Manning, Hawkeyes lead Colts to Super Bowl!!

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 4:19 am

6 catches 137 yards for Dallas Clark, his 2nd 100+ yard receiving game of the playoffs this year.
Bob Sanders made arguably the biggest play of the game batting down a pass on 3rd and 4 for the Patriots. Had the pass been completed, the game would have been over and New England would have won. Instead, Colts get the ball back and the rest is history.

It sure is a shame the Hawkeyes don't ever produce any NFL talent.......allegedly!!

Rack our 2-star recruits that will be KEY players in the Super Bowl in 2 weeks.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 4:22 am

Oh, and rack the fuck outta Peyton Manning. I've been sick and fucking tired of hearing how he can't win in the playoffs. Bullshit. All those piece of shit media members have their collective heads between their legs right now.

So, here's to Peyton Manning........THE BEST QUARTERBACK IN THE NFL. And if you even try and dispute that, you are a fucking idiot that has NEVER watched an NFL game.

peter dragon · Post by **peter dragon** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 6:38 am

we need a NFL forum :roll:

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 2:06 pm

What's more annoying Jon and his Iowa love or m2 with his constant references of Tom Brady being from the Bay Area and Joe Montana was his idol growing up. These guys act like they're taking credit for something...Jon and m2 didn't do shit but they want to make it known that in some pretzel logic that they personally had something to do with it. I just love how arrogant fans of such medicore programs can be.

Marlin Jackson, former Wolverine, with the game-clinching INT...in case you're keeping score. :wink:

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Mon Jan 22, 2007 3:09 pm

Act like you've had players in the NFL before.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 3:30 pm

TheJON wrote:Oh, and rack the fuck outta Peyton Manning. I've been sick and fucking tired of hearing how he can't win in the playoffs. Bullshit. All those piece of shit media members have their collective heads between their legs right now.

So, here's to Peyton Manning........THE BEST QUARTERBACK IN THE NFL. And if you even try and dispute that, you are a fucking idiot that has NEVER watched an NFL game.

So Colt Brennan is THE BEST QUARTERBACK IN THE NCAA?

And it's too bad Nate Kadeing can't hit a clutch kick or the Chargers would be there.

And Marlin Jackson made the play of the game, not Bob Sanders.

indyfrisco · Post by **indyfrisco** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 3:36 pm

Awesome game. Probably the second best game I've been to in person, college or pro.

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 3:48 pm

Killian wrote:And it's too bad Nate Kadeing can't hit a clutch kick or the Chargers would be there.

Touche!

That Robert Gallery guy is a bad ass too...

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 3:49 pm

IndyFrisco wrote:Awesome game. Probably the second best game I've been to in person, college or pro.

What was #1?

Props on being there yesterday...by the way.

indyfrisco · Post by **indyfrisco** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 3:57 pm

T+1, 1999 Texas A&M vs. Texas My senior year in college. THat was the year of the Bonfire collapse. A&M had no business winning that game, but the team was inspired that day. Very emotional. To top it off, my coworker's mom worked for President Bowen at the time and was able to get me tickets on thee 50 yard line, alumni side, 8 rows up. We sat right behind McCown's parents (A&M's QB).

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 4:02 pm

What the hell does Colt Brennan have to do with Peyton Manning?? If you think my argument for Manning has to do with stats, you're mistaken. No one, and I mean no one, makes the throws he makes. There is not a more talented QB in the NFL. In fact, I'd argue that the 2 most talented QB's in NFL history are Dan Marino and Peyton Manning. Probably throw Brett Favre in there at #3. I know it's hard for most football fans to grasp the concept of "there's more than just a QB on the field" because all you guys ever hear from the media is talk about QB's, but there really are other players on the field and they actually help decide playoff games as well.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 4:06 pm

As for Kaeding.....you're blaming dude for missing a 54 yard field goal with the game on the line? Blame "Regular Season" Marty for pissing away a timeout on a bad challenge decision or maybe Kaeding would have had a 40 yard field goal instead of a 54 yarder. There's maybe 2-3 kickers in the history of the game that would have made that kick in that situation. And, in case you wondered, Kaeding's kick would have only TIED the score. Kaeding did not lose that game. The Chargers lost that when they didn't drop the dagger on the Patriots early in the game and let the Patriots hang around.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 4:10 pm

