.

2) I apoligze if I have so completely flustered you that you're unable to any longer actually post a "take" on any topic dicsussed here.

Felix:

I think my biggest problem is that there is nothing in the story that I would expect to elicit such a tardish reaction......but then again, were talking about Detwat so I guess that's my bad....

What "tardish reaction" are you referring to?

I merely acknowledged that this individual has no scientific training to base her opinions on nor her insinuations.

What is tardish about that?

What is tardish is you automatically getting to your knees to defend anyone I or Mvscal might criticize.

[Mister Bushice]

I think my biggest problem is that there is nothing in the story that I would expect to elicit such a tardish reaction......but then again, were talking about Detwat so I guess that's my bad....

The more people who post here with solid opinions and not holy than thou attitudes the less of a mess Detriot makes of the place.

Post more often. :)

[Felix]

What "tardish reaction" are you referring to?

Sorry, but she can take her opinions to space, at least she won't be wasting our air.

Again, which passage of the article has you so infuriated?

"Sometimes you can see how there is erosion, and you can see how there is deforestation. It's very widespread in some parts of the world,"

Are you going to tell me these things aren't occurring?

"We would like to see, from the astronauts' point of view, people take good care of the Earth and replace the resources that have been used,"

Heresy, how dare she suggest people take care of the earth.......

"The atmosphere almost looks like an eggshell on an egg, it's so very thin," she said. "We know that we don't have much air, we need to protect what we have."

Obviously, your problem must be with this passage......so tell me, what is it that she said that has you so mad.....

[DrDetroit]

Again, which passage of the article has you so infuriated?

Why are you speculating re: my emotional state?

Are you going to tell me these things aren't occurring?

She made a self-evident observation. It doesn't take an astronaut to observe that deforestation or erosion is happening.

Heresy, how dare she suggest people take care of the earth.......

Is anyone criticizing her for this comment?

Obviously, your problem must be with this passage......so tell me, what is it that she said that has you so mad.....

Again with the speculation. Are you that interested in me?

In any case, only a blind, partisan idiot would dismiss the clear implication of her remarks. She's abusing her status as an astronaut to push an agenda.

[BSmack]

BSmack:

How many Masters Degrees do YOU have?

Hmmm, she has two masters' degrees, yet neither one in climatology, geology, environmental science, etc.

What "qualifications" were you referring to, dolt?

So you have none. Nor do you have any relevant experience re: viewing the earth from space. Near as I can tell, your only qualifications are a business degree and a poor attitude.

[Felix]

This is rich......damn dude, you couldn't administer self ass-kickings any better if you were trying.

Why are you speculating re: my emotional state?

Is anyone criticizing her for this comment?

Again with the speculation.

Which is followed by this.....

In any case, only a blind, partisan idiot would dismiss the clear implication of her remarks. She's abusing her status as an astronaut to push an agenda.

Which agenda is she pushing?

God knows that anytime I want to know about the condition of the earth, I always consult astronauts. But I try and find ones that don't abuse their status as astronauts.......

You made the funnay...I get it.....

[DrDetroit]

BSmack:

How many Masters Degrees do YOU have?

Hmmm, she has two masters' degrees, yet neither one in climatology, geology, environmental science, etc.

What "qualifications" were you referring to, dolt?

So you have none. Nor do you have any relevant experience re: viewing the earth from space. Near as I can tell, your only qualifications are a business degree and a poor attitude.

No, I have two - Public Administration and Business Administration.

What she observed is self-evident. You don't need to be in space to observe it. We already know about erosion and deforestation. She hardly has a "Eureka!" moment.

[DrDetroit]

This is rich......damn dude, you couldn't administer self ass-kickings any better if you were trying.

Why are you speculating re: my emotional state?

Is anyone criticizing her for this comment?

Again with the speculation.

Which is followed by this.....

In any case, only a blind, partisan idiot would dismiss the clear implication of her remarks. She's abusing her status as an astronaut to push an agenda.

Which agenda is she pushing?

You made the funnay...I get it.....

What's funny is that you think smacking someone involves speculating their emotional state.

Nonetheless, the implications of her remarks are clear...if you cannot identify them then you have no business in this thread other to demonstrate, again, that you'll go to your knees to defend someone that I am criticizing faster than Guy Fawkes got to his knees to suck cack.

[Felix]

Nonetheless, the implications of her remarks are clear...if you cannot identify them then you have no business in this thread......

Look, you just spent the post previous chastising me about my speculating on what you may or may not think or feel. Then in the same sentence you SPECULATE on what her motivations may or may not have been, you SPECULATE that she's pushing some agenda.

This is the third and last fucking time I'll ask, show me exactly what statement that she made that warrants you're continuous bashing of her. She's a national fucking hero pal.

If you ever want to know why everyone at this board laughs at your pathetic ass, just look back to this thread.......

[Mister Bushice]

I tried to tell ya, Felix......

[DrDetroit]

Nonetheless, the implications of her remarks are clear...if you cannot identify them then you have no business in this thread......

Look, you just spent the post previous chastising me about my speculating on what you may or may not think or feel. Then in the same sentence you SPECULATE on what her motivations may or may not have been, you SPECULATE that she's pushing some agenda.

This is the third and last fucking time I'll ask, show me exactly what statement that she made that warrants you're continuous bashing of her. She's a national fucking hero pal.

If you ever want to know why everyone at this board laughs at your pathetic ass, just look back to this thread.......

Look who is getting infuriated now...

LMAO!!!

Take a breather...

[Felix]

Look who is getting infuriated now...

LMAO!!!

Take a breather...

No bud, you mistake my responses to you as giving a shit about what you think--which I don't......

But for you to cast aspersions toward a national hero because said person stated something you didn't like is about as low as you can go..........

