The BCS Debate Thread

Terry in Crapchester · Mon Nov 28, 2005 7:52 pm

Fwiw, I'm not the only one projecting ND and Oregon in the Fiesta Bowl.

http://www.sportsline.com/collegefootba ... redictions

Van · Post by **Van** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 8:01 pm

That'd be a funny one, an Oregon/ND match up...

No matter who wins that one detractors of that program will simply say, "Big deal. We all knew <the loser> was overrated anyway. Really, who did <the loser> really beat this year? Looking at <the loser>, even with this win, c'mon, who did <the winner> really beat this year?"

That's a no win situation for both teams, excepting of course the payout involved...

Oregon and their one loss to USC, I still think they're going to get tossed in favor of the two loss Domers and Buckeyes.

Hell, records aside, I'd rather see OSU-ND. That'd be a bowl game pairing of two traditional giants I'm not sure we've ever seen before.

Have those two ever met before?

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 8:06 pm

Van wrote:Hell, records aside, I'd rather see OSU-ND. That'd be a bowl game pairing of two traditional giants I'm not sure we've ever seen before.

Have those two ever met before?

4 times, 2-2 series total. Most recently in '95 and '96. OSU won both games.

Degenerate · Post by **Degenerate** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 8:10 pm

Van wrote: Hell, records aside, I'd rather see OSU-ND. That'd be a bowl game pairing of two traditional giants I'm not sure we've ever seen before.

Have those two ever met before?

Well, you have to go way back to the last century, circa 1996, long before you or I were born. Word is that the Buckeye faithful got wind of their school's road win by Pony Express.

Van · Post by **Van** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 8:12 pm

Killian wrote:
Van wrote:Hell, records aside, I'd rather see OSU-ND. That'd be a bowl game pairing of two traditional giants I'm not sure we've ever seen before.

Have those two ever met before?
4 times, 2-2 series total. Most recently in '95 and '96. OSU won both games.

Were any of these bowl games or were they regular season games? That's what I was asking, ie, have they ever met in a bowl game before?

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 8:13 pm

No bowl game. Two games in the '30's and two in the '90's.

PSUFAN · Post by **PSUFAN** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 8:14 pm

Van, drop this in your bookmarks:

http://www.cfbdatawarehouse.com

Terry in Crapchester · Mon Nov 28, 2005 8:16 pm

Van wrote:Hell, records aside, I'd rather see OSU-ND. That'd be a bowl game pairing of two traditional giants I'm not sure we've ever seen before.

Have those two ever met before?

A home-and-home in '95 and '96. tOSU won both. :twisted: IIRC, those are the only times in my lifetime they've met. Strange, considering that both schools have such tradition and the campuses are relatively close (about 250 miles or so).

Interestingly, in '95 and '96, ND dropped Michigan and Michigan State in both years in favor of Northwestern and tOSU. ND also dropped Stanford, another traditional opponent, in both years, and Pittsburgh, a fourth traditional ND opponent, in '95 but not '96. Strange schedule those years.

Van · Post by **Van** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 8:22 pm

So it's been ten years since they've met at all and they've never met in a bowl game...

Yep, just as a fan, gimme a BCS pairing of OSU/ND over Oregon vs Anybody.

That is, unless we can somehow overlook Cal's numerous losses this year in order to grant all of us another Oregon/Cal match up. Win or lose, Cal still has to be considered for the BCS, the title and inclusion into a John Facenda voice over project comparing 'em to the '85 Bears...

Chicago Bears, mind you...

:-)

Van · Post by **Van** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 8:23 pm

PSUFAN wrote:Van, drop this in your bookmarks:

http://www.cfbdatawarehouse.com

Done. Thanks.

Why do I suddenly feel all warm and Dinsy...

Terry in Crapchester · Mon Nov 28, 2005 8:51 pm

Van wrote:
PSUFAN wrote:Van, drop this in your bookmarks:

http://www.cfbdatawarehouse.com
Done. Thanks.

Why do I suddenly feel all warm and Dinsy...

Van, considering our discussion about BC earlier . . .