And whoever said that Sanders didn't make the play of the game might want to re-watch this game. Patriots most likely weren't gonna score anyways even if Jackson doesn't pick that pass off (that, by the way, was thrown RIGHT TO HIM). They didn't win on that. The odds of any team going 30 yards in 15 seconds are slim to none anyways. Sanders made one hell of a play. If he doesn't make that play, the game is over and New England wins. So how is that NOT the play of the game? Now, of course, if Marlin Jackson were a Hawkeye and I came on here claiming he made the play of the game, Killian would be on here going Bob Sanders made the play of the game. I'm not really sure how anyone can dispute that Sanders made, at the very least, the defensive play of the game. There's really not much argument on this.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 4:18 pm

You know, you can just hit enter and break all of that up into one post.

Kaeding has done this before, like two years ago against the Jets. And I seem to remember the Oregon State kicker drilling a 50+ yarder as time expired to tie the game and send it into overtime in some shitty conditions.

There are QB's in the league who can make the same throws as Manning. And if you don't think Tom Brady is a better QB, you're fucking high. Look at the talent around him and what he's done. And when the game was on the line, they pounded it with Addai, not throw it with Manning.

As for Sanders, he made a great play, no doubt. But there were plenty of plays that could have been "the play of the game". And the Pat's would have scored if not for Sanders play, but wouldn't have even with out Jackson's play? Great call JON.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 4:32 pm

I may be high, but you're shooting up on heroin if you think Brady is better. Give me a break. He doesn't make half the throws. Why does Peyton having more talent prove Brady is better? So if the Colts and Patriots traded QB's, you'd say Manning is now the better QB because he has less talent? Manning makes unreal throws and has an arm that Brady could only dream of having. I love it when people say Brady hasn't had great talent around him. That's such fucking bullshit. Maybe not as much this year, but in past years, he's been on a team where they've had a very good player (maybe not a great one) at basically every position. Guys like Willie McGinnest, Ty Law, Deion Branch, Teddy Bruschi, Corey Dillon, Adam Vinniateri, etc.... those guys had outstanding careers in New England. Tom Brady is a very good QB. In fact, I'd say he's one of the Top 20-30 QB's of all-time. But if you actually watch him play (instead of just parroting everything you hear from ESPN and other media outlets), you'd find out that the throws he makes really aren't that tough. Shit, dude got Super Bowl MVP in a game in which he threw for probably less than 150 yards. I know they had that drive, but go back and watch the drive and see how many tough throws he makes. The answer is ZERO. He threw 5 yard dump-offs the whole drive. Oooooohh!!

Man, I swear, no one actually watches the games, they just take what they hear from their favorite sports columnist/personality and repeat. Winning games does not make 1 player better than the other. Sometimes luck and your teamates performances actually have something to do with the game as well, although I'm sure you'd probably dispute that. And don't give me Manning has better talent than Brady in his career. The fact is, Manning's supporting cast plays like SHIT in the playoffs. That includes Marvin Harrison. Heck, just yesterday, Harrison had 2 HUGE dropped passes. Wayne fell down twice on 2 big pass plays. Last year in the playoffs, Dallas Clark and Edgerrin James forgot how to pick up a blitz and Manning got killed. Brady's supporting cast plays much better in the playoffs than Manning and that's a fact. Even yesterday, his supporting cast played like crap. Lot's of dropped balls, O-line had trouble with a blitz, and the D struggled in 3rd and 4th down situations allowing NE to extend drives. But there was no stopping one of the best QB's that has EVER played the game.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Mon Jan 22, 2007 4:42 pm

They both can make amazing throws, it's just that Brady makes them look a little easier. Manning starts to get those happy feet, and he starts shuffling around like a dipshit in the pocket when he gets pressured. Then he ends up running back 5-7 yards and throws a deep pass off of his back foot. He makes throws more complex than they have to be due to his inability to scramble and get outside the pocket. Sure, he winds up making an incredible throw, but, he makes a lot of "tough" throws many other QBs can make with a lot more grace.