I've asked you to provide which passage you have such trouble with four times, but you've avoided that like the plague. Bottom line there's nothing she said that pushes any agenda, she just vocalized some observations which you yourself have admitted are fact.

Sorry to tell you this bud, but your a fucking putz plain and simple....

[BSmack]

No, I have two - Public Administration and Business Administration.

So, no science degrees eh?

What she observed is self-evident. You don't need to be in space to observe it. We already know about erosion and deforestation. She hardly has a "Eureka!" moment.

And you know this from your repeated space visits?

[DrDetroit]

No bud, you mistake my responses to you as giving a shit about what you think--which I don't......

I'm not your bud and yes, you do give a shit about what I think. That's why you keep replying.

But for you to cast aspersions toward a national hero because said person stated something you didn't like is about as low as you can go..........

What aspersions did I cast?

I've asked you to provide which passage you have such trouble with, but you've avoided that like the plague. Bottom line there's nothing she said that pushes any agenda, she just vocalized some observations which you yourself have admitted are fact.

Yeah, you must be blind.

The implication in her comments is that we must do something about the atmosphere, dickhead, when it's not quite clear that a) human activity is harming the atmosphere; and b) that there is anything we can do even if we wanted to.

It's the typical enviro-hack argument.

[Mister Bushice]

What she observed is self-evident. You don't need to be in space to observe it. We already know about erosion and deforestation. She hardly has a "Eureka!" moment.

And you know this from your repeated space visits?

That WOULD explain a lot. ;)

[BSmack]

What she observed is self-evident. You don't need to be in space to observe it. We already know about erosion and deforestation. She hardly has a "Eureka!" moment.

And you know this from your repeated space visits?

That WOULD explain a lot. ;)

I'm still betting that "getting dosed with 4 hits of liquid LSD by hippies at a Phish concert" is the correct answer.

[Left Seater]

"Sometimes you can see how there is erosion, and you can see how there is deforestation. It's very widespread in some parts of the world," Collins said

Of course there is erosion. Just as land is constantly growing, ie Hawaii et al. Just how does she suggest we stop erosion? I can't wait to hear how she plans to keep rivers from flowing and prevent tsunamis from occuring.

[Mister Bushice]

The counterpoint was "widespread deforestation", not merely erosion, although that is a consequence of deforestation.

[Left Seater]

The counterpoint was "widespread deforestation", not merely erosion,

Well, the USA is certainly not the problem when it comes to deforestation. Deforestation is a problem in third world countries not here. Our forests are stronger now than they have ever been. And unless you are ready for the US to start spreading our will on places like Hati, then there is little we can do about deforestation.

[Mister Bushice]

The counterpoint was "widespread deforestation", not merely erosion,

Well, the USA is certainly not the problem when it comes to deforestation. Deforestation is a problem in third world countries not here. Our forests are stronger now than they have ever been. And unless you are ready for the US to start spreading our will on places like Hati, then there is little we can do about deforestation.

That really wasn't the point. The US is not deforesting, but the fact exists. Deforestation is a global problem. It's not like Third world countries live on another planet and what they do doesn't ultimately affect us. However there is quite a bit of financial influence the G8 has over third world countries but I'm guessing they'll not use it until it is too late. Forgiving debt and feeding the hungry is all well and good but the rainforests give far more than the option of not having them, and destroying them takes away from the health of the planet as a whole and turns the land they grew on into a wasteland.

[DrDetroit]

Yeah, she had no agenda. At least Bushice got the implication of her comments.

[Left Seater]

So please tell me what you think the G8 should be doing with third world countries to help stop deforestation.

Furthermore, how do we implement your suggestions without the UN and the rest of the world from claiming that our actions are just part of a plan to spread the will of the US across the planet?

[Mister Bushice]

So please tell me what you think the G8 should be doing with third world countries to help stop deforestation.

Education, farming and forest preservation programs.

Furthermore, how do we implement your suggestions without the UN and the rest of the world from claiming that our actions are just part of a plan to spread the will of the US across the planet?

Ah, the gordian knot. The UN is certainly a roadblock on the road to good intentions.


I never said my plan was fool proof. The fools at the UN would ultimately prove that.

[Dr_Phibes]

So please tell me what you think the G8 should be doing with third world countries to help stop deforestation.

Well, a quick example would be the American defoliation campaign going on in Columbia at moment. In an attempt to rid rural areas of the FARC-EP (much like Viet Nam), American aircraft are spraying Monsanto prepared combinations of glyphosate and cosmoflux - at five times the legal limit of destructive ingredients allowed.

Operating under the principle that you can't have a peoples war without any people, 20% of all greenbelt land has been chemically destroyed in an effort to drive the population into urban ghettos where they can be controlled.

Furthermore, how do we implement your suggestions without the UN and the rest of the world from claiming that our actions are just part of a plan to spread the will of the US across the planet?

Well essentially, you can't. While it's fairly easy to slip one by on the domestic American population by omitting the news, you can't hide the crimes from the victims.

[Left Seater]

Again, how far do we go with this education, and farming when other nations don't want our help. Hell, we already grow a large percentage of the crops for the world.

Furthermore, take a look at the island the Dominican and Hati share. You can see the border between the countries from the air. The DM is green and lush while Hati is brown and barren. Both are third world, poor, and take US aid, yet one is green and the other isn't.

IMO we can educate, and give money away and teach farming, but unless those receiving it want it it doesn't matter. Kinda like the old proverb, give a man a fish and he eats for the day, teach a man to fish and he eats for a lifetime. But that only works if the teachee wants to learn.

When our own citizens would rather take handouts and stay on welfare rather than work, what makes you think other countries will be different.