Manning, Hawkeyes lead Colts to Super Bowl!!

T REX · Post by **T REX** » Tue Jan 30, 2007 5:55 pm

TheJON wrote:
Michael Irvin.....coke addict from The U. Aikman in the HOF, Irvin not. How anyone could say that Aikman should be in but not Irvin is beyond me.

Uhhhh....answer your own questions much?

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Tue Jan 30, 2007 6:05 pm

So because he's a coke addict means he isn't a HOFer?? OJ's a double murderer and he's in. Ty Cobb is probably the biggest piece of shit in the world and he's in the Baseball HOF. If we're talking about the Good People Hall of Fame, then no Irvin should not be in. But this is the football hall of fame and being a drug addict should not keep him out unless they hold that standard for everyone, which they don't.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Tue Jan 30, 2007 10:12 pm

Leave the conspiracy bullshit out of this debate, JON. You can talk all day long about how handsome you think Tom Brady is, but at the end of the day, you can't back any of that bullshit up with facts. None of that is relevant to this argument. I can think of a lot of "good looking" athletes who get shit on by the media. The reason Brady is well-respected by the media isn't because of his looks. It's because he just performs, just wins, keeps his mouth shut while doing it, and isn't the typical "me first" blinged-out, selfish, cocky, money-obsessing asshole that many pro athletes have become.

He was the same "good looking, All American kid" you talk about when he was at Michigan, wasn't he JON? But the reason the media wasn't fawning all over him was because HE HADN'T WON HIS 3 SUPER BOWL RINGS YET. Fuck, man, John Navarre was talked about more at Michigan than Brady was, and he's a gumpy ass motherfucker.

You can't deny that the media has a tendency to latch onto a winner. It isn't anything exclusive to Brady.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Tue Jan 30, 2007 11:29 pm

Of course I can't back it up with facts (oh shit, there's new sig material for Frisco.....dammit, why do I always have to say shit that's too easy to be taken out of context?) because this is a subjective argument. I think Manning is better, you think Brady is better. Matter of opinion, and neither of us can claim to be right or wrong.

But about John Navarre..... College is different than pro sports. It's more about the team than the individual to most people. It's not that great players don't get any love in college, but not like pro athletes. In college, the coach gets more credit than the players. In the NFL, seems to be different. But John Navarre was not a well loved QB at Michigan. Heck, we've got a local guy that's from Michigan and when Navarre was at UM, he'd basically go on a rant every day on his show about what a piece of crap Navarre was and how his choking on the road was costing Michigan a national title.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Tue Jan 30, 2007 11:39 pm

TheJON wrote:But John Navarre was not a well loved QB at Michigan.

No fucking shit. That was my point. Go back, read the tone of my voice with what I typed, and you just might get it. Or maybe you'll get lucky or something.

Heck, we've got a local guy that's from Michigan

Well, then you MUST be the authority. Hell, I only live in the heart of Wolverine land, interact with Wolverine fans on a daily basis, read Wolverine-based articles, listen to Wolverine-based radio, etc., so what the fuck would I know? Probably not much in comparison to you since you've got a "local guy from Michigan" on your radio dial.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Tue Jan 30, 2007 11:58 pm

Well at least you're not a complete fucking asshole.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Wed Jan 31, 2007 12:02 am

Is this the part where you wish death upon me and my family?

M Club · Post by **M Club** » Wed Jan 31, 2007 2:30 am

navarre was the second-coming of drew henson. i absolutely loved him while he was at umich, though not as much as i loved doug flutie. i hope that quip was aimed at my height and not at my mullet.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Wed Jan 31, 2007 3:25 am

I'm left handed and I bet I could throw a better deep ball right handed than Flutie could. There may not have been a lesser talented quarterback to ever make it to the NFL than Flutie. Oh, but he has a "heart of a champion!" Fuck that shit! He's a 2 foot midget that throws like a girl. I'd rather have a dead Johnny Unitas than Flutie in his "prime."

indyfrisco · Post by **indyfrisco** » Wed Jan 31, 2007 2:17 pm

TheJON wrote:In college, the coach gets more credit than the players. In the NFL, seems to be different.