Killian · Post by **Killian** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 4:45 pm

You saying people are parroting ESPN and their favorite sports columnists is high comedy.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 4:51 pm

Why is that high comedy? What is comedy is that people think I parrot people, when my comments are the exact opposite of the majority much of the time. Unlike most sports fans (well, people in general actually), I actually have the ability to think up my own thoughts and couldn't give a fuck who agrees or disagrees with my views. 90% of the posts I read on this board are the same crap I hear from ESPN. Unlike 90% of the posters on here (and no, I'm not singling anyone out specifically), I actually watch the games and then give my opinions. Rarely are they the opinions of most of the sportswriters/analysts that I read. Sometimes they are, that's just the law of averages. But saying I parrot anyone only proves how wrong you people are.

Shoalzie · Post by **Shoalzie** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:02 pm

TheJON wrote:I may be high, but you're shooting up on heroin if you think Brady is better. Give me a break. He doesn't make half the throws. Why does Peyton having more talent prove Brady is better? So if the Colts and Patriots traded QB's, you'd say Manning is now the better QB because he has less talent? Manning makes unreal throws and has an arm that Brady could only dream of having. I love it when people say Brady hasn't had great talent around him.

Marvin Harrison is better than any receiver Brady has ever had and it can be argued that James was better than any running back has ever lined up behind Brady. Didn't they win a Super Bowl with Antowain Smith as their featured back?

Skills-wise, Manning is tremendous...no one thinks he's doesn't have game. It's just that intangible ability to come up big when your team needs you the most. He couldn't win at Tennessee and up until yesterday, he hasn't taken the Colts to the Super Bowl. When you think of the Mount Rushmore of QBs...the common link is winning. Montana, Starr, Elway, Favre...all champions. Brady and Bradshaw can be thrown into the mix as well. Manning was pretty much in the category of great QB but not great champion like Marino, Fouts and Tarkenton.

The Patriots had the better defense all this time and Vinatieri was the ace in the hole in several close games. You can call some of the Pats wins through the years as flukes or lucky...the bottom line is they won. Also, the Pats have progressively lost players off their team and the constants throughout the years have been Brady and Belichik as well as a few others like Bruschi, Seymour and Vrabel. They've plugged in different guys and it's been a winning mix more times than not.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:06 pm

I know you'll just resort to your "I don't give a shit what people think" routine, but the fact is, the reason nobody takes your shit seriously in this forum is because you pull bullshit "statistics" out of your ass in an attempt "prove your point."

I've forgotten more football than 99% of the fans out there

Unlike 90% of the posters on here, I actually watch the games

Huh? How the fuck could you know that? How can you just arrive at such...surreal figures, and do so with ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY?

This type of shit is precisely why people think you're a gibbering, ignorant dipshit.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:13 pm

You're right, it's not absolute certainty. I should have noted a +- 2% in my scientific research.

buckeye_in_sc · Post by **buckeye_in_sc** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:26 pm

Rings

Brady 3

Manning 0

Scoreboard Brady...Thanks for playing douche...

Look Manning is incredible...but Brady has put up some gaudy stats as most have pointed out with receivers like Troy Brown, etc...finally they get a running back such as Corey Dillon but those guys are not in the same league as Edge, Harrison, Wayne, etc...so yeah I would want Brady leading my team if I had to start one today (did I just say that...a michigan guy barf)...

You wouldn't get plungered as bad on here if you actually knew what you were talking about...oh and before this year HOW MANY AFC Championship Games did Peyton Manning and the Colts win? Again waiting for your answer...

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:28 pm

What's wrong with guys like Troy Brown and Corey Dillon? Those are some damn good football players. And how does winning a Super Bowl prove you're a better PLAYER. Better team, yes.

So now I ask you a question....

Rank these QB's.....

