To melt or not to melt???

[buckeye_in_sc]

Buckeye Nation:

It is painfully obvious the Bucks have some issues. Offensively to go from rolling Iowa like a blunt to this is pathetic...I know Jo Pa and the Lions came to play and hats off to them. All that matters is the final score and in this case well 17>10.

In know way am I bitching or saying someone needs to go, etc. Just some random observations through 5 games.


My thoughts:

1 Offense - what happened? Thes supposed best WR's in the B10, Much better O line play, and a better than average running game. The imagination is gone...not sure what is going on here.

2 Defense - hard to fault them...only gave up 10 points last night...playing pretty much lights out all year...

3 Hype - did the team buy too much into it? they walk and talk like captains but it appears no one steps up at times to make the BIG play.


I was talking to a few buddies and we threw out that say between 93 and 98 you never saw a tOSU team not score pretty much at will (save for a couple of michigan games), and do it with the same scheme week after week.

This changing schemes every week has got to be one of the main culprits...at this point pick a scheme and stick to it...

as far as the QB play goes...can any buckeye fan honestly say that TS is better than JZ????

its early (my son woke up at 6am EST) and yes I am still a little edgy after last night...

thoughts, comments? in no way is this a bitch fest about Tressel needs to go etc...just my thoughts...

[Snake]

I'll start with Penn State play a good game, kudos....I like JT as a head coach. I hate him as an OC. Defense is playing lights out. TS needs to stop reading his press clippings and start reading defenses. That's all I got, dammit we need an OC............................

[Ken]

1 Offense - what happened? Thes supposed best WR's in the B10, Much better O line play, and a better than average running game. The imagination is gone...not sure what is going on here.

My initial thought on the WR comment:
Perhaps OSU should utilize true WR's rather than a converted track star. Seriously. Think about it.

[Ken]

3 Hype - did the team buy too much into it? they walk and talk like captains but it appears no one steps up at times to make the BIG play.

Defensively, OSU did play up to their lofty standards if you ask me... so I wouldn't pin too much blame on them. DWill simply beat Hawk to the corner and scored... TS put the D in a bad position at their own 2... PSU's o-line played juuuuuust well enough to semi-neutralize OSU's d-line.

Now, OSU's offense? I don't think any of their players were put into position to MAKE a big play. Not sure why true frosh DB, King, wasn't tested more by OSU. They didn't test the middle of the field with their TE like they should have either... that is where PSU's D can be suspect. Nonetheless, PSU's d-line played extremely well and really didn't give much of a chance for anyone to MAKE a big play.

[PSUFAN]

I wonder if Zwick would have been the difference in this game? Smith had a couple of important opportunites that he missed.

The more I think about this game, the more similar I believe OSU and PSU to be - smoking defense, and an offense with great (but not fully realized) potential.

[Jobocky]

I'm not sure what really happened Sat. night. Very disappointed in even the effort given by the OSU offense. Was it just me or was Smith totally unprepared for this game? From some of the replays it appeared he had receivers open either down the middle or down the sideline and instead he either threw to a receiver he already committed to, or took off and ran. Then when he made up his mind he was going to throw the ball, he just stood there and forced something. Worst game I've seen an OSU QB have in a long time.

Ginn appears to be playing scared it you ask me. Returning kicks and receiving the ball, he curls up in a ball in the presence of defenders.

Very frustrating performance. There's a lot of love going out to PSU fans and their team, but except for 31 (who's a down-right bitch) I honestly was not that impressed with PSU. No way do they beat anyone currently in the top 10. They will lose at least 2 Big Ten games.

That being said, congrats for out-playing the Buckeyes and taking control of the Big Ten.

[buckeye_in_sc]

PSU - I believe Zwick would have been a difference in the game...I think he reads progressions much better than Smith...

heard the radio announcers say that Tressel was telling Smith which receivers to throw to or look for on certain plays...that is FUCKING SAD if that is the case...

I was screaming for Zwick...Tressel was not at all hesitant to pull Zwick why not Smith?

oh well games are won and lost on the field by the players and coaches...there was a LACK of execution on the OFFENSIVE side of the ball by everyone...

Defense - too bad your O couldn't do anything for you to give up 10 points in theory (7 came off the INT return to the OSU 6)...that should have been enough...

rant over

[PSUFAN]

I didn't agree with the offensive approach taken by PSU in the second half - however, the staff won the game with it. They scaled back what they were trying to do in dramatic fashion. They required the defense to step up and make big plays...which is exactly what they were able to do. That gameplan doesn't win against a lot of teams...but then again, maybe they don't try it against other teams.

Smith is another athletic QB who doesn't look too polished as a QB, especially under duress. There are times when you need a QB to be a QB, not a great athlete.

Ginn is a young kid. He will be a great football player, but right now he's got a bit to learn. I don't think King and Williams are at his level athletically, but I think they are better football players, who know how to bring their explosiveness to each and every play. They seem to have great football speed. Ginn has so much world class speed that it's actually an obstacle in his football development. JMHO

[buckeye_in_sc]

^^^

I would agree...I thought when tOSU got to 14-10 at half it would be a different ball game...

can't ask your defense for much more than holding an opponent without a first down for the last 22 minutes of the game...

great game, good luck the rest of the way...

actually Fuck Zwick and Smith...put Boeckman in and see what he can do...

[PSUFAN]

Tressel was not at all hesitant to pull Zwick why not Smith?

Probaby, Smith looks totally unbeatable in practice, and against marginal teams. That is certainly the case with Robinson, although Mike has struggled some with marginal teams as well. Things like progressions, reads, and footwork become very important in a game of that caliber. It's tough for that to go well when you're wondering whether you should just tuck the ball and run. The great ones are the ones who can beat you instinctively with their feet and arms - Elway, Montana, etc.

