Local Radio Drama - CAIR 1, Free Speach 0

[BSmack]

If you're looking to the "liberal" or "moderate" Muslims to rat out the "extremist" Muslims, I'm afraid they are out of the loop just as you and I are.

Bullshit.

If you know, then you should know who the liberal muslims know. So why don't YOU rat them out.

Traitor.

[Tom In VA]

Dinsdale,

Ahmed Ressam entered the U.S. at Port Angeles, Washington. That's in the U&L.

Mohammed Atta flew from Portland, ME (U&R) to Logan Airport.

Facts. There are number of logistical support centers throughout the U.S. But I guess because you've played grabass with your local Imam at the annual "Hey we're really nice guys" picnic, you know more about terrorism and the networks used to support than do countless others in Law Enforcement.

As for your contention about the Portland 7 being "absolue" heinous bunch of propaganda crap. That's for the courts to decide. It was not an example I was going to cite.

OK, I see we agree on something -- that you're an easily duped mental midget that bought into the hatred. What was the name of that one dude who said that all Jews were out to get the Aryans? Didn't he start calling people out for harboring Jews?

Hold your horses there ma'am. Don't get your panties in a wad and start running around like a bitch casting aspersions and making false claims about what I've said and what I believe.

Cite for me where I've "bought into hatred". Back up your bullshit. All I've done is:

1. Cited an actual double standard.
2. Provided facts.

I'm not the one that was easily duped by the Tupperware party my local Mosque held. You are. I've merely stated that I'm not ready to make the leap that just because the local Mosque invites me over for a continental breakfast and coffee, they wouldn't sit by and chant "Allah Akbar, Allah Akbar" as your infidel head is being sliced off.

These ice cream socials you've been going to at your local mosque mean nothing. That's all I've said. So back up your bullshit and cite for me where I stated anything about ALL MUSLIMS.

[DrDetroit]

You're diving into an empty pool, BSmack.

[BSmack]

You're diving into an empty pool, BSmack.

I'm trying to pick Tom's brain.

You saying there isn't anything there?

[Tom In VA]

Tom,

Your anti-Christian (Catholicism) and anti-Semite (Judaism) angle is interesting. The standards are so much doubled as they are apples and oranges. Did the movies "Priest" and "Dogma" call Catholicism a terrorist organization? No. Did it threaten the church's hierarchy higlighting the hypocritical nature of the church or skewer the church over satirical coals? Yes. They are works of fiction that provoke or challenge the faithful to take a hard look at ourselves/themselves perhaps even laugh a little, whereas Graham is very real touting his views over the air.

I can't NOT respect that post. Thank you. You make an excellent well written point. Ultimately Graham's choices are responsible for his firing. On this we agree.

I'm still fuzzy on the "why" of the whole double standard thing. As I asked Dr D. What leverage or power does CAIR have over ABC that Rome for instance does not ?

Is there an implied respect for CAIR and disrespect for Rome ?

[Tom In VA]

B,

1. "My guess is they haven't done anything of the kind because they know that most Americans won't relate to a movie about a suicide bomber. Most Americans know a Priest. Not many know a sucide bomber or an Imam."

I'll buy that.


2. Nah, you were up to something. I was measuring my reply.


3-5. "Because he denigrated a whole religion by calling them a terrorist organization. That is like calling the RCC a terrorist organization because the IRA is comprised of Catholics. It is stupid, uninformed and makes the people who hired Graham look stupid and uninformed. "

I'll buy that one too. To a point. Islam has quite an overbearing past, present and the most hardcore would like it to be future as well. Yet somehow they still get a pass. This could possibly be explained within context of your first quote. That up until recent past, Islam, really hasn't been on the forefront of discussion and it was limited to certain areas of the world. Now that it's the world's fastest growing religion, it's getting more attention. But in terms of castigating and scrutinizing religions, Islam appears to get a pass. Perhaps it's newness in this hemisphere and the familiarity with Christianity and Judaism are the root factor.

6. I'm Soul Train. You hung with the "spinners" at Dead shows.

[Dinsdale]

Did it ever occur to you why they're so nice and friendly in the U&L ? It's a strategic entry point, just like the U&R.

