Saban - Alabama far from a Dead Deal

MuchoBulls · Post by **MuchoBulls** » Thu Dec 14, 2006 4:17 pm

Sudden Sam wrote:
Jsc810 wrote:Poor ol' Mal has painted himself into a corner with his "We want a head coach who's won consistently" crap. Let's see...who did Oklahoma hire to get out of their funk? Oh, yeah. The D coordinator at a school with a great head coach.

Mal has to be under a tremendous deal of stress. I just put him in my 2007 death pool.

SoCalTrjn · Post by **SoCalTrjn** » Thu Dec 14, 2006 9:01 pm

Bama will go after Sylvester Croom, he's a Bama guy and likely the only one dumb enough to want the Red Sea coaching job

Adelpiero · Post by **Adelpiero** » Thu Dec 14, 2006 10:05 pm

gary pinkel

he's taken Mizzou to 3 straight bowl games. just think what he could do with 4-5 star talent.

do it, he's a great coach

:wink:

peter dragon · Post by **peter dragon** » Thu Dec 14, 2006 10:42 pm

what about ohio coach Solich

all he's done is win the mac with Ohio. that is mighty impressive
plus a bowl game!

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Fri Dec 15, 2006 12:43 am

Central Michigan won the MAC, actually. They beat Ohio.

Solich is a good coach for a mid-major team or a crappy major conference team. Come to think of it, yeah, he'd be a great fit at Bama. They're a program that is washed up. The only success they've had in the last 20 years or so was due to the fact that they were cheating (kinda like USC).

If I were Alabama's AD, I'd probably go after someone like Bo Pelini. Who else can they realistically get? No one wants that job. It's a horrible job. Like I said, Bama is done. Stick a fork in them.

King Crimson · Post by **King Crimson** » Fri Dec 15, 2006 6:31 am

i don't know if there's any truth to it.....but i've heard rumors around Colorado that Air Force might be interested in Solich when Fisher DeBerry (finally) steps down (which OUGHT to be soon). Fisher has done a great, great job at AFA but he's running on fumes these days....

but, anyway, Frankie seems like a guy who could do well at a service academy.

but, back on topic....Bama is in a hiring mess unless they've got a rabbit in a hat.

King Crimson · Post by **King Crimson** » Fri Dec 15, 2006 6:17 pm

King Crimson wrote:i don't know if there's any truth to it.....but i've heard rumors around Colorado that Air Force might be interested in Solich when Fisher DeBerry (finally) steps down (which OUGHT to be soon). Fisher has done a great, great job at AFA but he's running on fumes these days....
.

amazingly, the local sports radio is reporting DeBerry stepping down today. weird. though, i don't imply this has any bearing on my claim about the Solich rumors.

Mississippi Neck · Post by **Mississippi Neck** » Fri Dec 15, 2006 6:40 pm

SoCalTrjn wrote:Bama will go after Sylvester Croom, he's a Bama guy and likely the only one dumb enough to want the Red Sea coaching job

Why? Because he's done so much at Miss. State?

MuchoBulls · Post by **MuchoBulls** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 1:35 pm

This is very interesting:

Shady dealings at Alabama

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 3:32 pm

If I were Bama (or any other big name school), I'd start making a run at Ferentz. I mean, throw-money-at-him-like-Saban type of run. I know he is very loyal to Iowa but I think he is finding it increasingly more difficult to pull skill position players to the middle of Iowa. If you look at Iowa's recent recruiting classes, they have struggled greatly to get kids at the skill positions (CB/WR, etc.). Ferentz isn't going to get Iowa to the next level without those players and those type of kids are crawling around the state of Alabama.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 4:11 pm

Are you on crack, Killian?

We're loaded with good young WR's. The problem this year was all of our good WR's are just that.....young or redshirting. Shit, Dominique Douglas just set Iowa freshman receiving yards and he was a true freshman. Trey Stross was a 4-star recruit and he'll be a sophomore next year. Throw in James Cleveland and Paul Chaney, who redshirted this year, and the weapons Jake has to throw to in the future is insane. We are stacked with 3 good RB's. We're about to land a 4-star safety (Jordan Bernstein), and some 4-star CB decommitted from Georgia Tech and looks like we're about to get him. Our QB for next year is one of the best young QB's in the nation.

As for Ferentz to Alabama. If they even called him, he'd laugh in their face. Why would he want to take a step down financially? We're paying him $4 million per year, more than most NFL jobs. Not only that but Iowa is a better program. We don't have to cheat to win. Bama hasn't done a damn thing without cheating in the past 20 years or more.

Geez, we have one down year and all of a sudden people think we're done in for.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 5:03 pm

It's not insane, it's very, very average.

