A question for the lawyers

[smackaholic]

And of course, all of the people who run lottery gaming establishments(for the state-run video poker and slots), have all reported sharp decreases in revenues after implementing smoking bans in their establishments(they're trying to take away a business owner's freedom to choose whether his establishment is smoking or not, free market and freedom of choice be damned), which would create severe shortfalls in other state funds.

Amen.

The anti smoking nazis really are fukking things up bad. I am OK with limiting smoking in the work place in most places where smoking in itself is not a prime reason for being there, but, when you put this on bar owners you are basically telling the owner, fukk you, I don't care if it puts your place under, we are banning smoking.

I work with a guy who co-owns a pool hall with his dad. A number of years back, they had to spend a lot of jack on smoke eating equipment. Then a year or so ago, they just flat out banned smoking. Business immediately went down by 50%. The place is still open, but Greg now has to work a real fulltime yob and let his semi-retired dad run the hall.

If this is not a flagrant trampling upon private property rights, nothing is. This is the main reason I can't bring myself to vote democratic. Not that the repubs are much better, but, atleast they seem to have some sort of concern for private property. The dems don't even pretend to.

[The Whistle Is Screaming]

smack,

NY's anti-smoking laws were enacted by a Republican Gov & controlled Senete, so don't blame the Dems. After 3 1/2 years there are no facts to support an increase in business closings that are attributed to the smoking ban.

It's nice to go out and not come home smelling like smoke. I was a smoker for 20 years & used the ban as an excuse to quit as most of my smoking was done in bars & at work.

[Goober McTuber]

Madison’s smoking ban was enacted by a Democratic Mayor and City Council. It has closed down some bars, and most every bar has complained of revenues being down by as much as 50%. Of course here it only takes minutes for someone to drive a few miles out of the city to a suburban bar where they can smoke.

[BSmack]

smack,

NY's anti-smoking laws were enacted by a Republican Gov & controlled Senete, so don't blame the Dems. After 3 1/2 years there are no facts to support an increase in business closings that are attributed to the smoking ban.

It's nice to go out and not come home smelling like smoke. I was a smoker for 20 years & used the ban as an excuse to quit as most of my smoking was done in bars & at work.

Ah, nothing like the fervor of the converted.

As for blaming the Dems, they don't get off that easy. You very conveniently forget to mention that the Democratic controlled Assembly was more than happy to go along with this further erosion of property rights. Nothing happens in New York without bipartisan support.

I'm not sure what the "studies" say, but around my neck of the woods, I have seen more bars closing than opening. Of course the puritanical attitudes of post Reagan America might have something to do with that, as well as the new .08 DWI limit. But you damn sure can't tell me that bars, bowling alleys and bingo halls are doing as well as they were 4 years ago..

[The Whistle Is Screaming]

Goob & B
My point is that it isn't a Dem or Rep thing, it's a bullshit political ploy that both sides will play with as they see fit. B, there is no proof that say's the smoking ban has closed more bars/restaurants than usual. Many places have seen an increase in business (like my local watering hole), is that attributed to the smoking ban? It's a tough business to be in period. I don't know anyone who stopped going to a bar because they couldn't smoke inside, but I do know people who go out more since the ban has been in effect.

As for being a convert, I don't care if people smoke or not. I just happen to like going out and not smelling like smoke when I get home, wife & kids appreciate it to.

[Mikey]

That damn .08 DWI limit. When is the government gonna stop taking away our personal rights?

[Tom In VA]

Not so sure driving is considered a "right" to begin with, much less driving impaired.

I think it's a stretch to compare the two. I'm not a smoker, never have been, my tabacky was Kodiak Wintragreen. Anyway, seems lame all the laws and shit.

Especially at bars and stuff. People go there to drink and smoke. If you don't like it, don't go.

[Goober McTuber]

TWIS,

In Madison the taverns have ALL reported a sharp decrease in revenue commencing with the smoking ban. I have not heard of any tavern owner coming forward and claiming to have increased revenue, unless they are outside of the city limits. Understand that I am not a smoker, but I do feel it should be up to the owner to decide smoking vs. non-smoking.