Gee, I don't know. What's the #1 story of the Super Bowl this year? Yep...two black coaches.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Wed Jan 31, 2007 4:37 pm

I didn't say coaches never get credit in the NFL. But in college, many coaches ARE the program whereas in the NFL the players get more love than the coaches most of the time. The NFL is a players game. College Football is a coaches game. That's why I would rather be a college coach. There's far more guys considered legendary coaches in college football than the NFL. I don't think I could come up with more than 10-12 NFL coaches of all-time that most people would consider legends. In college, there's hundreds of them (Devaney, Wilkinson, Osbourne, Paterno, Bowden, Royal, Spurrier, Hayes, Schembechler, etc.). Heck, Bo Schembechler never won a national title and he's pretty much a god in Michigan. You have to win at least 2 Super Bowls just to have a chance to be considered a legendary NFL coach.

indyfrisco · Post by **indyfrisco** » Wed Jan 31, 2007 5:29 pm

Considering the ratio is nearly 4:1 (note this stat wasn't pulled from my ass) of college coaches to NFL coaches, then yeah, I would say there should be 4 times as many "legendary" coaches in the college ranks. There are not "100s" of legendary coaches in CFB. 20-30 maybe? If that were the case, then the NFL should be right around 5-7 "legendary" coaches in the NFL. I'd say it's about right.

Oh, and CFB has a much longer history than the pros with many more teams. You can't compare eras in one when that era did not exist int he other. I'm not a "defender" of the NFL by any means, just a defender of common sense.

MgoBlue-LightSpecial · Thu Feb 01, 2007 1:57 am

IndyFrisco wrote:Considering the ratio is nearly 4:1

IndyFrisco wrote:Oh, and CFB has a much longer history

I simply cannot believe both of these, rather elementary pieces of information, had to be explained to JON. Or can I? It's pretty hilarious that these two tidbits escaped JON's thought process, as he reached another one of his epic, all-knowing Grand Conclusions.

Seriously, JON...are you fucking retarded?

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Thu Feb 01, 2007 4:39 pm

Yeah, those facts completely slipped my mind. I thought the NFL had just as many teams as in college football. Silly me!! Next, you're going to tell me that the NFL is a professional league and college is an amatuer league. Shit, I had no idea. Thanks for the info!

College football is a coaches game. NFL is a players game. In college, the coach gets the credit. In the NFL, it's the star players. Not always, but a majority of the time. You're the face of your program in college as a coach. In the NFL, it's typically your franchise player. Coaches can become legends in college football without even winning a national title (see Bo Schembechler). In the NFL, to even be considered you gotta have 2-3 Super Bowl rings 99% of the time.

I'm not really sure what you're trying to dispute. This really is pretty much common sense.

M Club · Post by **M Club** » Fri Feb 02, 2007 5:27 pm

TheJON wrote:I'm left handed and I bet I could throw a better deep ball right handed than Flutie could. There may not have been a lesser talented quarterback to ever make it to the NFL than Flutie. Oh, but he has a "heart of a champion!" Fuck that shit! He's a 2 foot midget that throws like a girl. I'd rather have a dead Johnny Unitas than Flutie in his "prime."

i don't know, flutie did make the screw turn. he never lasted anywhere in the nfl much too long, but he won wherever he went, or at least outplayed whoever was thought of as the better qb on his teams. it's funny you make a quip about his long ball considering the play he's best know for.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Fri Feb 02, 2007 5:33 pm

Yeah, he's known for a luck play! Blind squirrel found a nut.

Put on a blindfold and then send 10 of your buddies into the end zone 50 yards down the field and try to complete it to one of the dudes on your team. 1 in 100 it works. That's what happened with Flutie. He completed a 1 in 100 pass.

And yeah, he did win some starting jobs.......kind of. Really, in Buffalo it just came down to the fact that he happened to find a team where he could compete with the one QB in the NFL that actually sucked worse than him (Rob Johnson).

M Club · Post by **M Club** » Fri Feb 02, 2007 5:47 pm

i know it was a lucky play, but i found it funny you mentioned him and the long ball. that's all. as for the bills, sure he competed against rob johnson, but the ol' wikipedia tells me he was 8-3, 10-5, and 4-1 as a starter in his three seasons there. 22-9 is a pretty solid record for someone with nothing but heart.

TheJON · Post by **TheJON** » Fri Feb 02, 2007 5:53 pm

That's not true. He has more than just heart. He has a girly arm too!