Let's take a look at the "loaded WR's" that Iowa brought in in the last 3 classes:

Dominique Douglas - 2 Star
Anthony Bowman - 3 Star
Paul Chaney - 2 Star
James Cleveland - 3 Star
Trey Stoss - 4 Star
Marcus Wilson - 3 Star
Andy Brodell - 3 Star

So you have one 4 star, three 3 stars, and two 2 stars. I would hardly call that "loaded".

Let's look at the CB's signed by Iow in the last 3 years:

Amari Spievey - 2 Star
Charles Godfrey - 2 Star
Adam Shada - 3 Star

There was a 4 Star JUCO, but that's it as far as CB recruiting goes. I'm sure there were other players that were recruited that were turned into CB's, but taking that into consideration, Iowa has 3 players in the last 3 years that are 4 stars who would be considerd players at skill positions. Christensen, Stoss and RB Kalvin Bailey. This is all taken from Scout.com. Also add in that Iowa's pipeline to IL has been hurt by Weis and Zook (fucking cheater), and the results will get even harder to obtain.

And I think 10 years, $57 million is more than $4 million a year. My math may be off, though. And he would make more money with speaking engagements by being introduced as "Alabama Head Coach, Kirk Ferentz" than as "Iowa Head Coach, Kirk Ferentz".

Don't kid yourself about being the better program, either. Alabama will always be a good job with national recognition. Iowa will be Iowa. A solid job in a good conference.

buckeye_in_sc · Post by **buckeye_in_sc** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 5:28 pm

IOWA is loaded?

Sin,

38-17

Be careful guys even if they come in as 1 star recruits they leave as part of a 22 man strong 1st round draft pool...

I mean Iowa had a SR QB, a decent running back and young WR's but I seem to recall their TE being pretty damn good and that all amounted to a 6-6 record.

Let's see tOSU had Robiskie and Hartline making HUGE plays all year as red shirt freshman as well as Chris Wells as a freshman making one SWEET ass run against Michigan. Plus let's not forget that tOSU started NINE new fucking people on defense...most sophs, redshirt Frosh, or redshirt soph's and they seemed to have played very well.

Mario Manningham at Michigan last year was a true freshman correct? What about some of the other guys around the country Ray Rice, Slaton, etc they are all young...oh McFadden at Arkansas is a sophmore with a sophmore QB and a true freshman who started for a few games and they are going to the Cap One Bowl. Perhaps Ferentz should either look for a new gig or start recruiting some of Iowa's best women to block for all these skill players...

just sayin

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 6:00 pm

Believe the Heupel wrote:I'd actually like to see a link to Ferentz being paid $4 mill per. Last I heard Stoops and Carrol were top dogs in the college pay scale and they were making about $3.5 mill. I'm not sure Iowa has the dedication to football to even be in the same zip code as USC and OU when it comes to coach salary.

I know Weis is up there as well after they re-worked his deal.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 8:33 pm

Sudden Sam wrote:I've heard for years what a genius Ferentz is, yet his teams consistently underachieve. I don't think anyone down here would be remotely interested in him.

His teams underachieve because despite what JON wants you to believe, they lack the talent at most skill positions to consistantly compete. However, they are always solid along both lines. The skill position issue would correct its self if he were at a bigger school.

peter dragon · Post by **peter dragon** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 9:57 pm

tressel is looking at about 1.4 or 1.5 million. If they win another NC I think he deserves a raise...

http://www.centralohio.com/ohiostate/st ... 96675.html

oh and 'Frentz is a tool. why would any one want to leave a pink lockerroom Iwoa?

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 11:15 pm

Ferentz is the 3rd highest paid coach in terms of guaranteed money at $2.7 million. In fact, he's making $200,000 per year guaranteed more than Stoops, which is funny considering all I heard from OU fans is that we could never keep a coach like Stoops because we couldn't afford him.

As for what he really makes......it's basically $4 million and I believe that makes him the highest paid coach. Really, he's guaranteed $4 million but they claim the other $1.3 million or so are "incentives." But if you read into those incentives it's really a pay raise. Basically, all he has to do to earn that cash is get to the Alamo Bowl or better and graduate a decent amount of his players. We almost always get to at least that bowl game and graduate a high amount of players. So, calling those "incentives" is silly. It's to be expected. Hidden pay raise is all it is.

Killian,

Stars are overrated. Ladell Betts was a 2-star running back. Now he's becoming one of the best RB's in the NFL. Dallas Clark was a 1-star LB recruit. Bob Sanders, Ed Hinkel, Robert Gallery, Eric Steinbach, Bruce Nelson, Clinton Solomon, etc......all 2-star recruits. You bring up Dominique Douglas. When all is said and done he very well might hold every Iowa receiving record. Since you jerk off to stars......Trey Stross happens to be a 4-star recruit. He's only a freshman. Tony Moeaki was a 4-star recruit. He's a sophomore and will be starting at TE next year.

