BCS question

[Adelpiero]

If MU wins Big12 title, and TejasorOU go to play in National Title game, the Fiesta can bypass Missouri to take another team, correct? MU would still get a BCS bowl, but get pushed to another bowl since Big12 highest BCS team went to national title game?????

[Shoalzie]

I have a hard time thinking whomever loses to Missouri would be in the top 2. What would actually be stupid is the fact that a team that doesn't play in the Big XII title game goes to the national title game with just one loss. Let's say Oklahoma goes to the Big XII title game at 11-1 and loses to Missouri...Texas at 11-1 could slide in because they don't play the extra game and don't get saddled with an extra loss and end up #2 in the BCS rankings.

I think we're seeing some delicious scenarios playing out right now with Oregon State potentially winning the Pac-10 and going to the Rose Bowl over USC...albeit, the Beavers did beat them head-to-head but aren't anywhere near the title discussion. You have Utah at 12-0 and are going to be in BCS game but has no shot at the title game. You can end up with pair of 1-loss powerhouses out of the SEC if Florida beats Alabama in their conference title game but I think for all intents and purposes, you have to believe that game is an elimination game. Then you throw in the Big XII mess...I can't see who we aren't going to see some sort of a controversy play out.

None of this makes a damn bit of sense but that's why we love the BCS, right?

[MiketheangrydrunkenCUfan]

I'm pretty sure the Fiesta would be stuck with Mizzou. They'd still be the official Big XII champs, even if the South "runner-up" ends up playing in the MNC game.

[War Wagon]

I'm pretty sure the Fiesta would be stuck with Mizzou.

You say that as if it's a bad thing.

IF Mizzou beats either Texas or OU at Arrowhead in the Title game, and that's a mighty big IF... they will have definitely earned a right to a BCS bowl. Especially after getting screwed outta' the Orange Bowl last year by Kansas, a team we fucking beat, for having the misfortune of losing said Title game.

[SunCoastSooner]

The Fiesta Bowl gets the Big 12 champion unless said champion is 1 or 2 in the BCS.

Similar situation in 2001. CU was Big 12 champs, went to the Fiesta, while Nebraska went to the Rose.

The Bowls have a right to trade teams in it is in the interest of the perspective bowls.

[Terry in Crapchester]

This is true, but that rule is mainly there to help the Rose protect a Big 10/Pac-10 matchup if possible. I can't think of any reason why the Fiesta would want to give up a top-10 Missouri team for any other team another bowl would be likely to give up.

I guess it's possible the Rose would give up Oregon State, USC, or Penn State to avoid a rematch from the regular season, but they've got that Pac-10/Big Ten fetish and if they traded Oregon State the Beaver fans would freak the fuck out.

I think there'd be a seismic wave of WTF's if the Rose Bowl gave up Oregon State, assuming that Oregon State wins the Pac-10.

The only scenario where I could see a Fiesta Bowl matchup without a Big XII team is if Oregon State wins the Pac-10 and USC also wins out. In that event, I could see the Fiesta matching up USC vs. Utah and sending the second Big XII team to the Sugar Bowl instead. That scenario, of course, makes more sense if Missouri doesn't win the Big XII, and the team that goes to the Sugar Bowl is either Texas or OU, whichever isn't playing for the national championship.

[SoCalTrjn]

Could the Fiesta choose an 11-1 USC over a 12-0 Utah?

[Terry in Crapchester]

Right, but the Fiesta can't choose to take USC over the Big 12 champion unless another bowl agrees to give them up.

If the Big XII champion goes to the Fiesta, then you're right. But the only way I see that happening is if Missouri wins the Big XII CCG.

Otherwise, I think you have that backward. I don't think another bowl can take a second Big XII team over the Fiesta unless the Fiesta agrees to give them up.

[MiketheangrydrunkenCUfan]

Not sure if this will clear anything up for you guys, but here are the official selection procedures...

http://www.bcsfootball.org/bcsfb/eligibility

The Fiesta is contractually obligated to take the Big XII champ. The only way they wouldn't is if the Big XII champ is #1 or #2 in the final BCS standings. If Mizzou wins the conference and the South team that doesn't play in the CCG backs into the MNC game, the Fiesta would have no recourse because they're technically an at-large team.

[SoCalTrjn]

Conceding that the SEC champ and BIG 12 cahmp reach the title game, what would be the picking order for the bowls? Does it go by which team is ranked higher? The Sugar bowl gets the SEC champ and the Fiesta gets the Big 12 Champ so if the Big 12 team is the higher ranked team in the BCS does the Fiesta bowl get the first "at large" pick and the Sugar get the second pick?

Assuming that Ore St and USC win out, Bama and Fla win next weekend as does OU and Texas. Then Fla beats Bama and TX beats Missouri, that would give us a Fla vs TX title game.
OU and USC would be #3 and #4 in the BCS Polls, and would likely wind up being the first 2 at large teams to be picked.
if TX is #1 would that give the Fiesta the #1 pick and the Sugar the #2 pick?
if Fla is #1 would that give the Sugar bowl the #1 pick and the Fiesta the #2 pick?
which bowl would get the third pick?

seems that USC needs TX to be #1 so they can have a shot at Bama in the Sugar Bowl since it seems that Utah is headed to the Fiesta

[Terry in Crapchester]

Conceding that the SEC champ and BIG 12 cahmp reach the title game, what would be the picking order for the bowls? Does it go by which team is ranked higher? The Sugar bowl gets the SEC champ and the Fiesta gets the Big 12 Champ so if the Big 12 team is the higher ranked team in the BCS does the Fiesta bowl get the first "at large" pick and the Sugar get the second pick?