Gee, couldn't be that they're good Americans, who are concerned for both their fellow Americans and world peace.

I'm sure you have it all figured out, though. Because a few terrorist nutjobs entered the United States through the Northwest, it must mean that ALL Muslims in the Northwest are plotting against you. That's a good little lockstepper, right there.

Another example of "if Muslim leaders don't speak out against it, they're in on it, but if they do speak out against it, they're in on it." Even though this is clearly untrue.

You're only solution to the Muslim leader's problem is for them to deliver heads on a silver platter....since, you know...they're in on it. And if by some fluke (read: the propaganda isn't quite true), they're NOT in on it...well, they're unfortunate victims of the terrorists, as well. But what the heck, they're all brown, and those sandniggers even have the same religion...just like you and the Jehovah's Witnesses do, so they had it coming.

Fucking redneck racist idiot.

[Tom In VA]

Did it ever occur to you why they're so nice and friendly in the U&L ? It's a strategic entry point, just like the U&R.

Gee, couldn't be that they're good Americans, who are concerned for both their fellow Americans and world peace.

Why yes it has. But there is the possibility that SOME are not. You've generalized and drawn conclusions here. I've stated facts. The facts are that the 9-11 attackers were very nice, supported by very nice socialiable muslims, some of whom are located in the U&L and U&R. I stated no conclusion either way nor have I suggested that ALL MUSLIMS are cheering on the terrorists.

Your conclusion that I'm a racist and a redneck is nothing short of laughable. This from the king of "You don't know me" responses . You're welcome to that perception of me. You can tuck it away with the rest of your delusions, you minute cunt.

[socal]

I'm still fuzzy on the "why" of the whole double standard thing. As I asked Dr D. What leverage or power does CAIR have over ABC that Rome for instance does not ?

Is there an implied respect for CAIR and disrespect for Rome ?

The difference I think is CAIR is more akin to a grassroots political action committee/media watchdog with political saavy. The Catholic Church's nearest equivelent as far as I can see is the US Conference of Catholic Bishops which despite having a DC address isn't as effective in its media monitoring. In fact, it does little more than issue press releases to the media about events in the church.

They describe their misssion like this:

Its purposes under civil law are: "To unify, coordinate, encourage, promote and carry on Catholic activities in the United States; to organize and conduct religious, charitable and social welfare work at home and abroad; to aid in education; to care for immigrants; and generally to enter into and promote by education, publication and direction the objects of its being."

I don't think they (or any other Catholic organization stateside or in the Vatican) is proactively listening and reading American media and sending letters to station management. They're more focused on the faithful and services for the faithful than critics of the faithful.

[Mike the Lab Rat]

Ward Churchill Says U. of Colo. Dropping Indian Probe

"Mannaggia! Why can't they let us fake Injuns alone!"

signed,

Espera DeCorti

[ChargerMike]

The Muslims out in LA had an "Open House" in some of their mosques.

It's a blatant attempt to try and grease the skids for the day when one of their freaks blows something up here, and the citizens retaliate. They're afraid they'll be blamed for the radical members actions.

So instead of openly denouncing AND pursuing action against the terrorists hiddne here, they have an open House.

Niiice. Wait until the day comes when Americans are killed here. People won't be so happy about muslims then, no matter who they are, because they NEVER stepped up to really fight terrorism.

No sweeping generalizations here.

Bushice, please. Ever occur to you that Muslims want to eleminate Americans, too?

FTFY

[See You Next Wednesday]

If you don't think muslims in the US are actively denouncing violence and terrorism then you aren't paying attention. Or more likely the press doesn't talk about it because really how interesting is that?

[Dinsdale]

If you don't think muslims in the US are actively denouncing violence and terrorism then you aren't paying attention.

That's not enough. They're supposed to actually hand deliver the terrorists. These guys told me so. Seems like a strange double-standard, since the Enlightened Righties here seem to have some unique insight into the world of American Muslims, yet they're doing NOTHING. I've yet to see a terrorist weeded out by anyone by the name of Tom from the state of Virginia.

He's obviously plotting against the United States. Fucking terrorist.

[socal]

I've yet to see a terrorist weeded out by anyone by the name of Tom from the state of Virginia.

He's obviously plotting against the United States. Fucking terrorist.