Our WR's next year are Douglas (and forget the number of stars he had, dude has already proven to be a diamond in the rough), and Trey Stross (a 4-star recruit). James Cleveland was a high 3-star recruit out of Texas, he'll be our #3 WR. Throw in 4-star recruit Tony Moeaki at TE along with incoming 4-star recruit Christian Ballard. Then, our RB's are 4-star recruit Albert Young (1,300 yards as a sophomore was injured this year), Damian Sims (who is averaging over 5 YPC in his 3 year career), and 4-star recruit Shonn Greene (although he's likely to move to safety). Our O-line will have a LT that was a 5-star recruit, a 4-star center, and a 5 star RT. Throw in Brian Bulaga, an incoming 5-star recruit that has a chance to get PT at RG immediately.

Our Quarterback was a 4-star recruit and was part of that Elite 11 camp as a HS senior. John Clay, one of the top RB's in the country is close to committing (from what I'm hearing). He'll have a shot to start in 2008.

Defensively, yeah, we've struggled to get cornerbacks. But other than that, we've done pretty good. Jordan Berstein, from Des Moines, is likely to commit soon. He's a high 4-star safety. We landed Jeremiah Hunter last year, a 4-star LB, who has a good shot to start next year. The D-line has been banged up, and that's been their problem but we have some proven guys that were pretty good recruits including Adrian Clayborn (redshirted last year), Ryan Bain, and Alex Kanelis. Throw in proven veterans like Brian Mattison and All-American candidate (when healthy) Ken Iwebema, and that's a pretty good line.

We do have a 4-star CB recruit that decommitted from Georgia Tech from what I'm told (don't know the name as I do not follow recruiting that much until they actually commit). It sounds like we have a very good chance of getting him.

And no way in frickin' hell is Alabama paying a coach $56 million over 10 years. No way, no how.

Iowa is more than a SOLID job. Give me a break. You get paid as well as anyone, you have a 70,000 seat stadium that sells out every week. You have the funding for whatever you want. You have great tradition. Maybe not Michigan or tOSU's tradition, but the level right below that. It's a program that has unlimited potential, but there will be bumps in the road (see 2006). The conference is great, the recruiting base is decent. It's better than solid. Calling Bama a better program is a load of crap. They have more HISTORY than Iowa, but that is exactly what it is.......history. Like I said earlier, it's a dead program. If it were as good of a program as you say it is, they'd be able to have success in the past 20 years or so without cheating and coaches would be jumping at the opportunity to take the job instead of turning it down left and right to stay at places like West Virginia.

Iowa > Alabma
Alabama = Finished.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 11:26 pm

Okay, just flipped through....

Sam, you didn't seriously just say Ferentz teams consistently underachieve, did you????

This year, yes they underachieved. But that's it. Last year they were just overrated. It wasn't underachieving. We lost 4-starters on the D-line and 3 on the O-line. What us Iowa fans learned is just how important it is to have experience on the lines. Games are won and lost there. So there was nothing we could do. But still, we made it to a New Year's Day Bowl even with those problems.

Going back to some old CFB Preview Mags, this is how we were picked since 2001....

2001....No bowl predicted. Ended up winning Alamo Bowl.
2002...."Lost too many seniors to contend in the Big-10." Won Big-10 title and made it to a BCS Bowl
2003...."Lost too many seniors...." Won 10 games including a new years day bowl.
2004...."Inexperienced QB......" Finished in Top 10 for 3rd straight year including a victory over LSU in New Years day Bowl.
2005-2006..... You could argue we underachieved in both those years but I disagree with 2005.

But yeah, we're consistently underachieving obviously!!

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 11:30 pm

Sam,

One other thing..... I 100% agree with the cheating thing. But that doesn't make it right to cheat because other schools are doing it. Sure, schools like USC, Ohio State, Tennessee, Florida State......they've been cheating for years and problably done far worse than Alabama. But that still doesn't take away from the fact that Bama's only success over the last 20 years has been basically due to cheating. It's just a shame that the NCAA only comes down on schools like Alabama but let's their cash cows Ohio State and USC get off scott free. What a joke.

peter dragon · Post by **peter dragon** » Mon Dec 18, 2006 11:45 pm

TheJON wrote:Sam,

One other thing..... I 100% agree with the cheating thing. But that doesn't make it right to cheat because other schools are doing it. Sure, schools like USC, Ohio State, Tennessee, Florida State......they've been cheating for years and problably done far worse than Alabama. But that still doesn't take away from the fact that Bama's only success over the last 20 years has been basically due to cheating. It's just a shame that the NCAA only comes down on schools like Alabama but let's their cash cows Ohio State and USC get off scott free. What a joke.