Assuming that Ore St and USC win out, Bama and Fla win next weekend as does OU and Texas. Then Fla beats Bama and TX beats Missouri, that would give us a Fla vs TX title game.
OU and USC would be #3 and #4 in the BCS Polls, and would likely wind up being the first 2 at large teams to be picked.
if TX is #1 would that give the Fiesta the #1 pick and the Sugar the #2 pick?
if Fla is #1 would that give the Sugar bowl the #1 pick and the Fiesta the #2 pick?
which bowl would get the third pick?

seems that USC needs TX to be #1 so they can have a shot at Bama in the Sugar Bowl since it seems that Utah is headed to the Fiesta

After the first two picks, the remaining picks are in a predetermined order. This year, the Fiesta would get the 3rd pick, the Sugar would get the 4th pick and the Orange would get the 5th pick.

So the order would be, depending on the rankings of the top 2:

1. Fiesta
2. Sugar
3. Fiesta
4. Sugar
5. Orange; or

1. Sugar
2. Fiesta
3. Fiesta
4. Sugar
5. Orange

In the scenario you laid out, essentially the Sugar would get right of first refusal on 'Bama, and the Fiesta would get right of first refusal on Oklahoma. Thee most likely matchups would be:

Sugar: USC-'Bama
Fiesta: Oklahoma-Utah

What I was suggesting earlier was a slight switch from these matchups, particularly in light of the following facts: (1) Oklahoma matched up against a non-BCS team in the Fiesta Bowl only two years ago; and (2) the fanbases of both USC and Oklahoma might benefit from easier travel arrangements if those teams were swapped out. Those matchups would then look like this:

Fiesta: USC-Utah
Sugar: Oklahoma-'Bama

[King Crimson]

What I was suggesting earlier was a slight switch from these matchups, particularly in light of the following facts: (1) Oklahoma matched up against a non-BCS team in the Fiesta Bowl only two years ago; and (2) the fanbases of both USC and Oklahoma might benefit from easier travel arrangements if those teams were swapped out. Those matchups would then look like this:

Fiesta: USC-Utah
Sugar: Oklahoma-'Bama

i could see the scenario switch, Oklahoma has played in the Fiesta two years in a row; which, if you were a Fiesta rep/local merchants power group...might make you think twice. Your scenario is OU fan traveling to a non-championship BCS game in the same location for the 3rd year in row.

were it to play-out, an OU-Bama Sugar Bowl would be a home run with both fanbases (in addition to the hype-friendly Stoops/Saban rematch in the Superdump), IMO, and a decent consolation prize if you can't play for it all....which is what these things are at this point.

[MiketheangrydrunkenCUfan]

Here's what I found interesting about the rules:

5. After completion of the selection process as described in Paragraph Nos. 1-4, the conferences and Notre Dame may, but are not required to, adjust the pairings taking into consideration the following:

A. whether the same team will be playing in the same bowl game for two consecutive years;
B. whether two teams that played against one another in the regular season will be paired against one another in a bowl game;
C. whether the same two teams will play against each other in a bowl game for two consecutive years; and
D. whether alternative pairings may have greater or lesser appeal to college football fans as measured by expected ticket sales for the bowls and by expected television interest, and the consequent financial impact on Fox and the bowls.

The pairings may not be altered by removing the Big 10 Champion or Pac-10 champion from the Rose Bowl.

I never realized the conferences have final veto power on non-MNC BCS bowls. While the Rose Bowl clause would seem to prevent them from tampering with a PSU/Oregon St. rematch (assuming the Beavs win out), keep in mind that both of those teams are technically "co-champions." I don't think they would take Oregon St. out of their first Rose Bowl in 30+ years, but I could see them swapping out PSU for aOSU.

[Adelpiero]

Here's what I found interesting about the rules:

5. After completion of the selection process as described in Paragraph Nos. 1-4, the conferences and Notre Dame may, but are not required to, adjust the pairings taking into consideration the following:

A. whether the same team will be playing in the same bowl game for two consecutive years;
B. whether two teams that played against one another in the regular season will be paired against one another in a bowl game;
C. whether the same two teams will play against each other in a bowl game for two consecutive years; and
D. whether alternative pairings may have greater or lesser appeal to college football fans as measured by expected ticket sales for the bowls and by expected television interest, and the consequent financial impact on Fox and the bowls.

The pairings may not be altered by removing the Big 10 Champion or Pac-10 champion from the Rose Bowl.

I never realized the conferences have final veto power on non-MNC BCS bowls. While the Rose Bowl clause would seem to prevent them from tampering with a PSU/Oregon St. rematch (assuming the Beavs win out), keep in mind that both of those teams are technically "co-champions." I don't think they would take Oregon St. out of their first Rose Bowl in 30+ years, but I could see them swapping out PSU for aOSU.

it could be a cluster fark. which is why we all want MU to win the big12 title game, screw this thing up even more

[Terry in Crapchester]

I never realized the conferences have final veto power on non-MNC BCS bowls. While the Rose Bowl clause would seem to prevent them from tampering with a PSU/Oregon St. rematch (assuming the Beavs win out), keep in mind that both of those teams are technically "co-champions." I don't think they would take Oregon St. out of their first Rose Bowl in 30+ years, but I could see them swapping out PSU for aOSU.

The problem with that scenario is that barring a USC loss, you won't get both Oregon State and tOSU in the BCS. One will get in, the other will not.

There are four at-large BCS bids. The BCS is locked into Utah for one. They'll also take a second team from the Big XII and the Meatgrinder (probably will be locked into one, but not both, of these).

That leaves one at-large BCS bid remaining. It will go to USC if both USC and Oregon State win out, otherwise it will go to tOSU.