[Shawn Marion]

I think has some serious quarterback issues across the board. If you think about it, none of the QBs under Tressel have progressed really at all, not Krenzel, McMullen, Zwick, or Smith. They all basically look the same as they did when they first came in.

An actual OC is needed, and an actual QB coach is needed as well. The offensive futility is sickening.

EDIT: This is in no way a shot at PSU, they pretty much kicked OSU's butts all day defensively. This is a shot at the entire offensive philosophy that OSU has had under Tressel. The offense has never really moved the ball at will except for when Maurice Clarett was in there. They line up in a freaking shotgun with (what I thought were) really good receivers and they run the ball, yet they have like 5 FBs sitting on the bench. If you are going to spread it out, throw the damn ball. If not, line up under center and run it.

[Cicero]

Tressel is an avg OC at best. I think that he needs to step aside and let someone call the plays b/c tOSU has some serious talent and there is no need for them to score only 10 points 5-6 games into the season. They have a great WR in Holmes and great TE in Gonzales and they need to utilize them more. PSU played great though, but you got to feel for Hawk and the boys. They just be allowed to hit each offensive player w/ a bag full of nickels including JT.

[L45B]

I agree with mostly everything above. I think Troy Smith is a wild card quarterback-- a guy that can win you games with big plays (see Michigan last year) and lose you games with stupid mistakes (see last week).

Either way, our weapons on offense (Holmes, Gonzales, Ginn, Hall) are not being utilized. We all saw how "Tresselball" won us a national title in '02. But that relies on a solid running game, lights-out defense, and a quarterback who doesn't make critical mistakes. We've got one out of three right now.

Tressel needs to either:
a) Refocus his offensive recruiting solely on guys who can run with a football, block for a guy who can run with a football, or hand the ball off to a guy who can run with a football (Barry Alvarez could be a great consigliere).

--or--

b) Continue recruiting top level talent at WR/TE and actually hire an offensive coordinator who knows how to get the most out of it.

[buckeye_in_sc]

I vote option 3 BOTH OF THEM...


to recruit the players tOSU has and not win games due to your offensive ineptness is beyond reproach...asking for some consistency is not bitching or whining in my book...

go back to 93-98 with the Walt Harris, Tim Salem, Mike Jacobs offenses...they ran the same 4 or 5 formations and did a multitude of things out of those formations...

they ran I formation with a TE and 2 WR's, they ran the Split Back with a TE and 2 WR's, they ran split back with 3 WR's, and occassionaly they ran a heavy type package with two TE's...they probably ran a few more formations but these were the bulk...they also utilized the backs out of the backfield and threw underneath a lot to the TE, especially in goal line situations or critical situations...they ran the same thing over and over and over...they rarely scored below 20+ points (save for a few michigan games, wisconsin games, and of course the 94 PSU game)...they brought it offensively every week just about...

the biggest difference in my mind between this year and recent years and the mid to late 90's is attitude...tOSU had the notion they were going to score everytime they got the ball...now the attitude is...better get at least 1 first down so we can keep our stellar defense off the field...those guys need a break...

look at USC over the past couple of years...same scheme every week and no one has been able to stop them from scoring...look at Nebraska in the 90's (sup Shaz and THE REAL BRAD) same thing every week and no one could stop it...FSU in the 90's same scheme every week...

could you imagine USC with tOSU's defense! Do you not think Carroll, Stoops, etc would love to have guys like Holmes, Ginn, etc? I mean do something with them or fucking just recruit a bunch of brainy crackers and turn yourself into Northwestern...

again...rant over I guess...FUCK ME RUNNING...

[PSUFAN]

One observation - they need to look at that blocking scheme they were in for the final drive. The TE was overmatched - badly.

Again - having a QB who can hit open guys makes all of the difference. Perhaps PSU had good downfield coverage...but I suspect guys were getting open to a certain degree. PSU's zone is anything but impenetrable.

There is amazing talent on the OSU roster. I hate to say it, but I think an insistence on an inconsistent QB is holding you back. Certainly that was my evaluation of Robinson headed into the Big 10 conference games...but he has shown some improvement and senior resolve the past few weeks.

[buckeye_in_sc]

^^^^

gets it...

we have the 2005 version of Stanley Jackson...PSU was rushing 4 and dropping 6-7 a lot of times...if you can't find any open receiver in a zone...then you are a fucking waste...at any rate the PSU DB's in a lot of situations were playing 5-6 yards off the OSU WR's...that in and of itself should have allowed a tunnel or bubble screen...quick slant, etc...

Smith while as athletic as hell can't read through his progressions enough...now the people who coach tOSU are much more knowledgeable and have access to wider angle film and what not...perhaps they had the right plays called and the offense didn't execute...it sucks to waste such a great defensive performance...

[PSUFAN]

All I know is that one of the most impressive coaching performances I have ever seen - the 2002 win over Miami in the Fiesta - came from OSU's staff. They flat-out kicked ass in that game. I suspect that there are some execution woes.

PSU was unable to beat such a zone against OSU in the 2002 game. Mills was fairly accurate, but he went against 5-8 pass defenders for almost an entire half, and eventually he broke down and made critical mistakes. In his case, he was physically unable to throw the ball fast enough to receivers open in the zone.

Smith is strong enough, but either he wasn't seeing the receivers, or they weren't helping him by running good routes, and staying on the move after the routes ended. If you have a stong, accurate QB, then receivers don't need a lot of room. An extreme example would be Brady, who seems to be able to get the ball quickly to just barely open guys with alarming consistency.

Imagine PSU or OSU with an accurate QB - the talent is there to throw to. Both teams are using guys who have underdeveloped QB instincts...which has both positive and negative consequences.