Where did OSU cheat? LINK?

L45B · Post by **L45B** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 12:05 am

peter dragon wrote:Where did OSU cheat? LINK?

That page cannot be displayed at the moment, due to the fact that Jon=Bitch.

Sky · Post by **Sky** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 2:47 am

TheJON wrote:2002...."Lost too many seniors to contend in the Big-10." Won Big-10 title and made it to a BCS Bowl

Hey fucko, do you want to clarify that statment? You shared the Big10 title, you couln't beat your in-state rival (again), and you got embarassed by USC.

Plus, where do you get these predictions of past seasons. Were these the things you and your Uncle Rico talked about during special time? If this is how you have to validate your team you have some problems.

On the cheating note, you can't blame tOSU, USC, FL, etc for cheating--how else are we supposed to compete with Iowa's NFL roster?

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 2:29 pm

JON,

See if you can follow me here. I said that Alabama and other big time schools should start to make a run at Ferentz because he may have reached a plateau at Iowa because of the difficulty to lure elite skill position players, specifically WR and CB, to Iowa. I guess I never actually typed the work "elite", so you got me there. But I figured it was implied seeing as how most difference makers in college at these positions were elite players in high school.

You then went on to tell everyone about Iowa's WR corps being "loaded with good young WR's" and then rattled off a bunch of names that most people outside of Iowa have never heard. Later on, you decided to tell us about all of the elite talent that Iowa has gotten on the offensive line, at TE, on the defensive line and at linebacker.

How does that relate to my original point about WR and CB? There are only so many sleepers a team can take. I fully understand Iowa's track record of developing unheralded players and turning them into productive college players, but do you understand how much more time it takes to find, evaluate, and recruit these "sleepers"? And most of these guys are sleepers for a reason, they usually suck ass in high school. Every team will have a sleeper now and then, or even a run of them like Iowa has had. But to get to the next level and play with the upper level teams, you have to start landing difference makers at the skill positions, not just solid guys. All of the guys you listed are solid players. How many of those guys would have gotten a sniff of an offer or early playing time from teams in the top 5-10? I'm guessing none of them, with the exception of Stoss.

And let's look at some of the other things you talked about:

John Clay - I would be surprised if he didn't end up at Wisconsin, and even more surprised if he actually qualified. Rumor is his core gpa is about a 1.8.

Ladell Betts - He is not becoming one of the best RB's in the NFL. Perhaps one of the best back-ups, but not one of the best RB's. There are many ahead of him.

Jake Christensen - I know you like little Jakey, but he is not one of the best young QB's in the nation. That would be like me saying Evan Sharpley is one of the best young QB's in the nation. He was also a 4 star recruit and was invited to the Army All-American game, but couldn't go because of stupid Michigan High School rules. He may be a very good QB, but you nor I have any idea.

As far as the Alabama job compared to the Iowa job, take your black and yellow glasses off for a moment and think about it. Alabama is in a similar situation as Notre Dame was a few years ago. They are down, but they are one great coach away from reaking havoc. The same cannot be said for Iowa, because they have their great coach and they are a solid Big 10 team. As far as fan support goes, it's not even close. I doubt there are many people in Iowa who have Frey's or Kinnick's birthday memorized and celebrate it each year. And I doubt the lunatic fringe (whatever the fuck you called it) would think that the terrorists purposly picked a specific date for an attack to fuck with their birthday like some Bama fans think they did with September 11th.

Iowa is Arkansas of the Big 10. They will come up and have a nice little run of a couple of years where they are a very good football team, and then fall back down to the 8-4 type level. Alabama is more on par with PSU, UofM or OSU. One good coach and they immedietly become a national power.

MuchoBulls · Post by **MuchoBulls** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 6:04 pm

Sudden Sam wrote:Recruiting at Bama is still very healthy, even after all the crap that's gone on for the last ten years.

Are you sure about that? The fact that a new head coach has not been hired, nor does one seem to be imminently hired cannot be a good thing. How can a recruit believe what Shula's assistant are saying when they don't even know if they will remain on the staff?

Marve is definitely not going to 'Bama now that Shula is out.

McClain, who was strongly considering the Tide, committed to USF.

I'm sure others have to be wavering too at this point.

MuchoBulls · Post by **MuchoBulls** » Tue Dec 19, 2006 6:41 pm

Sudden Sam wrote:
MuchoBulls wrote:There are a lot of kids, even today, who would go to Bama if I was named head coach!