[ucantdoitdoggieSTyle2]

my tabacky was Kodiak Wintragreen.

Ahh... The Bear.

I still have this 'Pavlovian urge to spit' everytime I watch a baseball game even though I haven't dipped in years... sometimes... I even reach down onto an empty table for a spitoon.

[The Whistle Is Screaming]

TWIS,

In Madison the taverns have ALL reported a sharp decrease in revenue commencing with the smoking ban. I have not heard of any tavern owner coming forward and claiming to have increased revenue, unless they are outside of the city limits. Understand that I am not a smoker, but I do feel it should be up to the owner to decide smoking vs. non-smoking.

They said that here as well, turns out most were full of shit. Think about it, do you and your friends go out more or less since the ban? Also, your case is a little different, in NY it is a statewide ban, if people can easily go somewhere outside the city limits then they may do that. I'd be interested if the bars closest to Madison, but not subject to a ban are seeing big increases in business.

[Tom In VA]

my tabacky was Kodiak Wintragreen.

Ahh... The Bear.

I still have this 'Pavlovian urge to spit' everytime I watch a baseball game even though I haven't dipped in years... sometimes... I even reach down onto an empty table for a spitoon.

No fuckin shit man. Of course I'm only 7 months quit. Finally weened myself off sunflower seeds, but still have to have a steady supply of cinnamon gum or mints around, the spicier the better. Get's me over the crave.

[Goober McTuber]

TWIS,

In Madison the taverns have ALL reported a sharp decrease in revenue commencing with the smoking ban. I have not heard of any tavern owner coming forward and claiming to have increased revenue, unless they are outside of the city limits. Understand that I am not a smoker, but I do feel it should be up to the owner to decide smoking vs. non-smoking.

They said that here as well, turns out most were full of shit. Think about it, do you and your friends go out more or less since the ban? Also, your case is a little different, in NY it is a statewide ban, if people can easily go somewhere outside the city limits then they may do that. I'd be interested if the bars closest to Madison, but not subject to a ban are seeing big increases in business.

I go out about the same amount (daily), as do my friends (most of whom don't smoke). And yes, the bars just outside of Madison have reported increased business. The governor has proposed making the ban state-wide to even the playing field. Of course, people living near the borders will go to bars in Illinois, Iowa and Minnesota (hopefully one of them will punch Mile-Hi T in the face).

[Dinsdale]

What always cracks me up in a big way about the debate over banning smoking in bars, is the whole premise of "well, it's bad for you."


Uhm...HELLO?

Some of the more retarded shit I've heard coming from whiney politician and do-gooders' mouths.


Yeah, I confude a freaking bar where I down 14 pints of beer with a freaking health club all the time...thanks for clearing that up for me.

Do these people realize how stupid they sound? "We need to ban smoking in bars, since it creates an unhealthy environment."

Because no one ever gets liver cirrohsis, STDs, unwanted pregnancies, or injuries in fights at a bar, and NO ONE would ever dream of scoring meth there...other than the smoking issue, bars and taverns exemplify clean, healthy living.

[Kansas City Kid]

Because no one ever gets liver cirrohsis, STDs, unwanted pregnancies, or injuries in fights at a bar, and NO ONE would ever dream of scoring meth there....

Just because these are the reasons you are at the bar doesn't mean it is the reason everyone else goes.

[Goober McTuber]

Because no one ever gets liver cirrohsis, STDs, unwanted pregnancies, or injuries in fights at a bar, and NO ONE would ever dream of scoring meth there....

Just because these are the reasons you are at the bar doesn't mean it is the reason everyone else goes.

Yeah, we know why you go there, KayLee. To score fresh dick.

[ucantdoitdoggieSTyle2]

Just because these are the reasons you are at the bar doesn't mean it is the reason everyone else goes.

Chaptard 9 -- Regurgitating/attributing parts of post to its author.




Thank you for your contribution to the T1B Tard Handbook.

[Dinsdale]

Thank you for your contribution to the T1B Tard Handbook.

He's quite the "scroll-wheel-special," ain't he?

Because "I know you are, but what am I" and all of its myriad variants are always fresh.