Perhaps if you went looking for Hezbillie Jim?



:P

[Tom In VA]

I've yet to see a terrorist weeded out by anyone by the name of Tom from the state of Virginia.

He's obviously plotting against the United States. Fucking terrorist.

Perhaps if you went looking for Hezbillie Jim?



:P

Two facts and then my honest opinion

1. I'm quite sure that there are American Muslims that disdain the terrorists' activities. In fact I personally know several. While I didn't attend a Fondue Party at my local mosque, the fact remains not ALL muslims are complicit. In fact, especially in this area, some are dilligently working to help combat terrorism.

2. I'm also quite sure that there are American Muslims that encourage and participate in terrorist activities. This is undisputed fact.

Opinion: Strategically it's better that American Muslims are perceived the way they are by the likes of Graham. Were it the other way around it might make the task of tracking and finding terrorist agents that much more difficult.

[Variable]

You could easily drop the "The" from the beginning of the sentence to satisfy the PCers but your message doesn't change. Not every Muslim is an extremist looking to kill Americans. There are Muslims from many walks of life who fall across the political spectrum and the varying degrees of assimilation that Detroit refuses to acknowledge. If you're looking to the "liberal" or "moderate" Muslims to rat out the "extremist" Muslims, I'm afraid they are out of the loop just as you and I are. These terror cells it turns out are pretty tight and don't broadcast their intentions daily upon sunset at the mosque. Apparently they're robbing banks in Torrance, eh?

Socal, what pisses me and other non-PCers off about that type of anal thinking is that you think you're smarter than everyone else on this issue. You think we're all too stupid to figure out that not every muslim is an extremist, right? If not, then why bother to point it out? No where does Bushice say that every Muslim is an extremist and it's not even implied. You just pull it out of thin air because he uses the term "Muslims" or "the muslims". Well congrat-u-fuckin-lations, you're a genius. Thanks so much for this divine inspiration. Without this brilliant insight, we all would have though Habeeb from down the hall was going to yell "Allah Ackbar" in the fucking lunchroom and blow everyone to smithereens.

Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue...

The implication is that someone, somewhere, in one of these muslim communities (i.e. "muslims", "the muslims") knows who these cats are, what they're up to and where they are. Extremists hang with other muslims, who may or may not be as radical as they are. This means that a muslim who is not as extreme as his buddy is, quite possibly could know what his pal is up to, but isn't an extremist himself. Damn, if I dumb that down any further, it'll be in freaking ("mm...Mohammed make'um bomb) Tarzan-speak.

<This post checked for spelling by Dinsdale 08/26/2005>

[Mike the Lab Rat]

You know I wonder if I "think of myself" as black can I qualify for minority hiring preferences and other AA benefits?

Well, the fairly recent mitochondrial DNA analysis supports the hypothesis that the human species originated in Africa, so...

we're ALL African-Americans!

[socal]

Nice rant, Vari. Did I hurt your self of steam?



Yes, there are Islamofacists in our midst. September 11 proved it. Subsequent arrests have uncovered individuals in NY and northern Cali who participated in Al Qaida training camps in Pakistan and Afghanistan. We need to be diligent in protecting our borders and find these cells before they do harm.

Are you happy now?



That being said, you're kidding yourself if you think Bushice isn't implying an equation of Muslim = Extremist. He's all but left out forcing young Muslims to join American Youth Groups, making daily loyalty oaths, and beating up Muslims who refuse to sport Bush/Cheney bumper stickers.

Howsabout respecting constitutional rights and conducting thorough investigations.

As Dins said earlier, this is fucking America.

[Mister Bushice]

That being said, you're kidding yourself if you think Bushice isn't implying an equation of Muslim = Extremist. He's all but left out forcing young Muslims to join American Youth Groups, making daily loyalty oaths, and beating up Muslims who refuse to sport Bush/Cheney bumper stickers.

Actually, Variable is 100% correct not only on what I said AND meant, but his simplification of it could not have been more precise. You are the one implying ludicrous accusations that I never said anywhere, and you need to re-read his post above and then read this:

I AM MISTER BUSHICE, AND I APPROVE OF THIS MESSAGE.