You're probably not too far down the list at this point :wink:

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 4:29 pm

Killian,

Your points are made and I see where you're coming from. But answer me this question..... If Bama is such a great job, why the problem of hiring a coach? Coaches would be lined up for a so-called "elite program." Trust me, if Ferentz leaves, the candiate pool will be MUCH larger than Alabama's. I still think it's a possibility Ferentz gets the Steelers job when Cowher steps down in a few weeks. I can tell you with confidence that the coach we bring in will have a big national name and will be paid BETTER than Alabama.

Iowa is not Arkansas. We've had far greater success than them. Iowa is a very good program. Say what you want, but 90% of the programs out there wish they were Iowa right now. That's not me and my "black and yellow blinders" saying that. It's a fact. Alabama is NOT a coach away from reaking havoc. You are overrating them. Comparing them to ND is ridiculous. You know I hate Notre Dame, but when I think of College Football that's one of the teams that's always popped into my head. Alabama has never been that. They do NOT have a national name anymore. 20 years ago.....sure. But that's dead. Unless they were to land a coach like Pete Carrol, they aren't gonna get the recruits you think they will but the same could be said about any program that lands a coach like that. Come on.....look at the area. Tennessee, Georgia, Florida, Florida State, LSU.....those are ALL better programs than Alabama. Too much competition.

Face it, Killian, Bama is done. That swagger they used to have is long gone. Bear Bryant ain't comin' back. Neither is Gene Stallings.

As for Iowa.....

You are way off base. Of course no one has heard of our WR's......they're all freshmen. Like I said, Trey Stross was one of the top WR recruits in the nation 2 years ago. He'll be a sophomore. Our #1 WR is Dominique Douglas and who gives a fuck how many stars he had? Like I said, he's already proven to be a diamond in the rough. Dude was one of the top freshmen WR's in the nation. Shit, he was our best offensive player this year. I've seen James Cleveland play in practice enough that he has the talent to be a big-time receiver. Now, I know, practice is just that.....practice. So you never know how he'll do in a game until he gets on the field, but he definitely has the physical skills to be a great WR.

If you think our problem has been skill position players the last couple of years, you are not even close to being right. The problem has been 2 things......injuries and the Offensive and Defensive lines. We've been either young or banged up at both positions. We're losing games at the line of scrimmage. Every game we lost in the last couple years had NOTHING to do with speed and skill players but EVERYTHING to do with getting our asses kicked up front. Injuries and inexperience will absolutely KILL you on the offensive and defensive lines.

As for Jake. I've seen enough of him in practice and in the game he started against Northern Illinois to know he has all the tools. And it's evident already that he has a lot more respect with his team than Drew Tate did these last couple of years. He has a great arm, shows great poise in the pocket, and throws a very good deep ball with good touch on it. Am I annointing him the next Chuck Long? No. But I can say for certainty, he is the most talented QB Iowa has EVER had. Now he has to go prove it on the field.

buckeye_in_sc · Post by **buckeye_in_sc** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 7:16 pm

^^^^^^^^^

Come on sam Iowa can't touch bama because there are 22 first round picks every year on Iowa's squad...so they are all worried about going to the league...

Iowa blows...Ferentz hasn't shown dick...yeah they went 11-2 in 2002 WOW...what have they done since then? won what an average of 8-9 games...wow...yeah you are right teams like NCSU, Vandy, NW, Baylor would love to be Iowa but I would guess that

USC
Michigan
Bama
Miami
FSU
tOSU
PSU
WVU
Louisville
ND
LSU
Tenn
Arkansas
FLA
Auburn
KAL
OU
Texas
A&M
Wisconsin
Va Tech

and the list goes on and on would just be good with who THEY are which are much better programs than Iowa...

there are what 119 Division 1 schools so Jon is saying roughly 107 of them would love to be Iowa? Does Iowa want to be like Iowa?

So 107 schools would love to be 6-6 and staring a bowl date with Texas down the barrel...right...or they might want to be 8-4 and losing in a pathetic effort to FLA in the Outback bowl...

Face it Iowa will be at best an average Big 10 team for the foreseeable future...if you don't think so then you got problems...right now tOSU, Michigan, PSU, and Wisconsin are better and will continue to be better oh and doesn't IU have bode on you as well...HOLY SHIT...

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 9:14 pm

I do not think Iowa is an elite program, I think there's potential for that. With that said, it's a very good program and 90% of the schools out there wish they had our facilities, tradition, success, and fan base.

5 Big-10 titles since 1981. 20 bowl games since 1981. 15 times finished in the Top 25 since '81. And a long list of players succeeding in the NFL. Etc...