1.Trent Dilfer
2.Dan Marino
3.Dan Fouts
4.Doug Williams
5.Mark Rypien

I eagerly await your answer.

buckeye_in_sc · Post by **buckeye_in_sc** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:32 pm

Wow a couple of them won super bowls...no shit dolt...

yeah so Dilfer won a Super Bowl with Baltimore and Rypien and Williams did with the Skins and Marino and Fouts got shut out...great...truth be told I would take Marino over any of them...much like I would take BRADY over manning dipshit...

but I'll tell you what Fouts, Marino had incredible skill and talent around them...much like Peyton...Brady while having good talent...you are fucking kidding yourself if you think Troy Brown is in the same league as Harrison...

what I was getting at douche was all this talent Indy has had and they have WON ZERO AFC championships...ZERO...

and let's not forget Peyton has laid some major eggs in the big AFC games as well...

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:37 pm

I know Troy Brown is not in Harrison's league or Dillon in Edge's league. They're more talented. But, the fact is, in the playoffs, Brady's supporting cast has played better than Manning's. Harrison has dropped a lot of passes in the playoffs, so has Wayne. Edgerrin James never really did much in the playoffs either. Even yesterday, Harrison played like shit. 2 HUGE dropped balls. Troy Brown makes those catches in the playoffs.

So, now that Manning (well, really the Colts, but I'll just go along with everyone else's theory that the QB is the only player on the field) finally got over the hump, how can anyone possibly even try and argue Brady as the better QB? There's no argument for it now. Manning has better physical tools and he proved he can lead his team to a Super Bowl. So there's no argument anymore.

indyfrisco · Post by **indyfrisco** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:38 pm

Marino couldn't score a TD on every posession. That's why he has no rings. He never had a defense worth a shit to help him out.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:43 pm

Exactly. Just like Manning hasn't had much defensive help in the playoffs nor has his offensive line been able to pick up a blitz from a 3-4 defense very well. The old saying "defense wins championships" was made famous for a reason. BECAUSE IT DOES!

T REX · Post by **T REX** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:45 pm

TheJON wrote: Winning games does not make 1 player better than the other.

I completely disagree. As a QB you touch the ball on almost every single play. There really isn't another player on the field at any given time with more influence on a game then he.

indyfrisco · Post by **indyfrisco** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:50 pm

T REX wrote:As a QB you touch the ball on almost every single play. There really isn't another player on the field at any given time with more influence on a game then he.

How about the center?

It's still a team sport. There is no other sport where "team" is emphasized more than football. All parts need to be in sync to have success. Yes, a QB is important, but without the other parts working together, it doesn't matter who isx taking the snaps. Once again, Trent Dilfer. Not a lot of talent there, but he worked well within their TEAM and he was successful.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:51 pm

But what if your WR's drop balls, your O-line can't block, your defense can't stop anyone, and your All-Pro kicker shanks a game winning FG??? There's nothing a QB can do. The fact is, there's been a lot of very good/great QB's that never won a lot of games because of a number of reasons. While crappy QB's (ie Trent Dilfer, Jim McMahon, Brad Johnson) were able to have a lot of success in terms of victories in their careers. Like I've said before, for all the talent the Colts have had, their star players have not performed well in the playoffs. And if you're the QB of a team where your supporting cast is underachieving, you're not gonna win regardless of how well you play. It's like the Bulls in the 1990's. Jordan was unstoppable, but they weren't gonna win jack squat in the playoffs if Scottie was playing like crap or they weren't getting solid production from guys like Steve Kerr, Luc Longley, and BJ Armstrong.

buckeye_in_sc · Post by **buckeye_in_sc** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:58 pm

Hey JON...

Manning LEAD his team to a super bowl...BRADY has LEAD and WON 3 super bowls...until manning wins one...fuck off

I still can't believe I have a sudden Jon Crush on Brady ala Jon on every Iowa player to go through the lockerroom in Iowa City...

fuck I feel dirty

oh and to use your logic of leading a team to the game and not actually winning it...then Troy Smith is the best QB ever in College Football...you know using your logic of leading his team to the MNC game but not actually winning it...end of discussion according to you...

indyfrisco · Post by **indyfrisco** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 6:00 pm

I wouldn't use basketball as an example of a team sport. In my opinion, no team works together better as a team than the Phoenix Suns. What have they won? In basketball, you just need a 1-2 punch with 2 stars and an average supporting cast. Look at Parker/Duncan, Shaq/Wade, etc.