I did some research at that site. Turns out of our all-time opponents, if you limit those who have a minimum of ten games against ND all-time, BC is tied for the fourth all-time best record against ND:

1. Michigan 18-14-1 (includes this year)
2. Nebraska 8-7-1
3. Penn State 8-8-1
4 (tie). Boston College 7-9
4 (tie). Wisconsin 6-8-2

http://www.cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/di ... onents.php

That's some pretty elite company.

Van · Post by **Van** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 9:09 pm

It's also mostly a product of circumstance. It simply results not so much from B.C.'s historical excellence as to when they played ND.

Many of those B.C. wins came only recently, during a very down era in ND football.

If ND played BC every year like USC or Navy that number would be tilted much more heavily in ND's favor...

Spinach Genie · Post by **Spinach Genie** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 9:12 pm

Yeah...cool site. According to its numbers, the SEC is 61-38-7 against the PAC.

BODE! :wink:

Terry in Crapchester · Mon Nov 28, 2005 9:30 pm

Van wrote:It's also mostly a product of circumstance. It simply results not so much from B.C.'s historical excellence as to when they played ND.

Many of those B.C. wins came only recently, during a very down era in ND football.

If ND played BC every year like USC or Navy that number would be tilted much more heavily in ND's favor...

True, but for that matter, Penn State benefitted from playing a good chunk of its series against ND during the Gerry Faust era, as well as the first year of Lou Holtz' tenure, when ND was still 5-6 and Penn State won the national championship.

I'm not saying BC is an excellent program, btw, but I think anyone would have a hard time finding another team that gets more motivated for a particular opponent than BC does for us.

Terry in Crapchester · Mon Nov 28, 2005 9:33 pm

Back to the topic at hand. Another dagger for the ND haters: Rutgers accepted a bid to the Insight Bowl.

http://sports.yahoo.com/ncaaf/news;_ylt ... &type=lgns

Could be wrong about this, but I don't think the Insight would have invited Rutgers if they thought there was a chance ND would fall out of the BCS and into the Gator Bowl. In that case, they could have Louisville, a better program than Rutgers.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 9:40 pm

And Louisville is already accepted an invite to the Gator.

Terry in Crapchester · Mon Nov 28, 2005 10:12 pm

Killian wrote:And Louisville is already accepted an invite to the Gator.

Did not know that, thanks.

All the more reason to project ND headed to the BCS. No question the Gator would much rather have ND than Louisville. If any bowl had an incentive to wait to extend its invitation, it was the Gator.

Have the Capital One and Holiday Bowls extended invites yet? Those bowls get the #2 team in the Big Ten and Pac-10, respectively.

SoCalTrjn · Post by **SoCalTrjn** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 2:33 am

Van wrote:
SoCalTrjn wrote:A plus one bowl is as bad of an idea people expecting computers to name a national champion. Youre going to give teams 5-7 weeks to prepare for their BCS bowl which is essentially the semi finals and then 1 week to prepare for the finals?
If youre going to go with a play off, go all the way
Why on earth must we give them 5-7 weeks for the first game? They only get about a month now and everybody seems fine with it.

So, so what? What's one extra week, especially when it's only for two teams?

All Plus One entails is keeping the exact same system we have now and adding one extra game for only two teams. It answers any and all controversies and how much simpler could it be? No huge system overhauls would be necessary, no thorough restructuring of the bowl games would be necessary and no new asinine playoff system involving a bunch of unworthy teams would be necessary.

There'd simply be one final game pitting USC against Auburn. Plain as the nose on your face, that's all that's needed and nothing could be easier.

Penn States last game was November 19th and the orange Bowl is January 3rd, more than 6 weeks after their last game... so you give them 6 weeks to prepare for their semifinal game and then they only get 1 week to prepare for the title game if they were to reach it. Doesnt make sense. if youre going to have a plus one game for all the marbles youll need to hold it maybe the Saturday before the Super Bowl so the teams would have as long to prepare for it as they did a game that meant less. Then push signing day to March 1st?
Exams are the second week of December and then you have 4 weeks off from class.

Van · Post by **Van** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 3:30 am

SC's last game is in early December so it'd only be about four weeks for them and we're only talking about inconveniencing two teams in the entire nation. That's nothing compared to the time demands of NCAA hoops or baseball.

One week later or the Saturday before the Super Bowl, either one would be fine.