Name me more than 12-13 programs that can top that.

buckeye_in_sc · Post by **buckeye_in_sc** » Wed Dec 20, 2006 11:21 pm

Well there are 20+ teams on my list...some off the top of my head that can match or exceed that of Idiots O Walking Around

Ohio State - NC in 2002, another potential NC this year, 60+ wins under Tressel, Cooper had the 2nd highest winning % of Big 10 coaches while he was there...finished #2 twice and won a Rose Bowl and a Sugar Bowl (the only 2 BCS Bowls they played in), Earle had a string of 9-3 seasons and a 5-4 record against Michigan. Lest we forget some of the outstanding pro's tOSU has put into the League, Orlando Pace, Chris Carter, Eddie George, Antoine Winfield, etc, etc

USC - Charles White, Ricky Ervins, Keyshawn, Leinert, Bush, sprinkle in a few Rose Bowls, a NC, plus a pretty good run of winning the Pac 10. Early 80's they were very good, mid 90's pretty deece, and recently outstanding.

Nebraska - yeah a couple of down years...but one of the greatest teams of all time 95 skers, sprinkle in 3 NC's, a long run of bowl appearances what 35 straight, very good NFL er's, etc, etc

FSU - Couple NC's, couple Heisman winners, tons of pros, carte blanche in the ACC for years...

need I go on or do you want this pilaging to continue?

Those 4 programs have somethings IOWA does not have:

NC
Heisman Winners
#1 overall picks in the draft

Fuck off...

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 3:13 pm

JON,

The bottome line is that your team is full of players that have to go beyond what is expected for them to be considered elite players. Teams who rely on such players typically don't succeed at a high level.

You know when a player looks good in practice, they are going against your team and there's a reason why some players are practice players. You never know until they hit the actual field.

As far a Alabama vs. Iowa, your debate is beyond asinine. Alabama has a NC in the last 15 years, bowl appearances, etc. Alabama is one of the teams that are thought of when you bring up College Football. Iowa is not. Your argument about why they can't attract a top flight coach is stupid. They had Fran when he was the "hot" name. They hired one of the best coaches in the game with Price, only to have him go Roll Tide on a stripper. Shula was a scramble hire and got the job beause of his connection to 'Bama and his name. Now, if they have a decent AD and search committee, they are taking their time. ND got hammered when looking for a coach because they were ND. Same with 'Bama. I bet no one outside of about 5-10 people actually know who the candidates for this job are. And a lot of shit goes on behind the sceens when looking for a new coach.

Iowa would have a deeper pool? You're out of your fucking mind. Ferentz may have a solid tree, but Alabama is a job that trancends coaching trees. Why would WVU alum Rich Rodriguez accept the job when he was already the HC at his alma matter? Because it's 'Bama. WVU had to scramble to keep him.

If 'Bama is doing this right, they will get a very good coach. And the more they get slammed and the less people know, the better chance that they are doing it right.

Cornhusker · Post by **Cornhusker** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 9:03 pm

TheJON wrote:Killian,

Your points are made and I see where you're coming from. But answer me this question..... If Bama is such a great job, why the problem of hiring a coach? Coaches would be lined up for a so-called "elite program." Trust me, if Ferentz leaves, the candiate pool will be MUCH larger than Alabama's. I still think it's a possibility Ferentz gets the Steelers job when Cowher steps down in a few weeks. I can tell you with confidence that the coach we bring in will have a big national name and will be paid BETTER than Alabama.

Iowa is not Arkansas. We've had far greater success than them. Iowa is a very good program. Say what you want, but 90% of the programs out there wish they were Iowa right now. That's not me and my "black and yellow blinders" saying that. It's a fact. Alabama is NOT a coach away from reaking havoc. You are overrating them. Comparing them to ND is ridiculous. You know I hate Notre Dame, but when I think of College Football that's one of the teams that's always popped into my head. Alabama has never been that. They do NOT have a national name anymore. 20 years ago.....sure. But that's dead. Unless they were to land a coach like Pete Carrol, they aren't gonna get the recruits you think they will but the same could be said about any program that lands a coach like that. Come on.....look at the area. Tennessee, Georgia, Florida, Florida State, LSU.....those are ALL better programs than Alabama. Too much competition.

Face it, Killian, Bama is done. That swagger they used to have is long gone. Bear Bryant ain't comin' back. Neither is Gene Stallings.

As for Iowa.....

You are way off base. Of course no one has heard of our WR's......they're all freshmen. Like I said, Trey Stross was one of the top WR recruits in the nation 2 years ago. He'll be a sophomore. Our #1 WR is Dominique Douglas and who gives a fuck how many stars he had? Like I said, he's already proven to be a diamond in the rough. Dude was one of the top freshmen WR's in the nation. Shit, he was our best offensive player this year. I've seen James Cleveland play in practice enough that he has the talent to be a big-time receiver. Now, I know, practice is just that.....practice. So you never know how he'll do in a game until he gets on the field, but he definitely has the physical skills to be a great WR.