In basketball, you can get away with that shit. Kobe is probably hte best player in the NBA but since he lost Shaq, that 1-2 punch no longer exists and he's fucked.

In football, ALL parts need to be on the same page and performing well. Much more of a team sport...

buckeye_in_sc · Post by **buckeye_in_sc** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 6:02 pm

Indy...

this is Jon we are talking about

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Mon Jan 22, 2007 6:02 pm

TheJON wrote:But what if your WR's drop balls

Yeah, ask Brady what he thinks about Caldwell.

Idiot.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 6:05 pm

buckeye,

Why is it that everytime we have a good debate going you have to ruin it?

I was only using the Bulls reference as an analogy. My point was just that without the supporting cast, Jordan never would have won. Just like Manning hasn't won partially because his supporting cast has not performed to their abilities in the playoffs like they do the regular season. Was not comparing basketball to football.

buckeye_in_sc · Post by **buckeye_in_sc** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 6:06 pm

re-read idiot...I didn't bust your ass for comparing basketball and football...if you're going to troll at least get the arguments straight...

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 6:07 pm

Mgo,

Yes, that is exactly my point right there. Those dropped balls by Caldwell really hurt New England. That proves exactly what I've been saying about how it doesn't matter what the QB does if the WR"s are dropping balls and everyone else is playing like crap. Thank you for proving my point!

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Mon Jan 22, 2007 6:23 pm

Manning simply hasn't played at the level of a Brady in "big games." You say he has more tools. Maybe so, but what does that really mean when he hasn't been able to take full advantage of them over the years in postseason games? Typically, the regular season Manning we know, we have not seen in the playoffs. Even just yesterday, he started making mental mistakes he simply doesn't make in the regular season, like not getting the snap off and getting a D.O.G. penalty. He just hasn't been as focused as Brady has been, and the mental aspect of the game definitely factors into the whole "who's better" debate.

Manning finally wins an AFC title, not even a SB, but an AFC fucking title, and now he's suddenly better than Brady? That's some fucked up logic, bud. You want to wipe out entire careers, and pin it all one one game. One conference championship game.

Nice.

Dude has to win at the very least one SB (which I think he will) before you can make this argument. I mean, shit, not only does Brady have the stats, including jawdropping comeback wins time-and-time-and-time over, but dude has 3 fuggin' rings to Manning's 0. That simply cannot be shoved to the side like it's some trivial little stat, as you're so desperately trying to do.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 6:29 pm

When did I ever say I think he's a better QB because of 1 game?? I've always thought Manning was better. In fact, I'm not really sure how anyone can debate this. But now that Manning got to a Super Bowl, I'm not sure how the Manning detractors can still be arguing against this? He's gotten over the hump, now where's the argument for Brady? Stop saying he's won more Super Bowls. Good god, it's a fucking team game. Why can't you people understand this???? Do any of you actually think up your own takes or does every one of your damn takes have to be what the national media says??? My goodness.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Mon Jan 22, 2007 6:42 pm

When did I ever say I think he's a better QB because of 1 game??

This statement certainly seems to say that:

So, now that Manning finally got over the hump, how can anyone possibly even try and argue Brady as the better QB? There's no argument for it now

Correct my logic here, but that statement essentially says that Manning is better now that he has gotten over the hump. And the "hump" indicated a win over NE, last night, did it not? Now, follow me closely...that would mean Manning became better after that one game, according to you. If you're implying something else, please, enlighten me genius.

Anywho, I'd entertain the argument that Manning is a more technically sound quarterback.

But that's about it.

That being said, I still don't think that means all that much when you haven't shown the ability to fully use all of your tools when it matters most.

Brady has been able to. His playoff record, and god-like amount of comeback wins alone proves that.

You want, so badly, to shove aside the facts and stats that matter most. But it just isn't going well for you at all.

T1B

Manning, Hawkeyes lead Colts to Super Bowl!!

Manning, Hawkeyes lead Colts to Super Bowl!!

Re: Manning, Hawkeyes lead Colts to Super Bowl!!