Howsabout respecting constitutional rights and conducting thorough investigations.

Investigations go nowhere without some assistance from others. There have got to be muslims leaders or community members out there in America right now who have knowledge of or suspicions of extremists in their midsts, and their duty to this country is to step forward and assist in that investigation. Their rights would not be violated at all, and I can't think of a better way to reduce the threat of terrorism here.

The FBI, the CIA, homeland security will get nowhere without leads or tips. The article I posted above was accomplished out of sheer luck. I refused to believe there wasn't a single muslim individual somewhere who suspected that guy might have terrorist ties, but it took an arrest for robbery to bring it to light.
[/quote]

As Dins said earlier, this is fucking America.

By not participating in the process of fighting terror here, they certainly are.

[Mister Bushice]

Two facts and then my honest opinion

1. I'm quite sure that there are American Muslims that disdain the terrorists' activities. In fact I personally know several. While I didn't attend a Fondue Party at my local mosque, the fact remains not ALL muslims are complicit. In fact, especially in this area, some are dilligently working to help combat terrorism.

while I agree not al lmuslims are complicit - most are not - there have not been enough arrests of suspected terrorists here to prove that.

2. I'm also quite sure that there are American Muslims that encourage and participate in terrorist activities. This is undisputed fact.

And they are part of the muslim community, so somebody is sure to know something.

Opinion: Strategically it's better that American Muslims are perceived the way they are by the likes of Graham. Were it the other way around it might make the task of tracking and finding terrorist agents that much more difficult.

It would be far easier with the full ACTIVE cooperation of the muslim leaders here. Actions not just words.

[socal]

The Muslims out in LA had an "Open House" in some of their mosques.

It's a blatant attempt to try and grease the skids for the day when one of their freaks blows something up here, and the citizens retaliate. They're afraid they'll be blamed for the radical members actions.

So instead of openly denouncing AND pursuing action against the terrorists hiddne here, they have an open House.

Niiice. Wait until the day comes when Americans are killed here. People won't be so happy about muslims then, no matter who they are, because they NEVER stepped up to really fight terrorism.

Bushice,

^^^Here is your original post.^^^

In it you openly dismiss a good faith gesture on the part of the Muslim-American community. You insist that they should identify the terrorists because in your steeltrap logic of a six-year old they "just know". They're not true Americans until they start naming names. Denounce and pursue with action! Nice job, xenophobe.

In your mind the other shoe has dropped. You ain't waiting to assign the blame. Cart before horse, much?

:roll:

[Variable]

I AM MISTER BUSHICE, AND I APPROVE OF THIS MESSAGE.

RACK

socal, you do realize that your basic slant towards Bushice in this thread is, "Don't tell me what you're thinking! I'm the one who knows what you're thinking!", right? Good luck with that.

[Tom In VA]

Bushice,

My stated opinion on the usefulness of the American Muslim being perceived as not too riled up about terrorist attacks is based on a bit of .....



I'm using the analogy of an undercover DEA agent, being seen and vocal at a D.A.R.E event.


Truth is, who knows where anyone's allegiences actually lie. That goes for all Americans.

[socal]

As a patriotic American, you should...NO! You MUST...tell the cops what you know.

I'll be turning mvscal in for smoking weed. This is a global war includes the war on drugs. If you tote, the terrorists win.

Detroit drove over 55 this morning. Such reckless behavior at a time when the price for a barrell of oil is over $65.

Variable failed to yield to a pedestrian. Granted he was obviously an illegal, and he was jaywalking with a cherry bomb in his pocket. But you cannot barrel them over just so you can get a prime parking spot.

:wink:

Bushice, your footdragging on naming the co-conspirators is quite troubling. Out with it already!

Your presumption that the Muslims "know" who the terrorists are is simply flawed, Bushice.

L8

[Variable]

Your presumption that the Muslims "know" who the terrorists are is simply flawed, Bushice.

Don't you mean some muslims or most muslims? I find your use of blanket generalities to be quite offensive. Surely you can't mean that all muslims don't know who the terrorists are, because you're clearly forgetting about the extremists who quite clearly know who their cohorts are. In the future, please only use the terms "most" or "some" when referring to groups of this nature, so as not to offend the rest of us. TIA.