If you think our problem has been skill position players the last couple of years, you are not even close to being right. The problem has been 2 things......injuries and the Offensive and Defensive lines. We've been either young or banged up at both positions. We're losing games at the line of scrimmage. Every game we lost in the last couple years had NOTHING to do with speed and skill players but EVERYTHING to do with getting our asses kicked up front. Injuries and inexperience will absolutely KILL you on the offensive and defensive lines.

As for Jake. I've seen enough of him in practice and in the game he started against Northern Illinois to know he has all the tools. And it's evident already that he has a lot more respect with his team than Drew Tate did these last couple of years. He has a great arm, shows great poise in the pocket, and throws a very good deep ball with good touch on it. Am I annointing him the next Chuck Long? No. But I can say for certainty, he is the most talented QB Iowa has EVER had. Now he has to go prove it on the field.

Please go to http://www.uiowafoundation.org/emails/iclub/

A periodic e-newsletter from the National I-Club
with news about the Iowa Hawkeyes and the I-Club
Dear Iowa Hawkeye Fan:

As the Hawkeye football team prepares to represent The University of Iowa at the Alamo Bowl on December 30, I'd like to take this opportunity to thank you for your support in 2006 for UI athletics!

We've had some great highlights this fall, made possible by loyal fans and dedicated student-athletes, coaches, and staff.

Of course, the Hawkeye football team took the field for its first season in the historic, renovated Kinnick Stadium, featuring the beautiful new Krause Family Plaza and Nile Kinnick statue. The field hockey team won the Big Ten tournament title and qualified to play in the NCAA championships. The men's and women's cross-country teams were nationally ranked all fall, and both competed in the NCAA championships.

Hawkeye student-athletes in every sport compete with determination and honor, knowing that Iowa fans are behind them. We look forward to your support at the Alamo Bowl in San Antonio, and to hearing your cheers at upcoming winter sports events (see details below). Thank you for your ongoing commitment to the black and gold. Best wishes during the holiday season. Go Hawks!

Matt Henderson
Executive Director, National I-Club

Someone need to tell this Matt the team colors are black and yellow.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 9:52 pm

No, our colors are black and gold. Why we call it "gold" is beyond me. But I have news for ya, just about every team that wears yellow calls it gold regardless of the sport. I always wondered why, but Iowa is one of 6,000 teams out there to claim their yellow uni's are gold. Not that I give a crap.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 10:01 pm

Killian,

You are dead wrong. I guarantee our pool of candidates if much larger and the hiring process is not carried out this long. Jim Leavitt would be my top choice because of his ties to Florida and he is a very good coach. It would take us less than 5 minutes to hire that guy. It would go like this "Jim, do you want the job?" "Sure, when do I start?" Don't think for a second that if we gave Brett Bielema a call, he'd turn us down. Iowa = Bielema's dream job. Don't believe me? Email him and ask. Mike Stoops, Chuck Long, Steve Kragthorpe, etc..... they'd all be given a look but most likely not get the job. There's tons of others too.

Bobby Stoops would have been hired but our AD at the time was a retard that wanted to interview other candidates. You may think that Stoops took the OU job because that's the one he wanted, but you would be factually incorrect. Stoops WANTED the Iowa job. In fact, when he was at Florida, he repeatedly said that he'd like to be the guy to replace Hayden Fry. Then we interviewed him, and he wanted the job. Unfortunately, Bowlsby decided to go interview a couple of shit candidates and then Oklahoma jumped in and offered him the job. While Iowa was dicking around interviewing other candidates, Stoops took the OU job. Good move on his part. But had Bowlsby not gone out interviewing other guys, Bob Stoops would be Iowa's head coach.....not OU's. That's not my Hawkeye homerism.....that's a fact.

MuchoBulls · Post by **MuchoBulls** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 2:09 pm

TheJON wrote:You are dead wrong. I guarantee our pool of candidates if much larger and the hiring process is not carried out this long. Jim Leavitt would be my top choice because of his ties to Florida and he is a very good coach. It would take us less than 5 minutes to hire that guy. It would go like this "Jim, do you want the job?" "Sure, when do I start?" Don't think for a second that if we gave Brett Bielema a call, he'd turn us down. Iowa = Bielema's dream job. Don't believe me? Email him and ask. Mike Stoops, Chuck Long, Steve Kragthorpe, etc..... they'd all be given a look but most likely not get the job. There's tons of others too.

Hate to break in to your little pissing match, but Coach Leavitt isn't going anywhere. He turned down Alabama twice after the 2002 (once before they hired Price and then once right after Price was fired), and he turned down Kansas State (where he came from before being hired at USF), who offered him more money and an equal number of years on the contract he has here.