[Kansas City Kid]

I thought you were ignoring me? How's that going for ya? :wink:

[Kansas City Kid]

Because no one ever gets liver cirrohsis, STDs, unwanted pregnancies, or injuries in fights at a bar, and NO ONE would ever dream of scoring meth there....

Just because these are the reasons you are at the bar doesn't mean it is the reason everyone else goes.

Yeah, we know why you go there, KayLee. To score fresh dick.

Just because you like to chug cock at the bar doesn't mean the rest of us do.

[Goober McTuber]

Just because these are the reasons you are at the bar doesn't mean it is the reason everyone else goes.

Yeah, we know why you go there, KayLee. To score fresh dick.

Just because you like to chug cock at the bar doesn't mean the rest of us do.

“I know you are but what am I”. Twice on one page. Brilliant.

[Dinsdale]

“I know you are but what am I”. Twice on one page. Brilliant.

It must be something in the water in KC. Retardation seems to be an epidemic.

[Kansas City Kid]

How's the ignoring going for ya? :wink:

[Kansas City Kid]

How's the ignoring going for ya? :wink:

Looks like it's going great since he hasn't responded to you yet.

FTFY

[smackaholic]

I cited a friend from work. The pool hall that he owns with his pop had bidness drop in half. Because of this, he now has to work a seperate fulltime job. Some of it eventually may return, but, alot of good that does to the poor bastard that hasn't got the cash reserves to weather the storm.

And yes there are plenty of idiots on the rep side as well. But, I think it is more of a dem thing. Note that these laws exist in the northeast and cali. You won't see it happening any time real soon in Tennessee or Iowa.

[BSmack]

I cited a friend from work. The pool hall that he owns with his pop had bidness drop in half. Because of this, he now has to work a seperate fulltime job. Some of it eventually may return, but, alot of good that does to the poor bastard that hasn't got the cash reserves to weather the storm.

And yes there are plenty of idiots on the rep side as well. But, I think it is more of a dem thing. Note that these laws exist in the northeast and cali. You won't see it happening any time real soon in Tennessee or Iowa.

You do realize that all 50 states have some form of anti-smoking laws on the books?

http://slati.lungusa.org/appendixa.asp

[Derron]

I cited a friend from work. The pool hall that he owns with his pop had bidness drop in half. Because of this, he now has to work a seperate fulltime job. Some of it eventually may return, but, alot of good that does to the poor bastard that hasn't got the cash reserves to weather the storm.

And yes there are plenty of idiots on the rep side as well. But, I think it is more of a dem thing. Note that these laws exist in the northeast and cali. You won't see it happening any time real soon in Tennessee or Iowa.

You do realize that all 50 states have some form of anti-smoking laws on the books?

http://slati.lungusa.org/appendixa.asp

I am quite sure that when the Dems' return to power in 08 that they will strike down all these conservative opressive laws. And then raise the sin taxes to pay for all the handouts they will promise in the electoral rethoric.

[Dinsdale]

"We're going to tax the shit out of Group A, and give it to you, Group B."


A bureaucracy must grow or die, never stay stagnant. And the ways they've come up with to feed the bureaucracy are getting downright comical, but they've actually been somewhat clever about it. As long as they pledge to pick on smokers, drinkers, and white men...especially those without children...they get away with it.

Cleverly disguised socialism is all it is. The dems want to steal your money and give it directly back to the bureaucracy, the repubs want to steal your money and return it to the bureaucracy by "trickling it down" through their buddies' coroporations. Lose/lose proposition, but the Average Joe is a retard, so they eat it up.

Still waiting on a real scientific study that shows that the evil secondhand smoke has ever hurt anybody...might be waiting a long time on that one.

[Mikey]

You wouldn't know a "real scientific study" if it walked up to you, grabbed you by the balls and wrapped them around the nearest lamp post.

[BSmack]

You wouldn't know a "real scientific study" if it walked up to you, grabbed you by the balls and wrapped them around the nearest lamp post.

I would be all like "What's up Real Scientific Study? Why are you wrapping my balls around the lamp post?"

[Tom In VA]

lol

[Mikey]

I'd be all like "ooooooooohhhh that pole is cold and stuff!"

Sin
Ciceroyal