The conversation would go a little something like this:

"Jim, do you want the job"

"Oh well, I really do appreciate the interest and I am honered, but USF is the place where I want to be. I'm from this area, my family lives here, and I have built this program from scratch. Thanks for the offer, but I am very happy at South Florida."

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 3:33 pm

Come on Mucho, don't you know that most coaches want to coach at Iowa? Hell, if they called Weis I'd be scared. I mean with all that offensive talent they have stockpiled and the fact they can pay him eleventy billion dollars, fuck. I'm already freaked out.

Spinach Genie · Post by **Spinach Genie** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 3:58 pm

Sudden Sam wrote:It's pretty funny to read all the "Alabama is finished", "Alabama will never be a power again", "Alabama had to cheat to win" crap. I thought this was a knowledgeable group in here, but, apparently, there are a bunch of folks who know very little about what they speak. Alabama, with a strong coach, will be back at the top of the SEC in no time. Recruiting at Bama is still very healthy, even after all the crap that's gone on for the last ten years.

Sam, it's not exactly coincidence so many of Bear's coaches have landed in trouble with the NCAA on down the road. Bear got away with a lot in this state and "The Machine" protected a way of doing business that is no longer possible in modern college football. Alabama plays in the strongest football conference in the nation. No longer can Bear recruit away hoardes of regional talent and bench them safely out of everyone else's hands. The playing field has leveled, and until the powers that be in Alabama come to terms with the fact the 70s will never come again, that team will struggle. Regardless of who they eventually sign as head coach, they have been absolutely embarassed in the national media for about the third or fourth time over a coaching search. Whoever takes the position is going to have to deal with the multitude of rich boosters and politics vying for control of the football program, and that will and has chased off some prime head coaching possibilities. As the 70s fades further into the history books, fewer kids are growing up with crimson starry eyes. "Tradition" isn't enough anymore. They want playing time, exposure and development. They want stability. Outside of playing time, Alabama currently has little of any to offer. Lately, Auburn has been beating Alabama in in-state recruiting. Given the proportion of Auburn fans to Alabama fans in this state, that's pretty remarkable. Regionally, Alabama is fighting recruiting battles with more recent national champions in Florida, LSU and Tennessee. As this coaching search shuffles on, they're losing recruits and reputation with high school coaches. Shula recruited a lot of talent, yes, but so did Auburn, Georgia, Florida, LSU and most of the other teams on Alabama's schedule year in and year out. Head to head, Alabama lost some hard fought games. They're coming off probation, a coaching carousel and a ten win season and they fire another coach. How many coaches want to walk into that? How many players parents and coaches want to send their kid into that kind of instability?

Alabama will be competitive again, I have little doubt, but on top of the SEC in "no time"? Something major is going to have to change before that happens.

Have a good Christmas, Sam!

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 9:19 pm

Don't get me wrong, I like to see USF do well. They're really building something there. But once the right job comes open offering up a lot of cash Leavitt is gone. Alabama is not a good job anymore mostly because of the fans. Why do you think Franchione bolted so quickly? No coach wants that job. Fans are much more reasonable at Iowa and we would pay Leavitt as much or more than Bama. Leavitt is a former Fry/Ferentz assistant. He knows the Iowa program well and the fans would rally behind him. If he got hired at Alabama, he'd be hated just because the only thing people in Alabama know how to do is to hate people. Forget the current contract he has, if Iowa offers, he's leaving. Guaranteed.

As for who would Stoops have chosen.....Iowa or OU? I don't know. Iowa is his alma mater. He always talked about replacing Hayden Fry. What I do know is had Iowa just offered him the damn job BEFORE OU came calling, he'd be our coach. He wanted the job, we just never offered because Bob Bowlsby is a fucking idiot.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Sat Dec 23, 2006 12:40 am

You honestly sound like a 12 year old when you say anything about 'Bama. You have nothing to support your arguments.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Sat Dec 23, 2006 2:43 am

I have plenty to back my arguments.....

Like Franchione bolting after 1 year. Or the fact that Bama can't find a coach right now to save their lives. Great programs don't have problems getting coaches. Coaches line up for those jobs. Maybe there's a reason Bama hasn't found one........

Let me guess.....Pete Carrol is leaving USC for the job, right??? Or is Tressel? Both would fit in well at Alabama. Cheating is not only accepted there, but it's also expected.

Great programs don't have to cheat to win. Say what you want about Iowa, but at least the success we've had in the last 25 years or so was due to hard work and not forking over cash to recruits, unlike a certain program we've been discussing.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Sat Dec 23, 2006 4:11 am

ND had a pretty hard fucking time over the last 5 years. And you have no idea if Iowa cheats, nor do I know if ND cheats.

Alabama has had some unusual circumstances when trying to hire a coach. They poached one guy who was at one school forever and almost got another who was at his alma matter. Could Iowa do the same?